Please help me understand my current situation

[annalise1609]

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Hi!

I'm currently a sophomore in college and have been in a huge dilemma regarding my GPA, stats, and other issues. I can explain my stats and GPA issues; I'm currently in o chem III and doing atrocious to the point where I will need to drop the course for my GPA. My issue is I already dropped a course in freshman year, bio III, which I did retake for a better grade (much better). I'm wondering how bad it will look if i dropped o chem III as a sophomore because I already struggled to get through o chem II (2.5 in the course and 2.7 in the lab) during as a freshman (this was also when I dropped bio III because my overall status as a person was really bad). I wanted to know how bad this will impact my chances at MD or MD-PhD.

I feel like I would need to add some information as to why my GPA is low. I think one of the main issues was that I haven't taken a huge break since sophomore in high school as I would do something every summer (whether it was classes or full time work or both) which could've catalyzed my burn out (as was mentioned by my brother and family) and I also worked as a freshman and paid my own tuition (I now work in a lab along with that and volunteer). I also don't know how to study properly, which definitely aided in my bad grades in o chem and biology. I wanted to know if me talking about my burn out as a freshman is a feasible explanation for my bad grades? I truly do not want to sound like I'm making excuses but rather want to understand my situation better to maybe seek help if I need it .

I was also wondering how can I get out of a burn out and rut? I feel like I'm either constantly thinking about work or working or studying (or thinking about studying) which definitely impacted my mental health. How can I learn to put up mental boundaries? I can also give you my stats if necessary?

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Welcome to the forums.

You have raised different issues. Does it matter to your application profile if you withdrew from a second class? The answer would be no, but since these are prerequisites, you have delayed your ability to take other upper-level biomedical science classes that may require passing grades in those courses (C's included).

How should you address your burn out? Have you talked with psychologists, counselors, or learning skills specialists? You should while your student activities fees support access. Honestly, you should have addressed this issue once you withdrew from your biology classes rather than push through organic chemistry (though a B-minus isn't that bad). Why have you delayed taking your mental health more seriously?

I commiserate if you have to work to support yourself while going to school, but I will question how you will be able to support yourself while getting involved in research projects that are necessary for a strong MD/PhD application. You should be looking for those projects and work full-time in the summer, provided there is summer research funding. However, you need a strong transcript to get a solid research position, and I can't predict how a faculty member or a summer research program committee will look at your grades to date, including the withdrawals. Again, it is important to know if you can work in a lab without having to juggle a job at the same time.

If you can't move forward from your situation that sounds like an excuse for your lack of optimal performance for MD/PhD (much less MD) and show you can adjust and adapt in the next few months, you may need to reconsider the timeline and aspirations... perhaps your purpose to pursue medicine as a career. This is not "major damage" to your application profile, but you don't have a solid foundation to give me confidence that you can handle the mental crucible that is medical education and training.

Seriously, what do you do to relax or have fun? What activities do you do with friends?

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[annalise1609]

Welcome to the forums.

You have raised different issues. Does it matter to your application profile if you withdrew from a second class? The answer would be no, but since these are prerequisites, you have delayed your ability to take other upper-level biomedical science classes that may require passing grades in those courses (C's included).

How should you address your burn out? Have you talked with psychologists, counselors, or learning skills specialists? You should while your student activities fees support access. Honestly, you should have addressed this issue once you withdrew from your biology classes rather than push through organic chemistry (though a B-minus isn't that bad). Why have you delayed taking your mental health more seriously?

I commiserate if you have to work to support yourself while going to school, but I will question how you will be able to support yourself while getting involved in research projects that are necessary for a strong MD/PhD application. You should be looking for those projects and work full-time in the summer, provided there is summer research funding. However, you need a strong transcript to get a solid research position, and I can't predict how a faculty member or a summer research program committee will look at your grades to date, including the withdrawals. Again, it is important to know if you can work in a lab without having to juggle a job at the same time.

If you can't move forward from your situation that sounds like an excuse for your lack of optimal performance for MD/PhD (much less MD) and show you can adjust and adapt in the next few months, you may need to reconsider the timeline and aspirations... perhaps your purpose to pursue medicine as a career.

regarding why I haven't taken my mental health more seriously, I honestly (still do) feel like I don't deserve to treat myself to any help until I have good grades or GPA (which is frankly, what an ugly mindset). I've always had issues with putting a boundary up for work and studying and that has spiraled into this mess. I knew I should've taken my mental health seriously but I also have asian parents which tend to hinder these ideas. also, I do not work full time anymore as my parents want me to take a break when i can get it but I used to work (this was before my research lab). When I got into my research lab in my freshman year, I drastically decreased my workload and focused on trying to balance a couple hours for some cash (as after my freshman year, my brother and parents kindly were absolutely willing to pay for my tuition. They always were but I had the money to pay my own as a freshman so I did) while balancing my research lab. I'm willing to do anything to be able to become better in the next couple of months as, MD-PhD is something that I truly want to work towards and will to making any necessary sacrifices. I'm more so wondering HOW I can move forward and how I can ignore my peers and comments.

After my insane workaholic-ness and constant comparison I've dealt with in the past and still dealing with, I've lost all sense of hobbies but recently, I've been into reading substack posts and writing little stories. I've also been going to the gym and kind of just working out and walking. I love to just hang out with my friends and talk to them but it's become harder due to my schedule but I'm more willing to make those changes.

I also really want to learn more about productive studying habits so I create more time for this. I've definitely suffered a lot and right now, I really don't want to anymore.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Why do you want to do MD/PhD? You shouldn't do it because "you can go to medical school for free." You could go straight-up for a Ph.D. if you love research and avoid the additional stress of the MCAT; all you need is solid research experience and mentors who can be your champions in their letters of recommendation for you. (Clearly, there's a bit more, but that's at least the floor.)

You can go to medical school without debt if you consider HPSP or NHSC. There are also the medical schools that will waive tuition either because of a generous donor or by policy if your family income is below a threshold. There are programs that also incorporate a research or scholarship year. To show us you can do this, you need to get into a research lab, and you may want to consider taking research postbac years. The best position for that would be getting a solid GPA before starting research.

Generally, Asian families/societies also consider mental health discussions taboo (https://asamnews.com/2025/11/17/taaf-mental-health-aanhpi-youth/). Financial matters are also challenging. Suffice to say, being a healer isn't just about getting all the items on the checklist. I don't know if you have fit in any clinical or community service experiences; those are necessary for a strong MD or MD/PhD application too. You must know why you are motivated to healing others, including the need to slow down to be present for your patients.

I don't know what your university offers regarding study habits or relaxation methods. I urge you to take advantage of what is freely available to you on campus, especially as the end of the term and exams approach. My point is that this is not a transactional matter. Don't believe the healthiest way to lose weight is a GLP-1 injection; similarly, there is no magic pill that can magically change your work/study/fun schedule. You have to find the resolve to be coached.

