Please help me learn to understand.

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I believe I just failed my orgo test. I just want some advice in regards to orgo, and learning in general. I don't think I've ever felt so terrible after a test before.I studied my tail off, starting about a week and a half to two weeks ago (that's about when we started the material for this exam). I did a lot of practice, but I just can't seem to pinpoint my weaknesses. I'm not understanding the material enough; I feel like I'm just studying something that's beyond my abilities. I know it's the end of the semester and therefore too late to do anything about my grade (other than studying for the final), but how could I have understood the material better? I did practice problems, but I don't know, it just didn't click for me. I appreciate any advice. Also, I feel like I need to drop out of the institution I'm at, I feel I don't belong here. I'm so unintelligent compared to my peers, I feel so bad about myself every time I'm around them. I can't figure out how to do anything correctly.
 
Perhaps that is where I went wrong. I redid problems we had done before. I couldn't do new problems, because I didn't understand the material enough! How do I get to the base of that? Where do I go to understand the information without memorizing mechanisms?

"Elaborate on "I did practice problems.""
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Tawantinsuyu said:
How do I get myself to actually think and use my brain?
Click to expand...

Always ask why. Why would this molecule attack that one? Why is this more acidic than that, and what does that mean for the reaction?

If you don't understand why things are happening the way they are, then all you are left with is memorization.

I think you have identified your problem in post #3. As far as where you can go to get a better "base," maybe try some sort of supplemental material that is written in a more conversational tone than a textbook. The "Organic Chemistry as a Second Language" books, for example.

Also, attempt the new problems anyway, even if you don't think you can learn anything from them. You can.
 
Wasted Energy said:
Always ask why. Why would this molecule attack that one? Why is this more acidic than that, and what does that mean for the reaction?

If you don't understand why things are happening the way they are, then all you are left with is memorization.

I think you have identified your problem in post #3. As far as where you can go to get a better "base," maybe try some sort of supplemental material that is written in a more conversational tone than a textbook. The "Organic Chemistry as a Second Language" books, for example.

Also, attempt the new problems anyway, even if you don't think you can learn anything from them. You can.
Click to expand...


I do use "Organic Chemistry as a Second Language", but I find myself simply memorizing the information from that. How do I stop myself from memorizing? How do I engage a higher level of thinking? Memorization is the lowest form of thinking.
 
Tawantinsuyu said:
I do use "Organic Chemistry as a Second Language", but I find myself simply memorizing the information from that. How do I stop myself from memorizing? How do I engage a higher level of thinking? Memorization is the lowest form of thinking.
Click to expand...

You're going to have to force yourself to stop avoiding "new" practice problems as you mentioned earlier. Get out of your comfort zone, because you won't learn anything new there. You said that you usually only practice problems that you have already done; that will not build your critical thinking skills. Attempting new problems will.

You said that you "study your tail off," so I know that you are familiar with the concepts (nucleophilicity vs. basicity, acid/base, sterics, etc.) Only when you start to use these concepts to understand why the reactions happen the way that they do can you become less dependent on memorization.
 
Tawantinsuyu said:
I do use "Organic Chemistry as a Second Language", but I find myself simply memorizing the information from that. How do I stop myself from memorizing? How do I engage a higher level of thinking? Memorization is the lowest form of thinking.
Click to expand...

I think @Wasted Energy hit the nail pretty well on the head. It's important to understand the big picture and understand why the mechanism works, not just what it does. If you find yourself studying and you're just memorizing concepts, steps, reagents, etc, stop and think about why they work. Sometimes you have to go on faith and take the professor's word that it just works, but a lot of times you can deduce how something works logically.

Example: Knowing electron donating groups on a 6 membered aromatic ring are ortho and para directors vs. knowing EDG's are o and p directors because they resonance stabilize the intermediate carbo-cation, and you're able to draw the different resonance structures.

That's the kind of understanding that separates the people who do well on exams vs. people who destroy their exams, at least in my opinion. Understanding the concept and why it works will allow you to use that concept and apply it more broadly, which I'm guessing is what your professor is testing on.
 
This is what worked for me, and I hope it helps you. I knew I was struggling in orgo pretty much immediately after the class started and changed what I was doing DRASTICALLY. After I made the change, I ended up missing only 5 points throughout the entire semester.

