Pitt vs Cornell

[scorponok31]

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Hi everyone,

A lot of my friends are actually in this very difficult position. They're trying to decide btw pitt and cornell for med school. Pitt's higher ranked, but cornell's in a nicer location. The list goes on, but ultimately i think both schools are pretty similar. Without going into too many details, what would your honest suggestion be as to where to attend, especially if you're from the city of pitt itself. Any suggestions welcomed. Let's keep this thread civil.

 

[Textuality]

Weather aside, Pitt's actually a great city 🙂 I grew up around there, and really liked the city. Some of my favorite things: the Phipps conservatory (gorgeous green house), the Carnegie museum of art and natural history, south side works (and the southside area in general). There's a lot to do there from theater to tattoo parlors, and you can find something no matter what you like 🙂

 

[limbicsystem1]

I think if research is important to you, PITT is a better choice. They have more funding and more opportunities tied in with their larger campus. It's also probably cheaper to live in pitt. Not that the tuition at either school is cheap, but I question whether the tuition at cornell is worth it considering you're paying 100k to teach yourself. My choice is pitt, but otherwise, you won't end up on the street graduating from both.

 

[sylar86]

You can't go wrong with PITT

 

[1956Goldtop]

Cornell has a smaller class size and is in a ridiculously wealthy neighborhood in NYC.

I have too many good things to say about Pitt...

But one thing I should mention is don't pay attention to the rankings. Both schools are excellent and you can't go wrong with either.

 

[MsJLewis]

I don't know if Pitt necessarily beats Cornell in the research department. People often seem to over look that Cornell has, in addition to researchers at the med school, affiliations with Sloan Kettering and Rockefeller which are research powerhouses (which med students have full access to) and aren't taken into consideration when doing the USNews ppl put out their list of rankings.

You really can't go wrong with either. I was trying to decide between the two myself a while ago. When it came down to it, location won out and I declined my Pitt acceptance (but I still haven't decided if I'm going to Cornell yet!). If I were you I would look at the financial situation and decide which location you like best in order to make a decision!

Congrats and good luck!

 

[ThinkaLot]

I got interviews and acceptances at both schools, and this is what I could glean:

In general, they are both exceptional places to be for research, and they both use similar levels of PBL in their curriculum.

However, Cornell's student body was a LOT more diverse than what I saw at Pitt, which is very important to me.

Pittsburgh, overall, may be cheaper than New York City. But as someone who has lived in Manhattan for the past four years, let me just say you can always find AMAZING deals (which I couldn't match in Pittsburgh, although I only lived there for a few months). Also, going to Pitt is manageable without a car, but it definitely limits your freedom.

Pittsburgh is very much known for its transplant surgery, and pediatrics. Also, I guess nothing can beat Pitt as far as simulators go (Hello WISER), so if that's your thing...

And not that it should matter, but everyone secretly considers it: Pitt is ranked higher than Cornell. However, the Ivy League name will always carry you.

When it came down to it, I chose Cornell. A big factor was location--you just can't compare. It also seems that Cornell is as international as it gets (strong ties in Qatar, Tanzania, etc). Yay global health!

 

[EkLiLiaN]

Do not let the rankings be the main reason why you choose one school over another.
I interviewed at Pitts and wasn't too excited about the location. And as mentioned above, the diversity was a bit <<<....

This is just my 2cents 🙂

 

[krispykremes101]

I personally loved PITT. Can't say the same for nyc. It's a personal choice. But i agree with the above post. If i'm shelling out that much money for an education, I'd rather be paying for a lecturer to guide my education as opposed to devoting so much effort to organize my education on my own via pbl. I'm currently a M2 a pbl "light" school and I've disliked every ounce of pbl so far.

 

[Erina]

I got interviews and acceptances at both schools, and this is what I could glean:

In general, they are both exceptional places to be for research, and they both use similar levels of PBL in their curriculum.

However, Cornell's student body was a LOT more diverse than what I saw at Pitt, which is very important to me.

Pittsburgh, overall, may be cheaper than New York City. But as someone who has lived in Manhattan for the past four years, let me just say you can always find AMAZING deals (which I couldn't match in Pittsburgh, although I only lived there for a few months). Also, going to Pitt is manageable without a car, but it definitely limits your freedom.