We also just released the 2025 Profile of the Accepted Student a few weeks ago. It may help you to understand the importance of having financial resources and strong mentoring/advising as significant factors to gain acceptance to a health professions program like medicine, dentistry, or veterinary medicine.

 

[annalise1609]

Why do you want to do MD/PhD? You shouldn't do it because "you can go to medical school for free." You could go straight-up for a Ph.D. if you love research and avoid the additional stress of the MCAT; all you need is solid research experience and mentors who can be your champions in their letters of recommendation for you. (Clearly, there's a bit more, but that's at least the floor.)

You can go to medical school without debt if you consider HPSP or NHSC. There are also the medical schools that will waive tuition either because of a generous donor or by policy if your family income is below a threshold. There are programs that also incorporate a research or scholarship year. To show us you can do this, you need to get into a research lab, and you may want to consider taking research postbac years. The best position for that would be getting a solid GPA before starting research.

Generally, Asian families/societies also consider mental health discussions taboo (https://asamnews.com/2025/11/17/taaf-mental-health-aanhpi-youth/). Financial matters are also challenging. Suffice to say, being a healer isn't just about getting all the items on the checklist. I don't know if you have fit in any clinical or community service experiences; those are necessary for a strong MD or MD/PhD application too. You must know why you are motivated to healing others, including the need to slow down to be present for your patients.

I don't know what your university offers regarding study habits or relaxation methods. I urge you to take advantage of what is freely available to you on campus, especially as the end of the term and exams approach. My point is that this is not a transactional matter. Don't believe the healthiest way to lose weight is a GLP-1 injection; similarly, there is no magic pill that can magically change your work/study/fun schedule. You have to find the resolve to be coached.

We also just released the 2025 Profile of the Accepted Student a few weeks ago. It may help you to understand the importance of having financial resources and strong mentoring/advising as significant factors to gain acceptance to a health professions program like medicine, dentistry, or veterinary medicine.

I definitely do NOT want to do MD-PhD for the free tuition, I want to do because I see the value in trying to understand things that can't be understand in a PhD and I want to aid in answering questions that MD can't alone. I want to do an MD-PhD because it offers the best of 2 worlds that I thoroughly enjoy, even if its hard and destroying to a point. I just don't want my CURRENT situation to be an hindrance to my goals in the future but I also don't want to destroy myself any longer. I feel like it has definitely gotten to that point that I'm willing to go against my parents to get the help I need to be a better doctor and researcher. I'm motivated to heal because I've seen what it feels like to be left alone when you need some help the most, I've seen so many of these cases in India. This is one of the very main reasons why i'm choosing not to give up. Also, I'm already in a research lab and have been so for around 8 months and I've learned so much from my mentors.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

I definitely do NOT want to do MD-PhD for the free tuition, I want to do because I see the value in trying to understand things that can't be understand in a PhD and I want to aid in answering questions that MD can't alone. I want to do an MD-PhD because it offers the best of 2 worlds that I thoroughly enjoy, even if its hard and destroying to a point. I just don't want my CURRENT situation to be an hindrance to my goals in the future but I also don't want to destroy myself any longer. I feel like it has definitely gotten to that point that I'm willing to go against my parents to get the help I need to be a better doctor and researcher. I'm motivated to heal because I've seen what it feels like to be left alone when you need some help the most, I've seen so many of these cases in India. This is one of the very main reasons why i'm choosing not to give up. Also, I'm already in a research lab and have been so for around 8 months and I've learned so much from my mentors.

Is your research PI an MD/PhD? Have you connected with our MD/PhD Research Scientists subforum? You should look into doing summer research or the intramural postbac research program at NIH. There aren't that many people who apply MD/PhD, and you should talk to those who are willing to live on a student stipend for 10 years rather than starting to earn real money after they graduate after 4-5 years.

 

[annalise1609]

Is your research PI an MD/PhD? Have you connected with our MD/PhD Research Scientists subforum? You should look into doing summer research or the intramural postbac research program at NIH. There aren't that many people who apply MD/PhD, and you should talk to those who are willing to live on a student stipend for 10 years rather than starting to earn real money after they graduate after 4-5 years.

My PI is not an MD/PhD and I've bene trying to get in contact with some at my university but its really hard (understandably) I did not know that there was an MD/PhD subforum. When you say summer research, what do you mean? Is that research elsewhere or more focused on working with a PI ONLY during summer? Also, do they take in sophomores or do you have to be of certain year in college?

 

[Mr.Smile12]

This is the Physician Scientists forum: Physician Scientists . Ask questions about opportunities to get research experience. Connect by attending APSA events for premed applicants.

Have you asked the science faculty about summer research opportunities? Your academic advisors? Your prehealth advisors? How informed are they about your desire to get more lab experience?

NIH has taken high school students to do summer research on their campus; other investigators may vary based on how their labs are set up and what projects they have planned.

 

[polymerization]

I know people come in with high school credits, but late-stage organic chemistry by sophomore year (you said you started as a freshman?!) feels absurdly early.

When I was in college for the first time, I felt like I had to run full-force toward this goal. I had a couple 18+ credit semesters that felt like holding my breath for 16 weeks. I was failing classes and my ego would just not give me permission to stop. I dug a really big hole that set me back farther than if I had just dropped out of school altogether.

Don't dig a bigger hole. If you feel like you're going to struggle in a course, plan for that. Don't overload your schedule with ECs and other elective courses that are going to distract you. Your grades matter, and collecting bad ones is going to generate a mess that future you is going to have to clean up.

And trust me, the older you get, the less glamorous and fun the idea of being a dark academia college girly sounds.

 

[annalise1609]

I know people come in with high school credits, but late-stage organic chemistry by sophomore year (you said you started as a freshman?!) feels absurdly early.

When I was in college for the first time, I felt like I had to run full-force toward this goal. I had a couple 18+ credit semesters that felt like holding my breath for 16 weeks. I was failing classes and my ego would just not give me permission to stop. I dug a really big hole that set me back farther than if I had just dropped out of school altogether.

Don't dig a bigger hole. If you feel like you're going to struggle in a course, plan for that. Don't overload your schedule with ECs and other elective courses that are going to distract you. Your grades matter, and collecting bad ones is going to generate a mess that future you is going to have to clean up.

And trust me, the older you get, the less glamorous and fun the idea of being a dark academia college girly sounds.

