possible to change residency site???

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jtu123

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as we all know we found out our match sites today. Although I am thrilled that I have matched EM, I am less thrilled about the site. I know that it was a binding contract to accept the certified ROL , however I matched at my last site 12 out of 12. I have vaguely heard of a resident swap service, but the web page seems to be a scam. Has anyone been successful changing their match sites or is this out of the question. What if anything can I do, and what steps should one take

my stats top quartile of state school, Step 1 234 Step 2 232.

Thanks in advance for any comments.
 
as we all know we found out our match sites today. Although I am thrilled that I have matched EM, I am less thrilled about the site. I know that it was a binding contract to accept the certified ROL , however I matched at my last site 12 out of 12. I have vaguely heard of a resident swap service, but the web page seems to be a scam. Has anyone been successful changing their match sites or is this out of the question. What if anything can I do, and what steps should one take

my stats top quartile of state school, Step 1 234 Step 2 232.

Thanks in advance for any comments.

I'm sure there's more than enough people who didn't match who would be willing to trade with you . . .
 
as we all know we found out our match sites today. Although I am thrilled that I have matched EM, I am less thrilled about the site. I know that it was a binding contract to accept the certified ROL , however I matched at my last site 12 out of 12. I have vaguely heard of a resident swap service, but the web page seems to be a scam. Has anyone been successful changing their match sites or is this out of the question. What if anything can I do, and what steps should one take

my stats top quartile of state school, Step 1 234 Step 2 232.

Thanks in advance for any comments.

Just be thankful you matched. Sure your geographic location may suck, but it's only 3-4 years after which you can move anywhere you want. I'm sure your new PD would be happy to let you out of the contract.....
 
Dont get me wrong I am very grateful to have matched, however I would love to be closer to my finance and thought that others may have had experience with changing sites...thanks
 
Dont get me wrong I am very grateful to have matched, however I would love to be closer to my finance and thought that others may have had experience with changing sites...thanks

Your only hope now would be for a spot to open up at your chosen site. In addition you would have to convince the current PD to let you go, as a letter from the PD endorsing the switch is required by most programs.
 
how would one find out when and if any spots open up?
 
I think that at this point, your best bet would be to ask around other EM-matched MS4s and see if you can find someone with a more agreeable program for yourself who is willing to trade. I don't think you should contact the PD until after you've found a feasible trade partner, because in case it doesn't work out, you don't want to show up to orientation already having the label of "the person who doesn't really want to be here". Also, there are usually a few spots that open up during or after PGY-1, so that may give you more options. You may be lucky and find a trade partner, as well as having both PDs agree to the switch, but in case you're not, you should also mentally prepare yourself that you'll be doing your intern year or beyond at that location, as it wouldn't be fair for the program to have a resident who's not 95%+ onboard. IMHO, you should do some research about your program, the hospitals, staff, as well as location, because there's a good chance you may learn some new things that will boost your enthusiasm for the program. Perhaps in 3-4 years you could find yourself looking back and wondering about how you could ever have possibility trained anywhere else!
 
I would think long and hard before embarking on this particular quest. As someone else said you don't want to show up and be the guy who tried to break his contract.

The chance that you are...

a) going to find someone else who wants to "trade."
b) that their PD is ok with it
c) that your PD is ok with it and that
d) all the paperwork goes through

seems very slim indeed.
 
I was in a similar situation last year. I matched to a program lower on my list. I noticed my second choice was unfilled (long story, but they didn't match anyone.) When I called them, they said they thought I withdrew from their applicant pool. Since they were higher on my list, I thought I would be able to just switch in. Their DME told me I could have the spot if A) I was released from my match commitment from my program and B) The spot was still open after that. And my reason for wanting to switch was purely geographical (Staying in NY vs. moving to Chicago). But I ultimately decided not to burn my bridges, since only 3 scenarios could have played out:

1- I was not released from my match commitment, and was known as the guy who didn't want to be there.
2- I was released, but the spot filled, and now I was SOL.
3- Everything went to plan. (And in hindsight, I would have been miserable, as my friends in that program are right now).

In the end, even though relocating sucked, my friends and family are 1000 miles away, and my girlfriend had to quit her tenured position as a teacher in NY and basically took a paycut when she found work here, were both much happier. Everything usually works out in the end. I know you're still dealing with the shock (I thought for sure I was getting my second choice, and where I matched was the last place I thought I would. I don't think it sunk in until I moved). Even if you have to start this year and use the residency swap sites, at least you matched in the field of your choice. I personally know people that would be very envious of you, and they actually took spots in other fields after unsuccesfully trying to match last year and this.
 
Thank you all for your posts.