Pittsburgh is very much known for its transplant surgery, and pediatrics. Also, I guess nothing can beat Pitt as far as simulators go (Hello WISER), so if that's your thing...

And not that it should matter, but everyone secretly considers it: Pitt is ranked higher than Cornell. However, the Ivy League name will always carry you.

When it came down to it, I chose Cornell. A big factor was location--you just can't compare. It also seems that Cornell is as international as it gets (strong ties in Qatar, Tanzania, etc). Yay global health!

i'm surprised to hear you don't think our student body is diverse. Pitt definitely believes in the importance of a diverse student body and puts a lot of effort into making sure that happens. I think we have a wide range of people in our class--maybe it's not completely obvious based on the color of people's skin, but the age range is huge and we have people from many different backgrounds. People who don't look like they add to the diversity actually do.

I'm sorry you didn't see the diversity when you were here. I don't know much about the second year class, but I wish you could see our class!

 

[uni8685]

I am also in the same situation-- although i'm leaning towards Cornell, I just got a letter in the mail from Pitt offering an absurd amount of academic scholarship money-- in addition to need based grants. If Cornell cannot match this, then it would be difficult for me to turn down Pitt.

As far as my decision making, a couple things are important to me. Match Possiblities, Research, Location, Curriculum, and Fin aid (in no particular order).

I haven't seen a match list for Pitt, and while i'm sure its excellent, I extremely impressed with Cornell's (people matching in Derm, Optho, and other specialties at top centers in the country). That said, I do feel its difficult to compare match lists of schools in the top tier-- too many variables involved-- = Toss up

In terms of research, UPMC is renowned, its one of the better established and most comprehensive med centers in the world. Pitt student's have access to that and whaterver resources its undergraduate campuses have to offer. Alternatively, Cornell has the powerhouses of NYP, MSKCC, HSS, and da Rock. In my particular situation, I went to undergrad at Cornell and through those networks have been able to communicate and form relationships with investigators at many of these institutions-- thus I kinda already have a foot in the door I guess at Cornell for competitive research. (Is this reasoning valid? Please keep me in check here...) = Point Cornell

Both schools have PBL, from my understanding, while Cornell does market itself as all PBL, it is in fact probably 30-40% of a day's work, as lectures, labs etc are among the daily routine. Classes are graded h/p/f, which I don't necessarily mind-- I hear that people aren't competitive so the honors doesnt get people bent out of shape. Also, Cornell gets out of class ~1pm. Pitt on the other hand does have pbl, I suspect its on par in terms of commitment with Cornell's, but just that they don't market it to being that way. Also, from what I remember, they have the first two weeks of anatomy, which I think is pretty cool.... (anything else i'm missing here? Current Pitt students?)
= Toss Up

As far as location, c'mon, let's be real. Manhattan>>>>>Pittsburgh. In terms of cost of living, Olin Hall is $500/month. That is absurd. Also, in med skoo we'll be able to find free meals readily avaible on a daily basis at both schools. I think that living frugally and spending prudently is more of an individual discipline question rather than blaming what is an expensive city. If you want to live cheaply in manhattan, it's definitely doable. = Point Cornell

As far as fin aid goes, I find it difficult to simply believe that one school is better than the other based on avg. Grad indebtness, the values calculated in the msar leave out a number of variables that may be and are often important to many people. I think its best to compare fin aid packages once you get them from the school. Right now for me Pitt is winning in this category, (I haven't received my package from Cornell yet) though I find it difficult for Cornell to match Pitt's scholarship. = Point Pitt

Sorry for the long response, I think this was meant more for me to rationally step through this decision making. Notice, the lack of usnwr ranking mention. Please people, do not use rankings to make decisions about schools-- you're stunting your medical education if you choose to do so. Remember, rankings and prestige do not save lives! Good luck. Oh and Pre-Pitters, how was second look weekend? I wasn't able to make it up....

 

[zod4321]

-

 

[uni8685]

Hi, first off. congrats on your acceptances. You're going to be a doctor!