I know its so normal for freshman to take o chem its insane. I'm actually planning on taking a break from any STEM classes until my junior year and just focus on my major classes right now (until I mentally work things out) I also definitely I'm currently full force and I don't know why I just feel the need to be constantly doing something and making use of my time. I will drop o chem and retake it over summer just because there is no point in mentally and physically using my energy for a class that is draining. I'm just hoping that admissions don't use it against me because I just NOW realized how important I am to myself AND how important grades are (as a freshman, I was just going with the flow of other students, and turns out ALL of them are the smart ones and can 4.0 o chem. definitely killed me inside) I think right now my concern is just how bad would two Ws look and if I can explain the reasons using one is chronic back pains (I've had all my life but were amplified in college) and severe burn since high school that I was/am struggling to figure out. I, again, do not want to sound like I'm making up excuses but rather explaining myself as to why my grades are not reflective of my learning.

 

[Goro]

W's are not f's. Nobody's going to care if you take two W's as a freshman. Nobody's going to ask you about why you took withdrawals.

You have to learn self care as an undergraduate student, because it's a skill you're going to need it as a medical student and a resident. Otherwise you will burn out, or worse.

Medical school is a furnace, and I've seen it break even healthy students.

 

[polymerization]

I know its so normal for freshman to take o chem its insane. I'm actually planning on taking a break from any STEM classes until my junior year and just focus on my major classes right now (until I mentally work things out) I also definitely I'm currently full force and I don't know why I just feel the need to be constantly doing something and making use of my time. I will drop o chem and retake it over summer just because there is no point in mentally and physically using my energy for a class that is draining. I'm just hoping that admissions don't use it against me because I just NOW realized how important I am to myself AND how important grades are (as a freshman, I was just going with the flow of other students, and turns out ALL of them are the smart ones and can 4.0 o chem. definitely killed me inside) I think right now my concern is just how bad would two Ws look and if I can explain the reasons using one is chronic back pains (I've had all my life but were amplified in college) and severe burn since high school that I was/am struggling to figure out. I, again, do not want to sound like I'm making up excuses but rather explaining myself as to why my grades are not reflective of my learning.

Yeah, I get it. It's hard to feel like you're trying to do all the right things, but nothing you're doing is working and you're exhausted and anxious about it all the time. I remember spending just entire months at a time locked in a room alone studying and feeling like I was retaining nothing, while my lab mates were winning scholarships and awards for effortlessly moving through double majors with a 4.0. My sleep was disturbed, caffeine throughout the day would make it worse, and everything felt so chaotic that by the time finals week came around one semester, I just didn't go to any of them. I spent the week sulking in my dorm room watching Friends. I had to drop the entire semester...even though I wasn't even going to fail any of the courses I was studying for prior to not showing for the final. It was 16 weeks worth of work gone because my body needed a break, whether my mind would allow for that or not.

I think you need a break.

 

[annalise1609]

Yeah, I get it. It's hard to feel like you're trying to do all the right things, but nothing you're doing is working and you're exhausted and anxious about it all the time. I remember spending just entire months at a time locked in a room alone studying and feeling like I was retaining nothing, while my lab mates were winning scholarships and awards for effortlessly moving through double majors with a 4.0. My sleep was disturbed, caffeine throughout the day would make it worse, and everything felt so chaotic that by the time finals week came around one semester, I just didn't go to any of them. I spent the week sulking in my dorm room watching Friends. I had to drop the entire semester...even though I wasn't even going to fail any of the courses I was studying for prior to not showing for the final. It was 16 weeks worth of work gone because my body needed a break, whether my mind would allow for that or not.

I think you need a break.

I think I need a break as well but every time I do take a break, I feel bad. I can't help but think maybe I could be doing something that is more "productive" this time. Obviously, that led to the situation I'm in right now, burnt out, very anxious and constantly hating myself for not being better. I wish I 4.0ed o chem like my friend and I wish I could work in 3 different labs like her and go an insanely hard major like engineering but, that isn't going to happen right now.

I'm planning on taking a longer break over winter and just breathing. I'm also planning on deleting reddit and any form of media so I don't constantly think about what others are doing.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

I know its so normal for freshman to take o chem its insane.

No, it's not normal. It is insane. Maybe if you took on an accelerated high school schedule and took college classes while in high school with credits that counted. You could take online/MOOC courses in organic chemistry or watch YouTube videos. But I assure you, most college freshmen are not ready to take organic chemistry.

Learn to slow down. It's okay to take a break. It's good to breathe, listen, and sleep.

 

[polymerization]

I think I need a break as well but every time I do take a break, I feel bad. I can't help but think maybe I could be doing something that is more "productive" this time. Obviously, that led to the situation I'm in right now, burnt out, very anxious and constantly hating myself for not being better. I wish I 4.0ed o chem like my friend and I wish I could work in 3 different labs like her and go an insanely hard major like engineering but, that isn't going to happen right now.

I'm planning on taking a longer break over winter and just breathing. I'm also planning on deleting reddit and any form of media so I don't constantly think about what others are doing.

Now that I think about it, undergrad was really the first time I had been in a truly diverse social environment. In grade school, you're limited to the people who live in the local area, which is obviously income-dependent; but in college, I was shoulder-to-shoulder with kids coming out of private college prep academies who had been exposed to all of this material before. It wouldn't really be until college that I would first see social inequality so seriously, and come to understand intimately why the academic contest I thought I was participating in, was actually rigged well before I was even aware it had begun.

In other words, you may just be coming to the realization that, actually, none of this is fair. People are coming in with skills nobody taught you, and getting ahead.

That said, you are not entirely helpless. The truth is that, yes, there may be a gap, but it's on you to bridge it.

I know it's hard, but try to hold both sides in your mind. Carry the knowledge that you're not at fault for not already being perfect, while also carrying the understanding that expectations are high. You can do this... but don't delude yourself into thinking that just wanting it will make it happen.

 

[annalise1609]

Now that I think about it, undergrad was really the first time I had been in a truly diverse social environment. In grade school, you're limited to the people who live in the local area, which is obviously income-dependent; but in college, I was shoulder-to-shoulder with kids coming out of private college prep academies who had been exposed to all of this material before. It wouldn't really be until college that I would first see social inequality so seriously, and come to understand intimately why the academic contest I thought I was participating in, was actually rigged well before I was even aware it had begun.

In other words, you may just be coming to the realization that, actually, none of this is fair. People are coming in with skills nobody taught you, and getting ahead.

That said, you are not entirely helpless. The truth is that, yes, there may be a gap, but it's on you to bridge it.

I know it's hard, but try to hold both sides in your mind. Carry the knowledge that you're not at fault for not already being perfect, while also carrying the understanding that expectations are high. You can do this... but don't delude yourself into thinking that just wanting it will make it happen.

Maybe, they did have other sources that I didn't and I recently found out what an MD-PhD even was.

What do you recommend I do right now? I know I'll need a break but what do you recommend I do to come out of.. this situation?

 

[polymerization]

Maybe, they did have other sources that I didn't and I recently found out what an MD-PhD even was.

