Physician MBA to work in Healthcare Industry

[lp430]

Hey everyone,
I'm a recent residency grad in Emergency Medicine. For several reason, I am interested in leaving full-time clinical practice to work in the healthcare industry. I'm not sure which area quite yet (consulting, healthcare tech, startups etc) but I recently applied to a number of consulting firms without much success. I am now debating going back to school for my MBA vs. EMBA to diversify my skill set and help network/find a niche.

I've read through these threads, but haven't found a lot of info. Has anyone done this after residency to transition careers? I know FT MBA is better than EMBA for networking/prestige/recruiting, but the thought of not working and accumulating more debt is a bit daunting. My other option is to keep working clinically and continue to apply for non-clinical jobs. I do live in a great area for business/networking but I feel that my application is lacking for a lot of these jobs. Anyone care to share their experiences?

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[LookForZebras]

Both types of MBAs have their pros and cons. Full-time programs give you the full immersive educational experience, while EMBA are specifically geared toward professionals who are working and already have years of experience. Given that you probably don't want to accumulate more debt, I think that deferring an MBA may be your best bet, as some employers will cover some or all of those cost. I'd say to keep working and applying for jobs, and reconsider an MBA down the road.

 

[lp430]

Both types of MBAs have their pros and cons. Full-time programs give you the full immersive educational experience, while EMBA are specifically geared toward professionals who are working and already have years of experience. Given that you probably don't want to accumulate more debt, I think that deferring an MBA may be your best bet, as some employers will cover some or all of those cost. I'd say to keep working and applying for jobs, and reconsider an MBA down the road.

Thanks for your input. That makes sense financially. I guess my thing is that I become impatient with the next step and feel like I'm in a holding pattern. Though, there are worse things than being "stuck" as an attending ER doc for a little while.

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[dpmgrad]

Hey everyone,
I'm a recent residency grad in Emergency Medicine. For several reason, I am interested in leaving full-time clinical practice to work in the healthcare industry. I'm not sure which area quite yet (consulting, healthcare tech, startups etc) but I recently applied to a number of consulting firms without much success. I am now debating going back to school for my MBA vs. EMBA to diversify my skill set and help network/find a niche.

I've read through these threads, but haven't found a lot of info. Has anyone done this after residency to transition careers? I know FT MBA is better than EMBA for networking/prestige/recruiting, but the thought of not working and accumulating more debt is a bit daunting. My other option is to keep working clinically and continue to apply for non-clinical jobs. I do live in a great area for business/networking but I feel that my application is lacking for a lot of these jobs. Anyone care to share their experiences?

Since you are a recent Emergency Medicine residency grad, have you considered the Weill Cornell Healthcare Leadership and Management Fellowship? In this fellowship, you have the option to complete the Cornell University EMBA / MS in Healthcare Leadership for free as part of the fellowship program. I know of several physicians in the program that have pivoted either into pharma or into venture due to Johnson networking. You can read more about the fellowship, along with the EMBA/MS option below:

Healthcare Leadership and Management Fellowship with Optional Executive MBA/MS | Emergency Medicine

Healthcare delivery has become increasingly complex, requiring physician leaders to develop a skill set not often obtained through traditional medical education or residency training. New York-Presbyterian/Weill Cornell Medicine is proud to offer a one or two-year, non-ACGME accredited...

emed.weill.cornell.edu

 

[lp430]

Since you are a recent Emergency Medicine residency grad, have you considered the Weill Cornell Healthcare Leadership and Management Fellowship? In this fellowship, you have the option to complete the Cornell University EMBA / MS in Healthcare Leadership for free as part of the fellowship program. I know of several physicians in the program that have pivoted either into pharma or into venture due to Johnson networking. You can read more about the fellowship, along with the EMBA/MS option below:

Healthcare Leadership and Management Fellowship with Optional Executive MBA/MS | Emergency Medicine

Healthcare delivery has become increasingly complex, requiring physician leaders to develop a skill set not often obtained through traditional medical education or residency training. New York-Presbyterian/Weill Cornell Medicine is proud to offer a one or two-year, non-ACGME accredited...

emed.weill.cornell.edu

Thanks for the suggestion! Interesting you mention that, as I did interview for a number of admin fellowships that had MBAs when I was a resident. Didn't end up going that route, as I didn't find a good fit and felt most of the graduates just ended up in hospital leadership, which isn't what I am seeking.