Now to my perspective. I'm currently a med student in boston, meaning I have no ties/affiliations to bias my opinions about these two schools. I actually didn't know that PITT had some pbl in its curriculum. But now that I do based on the above post, that just reinforces my earlier beliefs regarding these two places. Honestly, I really see no difference between PITT and Cornell in terms of academics, curriculum, match list, research opportunities, and reputation. They're pretty much equal. Where you do find a difference is in location and financial aid. Both schools have their downsides too so they're not perfect.

I also want to lay down my perspective on the ongoing theme of research opportunities. Regardless of where you go, provided that the school has decent funding, your research experience will not differ. Constantly claiming that cornell has msk, hsp, etc doesn't make sense b/c you can ultimatley only join one lab. I'm not picking on cornell, but i'm just using it as an example of a common theme i see on sdn that I feel is extrapolated too far. Research is research. Doesn't matter how many labs surround you. If you get a pub in an unknown lab, i don't think anyone would disagree that that is a bigger accomplishment that saying you worked in a lab at hopkins w/o any publication.

anyways, i sorta went off topic.

i say, look more at financial aid and what location works best for you.

I agree wholeheartedly. Which is why many admissions directors, deans, etc will tell you that the use of NIH funding as a measure of a student's medical education/propensity for research is useless. Moreover, I believe the main reason that I as have others tend to quote mskcc, hss, and da rock as research possibilities, is because there seems to be a common misconception that the only institution available to weill students is nyph. Labs, researchers etc seem to be no less available to Cornell students as is what's available to their peers uptown, in Boston, Baltimore, Philly, Pitt, etc. The fact of the matter -- and what the above post seems to suggest, is that as med students, research will be available to us. While name and prestige may matter to some degree, the sheer quality of what is produced as research is determined by our competency as researchers/med students. Furthermore, I think students should evaluate things on a personal level, for me this seems to be in terms of relative access (though i may be naieve). I subjectively think Cornell is a better opportunity than Pitt in terms of research because a number of physicians/scientists have already asked me to work with them-- so this is perhaps due to ease of access for me. This is clearly subjective-- but I think its fair for each of us to make decisions along such paradigms.

What do you all think?

 

[iatrogenic7]

this is a no brainer.. go with cornell unless you have personal reasons to be in pittsburgh

pitt isn't in the same league as schools such as cornell, pritzker, baylor, vanderbilt, etc.

keep in mind that pitt is a public school that gives slight preference to local PA residents, and as reflected in their match list, retention rates, etc. it simply cannot compete with aforementioned institutions to attract
the brightest students and faculty.

on the other hand, while cornell isn't in the same level as harvard, stanford, and JHU, it is a great school with exceptional resources (MSKCC, HSS, Rockefeller).

 

[uni8685]

Wait, where'd you see Pitt's match list?

 

[shantster]

this is a no brainer.. go with cornell unless you have personal reasons to be in pittsburgh

pitt isn't in the same league as schools such as cornell, pritzker, baylor, vanderbilt, etc.

keep in mind that pitt is a public school that gives slight preference to local PA residents, and as reflected in their match list, retention rates, etc. it simply cannot compete with aforementioned institutions to attract
the brightest students and faculty.

on the other hand, while cornell isn't in the same level as harvard, stanford, and JHU, it is a great school with exceptional resources (MSKCC, HSS, Rockefeller).

Where do people keep getting that Pitt is a public school? It's a private school. People come from all over the country (and that's obvious if you meet people in the class). Our match list looked pretty good this year (which again, why are you looking at match lists as a pre-med when you don't know which programs are the premier for their specialty?), and the reason that many people match here is because they rank Pitt really high. When you look at match lists you never get an idea of where people ranked their places so it's not a good indication of where people could go. I remember last year that on one of my interviews the admissions office told us that having a lot of people match at their institution is a good sign since they are the people that know their clinical training experience and thought that it was so good that they wanted to continue their training there.

And our faculty is great. I personally know that Pitt has been taking stem cell researchers from Harvard. I don't know how you can say we can't compete with people to get faculty.

