Part time, 40 hours, IM (or similar): What must I sacrifice for this?

[259634]

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I am pursuing medicine partly because I love the challenge of the subject matter, love being able to contribute to the health of others, and generally want to complete a terminal education in a well-defined, secure occupation.

Can someone please explain to me how realistic it is to expect a part-time or 40 hr/week job as a physician in a non-ROADs speciality? I am preparing for medical school and having panic attacks about never having a life. Seven years of isolation is fine, but I would like reassurance that for a salary cut (70k/year would be fine) I can focus on a family at some point, particularly even right after residency. What will I have to sacrifice to reach this goal? For me, nothing could take the place of watching my children grow up.

I will start med school at 25 y/o, and will not have to worry about med school loans/debt.

 

[drizzt3117]

b/c doctors don't a) marry, b) have kids, or c) ever have time to see them in the infinitesimally small chance that they manage to accomplish both a and b...

 

[236116]

b/c doctors don't a) marry, b) have kids, or c) ever have time to see them in the infinitesimally small chance that they manage to accomplish both a and b...

Durrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

 

[Brent8927]

I think it's very realistic to expect part-time work if that is what you want, escpecially if you open up your own practice then you set your own hours. I know a physician in Berkeley who works only about 5 hours a day. This works out well since it also gives him plenty of time to check on patients in the hospital, conduct a home visit, etc. without impacting his schedule.

Of course residency is a completely different story...

 

[236116]

1. Medical education NEVER ends.
2. Part-time isn't realistic, especially if you're new, either in PP or academia.
3. Everyone who wants kids- even the surgery people- work it out.

 

[sarahg]

I've seen some part time physician jobs searching usajobs.gov, so they're out there (if you're willing to work for the government at least).

How do you feel about psychiatry? It's lower-paying than the ROADS specialties but has a good lifestyle. Emergency Medicine can also have a good lifestyle -- less call because there's someone to replace you when you go home.

 

[Brent8927]

1. Medical education NEVER ends.
2. Part-time isn't realistic, especially if you're new, either in PP or academia.
3. Everyone who wants kids- even the surgery people- work it out.

I disagree. I mentioned already that I know part-time physicians in private practice, and I also know some in academia. This doesn't mean it's common, but it's definitely realistic--if the OP is willing to take the time to find a part-time position.

But I do agree to your other statements--medical education never ends (which is part of the appeal!) and even those who do work the normal hours can work things out.

 

[236116]

I disagree. I mentioned already that I know part-time physicians in private practice, and I also know some in academia. This doesn't mean it's common, but it's definitely realistic--if the OP is willing to take the time to find a part-time position.

But I do agree to your other statements--medical education never ends (which is part of the appeal!) and even those who do work the normal hours can work things out.

Which part of "new"? Every group you can join wants to make money, they can't do that if they take on the burden of someone who ain't working, never mind the you're-always-on-call when it comes down to it.

 

[melanoleuca]

I think it's very realistic to expect part-time work if that is what you want, escpecially if you open up your own practice then you set your own hours. I know a physician in Berkeley who works only about 5 hours a day. This works out well since it also gives him plenty of time to check on patients in the hospital, conduct a home visit, etc. without impacting his schedule.

Of course residency is a completely different story...

So he works more than five hours a day. Checking on patients in the hospital is work, as is making home visits. What you mean is that he only has five hours a day in his clinic.

 

[GonnaHappen]

I am pursuing medicine partly because I love the challenge of the subject matter, love being able to contribute to the health of others, and generally want to complete a terminal education in a well-defined, secure occupation.

Can someone please explain to me how realistic it is to expect a part-time or 40 hr/week job as a physician in a non-ROADs speciality? I am preparing for medical school and having panic attacks about never having a life. Seven years of isolation is fine, but I would like reassurance that for a salary cut (70k/year would be fine) I can focus on a family at some point, particularly even right after residency. What will I have to sacrifice to reach this goal? For me, nothing could take the place of watching my children grow up.