I never did end up applying to Cornell (and a few others that required to be PGY-4), but I'll look into it. If you know docs that did it, had good experiences and ended up in areas like VC, that may be an option worth pursuing.

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[LobsterMan]

If you can get into a top full-time MBA program, the extra time and money may be worth it. If you've already completed your residency and are practicing, you will be in short supply and thus have a good chance of nabbing a scholarship at a top MBA program, assuming you can do well on the GMAT.

I did the full-time MBA and found it to be the best thing I've ever done professionally. Keep in mind that the classroom aspect of business school is only a small part of the experience, which is what makes me more skeptical about the EMBA (though I'm admittedly biased).

In my MBA, I grew most through opportunities to learn through immersive, time-intensive classes that require trust-building and vulernability. Some highlights were experiences about storytelling, influence, group dynamics, negotiations, etc. and semester or year-long revolving around leadership styles, inspiring/motivating others, teaching, etc. I probably spent 20 hours a week in extracurriculars or conversations that really made me grow as a person and a professional. While some of the value-add is financial, I think that some of the value-add is also simply broadening your perspective and giving you the tools to shape a career that matches your unique identity and motivations. Thus, a lot of time is spent engaging in personal development - and I have found to make me a much happier person overall.

You get to spend a TON of time surrounded by a bunch of sharp, successful people from an INCREDIBLY broad variety of backgrounds (very unlike medicine - teachers, government lobbyists, ex-military, finance, marketing, artists, musicians, etc. etc.) who remain ambitious and/or weren't fully satisfied with their current trajectory (i.e., they wanted to move up faster, develop new skills, or switch careers). A lot of people come to business school to learn more about themselves and what they really want to do with their life, leading to lots of enriching conversation. People love to share their stories, and I learned an insane amount about different people's fields/opportunities/personalities/motivations/cultures in just two years.

I found that going to business school opened up an almost infinite amount of career opportunities as well. I could have picked from literally hundreds of jobs in healthcare across the full spectrum. I have no idea how I would've accessed these nor had the credibility to jump into these roles without an MBA behind my name.

All that said, I would NOT get an MBA only because you're unhappy where you are or because it seems like a lot of fun (which it is!). You should have some vision of what you want to accomplish by getting an MBA and seek out opportunities to grow in that area. I was personally very interested in learning the soft skills necessary to lead others and the hard skills to streamline operations (which are very inefficient in hospitals), which were motivated by my direct experiences in medicine. Having fun is an amazing byproduct of the experience, but isn't worth the cost/time/etc. on its own, and it can be easy to waste two years if you aren't focused to some degree.

One final word of advice. If you're thinking about business, take time to do some business-y things. Listen to podcasts, read books. You can always volunteer at a university healthcare consulting group or hospital project or take on an operations role in the ED or network through friends who have left for business to find a part-time gig to give you some experience before you make a big jump.

Good luck to you!

 

[lp430]

If you can get into a top full-time MBA program, the extra time and money may be worth it. If you've already completed your residency and are practicing, you will be in short supply and thus have a good chance of nabbing a scholarship at a top MBA program, assuming you can do well on the GMAT.

I did the full-time MBA and found it to be the best thing I've ever done professionally. Keep in mind that the classroom aspect of business school is only a small part of the experience, which is what makes me more skeptical about the EMBA (though I'm admittedly biased).

In my MBA, I grew most through opportunities to learn through immersive, time-intensive classes that require trust-building and vulernability. Some highlights were experiences about storytelling, influence, group dynamics, negotiations, etc. and semester or year-long revolving around leadership styles, inspiring/motivating others, teaching, etc. I probably spent 20 hours a week in extracurriculars or conversations that really made me grow as a person and a professional. While some of the value-add is financial, I think that some of the value-add is also simply broadening your perspective and giving you the tools to shape a career that matches your unique identity and motivations. Thus, a lot of time is spent engaging in personal development - and I have found to make me a much happier person overall.

You get to spend a TON of time surrounded by a bunch of sharp, successful people from an INCREDIBLY broad variety of backgrounds (very unlike medicine - teachers, government lobbyists, ex-military, finance, marketing, artists, musicians, etc. etc.) who remain ambitious and/or weren't fully satisfied with their current trajectory (i.e., they wanted to move up faster, develop new skills, or switch careers). A lot of people come to business school to learn more about themselves and what they really want to do with their life, leading to lots of enriching conversation. People love to share their stories, and I learned an insane amount about different people's fields/opportunities/personalities/motivations/cultures in just two years.