 

[iatrogenic7]

Where do people keep getting that Pitt is a public school? It's a private school. People come from all over the country (and that's obvious if you meet people in the class). Our match list looked pretty good this year (which again, why are you looking at match lists as a pre-med when you don't know which programs are the premier for their specialty?), and the reason that many people match here is because they rank Pitt really high. When you look at match lists you never get an idea of where people ranked their places so it's not a good indication of where people could go. I remember last year that on one of my interviews the admissions office told us that having a lot of people match at their institution is a good sign since they are the people that know their clinical training experience and thought that it was so good that they wanted to continue their training there.

And our faculty is great. I personally know that Pitt has been taking stem cell researchers from Harvard. I don't know how you can say we can't compete with people to get faculty.

Why don't you go to wikipedia and look up your own school and tell me whether it's public or private?

I'm not trying to take away any credit from Pitt.. it is a strong program. As far as match list goes, both Cornell and Pitt students match into their home programs with alot of success. You don't have to get defensive about alot of your graduates matching at UPMC. Believe me, alot of Cornell kids match into NYP.

 

[Erina]

this is a no brainer.. go with cornell unless you have personal reasons to be in pittsburgh

pitt isn't in the same league as schools such as cornell, pritzker, baylor, vanderbilt, etc.

keep in mind that pitt is a public school that gives slight preference to local PA residents, and as reflected in their match list, retention rates, etc. it simply cannot compete with aforementioned institutions to attract
the brightest students and faculty.

on the other hand, while cornell isn't in the same level as harvard, stanford, and JHU, it is a great school with exceptional resources (MSKCC, HSS, Rockefeller).

why do you say pitt isn't in the same league as those other schools? pitt's very well known in the residency world.

And if you insist on using wikipedia as a source, "The School of Medicine is included as a member of the "13 School Consortium" of elite medical schools. Members of this group include Case Western Reserve University School of Medicine, Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons, Duke University School of Medicine, Harvard Medical School, Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine, Stanford University School of Medicine, Pritzker School of Medicine (University of Chicago), University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine, University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine, University of Rochester School of Medicine and Dentistry, Washington University School of Medicine, Weill Cornell Medical College of Cornell University, and Yale University School of Medicine."

 

[iatrogenic7]

why do you say pitt isn't in the same league as those other schools? pitt's very well known in the residency world.

And if you insist on using wikipedia as a source, "The School of Medicine is included as a member of the "13 School Consortium" of elite medical schools. Members of this group include Case Western Reserve University School of Medicine, Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons, Duke University School of Medicine, Harvard Medical School, Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine, Stanford University School of Medicine, Pritzker School of Medicine (University of Chicago), University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine, University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine, University of Rochester School of Medicine and Dentistry, Washington University School of Medicine, Weill Cornell Medical College of Cornell University, and Yale University School of Medicine."

'13 School Consortium' meets twice a year to discuss med school applicants and this is irrelevant to the question originally posed by the OP. Would you weigh Harvard vs. Rochester on equal terms because both are in the Consortium? All 13 are great schools and there are more great schools not included in the consortium as well, but there are large differences even within this select group of schools.

 

[uni8685]

Why don't you go to wikipedia and look up your own school and tell me whether it's public or private?

I'm not trying to take away any credit from Pitt.. it is a strong program. As far as match list goes, both Cornell and Pitt students match into their home programs with alot of success. You don't have to get defensive about alot of your graduates matching at UPMC. Believe me, alot of Cornell kids match into NYP.

Again, where did you find the Pitt match lists? And how can you objectively compare match lists between so called 'top tier' schools? In conversations with knowlegeble people in the industry-- namely attendings/deans etc. Way too many variables are involved in the match system to compare schools upon. I find it difficult and even ludicrous to believe pre-meds that try and compare match lists so as to definitively say that one school is better than another. That said, I would love to see where and what Pitt students are matching in. So if you have this info, please share.

Oh, and Pitt is public and has been since the mid twentieth cent, although it was founded private. Not that this matters in anyway-- the class, as someone who would know (a Pitt student) mentioned above, is extremely diverse with respect to region. Although on my interview there, it didnt seem like racial/ethinic diversity was that great, maybe I just came on a bad day? Anyways, if you're saying Pitt is not as great because its Public (in terms of class/regional diversity) to be blunt, you're mistaken.

 

[scorponok31]

keep in mind that pitt is a public school that gives slight preference to local PA residents, and as reflected in their match list, retention rates, etc. it simply cannot compete with aforementioned institutions to attract
the brightest students and faculty.