I will start med school at 25 y/o, and will not have to worry about med school loans/debt.

Ugh. If only...

 

[cpants]

What you will have to sacrifice is money, plain and simple. If you want to work less, you will be able to. You only have to see as many patients as you want to in private practice, and there are part and reduced time jobs out there if you want to work for someone else. Just don't expect to rake in the big bucks doing it.

 

[amakhosidlo]

Google locum tenens.

Think pay rates range from 70-100/hr depending on where you are. Downside: you might not be covered by your employer's malpractice coverage, and your job security is significantly reduced (you're basically a part time/reserve/substitute doc). Most locums work is with government entities (prisons, military bases, etc). Not always the best work environments, but you can't beat it in terms of flexibility. Another sweet gig is being an examiner for workman's comp claims. Part time, nothing but basic physicals and report writing. Great way to partially retire, I've heard...

 

[Brent8927]

Which part of "new"? Every group you can join wants to make money, they can't do that if they take on the burden of someone who ain't working, never mind the you're-always-on-call when it comes down to it.

You're correct. I wasn't referring to joining a group--they want to make money. I think it wold be very difficult to find part-time work through a group. If you start up your own practice, that is when it's easy to work part-time, because you are your own boss and can set your hours.

 

[Brent8927]

So he works more than five hours a day. Checking on patients in the hospital is work, as is making home visits. What you mean is that he only has five hours a day in his clinic.

Yes, he works a bit more than five hours a day--probably around six. He takes two hours off for lunch everyday, and takes all of Wednesday afternoon off to golf. So he's definitely a part-timer. He doesn't have a large patient base, so he's not checking in at the hospital everday, and the home visits are rare--they're reserved for when it would be difficult for the patient to come to the office.

 

[cpants]

You're correct. I wasn't referring to joining a group--they want to make money. I think it wold be very difficult to find part-time work through a group. If you start up your own practice, that is when it's easy to work part-time, because you are your own boss and can set your hours.

The opportunities are out there, probably even more so in group practice. A lot of practices would rather expand with part-time help, because it is cheaper. You don't have to pay benefits or as much salary, but you can still get someone to take some more patients into the practice and to take call when the full-timers are out of town or busy.

 

[pianola]

Are there any special opportunities for women who have to raise a kid or is it "good luck, I hope you and your partner work it out"?

 

[236116]

Are there any special opportunities for women who have to raise a kid or is it "good luck, I hope you and your partner work it out"?

1. Super-specialise, you won't have enough pts to be FT.
2. Go in with a big FM/Peds group.

 

[VMSmith]

It's possible. I know a psychiatrist who works 12 hours a week (6 hours/day for 2 days) and makes around $70k/year pretax. She's 2 years out of residency, decided to work part time so she'd have more time to spend with her kids.

Edit to add: She joined a group that let her work part time when she graduated - she paid them something like 30% of her income in exchange for using their office space and secretary and referral network. After she built up a patient base she rented a small office and is now on her own. The group let her take her patients with her when she left.

 

[Bananas Foster]

I think most situations can go both ways. I know one Family practice doc in a solo practice who works pretty relaxed hours, but she had to bust her butt to get to that point.

I've heard a lot of stories from group practices that expect you to bring in crazy amount of money, one doctor I know said she has to see something like 80 patinets a week just to cover overhead. But like people say some group practices can be flexible.

And aside from private practice I know a couple hospitalists IM docs who only work 15 days a month.

And those aren't your only options. Aside from derm, rad, or optho I know a lot of PM & R doctors who work very relaxed schedules (my preceptor clocks in about 35 hours a week by my observations, which is a pretty good deal).

 

[Blesbok]

If you really wanted to, you could easily make a good living working the hours you want by just picking up shifts in the ER, walk in clinics, and covering for hospitalists.

 

[NotAndrew]

Medicine has to be the only profession where 40 hours is considered part time.

 

[techie222]

Doctors that work as hospital employees can work as little as 15 days a month and still earn the 70k/year that you have set as your standard.