First, is this orgo 1 or 2?

Here's what I do:
-go to lecture and FOCUS. If you are having trouble understanding the material, I know it can be hard to figure out what is important for notes. It worked for me, but you may want to switch up step 1 and 2 (below).
-read ALL of the corresponding material in the book. If you absolutely know a section is not covered (if this was explicitly stated by your professor), don't worry about it (unless you want to get a head start on the MCAT and it is on the topic list). Otherwise, read every word. Highlight if that kind of thing works for you. After each section, take notes on the most important points. I write down everything that I am not 100% sure I will remember next time. In the beginning, that's A LOT of stuff. As chapters progress, it gets to be less and less because you've truly learned the material from previous chapters and the concepts are repetitive. I also keep a separate list of every reaction/mechanism, regardless of if it is explicitly tested, because if you don't know all of your available reactions, multi-step synthesis and retrosynthetic analysis can be really difficult. I do put little notes in the columns to remind myself if the mechanism is tested or if I just need to know the reactants, reagents, and products, but as time goes on, you start to intuitively understand the mechanism even if you don't memorize it, because atoms generally behave one way or another and again, that's repetitive.
-after I am finished reading the chapters for a test, I print my notes and study from them, highlighting as needed. From that point on, unless I get confused and can't find clarification in my own notes, I do not refer to the book again.
-Does your professor assign problems? If so, do all of them. I do the in section problems after I've finished reading/highlighting the section and finished taking notes on it. I do the end of chapter problems after I've finished all of the note taking for the chapter. By that point, you should have completed enough in chapter questions that you don't have to refer to notes to do the problems. If you can't figure out a problem, DO NOT look up the answer. Struggle for at least 5 full minutes and run through (in your mind) the notes you just took over the chapter. If you still can't figure it out, you go back to your notes, not to the answer key. You should be able to figure it out now. If not, you didn't write down something that is obviously important. Go back to the right section in the book, figure out what you're missing, add it to your notes, and complete the problem (again, try this first without referring back to the notes). Your very last resort is the answer key. Rinse and repeat.
-use the practice tests as your very last practice material. You should be so ready for your test that you could pretend the practice test is the real test and be happy with your score. This is your best and possibly only chance to see how the professor tests the material. Don't waste this valuable resource when you still need extra practice.

Other tips:
-I do add little margin notes into my practice problems notebook, and the notes are color coded. If I get something wrong, I add a note in one color telling me (in one sentence) what I was missing. If I don't agree with the answer, I add a star next to it with another color. (By the way, this happens a lot...I don't know if we are just using a poorly edited book, but the book DOES have errors, so watch for them! If the answer is opposite to your intuition, don't just assume the book is right. I constantly ask my professor for clarifications.)
-I do not check my answers until I am finished with all of the end of section/end of chapter problems, unless I truly do not know the answer and I would be wasting my practice material by answering any more questions on the topic. I probably look up 2-3 problems per chapter while I'm still working and all others are checked together at the end. I feel like this helps because it simulates test conditions, it keeps me from accidentally seeing other answers, and it keeps me from just saying, "Well, I don't know this, so I guess I'll look it up."

Sorry for the novel, but I hope it helps.
 
Alright. Well after all of your advice, I wish I could restart the semester. Given that my final is in one week, what do you think I can do?
 
I'll give you my advice, coming from someone who's favorite class is both orgo and biochem, and I got the highest grade in my orgo classes.

The reason, I think, why people do bad, or are even "afraid" or orgo is because a) they don't give themselves enough practice/ time and b) not fully grasping concepts, or are trying to memorize everything (most of the time, Orgo is NOT the subject for crude memorization).

I'm glad that you knew to give yourself time, but I don't think you need that much time in my honest opinion. Four days for me worked really good. My exams were always on Mondays and I studied Thursday-Sunday.

What really worked for me was to go over what I learned in class right away (or at least as soon as possible). By allowing yourself to engage and practice the material right after lecture, you understand the concepts early on, even if you don't grasp them fully right away. And if you can't grasp them fully right away, it's time you go to your professor's office hours. I usually went at least once a week to clear up any issues I had- even ten minutes visiting could help a lot. If that isn't enough, definitely try tutoring.

