OMS-3 here, have no family background in medicine and wished I had explored more subspecialties first and second year. I ended up getting a 666 on the COMLEX and 243 on Step 1. Now I am exploring more competitive specialties that I did not previously think I honestly had a shot at. Am i totally out of the picture since I haven't been doing research since day one? Just wondering if I had a shot at competitive specialties (would only be applying to historically osteopathic residencies, not even thinking to apply to MD residencies) like derm, ENT or ophtho. I've started to realize I just want to have a chill job, make good money, be happy and not be too stressed out like my damn didactics teacher (whose an IM doc) lol. Do you guys think I could match into a historically osteopathic residency with my scores but no research as of now?
osteopathic competitive specialty chances
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"...derm, ENT or ophtho..."
"Do you guys think I could match into a historically osteopathic residency with my scores but no research as of now? "
No, particularly now that they're open to MD students. But, you still have time to build an app for them. I say this with absolutely no experience in the process, but given how many ENT DO programs there are in the entire country (just as one example), I'm inclined to think you really need to be the total package to have a shot at any one of them.
"Do you guys think I could match into a historically osteopathic residency with my scores but no research as of now? "
No, particularly now that they're open to MD students. But, you still have time to build an app for them. I say this with absolutely no experience in the process, but given how many ENT DO programs there are in the entire country (just as one example), I'm inclined to think you really need to be the total package to have a shot at any one of them.
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AnatomyGrey12
I mean you have a tiny chance yes, but it isn't very good. You will need to audition as hard as you possibly can and have a reasonable back up (more like a plan 1b). Your scores are solid, but they aren't going to blow anyone away, you will need to grind every single day from here on out for the specialty you choose. Ophtho is likely out since so few of the programs made it through the merger and you won't match MD ophtho without research and strong MD letters/connections.
I will say that people who match those specialties with those scores tend to be people who know exactly what they want and have been working towards that goal from day one. They live and breath the specialty they are going for. You don't really strike me as one of these people seeing as you list 3 fields where the ONLY thing in common amongst them is that they are very competitive.
I will say that people who match those specialties with those scores tend to be people who know exactly what they want and have been working towards that goal from day one. They live and breath the specialty they are going for. You don't really strike me as one of these people seeing as you list 3 fields where the ONLY thing in common amongst them is that they are very competitive.
Yeah you are right, it definitely seems like the people who match these specialties knew what they wanted from day one or even since high school. When I was a teenager/in college I wasn't really thinking about what medical subspecialty I wanted exactly and I feel like the majority of adolescents/college students didn't either, I just knew I wanted to be a doctor. I know this is just the way things go in life. It's a bit frustrating that just because I hadn't already decided what specialty I wanted to pursue since day one or happened to have parents in the medical field to help guide me, that I am now at a huge disadvantage. I am in my third year rotations and am just now experiencing and learning what different specialties are like. Anyone know a guy who matched any of these specialties that didn't know from day one and didn't have that much research?
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OP will not be the only candidate who feels this way.
He is comparing himself to so many other applicants / stories who seem to be “on top of it.” An example that comes to mind is Dr. Andrea Tooley who knew she wanted to be an ophthalmologist since high school and used this vision to successfully completed her goals to transform dreams into reality.
But as a matter of fact, there will be so many other applicants in OP’s position - who didn’t decide on a speciality until later in medical school. But these other applicants feel just as apprehensive about the same predicament and therefore we do not hear about it as often.
I think OP should just focus on the accomplishing the necessary goals with his remaining time. There is plenty of time left since it is early in the OMSIII year.
Also, this is probably a better predicament in comparison to the “more common” scenario of wanting a particular speciality but not having the board score for it. Keep up the good work!
He is comparing himself to so many other applicants / stories who seem to be “on top of it.” An example that comes to mind is Dr. Andrea Tooley who knew she wanted to be an ophthalmologist since high school and used this vision to successfully completed her goals to transform dreams into reality.
But as a matter of fact, there will be so many other applicants in OP’s position - who didn’t decide on a speciality until later in medical school. But these other applicants feel just as apprehensive about the same predicament and therefore we do not hear about it as often.
I think OP should just focus on the accomplishing the necessary goals with his remaining time. There is plenty of time left since it is early in the OMSIII year.
Also, this is probably a better predicament in comparison to the “more common” scenario of wanting a particular speciality but not having the board score for it. Keep up the good work!
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Surgical subs and derm likely not. You could do a research year if you really have the passion for those fields, but it honestly sounds like you don’t tbh. Most mortals don’t. Pretty much anything else though is fair game though. Also, some solid programs in most fields. Your in a better position than most folks so congrats.