What do you recommend I do right now? I know I'll need a break but what do you recommend I do to come out of.. this situation?

I think something that would've been liberating to have come to terms with sooner is the timeline. It is going to be unlikely that you're going to be going to medical school with your cohort...although, "traditional" students seem (to me) to be a dying species. What admissions asks of us is just increasingly impractical within the three years you're in college prior to applying, so more and more students will wait until they've graduated—or, even more likely, one or more gap years where they can focus on activities exclusively to support their application.

And this isn't something I'm saying to patronize you: I started my freshman year the Fall of 2013. I will be matriculating to medical school next Fall. You do the math. It can be a very long road, and there will always be more you can do or work on. Mind you, I was coming in with almost 20,000 clinical hours, publications, major leadership roles... I was very fortunate to be accepted early in the cycle at a school I am jumping-up-and-down-excited to go to, but I've also just been rejected from 6 schools this week. The competition is real.

I think what you have to have come out of this situation is a recognition that this is only the first obstacle in a course with many more of them. Not only do you need a break, you need to have a plan. Just winging it is not working. Do research into the requirements and what you need to do before applying and then get some advising. Be critical of that advising. Do more of your own research. Find resources that work for you.

What I love about school is that you get immediate feedback. Did you try out a new study method? Your grade on the test will tell you if it worked or not. Use assessment to guide yourself as you figure out how you personally learn best.

Once you figure it out, it's wash, rinse, repeat. What is much harder is the psychological trial of failing constantly within a system that is pretty much constantly judging you. I don't think the "neurotic" label pre-meds get is so much warranted as it is inherited, conditioned, and enforced.

 

[annalise1609]

I think something that would've been liberating to have come to terms with sooner is the timeline. It is going to be unlikely that you're going to be going to medical school with your cohort...although, "traditional" students seem (to me) to be a dying species. What admissions asks of us is just increasingly impractical within the three years you're in college prior to applying, so more and more students will wait until they've graduated—or, even more likely, one or more gap years where they can focus on activities exclusively to support their application.

And this isn't something I'm saying to patronize you: I started my freshman year the Fall of 2013. I will be matriculating to medical school next Fall. You do the math. It can be a very long road, and there will always be more you can do or work on. Mind you, I was coming in with almost 20,000 clinical hours, publications, major leadership roles... I was very fortunate to be accepted early in the cycle at a school I am jumping-up-and-down-excited to go to, but I've also just been rejected from 6 schools this week. The competition is real.

I think what you have to have come out of this situation is a recognition that this is only the first obstacle in a course with many more of them. Not only do you need a break, you need to have a plan. Just winging it is not working. Do research into the requirements and what you need to do before applying and then get some advising. Be critical of that advising. Do more of your own research. Find resources that work for you.

What I love about school is that you get immediate feedback. Did you try out a new study method? Your grade on the test will tell you if it worked or not. Use assessment to guide yourself as you figure out how you personally learn best.

Once you figure it out, it's wash, rinse, repeat. What is much harder is the psychological trial of failing constantly within a system that is pretty much constantly judging you. I don't think the "neurotic" label pre-meds get is so much warranted as it is inherited, conditioned, and enforced.

I have realized how the expectations for success are getting higher and higher, which is exactly why I'm feeling the way I am. I used to be fine with failing as I could learn from it (and it usually showed I did) but after I got to college, regardless of how much tried, I kept failing. I just got my score back for my o chem exam 2 and i got a 73/175 (the average was 99/175) and the first exam I got a whooping 63/175 (average was 103/175). I DID improve but it isn't enough, that is exactly why I wanted to drop o chem in the first place.

The thing is, I'm not even trying to be a traditional student because I know things will tremendously change in the next 2-3 years. I just kind of want to know that I'll be ok and i can continue with my MD-PhD track without feeling like a failure

 

[polymerization]

I have realized how the expectations for success are getting higher and higher, which is exactly why I'm feeling the way I am. I used to be fine with failing as I could learn from it (and it usually showed I did) but after I got to college, regardless of how much tried, I kept failing. I just got my score back for my o chem exam 2 and i got a 73/175 (the average was 99/175) and the first exam I got a whooping 63/175 (average was 103/175). I DID improve but it isn't enough, that is exactly why I wanted to drop o chem in the first place.

The thing is, I'm not even trying to be a traditional student because I know things will tremendously change in the next 2-3 years. I just kind of want to know that I'll be ok and i can continue with my MD-PhD track without feeling like a failure

Take a deep breath, like right now. No, really, like...

An MD-PhD is a life goal. Your immediate goal is just to feel like yourself again. Your more distal goal is to get back on the horse and perform well in class. Distal to that can be a goal to craft an impressive medical school application. Once you get in, you can make graduating from your PhD your goal, and then the MD your goal after that. And who knows, maybe your goals change midway through. Have patience with yourself.

Do you see how you are putting yourself in both a helpless and hopeless situation by defining your goal inappropriately? It is very much in the same vein of people who say "I can sleep when I'm dead," or "I'll be happy once I become a doctor" and then jump off the roof of the hospital one night because they have made their life so intolerable and devoid of any enjoyment that it all stops making sense.

Nothing is changing in the short term, but patterns crystallize in the medium and long-term. In the last 10 years, the admissions landscape became more challenging for people like me with few resources. I suspect that pattern will continue. Either way, I don't say it to encourage complaining or doomer-adjacent lines of thinking, I just think being real with yourself is really important as you make your plans.

Baby steps. You are going to be OK.

 

[annalise1609]

Take a deep breath, like right now. No, really, like...

An MD-PhD is a life goal. Your immediate goal is just to feel like yourself again. Your more distal goal is to get back on the horse and perform well in class. Distal to that can be a goal to craft an impressive medical school application. Once you get in, you can make graduating from your PhD your goal, and then the MD your goal after that. And who knows, maybe your goals change midway through. Have patience with yourself.

Do you see how you are putting yourself in both a helpless and hopeless situation by defining your goal inappropriately? It is very much in the same vein of people who say "I can sleep when I'm dead," or "I'll be happy once I become a doctor" and then jump off the roof of the hospital one night because they have made their life so intolerable and devoid of any enjoyment that it all stops making sense.

Nothing is changing in the short term, but patterns crystallize in the medium and long-term. In the last 10 years, the admissions landscape became more challenging for people like me with few resources. I suspect that pattern will continue. Either way, I don't say it to encourage complaining or doomer-adjacent lines of thinking, I just think being real with yourself is really important as you make your plans.

Baby steps. You are going to be OK.

I DEFINITELY took deep breaths as I found out my score IN the middle of another lecture. I feel like at this point, I've gotten so numb I feel like all I do is complain and breakdown. I feel like I've become a toxic person to be around because conversations always come back to one thing: how are classes and how much i hate my classes that are giving low grades. Quite frankly, I hate myself for the person i've become because in high school, I would have HATE to hung out with current me.