The biggest problem I saw for a lot of students in my orgo classes was that they believe it's all memorization. Don't be fooled by this, and definitely don't be one of the people that pulls an all nighter or two before the test. You will most likely do bad. Besides going through notes, I liked to test my knowledge on what I learned right away. Do all the practice problems your professor assigns in general, but do the problems specific to what you're doing in lecture. I also found it helpful to look over the chapter before the lecture- you experience the concepts early, so you don't get lost in lecture, which can happen in orgo a lot. Focus on these things as well: memorizing reactions (all i memorized in orgo), nomenclature, and then concepts. Concepts I believe should be last because you have the foundation from everything else. And for reactions, it's REALLY helpful to make notecards, and memorize them (reagents and what they do) early, so that way when you actually study for your exam, you focus on the bulk of the exam, saving you time. For mechanisms, i found it good to write them down on paper over and over until I got them. With anything in orgo, PRACTICE MAKES PERFECT!!! Literally. I sometimes did all the problems 10 times just to make sure I knew them. I know a lot of people struggle with synthesis- definitely know your reagents, and then do all synthesis problems until you feel comfortable in handling a big one on the exam. It's also helpful to make ones up with your friends and then exchange them for extra practice. Spectroscopy could be an issue too. I liked this site for extra practice: http://orgchem.colorado.edu/Spectroscopy/Problems/1.html

Big overall pointers:
-Practice, practice, practice
-Review notes as soon as you can
-Get help early- don't be shy!
-Give yourself time

While I know you may be discouraged, and this may sound cliche as hell, but don't give up, especially if medicine is your dream. Don't give up on something that you can't go a day without thinking about. That's honestly what keeps me going. Keep working hard! Ochem is a challenging course, but that doesn't mean you can't do well. Take advantage of your resources and once again, PRACTICE!!

If you have any other questions, or need other suggestions, please let me know (Message me), and I'll be glad to help- Good luck!
 
Tawantinsuyu said:
Alright. Well after all of your advice, I wish I could restart the semester. Given that my final is in one week, what do you think I can do?
Click to expand...

Take our advice, study hard and work hard. That's all you can do, but I think if you just look to get a higher understanding of the material, you'll be in really good shape man.
 
Tawantinsuyu said:
Alright. Well after all of your advice, I wish I could restart the semester. Given that my final is in one week, what do you think I can do?
Click to expand...

Can you tell us about the structure of your exam? Is this a cumulative final? If organic 2, is it cumulative over both semesters' material? Was there information at the beginning of this semester you feel you understand and could give you some "easy" points? I don't think one week is enough time to truly understand all of the material if you've felt lost for a while, BUT you could certainly maximize your efforts and points if you direct your energy to the most worthwhile topics. (Worthwhile being, you can learn them over the next week.)
 
SweetCaroline7 said:
Can you tell us about the structure of your exam? Is this a cumulative final? If organic 2, is it cumulative over both semesters' material? Was there information at the beginning of this semester you feel you understand and could give you some "easy" points? I don't think one week is enough time to truly understand all of the material if you've felt lost for a while, BUT you could certainly maximize your efforts and points if you direct your energy to the most worthwhile topics. (Worthwhile being, you can learn them over the next week.)
Click to expand...
I scored above the class average on the first and second exams, though I did poorly on the second exam, which focused on stereoisomerism and substitution and elimination mechanisms. The exam I took today, which I felt terrible about, was focused on IR/NMR/MS spectroscopy and alcohol/ether mechanisms. I understand the material, but I really screwed up because I couldn't identify the molecules given from the spec problems on the exam.....they were different...... Also, I had a hard time with coupling constants.
 
asigna said:
I'll give you my advice, coming from someone who's favorite class is both orgo and biochem, and I got the highest grade in my orgo classes.

The reason, I think, why people do bad, or are even "afraid" or orgo is because a) they don't give themselves enough practice/ time and b) not fully grasping concepts, or are trying to memorize everything (most of the time, Orgo is NOT the subject for crude memorization).

I'm glad that you knew to give yourself time, but I don't think you need that much time in my honest opinion. Four days for me worked really good. My exams were always on Mondays and I studied Thursday-Sunday.