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It would be an uphill battle but you try. Derm and ophtho would likely be out. Even in the Osteopathic residencies, derm residents are pretty studly. Not enough spots for ophtho IMO. ENT is a viable option, but your chances will likely be pretty slim with no research. I would either take a research year or start sending out mass emails to get a project going. Also, You’ll get smoked in sub Is compared to people who have been preparing from day 1. You need to seriously commit and put your best foot forward if you’re gonna do this.
There’s always radiology and anesthesia, if it doesn’t workout.
There’s always radiology and anesthesia, if it doesn’t workout.
D
deleted898021
You need to pick one of those specialties(whichever one you feel like you want to do) and do a third year elective if possible, and immediately email everyone at an academic center nearby that does research in that field and see if you can do some research in the field, you could also take a research rotation, I know my school let’s us do that. If you can do good research and get some pubs in and do well on your rotations and get good letters from prominent MD/DO faculty then you will increase your chances to match, i would def apply to a backup like IM/FM or anesthesia or even gen surg cause it would still be an uphill battle in those fields. Derm has more former DO programs in acgme and many of them are still taking majority DO after the merger but ent and optho have less programs that made it. Just my 2 cents
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AnatomyGrey12
The problem isn't that you didn't know from day one, although that does hurt as DO's are not afforded the luxury of MD's of being able to decide later, but that even now you don't really seem like someone who actually want one of these specialties. You listed 3 fields that really don't have anything in common.
I do happen to know a person with almost your exact scores who applied ENT, who decided only like 1-2 months before auditions started. They did not match. They did however get 2 MD interviews and interviews at all 6 ENT auditions they did. You have a chance. It might work out, for some people it does, but for a lot of people it doesn't. You need to decide how bad you want this.
Not really, many competitive fields start accepting audition rotation applications in January.
This. OP needs to decide if they really want to do this and then they need to live and breath X field from now on. The nice thing about having the above mentioned scores is that there are many fields that will be happy take OP if they don't match. Might take a surgery prelim year to get there but it is a valid option/back up.
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AnatomyGrey12
The only 2 derm applicants I know have 250/700+/10+ pubs and the other has an 800+ also with pubs. The DO derm applicants are VERY competitive.
No. You have zero motivation other than wanting a "chill job", you probably know nothing about those fields, you're already halfway through 3rd year without any research, and you seem like you just randomly listed a few competitive fields off the top of your head for no apparent reason. I don't know what else to say other than... you're going to have to pick from less competitive fields.
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OP, I felt similar as you did after receiving my board scores (also a 243 Step 1). I literally posted something similar to your post. I spent hours researching uber-competitive specialties, I told myself I would like urology, then 2 weeks later said well maybe IR would be nice. It wasn't until about a month later that I realized I still had no f***ing clue what I wanted to do. It's a nice problem to have good board scores to be sure. Don't force it. Find what you like and go from there. FWIW, now that I am half-way through M3, the specialty that initially attracted me (and made me feel okay going the DO route), may be the one I end up going for which is EM. Another personal favorite of mine is anesthesiology. Little to no notes. 5 min patient interactions. Highly sought after skillset, applied physiology, and great job market (don't give into the CRNA hysteria -- it is overblown).
You'll be fine.
Edit: Anesthesiologists are super chill. Honestly is one of the reasons why I still can't decide between EM and gas.
You'll be fine.
Edit: Anesthesiologists are super chill. Honestly is one of the reasons why I still can't decide between EM and gas.
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I know a guy who was actually at an MD school and didn't decide until 3rd year that he wanted ENT. He took a research year to beef up his app and matched.
I agree with others that even now you don't seem to know what you want. You need to stop worrying about matching something competitive and ultimately decide what career will make you the happiest.
There's a lot of jobs that can be chill, certainly more chill than an IM hospitalist and even variety in the chill-ness of hospitalist jobs. Forget your score for a second and find the actual work/subject matter you enjoy doing. Your score is good and won't hold you back, but it's silly to decide your desired field based solely on that number.
If in the end you realize you love one of those fields or some of the surgical subspecialties, take a research year and go all out. If that seems like too much work, chances are you wouldn't match anyway, so find something else. Don't forget that you could always go IM and then do a subspecialty too, but you have to get through IM residency and will need research to get anything remotely competitive.
Like I said, you're not behind, find what you like. Contrary to popular belief there are plenty of people in FM, Psych, and Peds with stellar board scores. Do what you enjoy. The score will help you have options.
nice
you sound a bit sour
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So if no one else is gonna comment, I gotta ask: What satanic ritual did you perform? Did you use some sort of dark arts OMM study guide?
In the mean time, have you considered things OBGYN, Gen Surg, or spicy IM residencies with intent to subspecialize? All of those have their own unique sub-specialties, though may not necessarily be conducive to chill lifestyles during residency/fellowship.