I found that going to business school opened up an almost infinite amount of career opportunities as well. I could have picked from literally hundreds of jobs in healthcare across the full spectrum. I have no idea how I would've accessed these nor had the credibility to jump into these roles without an MBA behind my name.

All that said, I would NOT get an MBA only because you're unhappy where you are or because it seems like a lot of fun (which it is!). You should have some vision of what you want to accomplish by getting an MBA and seek out opportunities to grow in that area. I was personally very interested in learning the soft skills necessary to lead others and the hard skills to streamline operations (which are very inefficient in hospitals), which were motivated by my direct experiences in medicine. Having fun is an amazing byproduct of the experience, but isn't worth the cost/time/etc. on its own, and it can be easy to waste two years if you aren't focused to some degree.

One final word of advice. If you're thinking about business, take time to do some business-y things. Listen to podcasts, read books. You can always volunteer at a university healthcare consulting group or hospital project or take on an operations role in the ED or network through friends who have left for business to find a part-time gig to give you some experience before you make a big jump.

Good luck to you!

Thanks for the detailed response! I would definitely do a FT MBA, if I got into a top 25 program. Obviously that depends on how I would do on the GMAT. I'm really not looking a programs that are not highly ranked. My thought is, if I am going to do it, I should fully commit and work hard to get into good school.
Would you mind if I sent you a PM?

 

[reca]

If you can get into a top full-time MBA program, the extra time and money may be worth it. If you've already completed your residency and are practicing, you will be in short supply and thus have a good chance of nabbing a scholarship at a top MBA program, assuming you can do well on the GMAT.

I did the full-time MBA and found it to be the best thing I've ever done professionally. Keep in mind that the classroom aspect of business school is only a small part of the experience, which is what makes me more skeptical about the EMBA (though I'm admittedly biased).

Did you do the full time MBA after residency? It seems that going without any medical practice for two years would sharply diminish the chances of doing any clinical work in the future, no?

I've long since decided to do an MBA about 5 yrs post-residency. I've only considered an EMBA but you make compelling argument for a full-time MBA. My biggest concern though is that going for a full-time MBA may be a death stroke for any clinical practice afterwards.

 

[LobsterMan]

I was able to do the full-time MBA and practice part-time. My institution saw the value of training a physician-leader, and was fully supportive and flexible in allowing me to schedule my clinical time. Keep in mind that most business schools have class 3-4 days per week, so I practiced on Fridays and weekends intermittently. Also, business school summers are very long in general -- I think mine was 15 weeks, so you can do an internship (typically 8-10 weeks) and still manage to put in a good amount of clinical work. If you're really dedicated, you can also skip out on spring break, fall break, winter break, etc. and work clinically, though I'd not recommend doing that!

My point is that you can legitimately work part-time if you really want to... all without diminishing your business school experience too much.

 

[reca]

I was able to do the full-time MBA and practice part-time. My institution saw the value of training a physician-leader, and was fully supportive and flexible in allowing me to schedule my clinical time. Keep in mind that most business schools have class 3-4 days per week, so I practiced on Fridays and weekends intermittently. Also, business school summers are very long in general -- I think mine was 15 weeks, so you can do an internship (typically 8-10 weeks) and still manage to put in a good amount of clinical work. If you're really dedicated, you can also skip out on spring break, fall break, winter break, etc. and work clinically, though I'd not recommend doing that!

My point is that you can legitimately work part-time if you really want to... all without diminishing your business school experience too much.

Mind if I DM you a few questions?

 

[lp430]

One of the great thing about EM! I wouldnt have to totally give up clinical practice to go back through school.

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[dpmgrad]

If you can get into a top full-time MBA program, the extra time and money may be worth it. If you've already completed your residency and are practicing, you will be in short supply and thus have a good chance of nabbing a scholarship at a top MBA program, assuming you can do well on the GMAT.

I did the full-time MBA and found it to be the best thing I've ever done professionally. Keep in mind that the classroom aspect of business school is only a small part of the experience, which is what makes me more skeptical about the EMBA (though I'm admittedly biased).