Thanks guys. these comments are really helpful and quite insightful. However, regarding the above comment, I actually disagree. Certainly, private school students have access to more resources given the larger endowment of their colleges, but in terms of attracting the brightest students and faculty....that's a bold statement that is quite erroneous. I'm pretty sure university of washington and the california public medical schools recruit students of a caliber equal or greater than those recruited by any other top 20 school. Unfortunatley, i didn't get into uwash or cali uc's. But anyways, what have you guys heard in terms of student satisfaction at either school. How do these schools compare in terms of living up to student expectations. I've noticed there's a huge difference between wanting to go to a school and actually liking it while there. Anything hear anything?

 

[iatrogenic7]

Again, where did you find the Pitt match lists? And how can you objectively compare match lists between so called 'top tier' schools? In conversations with knowlegeble people in the industry-- namely attendings/deans etc. Way too many variables are involved in the match system to compare schools upon. I find it difficult and even ludicrous to believe pre-meds that try and compare match lists so as to definitively say that one school is better than another. That said, I would love to see where and what Pitt students are matching in. So if you have this info, please share.

Oh, and Pitt is public and has been since the mid twentieth cent, although it was founded private. Not that this matters in anyway-- the class, as someone who would know (a Pitt student) mentioned above, is extremely diverse with respect to region. Although on my interview there, it didnt seem like racial/ethinic diversity was that great, maybe I just came on a bad day? Anyways, if you're saying Pitt is not as great because its Public (in terms of class/regional diversity) to be blunt, you're mistaken.

I received a copy of their match list on my interview day. As you said, there's no objective way of comparing match lists. But it could be used to give you a rough idea of where you could head after graduation.

 

[Monkey House]

Everything in Pitt is so cheap compared to NYC. You can get such an awesome apt and fill it with cool stuff vs. living in a dorm.

Basically both offer the same caliber education but Pitt offers a lifestyle where you can come home to a nice place, feel comfortable, and actually afford stuff!

Go Pitt! But Cornell is cool too...

 

[iatrogenic7]

Thanks guys. these comments are really helpful and quite insightful. However, regarding the above comment, I actually disagree. Certainly, private school students have access to more resources given the larger endowment of their colleges, but in terms of attracting the brightest students and faculty....that's a bold statement that is quite erroneous. I'm pretty sure university of washington and the california public medical schools recruit students of a caliber equal or greater than those recruited by any other top 20 school. Unfortunatley, i didn't get into uwash or cali uc's. But anyways, what have you guys heard in terms of student satisfaction at either school. How do these schools compare in terms of living up to student expectations. I've noticed there's a huge difference between wanting to go to a school and actually liking it while there. Anything hear anything?

Have you even been accepted to these schools?

I am only sharing my opinion based on the experiences I had this year interviewing at both of these schools. And I will choose Cornell over Pitt any day.

 

[uni8685]

Have you even been accepted to these schools?

I am only sharing my opinion based on the experiences I had this year interviewing at both of these schools. And I will choose Cornell over Pitt any day.

I have been accepted to both schools as other people on this thread have. I'll look at the packet Pitt gave us. Though I do not remember seeing a match list there. Hopefully i'm wrong. Thanks. Best of luck to all of you.

 

[shantster]

Why don't you go to wikipedia and look up your own school and tell me whether it's public or private?

I'm not trying to take away any credit from Pitt.. it is a strong program. As far as match list goes, both Cornell and Pitt students match into their home programs with alot of success. You don't have to get defensive about alot of your graduates matching at UPMC. Believe me, alot of Cornell kids match into NYP.

Actually, besides knowing that it's a private school, AAMC lists it as a private school. That's a much better source than using wikipedia.

http://www.aamc.org/students/applying/admissions.htm

And the reason that I got so defensive about matching into UPMC (which is a fantasic institution that dominates the city) is because of this quote from you:

keep in mind that pitt is a public school that gives slight preference to local PA residents, and as reflected in their match list, retention rates, etc. it simply cannot compete with aforementioned institutions to attract
the brightest students and faculty.

I simply don't like people saying that we don't attract the brightest students or can't match where we want, especially when they use completely false information to make their claims.