This is definitely a mindset problem and the "I'll be happy once I become a doctor' applies SO WELL to me. I'm always like "i'll be happy once I get this job" or "I'll be happy once I get into a lab" or "once I get into a good med school" to the point where ALL I day dream is about this -> mind you even after I get this, I want MORE like get a better job or join another lab (with what time? only god can tell) . If you talk to anyone I know, you'll hear them talk about how I barely have a life outside of college or prepping for med school (i.e. researching volunteering, shadowing) sometimes I wonder how I still have friends.

I kind of realized how I have no enjoyment in life how that you mention it, not a good hobby that isn't youtube for distraction, barely hang out with my friends anymore, and I've also stopped using any form of media or there is barely any stimulation (I literally listen to podcasts) -> what the hell have I become at 20 😭

Right now, I'm definitely on the verge or a breakdown but I'll have to hold it in until the end of the day. Let's see

 

[polymerization]

I DEFINITELY took deep breaths as I found out my score IN the middle of another lecture. I feel like at this point, I've gotten so numb I feel like all I do is complain and breakdown. I feel like I've become a toxic person to be around because conversations always come back to one thing: how are classes and how much i hate my classes that are giving low grades. Quite frankly, I hate myself for the person i've become because in high school, I would have HATE to hung out with current me.

This is definitely a mindset problem and the "I'll be happy once I become a doctor' applies SO WELL to me. I'm always like "i'll be happy once I get this job" or "I'll be happy once I get into a lab" or "once I get into a good med school" to the point where ALL I day dream is about this -> mind you even after I get this, I want MORE like get a better job or join another lab (with what time? only god can tell) . If you talk to anyone I know, you'll hear them talk about how I barely have a life outside of college or prepping for med school (i.e. researching volunteering, shadowing) sometimes I wonder how I still have friends.

I kind of realized how I have no enjoyment in life how that you mention it, not a good hobby that isn't youtube for distraction, barely hang out with my friends anymore, and I've also stopped using any form of media or there is barely any stimulation (I literally listen to podcasts) -> what the hell have I become at 20 😭

Right now, I'm definitely on the verge or a breakdown but I'll have to hold it in until the end of the day. Let's see

Well, it sounds like you know where your path to self-development is going to have to start, then.

And, if it makes you feel better, just getting in doesn't solve everything. Like I said, the road is long. You sacrifice parts of yourself. There is grief and mourning even in success. And it's real sacrifice: it won't feel like Grey's Anatomy where you're surrounded by supermodels constrained within a universe in which money apparently is not a problem for anyone. It's not going to feel like optimistic striving. It's going to feel like a slog; sometimes, even a punishment. But you have to take the good with the bad and try to find silver linings where you can to survive with your sanity intact.

So, yeah, I totally agree with finding new things to do. You're in college! You spend all day surrounded by people your age. This will never happen again! Find friends. Please. Socializing is part of your education. If you grow up to be a big weirdo, you'll struggle with the group activities and interviews and open houses and second looks that compose a part of the pre-med journey (if you even make it that far).

I think a lot of people struggle to find their place at your age. It's normal. One of the ways I build connections is by being vulnerable. Just sharing you've been struggling to feel connected is something I think a lot of people could relate to on-campus. Touch grass...in community.

 

[rushingtide]

Take it from the 37-year-old applying this cycle who started school back in 2006: life doesn't get any easier, and you need to put yourself first. No one will love you more than yourself. The road to self-love is longer and more arduous than getting into med school, but it can and will come in time. Just like everything in life, it will take work to get there.

You will be whatever you want to be, whether that is the doctor, the researcher, the mentor, the teacher. Whatever it is. Failure is part of life. How you overcome failure is what will help you as you get older.

You've gained a lot of insight and perspective from here, and I hope it's been helpful. After reading all of this, what would I recommend you do first? Get off this website and either restart something you haven't done in a while, or go find something new to enjoy.

I'm sending you a great, big hug from across the internet. Know that you are not alone. It is a good thing you've shared these sentiments here.

 

[LizzyM]

Step 1: stop comparing yourself with anyone else. "Comparison is the thief of joy" as they say.
Step 2: take a step back from everything you are doing except taking classes for your degree.
Step 3: look at what you enjoy and ask yourself if there is any way you could share what you enjoy doing with those in need. If you enjoy cooking or food prep, see if your skills could be used in a local soup kitchen or homeless shelter. Like keeping things organized? food pantry could use your help. Like teaching? Search out an after school tutoring program that could use you as a volunteer for grade school or HS kids. Play a musical instrument? See if a local nursing home, hospice or senior center could use you to entertain the clientele. You get the idea. Pick one thing that you can do for a few hours a week that you enjoy and that benefits others.
Step 4: Consult the office your school has to help students hone their study skills (your advisor should be able to refer you).

If you are unsuccessful academically after taking these steps, seek a referral to a mental health professional (licensed clinical social worker, psychologist, psychiatrist) who works with students. Again, your school's health office should be able to direct you to someone you can talk to. If there is an underlying issue, getting that taken care of can make a world of difference in your outlook and your performance.

 

[annalise1609]

Step 1: stop comparing yourself with anyone else. "Comparison is the thief of joy" as they say.
Step 2: take a step back from everything you are doing except taking classes for your degree.
Step 3: look at what you enjoy and ask yourself if there is any way you could share what you enjoy doing with those in need. If you enjoy cooking or food prep, see if your skills could be used in a local soup kitchen or homeless shelter. Like keeping things organized? food pantry could use your help. Like teaching? Search out an after school tutoring program that could use you as a volunteer for grade school or HS kids. Play a musical instrument? See if a local nursing home, hospice or senior center could use you to entertain the clientele. You get the idea. Pick one thing that you can do for a few hours a week that you enjoy and that benefits others.
Step 4: Consult the office your school has to help students hone their study skills (your advisor should be able to refer you).

If you are unsuccessful academically after taking these steps, seek a referral to a mental health professional (licensed clinical social worker, psychologist, psychiatrist) who works with students. Again, your school's health office should be able to direct you to someone you can talk to. If there is an underlying issue, getting that taken care of can make a world of difference in your outlook and your performance.

I'm planning on talking to my advisor tomorrow to see what I can do. Today is going to be a chill day and I will try to focus on myself. I will also start volunteering at the food bank more every week as you mentioned!

 

[Goro]

I think I need a break as well but every time I do take a break, I feel bad. I can't help but think maybe I could be doing something that is more "productive" this time.

I suggest a visit to your school's counseling center or talking to your doctor. This is NOT giving medical advice!

Look, if you were peeing blood, you'd get to the ER right away. Your situation is no different. Your approach to academics is becoming pathological and it's harming you.