In my MBA, I grew most through opportunities to learn through immersive, time-intensive classes that require trust-building and vulernability. Some highlights were experiences about storytelling, influence, group dynamics, negotiations, etc. and semester or year-long revolving around leadership styles, inspiring/motivating others, teaching, etc. I probably spent 20 hours a week in extracurriculars or conversations that really made me grow as a person and a professional. While some of the value-add is financial, I think that some of the value-add is also simply broadening your perspective and giving you the tools to shape a career that matches your unique identity and motivations. Thus, a lot of time is spent engaging in personal development - and I have found to make me a much happier person overall.

You get to spend a TON of time surrounded by a bunch of sharp, successful people from an INCREDIBLY broad variety of backgrounds (very unlike medicine - teachers, government lobbyists, ex-military, finance, marketing, artists, musicians, etc. etc.) who remain ambitious and/or weren't fully satisfied with their current trajectory (i.e., they wanted to move up faster, develop new skills, or switch careers). A lot of people come to business school to learn more about themselves and what they really want to do with their life, leading to lots of enriching conversation. People love to share their stories, and I learned an insane amount about different people's fields/opportunities/personalities/motivations/cultures in just two years.

I found that going to business school opened up an almost infinite amount of career opportunities as well. I could have picked from literally hundreds of jobs in healthcare across the full spectrum. I have no idea how I would've accessed these nor had the credibility to jump into these roles without an MBA behind my name.

All that said, I would NOT get an MBA only because you're unhappy where you are or because it seems like a lot of fun (which it is!). You should have some vision of what you want to accomplish by getting an MBA and seek out opportunities to grow in that area. I was personally very interested in learning the soft skills necessary to lead others and the hard skills to streamline operations (which are very inefficient in hospitals), which were motivated by my direct experiences in medicine. Having fun is an amazing byproduct of the experience, but isn't worth the cost/time/etc. on its own, and it can be easy to waste two years if you aren't focused to some degree.

One final word of advice. If you're thinking about business, take time to do some business-y things. Listen to podcasts, read books. You can always volunteer at a university healthcare consulting group or hospital project or take on an operations role in the ED or network through friends who have left for business to find a part-time gig to give you some experience before you make a big jump.

Good luck to you!

I think that you have made some great points for attending a full time MBA program. There are pros and cons for choosing a full time MBA programs. Full time MBA programs are a great option if you can include it part of your medical school / residency training / fellowship training. If you are looking to pivot into business sector that requires an internship (such as finance), then full time MBA program is usually mandatory. An exception to this would be someone that had experience in the business sector and had a bachelors degree in business prior to entering medical school. Lastly, if you are thinking of pivoting fully out of medicine and into business, a full time MBA program may be the better option.

As for me, full time MBA was not an option for me. Since I am in a surgical specialty, I needed to practice full time and get my cases for board certification. I also have a family to support and cannot simply not work for 2 years. Hence, my two options are either online MBA (UMass Amherst online MBA is very popular with physicians) or executive MBA program. I chose the executive MBA options for many reasons that you have stated for attending a full time MBA program. I wanted the ability to bond and network with my classmates, which an online program would not offer. By choosing executive MBA program, I am well aware that I will not be able to pivot into business sectors that traditionally require or prefer internships. I am also aware that my elective options or ability to do a concentration may be limited in EMBA program.

As someone that is about to complete my EMBA program soon at one of the top business schools, I have encountered many of the same experiences that you have encountered in full time MBA program. Each semester, we are assigned a study team that you will work with on various team assignments for various courses. In every team that you are part of for each semester, you will have to learn to lead, follow, negotiate, motivate, teach, influence, etc.. Each team is assigned to an executive team coach to work on team dynamics and team issues. In addition to team coaching, students in my EMBA program also get leadership coaching and separate career coaching as well. All of this, along with the additional leadership coursework in my EMBA program, has provided a journey of self discovery and opportunities to work on areas of weakness. Since the executive MBA cohorts are much smaller than full time MBA programs, students do get to know each other well and allow for life long bonds and plenty of networking opportunities. Many of the EMBA programs at top business schools have several residential week sessions, where the EMBA students stay together in a location for 1 - 2 weeks for coursework and various activities.