And FYI, someone posted our match list on a thread with them somewhere. Again, I don't think that it's relevant to you since you have no idea where people ranked as their preferences.


To the OP: We are very happy at Pitt here. If you came to second look you would have realized it. If you have more specific questions, feel free to PM me.

 

[1956Goldtop]

this is a no brainer.. go with cornell unless you have personal reasons to be in pittsburgh

pitt isn't in the same league as schools such as cornell, pritzker, baylor, vanderbilt, etc.

Yet, it is ranked higher than all of those schools.

PS I don't care about rankings, but I wanted to demonstrate how wrong that comment is.

Pitt is regarded on the same level or higher than all of those schools you listed.

 

[searun]

Yet, it is ranked higher than all of those schools.

PS I don't care about rankings, but I wanted to demonstrate how wrong that comment is.

Pitt is regarded on the same level or higher than all of those schools you listed.

I agree but I think people not in the know just do not respect Pittsburgh, as a city. Pretty lowbrow but that is the way it is.

 

[krispykremes101]

I usually don't talk about rankings, but with the recent slew of egregious erroneous statements, I feel the need to highlight a basic point.

i know the truth bites, but to be honest, saying that pitt is not in the same league as cornell is just plain idiotic. I know most of you want to stick with your old-world ivy mentality, but seriously, get with reality and accept today's rankings. Cornell barely made the top 20. enuff said.

 

[uni8685]

Shots fired!! Ok guys, tone down the pointless negative rhetoric. Is it possible to carryout an intellectual conversation without referencing illegitimate rankings? Some of us here are actually considering both schools and would like to hear rational people discuss differences and similarities between the two schools.

 

[Textuality]

I vote Pitt. Cozy and cultural city, extremely devoted faculty, sim center like you'll never see elsewhere, and great opportunities via the UPMC umbrella. Pitt's also the only med school in the city, whereas there are like...5 in NYC at least? I feel like that should work to your advantage as a pitt student.

But for those curious, in US today's 2009 edition, cornell ranks .1 pts higher in terms of residency director's view of them. But it's only .1 (5pt scale)

 

[edfig99]

Shots fired!! Ok guys, tone down the pointless negative rhetoric. Is it possible to carryout an intellectual conversation without referencing illegitimate rankings? Some of us here are actually considering both schools and would like to hear rational people discuss differences and similarities between the two schools.

as you've probably already realized by now, there's very little that's truly rational about the whole med school admissions process. up is down, down is up...etc.

i've told many an applicant before - the reality is a med school is a med school is a med school. at least for allo schools, they're accredited by the same body with the same standards and though ultimately each school has their own way of meeting those standards, at the end of the day you will have a top notch education wherever you go. your job is to do the best you can (and then some) regardless where you end up.

while i would love all the students that i've interviewed and have been accepted to come to wcmc, I have always told them it's a matter of "fit". you just have to decide where you think you'll fit in the most. It often will not be a matter of curriculum or resources, it won't be what research is available, it's certainly not match lists, and I personally never cared for USNews rankings -- not when I was applying, and not now. Both schools and medical systems are well regarded and the opportunities for students are sometimes overwhelming at either campus.

Ultimately it's going to come down to that vibe you feel in your gut -- whether it's reliving the interview day and tours from your memory, or from the revisit weekends.

And if that doesn't help, and all other factors (including financial aid) are equal...heck, flip a coin. you won't go wrong either way.

 

[uni8685]

THanks!!

 

[zod4321]

Seriously guys, PITT and Weill are too equal to say that one blows out the other. Your experiences at both will be roughly the same. The type of students you see at both will be roughly the same. The only differences lies in the features that allowed pitt to go higher in the rankings than cornell. But these differences won't alter your experience. Ultimately, i think pitt is more recognized for medicine though. my just opinion.

 

[NEpats]

I don't know if this is significant to most of you. But how good are each other's PBL's? I know that if they don't design/organize them well, then it can be a waste of time.

Any thoughts about PBL in each place guys?????

 

[limbicsystem1]

I don't know if this is significant to most of you. But how good are each other's PBL's? I know that if they don't design/organize them well, then it can be a waste of time.