That's Sab. He's like our local Eeyore. After awhile you start to enjoy his consistently consistent negativity.
Not sour at all. Giving you a response with real advice. You asked a very straightforward question and I gave you a very straightforward reply. You can do what you want with it.
Ok man take a deep breath
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Thats just the way @sab3156 is dont take it personal. Advice usually blunt and a realist. However, she/he is not wrong-if you want a competitive specialty bad enough becauae you find youre passionate about whatever you choose you have to go HAM going forward and I mean eat breathe sleep ophtho/derm/ent or whatever it is. Its possible but going to be very challenging and you have to want to want it with youre entire being doing whatever it takes to get there. I hate telling someone theyll never be something so I think if you play your cards right and bust your ass you can have a shot
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Do what you like not something fancy just because you might can. You can have a good life in IM subspecies just as you can with those fancy specs mentioned above. Good thing w IM subspecs is you have less an uphill battle since the lines are somewhat blurred MD vs DO when applying for competitive fellowship compared to a straight up hard to get residency. And you have more time to fix weak spots.
I got a little wet once my board scores came out but decided IM out of interest not just the “oh I can do fancy things now itis”
what do you want to do?
I got a little wet once my board scores came out but decided IM out of interest not just the “oh I can do fancy things now itis”
what do you want to do?
His advice, while blunt, is sound. Being a DO knocks 10 to 15 points off your step 1 so consider how competitive you'd be as an MD with a 228-233. ENT, derm and optho, while not completely out of the question, would be a less than 60% chance of matching. Those are brutally competitive specialties even for MDs.
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I decided to commit to a surgical subspecialty in 3rd yr and ended up matching. I did some research in a different surgical specialty between 1st and 2nd year but nothing crazy. Point is, it’s possible but you have to bust your ass on auditions and play your cards right with prior DO programs. You also have to really like the field you choose. If not you wont be able to grind for 5 months on auditions.
I’m applying to historically osteopathic residencies!
Let's talk about ophthalmology for a minute. How many programs made it through the ACGME shredder? Very few. You would be silly to only apply to former AOA programs - the seats are few. Not only are there many DO students like yourself who think they are going to be in those seats (even with the downsizing), you're going to be competing with MDs as well, and some of those programs may not be favoring DOs for long. Who knows. You haven't been playing the game and aren't even playing the game yet, so your clout in this field among faculty who will help you is zilch.
You should have been actively working in the field, doing research, building connections with people who matter in the ACGME world. This is because the better route would be to apply to ACGME programs all over, and not place your bets on being in one of the remaining seats at former AOA programs. There has been a downsize in the AOA ophthalmology world, as I just said.
Applying only to "historically osteopathic residencies" in ophthalmology is a fool's game. It's gambling at best, unless you have stuck your nose so far up a DO program director's behind that you can feel his shoulder Chapman point and diagnose his Retina pathology.
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It’s New Year’s Eve Bro
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Bro why you getting passive aggressive? Your CV is thicker than your skin...
“since I haven't been doing research since day one?”
Dude, you didn’t do it day one; nor did you anything the other 730 days...
Your ass scored a 240... Cool... As it sits your app isn’t competitive for competitive specialties. Believe it or not people accomplished what you did and more... Like a **** ton more!
Also, quit saying “historically osteopathic residencies” like it changes the optics of your situation... You think some 70 year old, bone cracking, crystal healing, Derm DO PD is saving you a spot?
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OP came in, stated his scores, expected people to drool over them and say how competitive they are and that he will match competitively in the mentioned specialties. He got the unexpected responses and thus his passive-aggressive behavior. This thread is nothing more than a validation-seeking thread.
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Scores not even that great lol nothing to make a post about. He won’t even tell us what part of medicine he or she enjoys. U just like the ppl in my class that made low 240s and come on and share heir study strats each year like they are a godsend on our fb page when tons of others scored higher. all that’s left is to post ur score report so we can drill over its mediocrity
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Very much this. I got about 30 seconds of derm fever when I got my scores back but quickly realized the people who got like 10-15 points lower than me with multiple pubs by their names were just superior candidates.
That’s okay bc derm is gross anyway😛
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How did you avoid burnout? Did you take any breaks between aways? Were you able to finish them all before ERAS, with letters in hand?
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I think everyone gets a little burned out toward the end but you still have some weekends off to relax and explore. Auditions July - November, got my letters during the first few. Most historically DO programs in my specialty require a rotation to interview / be seriously considered in rank. I think this will result in continued opportunities for us in historically DO programs. Powerhouse MD applicants just aren't scheduling aways at our programs and the DO’s rotating are great applicants with a solid work ethic.
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That's good to hear. Thank you.
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I actually agree with everything Sab has said but this is hilarious. I love this guy