We teach my medical students that self-care is a professionalism thing. Self-care IS being productive.

 

[annalise1609]

Take it from the 37-year-old applying this cycle who started school back in 2006: life doesn't get any easier, and you need to put yourself first. No one will love you more than yourself. The road to self-love is longer and more arduous than getting into med school, but it can and will come in time. Just like everything in life, it will take work to get there.

You will be whatever you want to be, whether that is the doctor, the researcher, the mentor, the teacher. Whatever it is. Failure is part of life. How you overcome failure is what will help you as you get older.

You've gained a lot of insight and perspective from here, and I hope it's been helpful. After reading all of this, what would I recommend you do first? Get off this website and either restart something you haven't done in a while, or go find something new to enjoy.

I'm sending you a great, big hug from across the internet. Know that you are not alone. It is a good thing you've shared these sentiments here.

This conversation has helped me a lot and I will definitely take these values and create something meaningful out of it. Thank you everyone for being here for my rant and vent! I realized I haven't been taking care of myself, let only my goals.

 

[annalise1609]

I suggest a visit to your school's counseling center or talking to your doctor. This is NOT giving medical advice!

Look, if you were peeing blood, you'd get to the ER right away. Your situation is no different. Your approach to academics is becoming pathological and it's harming you.

We teach my medical students that self-care is a professionalism thing. Self-care IS being productive.

Already booked an appointment with my counselor at my Uni and with an advisor !

 

[annalise1609]

Take a deep breath, like right now. No, really, like...

An MD-PhD is a life goal. Your immediate goal is just to feel like yourself again. Your more distal goal is to get back on the horse and perform well in class. Distal to that can be a goal to craft an impressive medical school application. Once you get in, you can make graduating from your PhD your goal, and then the MD your goal after that. And who knows, maybe your goals change midway through. Have patience with yourself.

Do you see how you are putting yourself in both a helpless and hopeless situation by defining your goal inappropriately? It is very much in the same vein of people who say "I can sleep when I'm dead," or "I'll be happy once I become a doctor" and then jump off the roof of the hospital one night because they have made their life so intolerable and devoid of any enjoyment that it all stops making sense.

Nothing is changing in the short term, but patterns crystallize in the medium and long-term. In the last 10 years, the admissions landscape became more challenging for people like me with few resources. I suspect that pattern will continue. Either way, I don't say it to encourage complaining or doomer-adjacent lines of thinking, I just think being real with yourself is really important as you make your plans.

Baby steps. You are going to be OK.

I actually have another question, after I talk to my advisor, I'm still on the end about dropping o chem right now. I'm not really fond of this class and do NOT want to take it again but after assessing my situation, I can try my best to end that class with a 2.5. Should I try to get it over with and try to get a 2.5 or drop take a W instead? I've heard two vastly different perspectives so I'm even more confused

 

[polymerization]

I actually have another question, after I talk to my advisor, I'm still on the end about dropping o chem right now. I'm not really fond of this class and do NOT want to take it again but after assessing my situation, I can try my best to end that class with a 2.5. Should I try to get it over with and try to get a 2.5 or drop take a W instead? I've heard two vastly different perspectives so I'm even more confused

A C is technically passing for the purposes of medical school prerequisites, but I wouldn't exactly say it screams "reinvention." It will fulfill the requirement... but... you'll see it all again in biochemistry, and then the MCAT, and then medical school... you're not just going to escape chemistry... in fact, the more you avoid it, the more urgent it will become that you understand it as you grow as a scientist more generally.

I say this as someone who avoided organic chemistry at all costs. It was overwhelming to finally take it. I struggled so much with Newman projections and felt so beyond stupid for not seeing what other people could see in structures. I got a few Cs on exams, but improved over time.

It was really valuable for me to have the experience of feeling stupid and deciding, OK, I'm going to do what "stupid people" do and go to tutoring. And recitation. And I'm going to spend all day long at the science learning center and get as much help as I can. And letting myself feel humbled by that, and realizing that the people I was sitting across from all wanted what I did—to do well and move on. I realized that avoiding chemistry was prolonging the anticipation and pain associated with failure, and that just getting past that threshold is way easier with others who are also finding their way with the same material.

After a while, my grades improved dramatically and I started to get really excited about the subject. It would turn out to be my favorite class that semester.

The moral of the story is, yeah, I guess you can take the C if you really wanted to. But just making that decision is not going to resolve the more fundamental tension, you'll just be kicking the can down the line to biochemistry, because all of that stuff comes back. And there are always going to be topics that are particularly difficult for you as a student... you still have to learn those things because the downside of not knowing it could be literally life and death.

 

[annalise1609]

A C is technically passing for the purposes of medical school prerequisites, but I wouldn't exactly say it screams "reinvention." It will fulfill the requirement... but... you'll see it all again in biochemistry, and then the MCAT, and then medical school... you're not just going to escape chemistry... in fact, the more you avoid it, the more urgent it will become that you understand it as you grow as a scientist more generally.

I say this as someone who avoided organic chemistry at all costs. It was overwhelming to finally take it. I struggled so much with Newman projections and felt so beyond stupid for not seeing what other people could see in structures. I got a few Cs on exams, but improved over time.

It was really valuable for me to have the experience of feeling stupid and deciding, OK, I'm going to do what "stupid people" do and go to tutoring. And recitation. And I'm going to spend all day long at the science learning center and get as much help as I can. And letting myself feel humbled by that, and realize that the people I was sitting across from all wanted what I did—to do well and move on. I realized that avoiding chemistry was prolonging the anticipation and pain associated with failure, and that just getting past that threshold is way easier with others who are also finding their way with the same material.

After a while, my grades improved dramatically and I started to get really excited about the subject. It would turn out to be my favorite class that semester.

The moral of the story is, yeah, I guess you can take the C if you really wanted to. But just making that decision is not going to resolve the more fundamental tension, you'll just be kicking the can down the line to biochemistry, because all of that stuff comes back. And there are always going to be topics that are particularly difficult for you as a student... you still have to learn those things because the downside of not knowing it could be literally life and death.

Ok so just based on situation, I should just drop it and take it again in summer for a better understanding and grade? I could take the C yes but I feel like right now, I'm also just as concerned about what I will tell my parents and peers. Like my parents have been up my ass about my one drop so now I'm like... another drop? Just quit med school.

 

[polymerization]

Ok so just based on situation, I should just drop it and take it again in summer for a better understanding and grade? I could take the C yes but I feel like right now, I'm also just as concerned about what I will tell my parents and peers. Like my parents have been up my ass about my one drop so now I'm like... another drop? Just quit med school.

I think what would shift things for me would be whether or not I would be fighting an uphill battle just for the C. If the math just isn't making sense anymore and you're going to have to ace the rest of the semester, I would drop it. If you're comfortably in C territory, I would say keep it.