Any thoughts about PBL in each place guys?????

I hear pbl in general is difficult to deal with. However, I've heard multiple perspectives from those who attended Weill that after they finished a few years at weill, they felt as if they had learned no medicine. Could be just that they weren't a good fit for pbl to begin with. But the weird thing is I only hear this experience echoed by people at weill.

 

[Textuality]

I think Pitt was actually one of the first school's to pioneer pbl. Didn't hear any complaints about it while I was there.

 

[edfig99]

I don't know if this is significant to most of you. But how good are each other's PBL's? I know that if they don't design/organize them well, then it can be a waste of time.

Any thoughts about PBL in each place guys?????

PBL is a component of WCMC's curriculum -- it's not a PBL only school, but rather a portion of an integrated curriculum in the basic science years. THere is PBL all of i think 4 hours a week. There are journal clubs, small groups, labs, and lectures. I personally loved the experience and came out well prepared to think on my feet and start residency which is where you'll really learn everything you need to learn for the practice of medicine, not med school. Some of my classmates hated their experience...but to be honest I'm not sure they would have been happy ANYWHERE. I am the first to admit it's not a good fit for some. Some of it depends on the facilitator, and some on the group dynamic. It's hard to predict what type of experience it will be for most. I do think that a person suited for a curriculum that involves >= 2/3rds of the time in a small group setting is one that is okay with uncertainty and not knowing everything, working well with others, comfortable with feedback - both positive and negative, able to take a leadership role in a small group and also blend into the background and disciplined enough to flesh out what you need to outside of the classroom, at your own pace. This is adult learning.

People bash PBL curricula for a number of reasons, and someone inevitably makes the comment of why pay to learn from your classmates, it's better to have someone lecture you...but those are the same people that ultimately stop going to class and just read transcripts and lecture notes...so why pay so much money to read on your own? It at least makes the process of learning a little more real and somewhat enjoyable. It's been the curriculum here since my class started back in '96 - so they have 10, 12 years with it.

 

[dbhvt]

I don't know if Pitt necessarily beats Cornell in the research department. People often seem to over look that Cornell has, in addition to researchers at the med school, affiliations with Sloan Kettering and Rockefeller which are research powerhouses (which med students have full access to) and aren't taken into consideration when doing the USNews ppl put out their list of rankings.

This isn't true. Affiliated institutions are part of total research dollars considered in the rankings. In fact, Cornell's administration considered the impact on the rankings when adding a recent affiliation (I forget where, but the purpose was to up total research dollars).

Now for the advice:
As I remember, Pitt and Cornell are VERY different in both location and curriculum. When I was comparing the two, Pitt won on curriculum and Cornell won on location (I ended up going elsewhere, though). You know how both sit with your gut. THe trick is just balancing those two.

I wouldn't try to make any distinctions about prestige. I think Cornell is every bit as well respected as Pitt. Regionally, Cornell will edge out Pitt in the new york area, and Pitt will edge out Cornell in western PA and OH. Otherwise, it's a wash.

 

[scorponok31]

Thanks everyone again for all these comments. they're really constructive and helpful. The vote among my friends is also not unanimous, but it appears to be leaning towards going to PITT. I've shared the feedback i've gotten here with them and I think they also thought it was quite helpful.

 

[IcePanda]

Thanks everyone again for all these comments. they're really constructive and helpful. The vote among my friends is also not unanimous, but it appears to be leaning towards going to PITT. I've shared the feedback i've gotten here with them and I think they also thought it was quite helpful.

Weren't you the troll on the PENN vs. Cornell thread? I really hope you go to Pitt so that I don't have to deal with you next year at Cornell. I vote for PITT! YEAH! WOO!

 

[Itistime]

this is a no brainer.. go with cornell unless you have personal reasons to be in pittsburgh

pitt isn't in the same league as schools such as cornell, pritzker, baylor, vanderbilt, etc.

keep in mind that pitt is a public school that gives slight preference to local PA residents, and as reflected in their match list, retention rates, etc. it simply cannot compete with aforementioned institutions to attract
the brightest students and faculty.

on the other hand, while cornell isn't in the same level as harvard, stanford, and JHU, it is a great school with exceptional resources (MSKCC, HSS, Rockefeller).