One of the major misconceptions of EMBA programs is that some people consider the EMBA program to be a watered down version of full time MBA. This is not true for the EMBA programs at top business schools. As for the EMBA course work at top business schools, they usually have similar core courses as the full time MBA programs. In my program, I take the exact same core as full time MBA students and have identical professors. The difference is that my course work is delivered in a more compressed format. One of the positive experiences of any MBA program is that students learn as much from each other, as from their professor. In the EMBA program, you get the added benefits from learning from classmates with significant amount of executive experience. Several of my classmates in the EMBA program have changed positions (upward mobility) from connections amongst my classmates. Most EMBA programs have plenty of extracurricular and networking events, which full time MBA students in my school have also attended since the full time MBA students wanted to network with EMBA students to leverage the network connection for potential job opportunities in the EMBA student employers. Several EMBA programs have now added more entrepreneurial coursework and opportunities in their programs. Several of my physician classmates have started some venture projects, as result of leveraging my business school network and resources. I am currently involved with 1 venture project and 2 consulting opportunities as the result of my EMBA program.

For me, EMBA program was the best choice for me. Since I do not get financial assistance from my employer for the EMBA program, I was able to get sizeable scholarship. I just wanted to share an EMBA perspective, Lastly, not all EMBA programs are alike and one needs to do his/her due diligence when selecting an EMBA program.

 

[lp430]

I think that you have made some great points for attending a full time MBA program. There are pros and cons for choosing a full time MBA programs. Full time MBA programs are a great option if you can include it part of your medical school / residency training / fellowship training. If you are looking to pivot into business sector that requires an internship (such as finance), then full time MBA program is usually mandatory. An exception to this would be someone that had experience in the business sector and had a bachelors degree in business prior to entering medical school. Lastly, if you are thinking of pivoting fully out of medicine and into business, a full time MBA program may be the better option.

As for me, full time MBA was not an option for me. Since I am in a surgical specialty, I needed to practice full time and get my cases for board certification. I also have a family to support and cannot simply not work for 2 years. Hence, my two options are either online MBA (UMass Amherst online MBA is very popular with physicians) or executive MBA program. I chose the executive MBA options for many reasons that you have stated for attending a full time MBA program. I wanted the ability to bond and network with my classmates, which an online program would not offer. By choosing executive MBA program, I am well aware that I will not be able to pivot into business sectors that traditionally require or prefer internships. I am also aware that my elective options or ability to do a concentration may be limited in EMBA program.

As someone that is about to complete my EMBA program soon at one of the top business schools, I have encountered many of the same experiences that you have encountered in full time MBA program. Each semester, we are assigned a study team that you will work with on various team assignments for various courses. In every team that you are part of for each semester, you will have to learn to lead, follow, negotiate, motivate, teach, influence, etc.. Each team is assigned to an executive team coach to work on team dynamics and team issues. In addition to team coaching, most executive MBA students in top business school also get leadership coaching and separate career coaching as well. All of this, along with the additional leadership coursework in EMBA programs, has provided a journey of self discovery and opportunities to work on areas of weakness. Since the executive MBA cohorts are much smaller than full time MBA programs, students do get to know each other well and allow for life long bonds and plenty of networking opportunities. Many of the EMBA programs at top business schools have several residential week sessions, where the EMBA students stay together in a location for 1 - 2 weeks for coursework and various activities.

One of the major misconceptions of EMBA programs is that some people consider the EMBA program to be a watered down version of full time MBA. This is not true for the EMBA programs at top business schools. As for the EMBA course work at top business schools, they usually have the same exact core courses as the full time MBA programs. In my program, I take the exact same core as full time MBA students and have identical professors. The difference is that my course work is delivered in a more compressed format. One of the positive experiences of any MBA program is that students learn as much from each other, as from their professor. In the EMBA program, you get the added benefits from learning from classmates with significant amount of executive experience. Several of my classmates in the EMBA program have changed positions (upward mobility) from connections amongst my classmates. Most EMBA programs have plenty of extracurricular and networking events, which full time MBA students in my school have also attended since the full time MBA students wanted to network with EMBA students to leverage the network connection for potential job opportunities in the EMBA student employers. Several EMBA programs have now added more entrepreneurial coursework and opportunities in their programs. Several of my physician classmates have started some venture projects, as result of leveraging my business school network and resources. I am currently involved with 1 venture project and 2 consulting opportunities as the result of my EMBA program.

For me, EMBA program was the best choice for me. Since I do not get financial assistance from my employer for the EMBA program, I was able to get sizeable scholarship. I just wanted to share an EMBA perspective, Lastly, not all EMBA programs are alike and one needs to do his/her due diligence when selecting an EMBA program.

This is super insightful! I only know people that have done full time or online, but this breakdown of the EMBA is great! Thanks.