However, there is less room to advance in your career. Private practice doctors can eventually become partners in the practice and move up in the chain of command so to speak.

 

[diosa428]

The major issue with working part time is malpractice insurance. Regardless of how many hours per week you work, you still pay the same malpractice. This makes it difficult to find part-time work for an employer who pays your malpractice (why pay the same amount for someone's insurance if they're only going to work half the time?). If you pay your own, you will have fewer issues, but then that's going to result in a big chunk coming out of your paycheck. For those saying "just go into private practice" - sure, you can do it, but you need to be a good business person, and if you want to bring home $70k, you're going to have to figure that you'll need to make significantly more than that to pay the overhead.

I've heard of some group practices where 2 people work part time and essentially split the job of one person, but I don't know exactly how that works.

 

[dragonfly99]

You can definitely work part time doing IM. Trust me. I have seen many ads for this. Also, the VA and other similar government entities will hire part timers. What it would probably be hard to do would to become an actual partner in a private practice while working only part time. Say you have 3 other partners (probably male) and taking Q4 call, they won't like it if you only want to work 1/2 as much...and take less call...so just don't get yourself into that position and you should be O.K. I have known one endocrine doc who had clinic 2 days/week, and shared office space with a derm who used the office the other 3 days/week...not sure how they worked out the rent, etc. but it can be done.

If you don't have to worry about med school loans, I think this is certainly possible. You can find work in urgent care places, sometimes ER and sometimes part time as a hospitalist (inpatient internal medicine doctor) too. I think part time can be harder to do in academics, and certainly would hurt your odds of being promoted up high, but you CAN do part time IM.

 

[dragonfly99]

I'm in my early 30's and I know of at least 1 med school classmate who did peds who is working part time. She has 2 kids, and works part time at either an urgent care or primary care place...can't remember which.

I would just stay away from surgical fields if you want to do part time...

 

[cpants]

You can definitely work part time doing IM. Trust me. I have seen many ads for this. Also, the VA and other similar government entities will hire part timers. What it would probably be hard to do would to become an actual partner in a private practice while working only part time. Say you have 3 other partners (probably male) and taking Q4 call, they won't like it if you only want to work 1/2 as much...and take less call...so just don't get yourself into that position and you should be O.K. I have known one endocrine doc who had clinic 2 days/week, and shared office space with a derm who used the office the other 3 days/week...not sure how they worked out the rent, etc. but it can be done.

If you don't have to worry about med school loans, I think this is certainly possible. You can find work in urgent care places, sometimes ER and sometimes part time as a hospitalist (inpatient internal medicine doctor) too. I think part time can be harder to do in academics, and certainly would hurt your odds of being promoted up high, but you CAN do part time IM.

There is no reason you can't be a partner working part-time. You just may not be an equal partner. This is just a business arrangement. Plus there are a lot of other factors which go into a partnership share which don't have much to do with the hours you are in clinic. Investment money would be the biggest one I can think of.

 

[259634]

Thanks for your generous responses. I'll just add that while searching through the literature, I came across many references to the millennial generation and the growing desire among young physicians to balance work and life. Also, part time work does not appear to reduce quality of care or respect of work from coworkers or patients.

References among these searches:
Google Scholar - Part time physicians

Google Scholar - Generation professionalism physician

I have to wonder, and would love to know the opinions of others who have considered this in depth, what will the medical career of generation Y (millennials) be like? Is there any chance that we will "humanize" medical practice (and training) in the next 15 years?

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We live in succession, in division, in parts, in particles. Meantime within man is the soul of the whole; the wise silence; the universal beauty, to which every part and particle is equally related, the eternal ONE. And this deep power in which we exist and whose beatitude is all accessible to us, is not only self-sufficing and perfect in every hour, but the act of seeing and the thing seen, the seer and the spectacle, the subject and the object, are one. We see the world piece by piece, as the sun, the moon, the animal, the tree; but the whole, of which these are shining parts, is the soul. - Emerson on the Over-soul