At this point my initial disappointment has settled more into shock however I am really grateful that I have matched into my chosen field. I am also really grateful that I ended up ranking all programs, even though I never thought I would drop below #5. it is a bit funny now but I attended my programs interview because I happened to be traveling through that region at that time and wanted to check out a city that I had never been to. I'm glad I did. Its funny how random life can be sometimes. 😎

I have a few questions that I was hoping someone may know the answer to.

1. Is it a match violation to look into to contact other programs regarding openings. And when would be the time to do this. I am assuming there probably are no openings at this point.

2. Is there a reliable source (web sites) to find residency openings or trade options.


If any one has any ideas or comments (or even wants to inquire about trading) I would like to stay anonymous at this point but I will say that I have matched at a EM Midwest program. feel free to reply or PM me.
 
end in question marks🙄:idea:
 
Don't Do it. Stay where you are and choose to be happy and satisfied.
 
You can switch. No problem. Especially if it is for family reasons. But you probably can't do it this year. You should tell your program director around October of this year that you love the program but you need to be closer to your family for personal reasons and if a spot opens up you would like to take it.
 
I'm a bit confused as to why you'd apply to a residency where you could never see yourself living...
 
I am curious as to how you fell to number 12 on your list with those numbers? If you have red flags it would make your goal much more difficult
 
Thank you all for your posts.

At this point my initial disappointment has settled more into shock however I am really grateful that I have matched into my chosen field. I am also really grateful that I ended up ranking all programs, even though I never thought I would drop below #5. it is a bit funny now but I attended my programs interview because I happened to be traveling through that region at that time and wanted to check out a city that I had never been to. I'm glad I did. Its funny how random life can be sometimes. 😎

I have a few questions that I was hoping someone may know the answer to.

1. Is it a match violation to look into to contact other programs regarding openings. And when would be the time to do this. I am assuming there probably are no openings at this point.

2. Is there a reliable source (web sites) to find residency openings or trade options.


If any one has any ideas or comments (or even wants to inquire about trading) I would like to stay anonymous at this point but I will say that I have matched at a EM Midwest program. feel free to reply or PM me.

program directors post openings at

http://www.saem.org/saemdnn/Home/Co...esidencyVacancyService/tabid/152/Default.aspx

it's going to be rare to find a PGY1 opening at this point. half way through intern year, you may seen openings for PGY2 the following year as people realize that EM is not for them... all programs will require you to notify your program director before applying for a vacant spot....

the reason you will likely not find a switch at this time is b/c the match is done via rank list... thus, you matched at the highest program that had a spot for you.. say you matched in ny but you really want to be in chicago... even if the guy in chicago wanted to be in ny... it wasn't meant to be b/c otherwise he would have matched in ny... so therefore, your program director (at the place you matched) probably wouldn't want the guy you found to switch with, they wanted you over him- get it? plus, i'm not sure you want your current program know that they were your last choice ... it's probably not the best way to start your residency
 
Every 4th year student seems to think they know more than PDs; what do they tell you? Rank every place where you are willing to attend. Conversely, if you don't want to go there, don't rank it!

In other words, your buyer's remorse will very likely end up with you remaining where you are.

When I was a med student, there was an ortho resident that matched 16th out of 16 places he had ranked, and he was ecstatic. He had gone to med school at Penn.
 
Great PM's and Posts everyone, all the nice words have made me feel less shocked about my situation.

To answer the question of why I applied to a place I wasnt sure I wanted to live....The simple answer is I want to be an EM physician and want a job...I am very grateful to not join the thousands of unemployed Americans

To answer why I didnt match higher....Thats the million-dollar question, I know I am not super great (even though my mom thinks I am) but every input I got from upperclassmen, PD's, residents, was that I was a competitive applicant. What makes this more shocking is that my program seems like a very competitive academic institution. In fact, I ranked some programs that are probably less established higher. I know there are no published stats for programs but I get that impression from my visits. Perhaps I am wrong.

so to answer why I didnt match higher, I don't know, maybe I dont understand the match (I ranked according to where I wanted to go) , maybe it was an unusually competitive year, maybe if I was in better shape or wore a different color shirt things would have been different. maybe I shouldn't have had that second bagel during breakfast 🙂 who knows? I know I dont know how this works but the computer in the sky is telling me to go to a program that I am sure I will get a great training...I'll keep an eye out incase something opens up, but I am confident I will put my best foot forward when the time comes.
 
Dont get me wrong I am very grateful to have matched, however I would love to be closer to my finance and thought that others may have had experience with changing sites...thanks

You don't want a bad rep. It's only a few years, suck it up and drive on. I am going to geographical location that sucks, but I am in a good program so I am fine with going there. If you want to be closer to your fiancee then get married. Problem solved. That'll be $200... cash, check, or charge?
 
You don't want a bad rep. It's only a few years, suck it up and drive on. I am going to geographical location that sucks, but I am in a good program so I am fine with going there. If you want to be closer to your fiancee then get married. Problem solved. That'll be $200... cash, check, or charge?