Either way, your parents will get over it. The whole point is for you to get into medical school, so you need to make the right decisions for you in service of that goal, not what would most please them.

You can get into an Ivy medical school and it might still not be enough for them. Ask me how I know.

 

[annalise1609]

I think what would shift things for me would be whether or not I would be fighting an uphill battle just for the C. If the math just isn't making sense anymore and you're going to have to ace the rest of the semester, I would drop it. If you're comfortably in C territory, I would say keep it.

Either way, your parents will get over it. The whole point is for you to get into medical school, so you need to make the right decisions for you in service of that goal, not what would most please them.

You can get into an Ivy medical school and it might still not be enough for them. Ask me how I know.

I think at this point, no I can't do any better than a C. I realized it is not worth it for me to push myself to the edge and wonder why I keep breaking down. I think I'll just not tell my parents until later in next year. I'm not sure how comfortable I'm in the C territory since it doesn't reflect my learning.

I want to do the same thing I did with bio, drop it and then 4.0 it the next time i take it

 

[annalise1609]

I think at this point, no I can't do any better than a C. I realized it is not worth it for me to push myself to the edge and wonder why I keep breaking down. I think I'll just not tell my parents until later in next year. I'm not sure how comfortable I'm in the C territory since it doesn't reflect my learning.

I want to do the same thing I did with bio, drop it and then 4.0 it the next time i take it

Also not related to this, do admissions take into consideration what college you've done your undergrad at? Like my university of known for insane weedouts but I've heard that some do take that into consideration but some really do not care?

 

[LizzyM]

We have known for more than 20 years that o-chem is a weed out and I can almost predict with 99% accuracy that a dip and recovery in GPA from one year to the next is the result of taking o-chem and then getting back on track.

You aren't holding a 4.0 GPA so dropping something doesn't look to an adcom like a perfectionist's tendency to drop a course to maintain that perfect GPA. Drop and take a do-over. Just be aware that ochem in the summer can be a bear because of the pace of instruction and because sometime the instructors who teach in the summer are beasts. Rate my professor (is that still aound?) could be your friend, particularly if you take this at a school other than your home institution.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Also not related to this, do admissions take into consideration what college you've done your undergrad at? Like my university of known for insane weedouts but I've heard that some do take that into consideration but some really do not care?

Yes and no. Read

Admissions Committees: The Art of the Decision | Student Doctor Network | SDN

Abstract: Faculty serve three to four year terms on admissions committees, so they can vary significantly year-to-year with shifting priorities over time.

www.studentdoctor.net

Committee letters often comment about how hard it is to get an A at their programs, but every school views that information in context.

 

[annalise1609]

We have known for more than 20 years that o-chem is a weed out and I can almost predict with 99% accuracy that a dip and recovery in GPA from one year to the next is the result of taking o-chem and then getting back on track.

You aren't holding a 4.0 GPA so dropping something doesn't look to an adcom like a perfectionist's tendency to drop a course to maintain that perfect GPA. Drop and take a do-over. Just be aware that ochem in the summer can be a bear because of the pace of instruction and because sometime the instructors who teach in the summer are beasts. Rate my professor (is that still aound?) could be your friend, particularly if you take this at a school other than your home institution.

Ok so I dropped o chem. I told my parents and (after a breakdown) they wanted me to focus on myself. ATP, this college situation has gotten so bad that they just want me to not to medicine if I'm going to sit here and ruin my health. What do you guys think is the next course of action would be? Should I focus on re-trying o chem again in winter so should I take a break and do it in summer and focus on my major classes now? I think the latter works the best with my situation.

I'm not of just not sure how to navigate my current college situation as even after talking to my advisor, they did NOT give me any form of advice. As a matter of fact, I think they made it worse.

Yes rate my professor is till around but it does not give good rating from my experience!

 

[polymerization]

What do you guys think is the next course of action would be?

Can I just ask you directly what YOU want for your life, irrespective of the collective opinions of others?

Surely everyone loves you so much they imagine you could be a neurocardiothroacic astronaut surgeon. The question is what makes you, specifically, happy? A few days ago you were insistent you couldn't move forward unless you were on-track to an MD-PhD, so what happened?

Learn about the puella aeternus.

 

[annalise1609]

Can I just ask you directly what YOU want for your life, irrespective of the collective opinions of others?

Surely everyone loves you so much they imagine you could be a neurocardiothroacic astronaut surgeon. The question is what makes you, specifically, happy? A few days ago you were insistent you couldn't move forward unless you were on-track to an MD-PhD, so what happened?

Learn about the puella aeternus.

Honestly, I don't know what I want. I wanted to do medicine, I worked hard starting from 10th grade. A lot of what I did was academically rigorous. Now... I feel like I lost hope..? IDK if I lost hope in medicine but I feel like I lost hope in myself. I know I sound like a typical, neurotic pre-med (toxic even) but it has been hard to cope with the fact that I'm maybe not as smart as I think I am and maybe not that hard working as I think I am. I could put in more effort to be better and when I did, I ended up dropping o chem. I it hard to think of myself anything beyond a failure because yes, I'm still insistent MD-PhD but I don't so if I AM meant for MD-PhD. I don't what to change or where to improve and it's just this constant cycle of " I can do it" or "never mind I can't" -> if this doesn't work out, I just want a job. I can't be jobless after graduation (i'm south asian so I fear that I will also be married off at like 25) and I don't know if I'm up to par with my expectations or goals I've set.

What makes me happy? great question, would need to look into a couple of years ago when my personality wasn't a stressed out student.

This is a lot to process and I know we've been running in circles about this but I kind of don't really have anyone to talk to or for comfort right now because I'm scared of judgement.

 

[polymerization]

Honestly, I don't know what I want. I wanted to do medicine, I worked hard starting from 10th grade. A lot of what I did was academically rigorous. Now... I feel like I lost hope..? IDK if I lost hope in medicine but I feel like I lost hope in myself. I know I sound like a typical, neurotic pre-med (toxic even) but it has been hard to cope with the fact that I'm maybe not as smart as I think I am and maybe not that hard working as I think I am. I could put in more effort to be better and when I did, I ended up dropping o chem. I it hard to think of myself anything beyond a failure because yes, I'm still insistent MD-PhD but I don't so if I AM meant for MD-PhD. I don't what to change or where to improve and it's just this constant cycle of " I can do it" or "never mind I can't" -> if this doesn't work out, I just want a job. I can't be jobless after graduation (i'm south asian so I fear that I will also be married off at like 25) and I don't know if I'm up to par with my expectations or goals I've set.

What makes me happy? great question, would need to look into a couple of years ago when my personality wasn't a stressed out student.

This is a lot to process and I know we've been running in circles about this but I kind of don't really have anyone to talk to or for comfort right now because I'm scared of judgement.