What really worked for me was to go over what I learned in class right away (or at least as soon as possible). By allowing yourself to engage and practice the material right after lecture, you understand the concepts early on, even if you don't grasp them fully right away. And if you can't grasp them fully right away, it's time you go to your professor's office hours. I usually went at least once a week to clear up any issues I had- even ten minutes visiting could help a lot. If that isn't enough, definitely try tutoring.

The biggest problem I saw for a lot of students in my orgo classes was that they believe it's all memorization. Don't be fooled by this, and definitely don't be one of the people that pulls an all nighter or two before the test. You will most likely do bad. Besides going through notes, I liked to test my knowledge on what I learned right away. Do all the practice problems your professor assigns in general, but do the problems specific to what you're doing in lecture. I also found it helpful to look over the chapter before the lecture- you experience the concepts early, so you don't get lost in lecture, which can happen in orgo a lot. Focus on these things as well: memorizing reactions (all i memorized in orgo), nomenclature, and then concepts. Concepts I believe should be last because you have the foundation from everything else. And for reactions, it's REALLY helpful to make notecards, and memorize them (reagents and what they do) early, so that way when you actually study for your exam, you focus on the bulk of the exam, saving you time. For mechanisms, i found it good to write them down on paper over and over until I got them. With anything in orgo, PRACTICE MAKES PERFECT!!! Literally. I sometimes did all the problems 10 times just to make sure I knew them. I know a lot of people struggle with synthesis- definitely know your reagents, and then do all synthesis problems until you feel comfortable in handling a big one on the exam. It's also helpful to make ones up with your friends and then exchange them for extra practice. Spectroscopy could be an issue too. I liked this site for extra practice: http://orgchem.colorado.edu/Spectroscopy/Problems/1.html

Big overall pointers:
-Practice, practice, practice
-Review notes as soon as you can
-Get help early- don't be shy!
-Give yourself time

While I know you may be discouraged, and this may sound cliche as hell, but don't give up, especially if medicine is your dream. Don't give up on something that you can't go a day without thinking about. That's honestly what keeps me going. Keep working hard! Ochem is a challenging course, but that doesn't mean you can't do well. Take advantage of your resources and once again, PRACTICE!!

If you have any other questions, or need other suggestions, please let me know (Message me), and I'll be glad to help- Good luck!
Click to expand...



Do you know of any places where I can find really difficult spec problems? The problems on that site you gave are simple, the ones on my test were extremely tricky.
 
Wait a minute, on that website, on problem 3, how is the hydrogen through the OH group detectable on the NMR? Our teacher told us otherwise.....
 
Tawantinsuyu said:
Wait a minute, on that website, on problem 3, how is the hydrogen through the OH group detectable on the NMR? Our teacher told us otherwise.....
Click to expand...
Of course. It has a chemical shift of ~2.2 ppm, by itself. They often occur as singlets.
 
Tawantinsuyu said:
I scored above the class average on the first and second exams, though I did poorly on the second exam, which focused on stereoisomerism and substitution and elimination mechanisms. The exam I took today, which I felt terrible about, was focused on IR/NMR/MS spectroscopy and alcohol/ether mechanisms. I understand the material, but I really screwed up because I couldn't identify the molecules given from the spec problems on the exam.....they were different...... Also, I had a hard time with coupling constants.
Click to expand...

Ok, so, my opinion: it's time to maximize the points you can earn and stop worrying about whatever is leftover. Make a list of the main topics on the test and make a study guide based on that list. Whatever you can write about with the least amount of reference to the book or class notes is what you should focus on. 10/10 on all of those questions + partial credit on the topics you understand partially should give you a fair score. I would maybe spend 1 day over the next week picking up whatever you can on those less well understood topics. Whatever you can outright memorize or already have some intuition about. Obviously it would be best to be able to prepare for all of the material, but I just don't think you have enough time to compensate at this point and you'll do best by focusing on what you can help.
 
I see a lot of people recommending khan academy. Don't waste your time. Use freelance-teacher.com he goes over almost everything in organic and he explains things very very very well.

Organic is not memorization its about understanding relationships between molecules. I also recommend if you are not using this book already to get a hold of Organic Chemistry by Paula Bruice and match up your topics. This book makes ochem so easy 5 year olds can do it if someone could explain the electrophile nucleophile relationship to them.
 
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