How would getting married solve anything? Whether it's their fiance or husband, they still hava a job I believe that they would have to relocate to be with him/her. I didn't have to get married to get my girlfriend to relocate with me, but she was able to. The OP and their fiance may not have that flexibility with their fiance's job.
 
See the glass as half full, see the silver lining in the cloud, (insert motivational cliche phrase here)

I was told by one of the program directors where I applied that this was the tightest match their program has had in over a decade. At my own school, the only program in the entire hospital system that had anyone scramble was a few spots in Pediatrics. That's it. Every single other program filled. See the positive in this and be happy that this program wanted you!

Good luck!:luck:
 
Hi,

I'm so sorry to hear about your situation, jtu123. That sucks. It feels crappy to have worked so hard to get here and then not be satisfied. I'm in a similar situation.


I matched in general surgery at my #2 spot and take full responsibility for not ranking as I would have liked. My boyfriend is across the country. He matched in a specialty that is rare and is not available anywhere hear me....So, I've accepted that I will doing my intern year at my matched program and we are anticipating me moving closer to him as a PGY-2.

Does anyone know how feasible it is to find a PGY-2 spot in general surgery? Michigan or Illinois would be great but New York, Boston, or D.C would work as well. If so, when do I start looking and at what point in my intern year do I tell my PD? Should I personally contact PDs before letting my PD know? Do I find a vacancy or a swap position, as I'm not sure if my PD would be open to swapping (although he may, but I don't want to screw myself over by being known as the one who wasn't happy)?

Thanks for all your help. I am still getting over the shock of not being near him but am overall grateful to have a spot in general surgery.
 
So in general, there's nothing he can do now, but barring spots opening up at other places for a PGY2 spot during the year, can he reapply for the match this year then start as a PGY1 (again) next year? Or a separate specialty altogether?

Only reason I'm asking is I know of a lot of people that switched from surg to anesthesia, and I never knew how they did it.
 
So in general, there's nothing he can do now, but barring spots opening up at other places for a PGY2 spot during the year, can he reapply for the match this year then start as a PGY1 (again) next year? Or a separate specialty altogether?

Only reason I'm asking is I know of a lot of people that switched from surg to anesthesia, and I never knew how they did it.

I had 2 collegues this year who did transitional years and then matched as PGY-1 at other programs. It sucks, but yeah, they are both repeating first year. I don't know how it would work for someone already in a training program. If you are doing IM or family, and switched, you probably can't get funded after your PGY-2 year (if you repeat a pgy-1). If you're in a 5 year program like surg or rads, yeah, you can probably switch into a 3 or 4 year program.
 
I second what has been said above. DON'T PISS OFF YOUR PROGRAM DIRECTOR! Residency is a 3 year long job interview. You will be scrutinized with a microscope and all your weakness will be gossiped about on a daily, weekly, and monthly basis. I had similar stats going into residency and ended up matching 9th on my list. I too experienced some shock and disappointment.

I don't make good first impressions, am really nerdy, and am not the kind of guy that you would think "I could totally go out and drink with that guy"...cause I don't drink. I'd like to think that I'm kind of like athletes foot, it takes me a while to grow on you, but once I'm there, I'm hard to get rid of.

I say that because if you had such great stats, you may not have as magnetic a personality as you think, and that is going reflect on your monthly evaluations in residency. You are probably not going to be the resident that everyone loves and idolizes and wants to work with.

At the end of residency, you will be looking for a job and you will depend on honest evaluations from your faculty. They are not going to lie to people. If you are not the hardest worker, they will tell people. If you don't get along with people, they will let them know. If you have a bad attitude at work, that is going to be subtly, if not honestly reported to your future job interviewers.

It is really hard to reverse a first impression. If you show up on day one with any less than an ecstatic attitude, you are screwed. Don't go there (showing up and asking for a way to get transfered to another residency). Take it or leave it. Put on a fake smile and go to work.

I'll never forget a resident director meeting where one of our residents was complaining about the way vacation was being figured out. The resident wanted to have a shift for shift reduction per month for vacation (so, if we were supposed to work 18 shifts that month, and we took 7 days of vacation, they wanted 11 shifts that month). Keep in mind that we got 20 days of vacation a year, which is higher than most residents get. Keep in mind that the internal medicine residents are happy to work 25 days in a row so that they can have 4-5 days off and call that a vacation. The resident said, "I don't think that you are fulfilling your part of the contract that we signed." The attending, who was THE nicest attending we had, and who would bend over backward for anything you wanted, got visibly pissed off and said, "We can always let you out of that contract." Silence, crickets chirping... End of discussion.

Program directors have gone through an insane amount of work to get you there. My program director started the program. When a resident says that they don't want to be at that program when they're accepted, they will feel an intense rage inside that will never quite be assuaged.
 
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