Dr. Alok Kanojia out of Harvard talks about this a lot. I think Dr. Marie Louise von Franz, who wrote the book he references, is even better.



She says, "...the healing hero, therefore, is the one who finds some creative way out, a way not already known, and does not follow a pattern. Ordinary sick people follow ordinary patterns, but the shaman cannot be cured by the usual methods of healing. He has to find the unique way, the only way that applies to him. The creative personality who can do that then becomes a healer and is recognized as such by his colleagues.”

If that doesn't run chills down your spine, I don't know what will.

We are all predisposed to think we are special somehow. Those that actually believe their own BS for long enough become doctors, and cannot see themselves any other way. No other job scratches the itch. Every other job lacks the expectation of internal self-transformation that medicine promises, and not having it after recognizing its value can feel psychologically intolerable. Worse so when the costs are so high and so we suffer from sunk cost fallacy and effort justification effects.

And we can see clearly that this myth is perpetuated by society, too—it is in the traditions and rituals we perform as medical students and physicians. It is in the way people talk about physicians, and the societal trust and power they hold with so little oversight (consider the physicians speaking out against things like vaccines right now)...

If it helps, it's not just you. So many people, including me, bear the mark of the "wounded healer." It's very much a thing in healthcare. But like all archetypes, it is more idea than reality. It's up to you to overcome the challenges your path presents. We see it resonate when people can't bear the possibility of applying DO, or "just working primary care," or, in your case, feeling like the effort is only worth it if you received the maximal possible benefit (MD-PhD) you imagine.

Watch the video, keep what fits for you, throw out what doesn't. This next part is going to be up to you... you get to decide how far (or not) you want to go.

 

[annalise1609]

Dr. Alok Kanojia out of Harvard talks about this a lot. I think Dr. Marie Louise von Franz, who wrote the book he references, is even better.



She says, "...the healing hero, therefore, is the one who finds some creative way out, a way not already known, and does not follow a pattern. Ordinary sick people follow ordinary patterns, but the shaman cannot be cured by the usual methods of healing. He has to find the unique way, the only way that applies to him. The creative personality who can do that then becomes a healer and is recognized as such by his colleagues.”

If that doesn't run chills down your back, I don't know what will.

We are all predisposed to think we are special somehow. Those that actually believe their own BS for long enough become doctors, and cannot see themselves any other way. No other job scratches the itch. Every other job lacks the expectation of internal self-transformation that medicine promises, and not having it after recognizing its value can feel psychologically intolerable. Worse so when the costs are so high and so we suffer from sunk cost fallacy and effort justification effects.

And we can see clearly that this myth is perpetuated by society, too—it is in the traditions and rituals we perform as medical students and physicians. It is in the way people talk about physicians, and the societal trust and power they hold with so little oversight (consider the physicians speaking out against things like vaccines right now)...

If it helps, it's not just you. So many people, including me, bear the mark of the "wounded healer." It's very much a thing in healthcare. But like all archetypes, it is more idea than reality. It's up to you to overcome the challenges your path presents. We see it resonate when people can't bear the possibility of applying DO, or "just working primary care," or, in your case, feeling like the effort is only worth it if you received the maximal possible benefit (MD-PhD) you imagine.

Watch the video, keep what fits for you, throw out what doesn't. This next part is going to be up to you... you get to decide how far (or not) you want to go.

I'll go ahead and watch the video. I feel my issue runs deeper than MD-PhD because my parents said literally any job is fine. It doesn't have to be med but just A job that pays. For some reason, I just don't like that, I feel like I'm giving up on a life that I didn't even try to achieve.

 

[polymerization]

I'll go ahead and watch the video. I feel my issue runs deeper than MD-PhD because my parents said literally any job is fine. It doesn't have to be med but just A job that pays. For some reason, I just don't like that, I feel like I'm giving up on a life that I didn't even try to achieve.

Figuring out what you want is actually the topic of the video. It doesn't have anything to do with physicians per se, but Dr. K does offer some reflection about their own path to medicine in this context (I don't remember if it's in this first part or the second).

There's some pretty infantilizing language throughout (obviously I recognize you are not a child), but the archetype is fundamentally structured around adulthood, so just try and listen for the parts that feel relevant. I acknowledge if you're not super into psychology, this might feel abstract, but try and listen knowing that this is all half-metaphor. Adapt what is being said to challenge some of the thoughts we talked about earlier.

 

[Goro]

Honestly, I don't know what I want. I wanted to do medicine, I worked hard starting from 10th grade. A lot of what I did was academically rigorous. Now... I feel like I lost hope..? IDK if I lost hope in medicine but I feel like I lost hope in myself. I know I sound like a typical, neurotic pre-med (toxic even) but it has been hard to cope with the fact that I'm maybe not as smart as I think I am and maybe not that hard working as I think I am. I could put in more effort to be better and when I did, I ended up dropping o chem. I it hard to think of myself anything beyond a failure because yes, I'm still insistent MD-PhD but I don't so if I AM meant for MD-PhD. I don't what to change or where to improve and it's just this constant cycle of " I can do it" or "never mind I can't" -> if this doesn't work out, I just want a job. I can't be jobless after graduation (i'm south asian so I fear that I will also be married off at like 25) and I don't know if I'm up to par with my expectations or goals I've set.

What makes me happy? great question, would need to look into a couple of years ago when my personality wasn't a stressed out student.

This is a lot to process and I know we've been running in circles about this but I kind of don't really have anyone to talk to or for comfort right now because I'm scared of judgement.

Take a gap year, and get a job, any job. Make some money and then think about what you really are interested in, and pursue that.

 

[annalise1609]

Take a gap year, and get a job, any job. Make some money and then think about what you really are interested in, and pursue that.

I would do this but I think my issue is what should I do NOW. Like academically and personally and emotionally and disconnect my identity to my academic and future goals. I'm watching the video suggested above right now but other than that as well I can take into consideration

 

[Goro]

As I wrote, get a job now and don't even think about your academics. You need to get yourself into a better headspace first.

 

[LizzyM]

I'm not of just not sure how to navigate my current college situation as even after talking to my advisor, they did NOT give me any form of advice. As a matter of fact, I think they made it worse.

Yes rate my professor is till around but it does not give good rating from my experience!

Does your school have any kind of academic assistance program? Any study-skills coaching service? Ask around.

What do you mean by "not give good ratings"? The professors are not rated as good or the ratings are not an accurate reflection of the professor's style/grading/classroom management? Those are two different things.

For now, focus on getting one foot in front of the other and making it through this term and the next. You can then take some time to really examine your interests, your skills, your talents and determine if there is a good fit for you somewhere other than medicine. I've been hearing it said for 40 years, "if you can find something else you'd be happy doing, do it!" What this means is that medicine is a very hard path and you may find happiness on an alternate road.