Switch around pitt and baylor and you've got it right.

Pitt is well reputed around the country whereas baylor isn't as well known outside of texas.

Pitt has one of the best regenerative sciences institutes in the world along with the monster that is UPMC. The area that the school is located leaves something to be desired, but that doesn't take away from the awesome reputation and education you'll get there.

I didn't apply to cornell, but I did interview at columbia, and the NY-Presby hospital is awesome (I know cornell and columbia students don't rotate thru the same area, but still). Also New York is just New York, I mean come on.

 

[sylar86]

Weren't you the troll on the PENN vs. Cornell thread? I really hope you go to Pitt so that I don't have to deal with you next year at Cornell. I vote for PITT! YEAH! WOO!

You're making the right choice. If you go to cornell you'll be around defensive people like that who will always be lsensitive and annoying b/c they couldn't cut it into the top 15 schools.

 

[1956Goldtop]

... Penn isn't a top 15 school?

 

[Itistime]

You're making the right choice. If you go to cornell you'll be around defensive people like that who will always be lsensitive and annoying b/c they couldn't cut it into the top 15 schools.

Some people just love New York...it's not fair to generalize a whole class like that. That being said, I don't think it's hardly the case that folks who go to Cornell couldn't cut it at those other schools. I'd say that the top 25 schools are all excellent schools and no one should feel bitter about going to any of them.

 

[IcePanda]

You're making the right choice. If you go to cornell you'll be around defensive people like that who will always be lsensitive and annoying b/c they couldn't cut it into the top 15 schools.

I will always be defensive, sensitive, and annoying because I couldn't get in to a top 15 school. Right. Except I'm turning down UPenn to go to Cornell.

 

[laost825]

An affiliated hospital for Cornell would be NY Hospital Queens, or Lincoln Hospital, or Methodist hospital. These are the institutions that Cornell/NYP considers when adding an affiliate. SKI and Rockefeller would not be considered affiliates in terms of research dollars because they are *not* faculty at Cornell. If you add the $ from those two institutions Cornell jumps. I've seen the math done on this forum, but I can't remember when or where.

Look, the point is: the rankings are meaningless. And Cornell is an example, where the major research centers we have access to are not considered in the rankings for the medical school. Pitt and Cornell are both prestigious, with great training programs, great doctors, great students, and PBL. When you get to medical school, everything will be put in a better perspective.

Go where you will be happy.

L

This isn't true. Affiliated institutions are part of total research dollars considered in the rankings. In fact, Cornell's administration considered the impact on the rankings when adding a recent affiliation (I forget where, but the purpose was to up total research dollars).

Now for the advice:
As I remember, Pitt and Cornell are VERY different in both location and curriculum. When I was comparing the two, Pitt won on curriculum and Cornell won on location (I ended up going elsewhere, though). You know how both sit with your gut. THe trick is just balancing those two.

I wouldn't try to make any distinctions about prestige. I think Cornell is every bit as well respected as Pitt. Regionally, Cornell will edge out Pitt in the new york area, and Pitt will edge out Cornell in western PA and OH. Otherwise, it's a wash.

 

[Textuality]

I will always be defensive, sensitive, and annoying because I couldn't get in to a top 15 school. Right. Except I'm turning down UPenn to go to Cornell.

Really? You're my hero 🙂
I'm still in UPenn limbo

 

[TheBigGREEN]

Where do people keep getting that Pitt is a public school? It's a private school. People come from all over the country (and that's obvious if you meet people in the class). Our match list looked pretty good this year (which again, why are you looking at match lists as a pre-med when you don't know which programs are the premier for their specialty?), and the reason that many people match here is because they rank Pitt really high. When you look at match lists you never get an idea of where people ranked their places so it's not a good indication of where people could go. I remember last year that on one of my interviews the admissions office told us that having a lot of people match at their institution is a good sign since they are the people that know their clinical training experience and thought that it was so good that they wanted to continue their training there.

And our faculty is great. I personally know that Pitt has been taking stem cell researchers from Harvard. I don't know how you can say we can't compete with people to get faculty.

alot of people see schools names after cities and states and assume its a public school. happens to PENN alot as well, also NYU...mostly by people not in the "know".