Pre-Match communication

[cablen64k]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Hey all, now that my rank list is in, I was wondering what other people have heard from PDs they've emailed. Of the programs I emailed post-interview expressing my interest, some just said "Thank you for your interest, good luck with the match!", some said "We rank your application highly and would be pleased if you matched with us", and some didn't respond at all. I assume the ones that didn't respond didn't care/didn't rank me, but is it normal for programs that do response to be so unequivocal in their responses? Feels like I'm on a date but I can't get a read on whether she's down or not. Was this the same experience others have had (with the match, not with dating)?

 

[Magillicutty]

I sent only my #1 program (orthopedic surgery) an email. I never heard back. Good times.

 

[manillabar]

I think it's hard to tell, because some programs told me outright that they won't say anything, and that it doesn't mean that they don't like you, but that they just don't want to play the post-interview games. so even if you got no reply or a vague polite reply, i don't think that's a reason to believe they're not interested (and sometimes the "good" replies don't mean much either, from what i've heard of others who have been burned :-/) it does feel like dating, haha ... but unfortunately i don't think we'll know how they *really* feel until we (hopefully!) match

 

[organdonor]

One program outright told me I was ranked to match, two told me they really liked me and pretty much radio silence from the rest (7-8).

Don't read into it much. Anything they tell you isn't binding and people have been burned before. I would also tell you not to let it influence your ROL but it is too late for that!

 

[Psychotic]

One program outright told me I was ranked to match, two told me they really liked me and pretty much radio silence from the rest (7-8).

Don't read into it much. Anything they tell you isn't binding and people have been burned before. I would also tell you not to let it influence your ROL but it is too late for that!

I experienced the same kind of communication. One really strongly worded email, and a couple of other programs made strong statements, but I did not hear from the vast majority one way or another.

The rules changed last year (or the year before?) effectively tightening the restrictions on post interview correspondence with applicants, and for good reason. There really is no reason for a program to send these 'love letters' to applicants given how much they can be misinterpreted.

 

[futureNCmed]

I think this is highly specialty-specific. My friends going in to Psychiatry have heard lots of "we are ranking you to match" and even calls from the Program Directors saying that they will be ranking them #1!

However other specialties (I'm med-peds and many friends in IM and Peds categorical) don't hear anything even when they are super competitive (not myself, but some superstar friends I know going in to IM). Not sure how the advanced residencies handle this or surgery.

Many PDs I met on the interview trail outright told us that they would NOT be contacting us after the interview and were simply not interested in playing the post-interview games

 

[shiftingmirage]

Of the programs I emailed post-interview expressing my interest...some didn't respond at all. I assume the ones that didn't respond didn't care/didn't rank me

I don't agree with that. More likely, some programs just have a policy of not responding to those kind of emails. Some are very upfront about it, will tell you in concluding remarks on iv day, and some aren't. I would not assume a lack of response means they don't care/didn't rank you.

Depending on the size of the program, Emory has 50-something PGY1s for IM. Let's say they interview 8/slot, so 400 people. How in the world is a PD supposed to reply to 400 emails on top of his/her normal duties?

 

[IMPD]

I don't agree with that. More likely, some programs just have a policy of not responding to those kind of emails. Some are very upfront about it, will tell you in concluding remarks on iv day, and some aren't. I would not assume a lack of response means they don't care/didn't rank you.

Depending on the size of the program, Emory has 50-something PGY1s for IM. Let's say they interview 8/slot, so 400 people. How in the world is a PD supposed to reply to 400 emails on top of his/her normal duties?

Exactly. Although some PD's in IM have been trying to get a policy of non-communication, it will never be universal. Smaller programs, programs looking for an edge, programs with boundary-challenged PDs...will all keep up the "We really really luuuuuuuved you" emails.

The rest of us would just like it to stop. Interview, send a thank-you, reply, end of story.

 

[MadHopsMD]

Means nothing. I got 4 I love you letters last year. And I didnt match. Take it with a grain of salt.

 

[Elisabeth Kate]

Means nothing. I got 4 I love you letters last year. And I didnt match. Take it with a grain of salt.

Just curious, what did your I love you letter say? Did they say they ranked you to match or anything specific like that or did they just thank you for coming to the interview?

 

[MadHopsMD]

Just curious, what did your I love you letter say? Did they say they ranked you to match or anything specific like that or did they just thank you for coming to the interview?

Word for word from one of mine LAST YEAR:

"You are among a pool of extremely strong candidates who share passion for FM and caring for underserved patient population likes ours in BLANK. We all enjoyed getting to know you on your interview day, and we wish you luck as you make some exciting decisions about your future in FM".

read what you may. it came 2 weeks before rank list.

 

[Psychotic]

Word for word from one of mine LAST YEAR:

"You are among a pool of extremely strong candidates who share passion for FM and caring for underserved patient population likes ours in BLANK. We all enjoyed getting to know you on your interview day, and we wish you luck as you make some exciting decisions about your future in FM".

read what you may. it came 2 weeks before rank list.

That is generic boilerplate and pretty vague and honestly I read nothing into it, certainly not the suggestion that you should be left with the impression of how they ranked you "to match" or anything close to it. They could legitimately send that identical email to every single interviewee in their interview pool and truly believe all of you were strong candidates, hence why they offered you an interview in the first place, without making any kind of promise that everyone on the list would or could expect to match.

Still, I agree that programs should not be sending any of this crap out. I received a couple of emails, and they did not influence my ranking at all, although it does turn out that the most strongly worded email did come from my #1 program. Nobody told me I was ranked to match, but they left me with the distinct impression I would match there if I ranked them accordingly. Sounds great, but I don't trust them. I will try to remember to come back and report how it all turned out.

 

[HelpPleaseMD]

totally agree that this game is dumb. it would be so much more enjoyable/less time consuming if everyone stopped sending post interview communications except for legitimate questions.

 

[Elisabeth Kate]

Word for word from one of mine LAST YEAR:

"You are among a pool of extremely strong candidates who share passion for FM and caring for underserved patient population likes ours in BLANK. We all enjoyed getting to know you on your interview day, and we wish you luck as you make some exciting decisions about your future in FM".

read what you may. it came 2 weeks before rank list.

I'm sorry you didn't match. I did receive some post-interview emails. The most strongly worded one sent me an email immediately after my interview, then sent another one about a month ago, then sent a third one two weeks ago. The first was from the PD and just said that I am a very strong candidate and everyone enjoyed meeting me. The second was from the associate PD and said that they were contacting their top candidates to answer any questions and that I was one of them (a top candidate). And the last one was the PD again and said they know I have a lot of choices, but that they hoped I was still considering them with their NRMP code at the bottom. I just hope it was sincere, but I hear stories like yours and don't know what to think. I will say it didn't affect my ranking. I ranked this program #2 which is what I had planned to do.

 

[shiftingmirage]

This thread reminds me of a fairly depressing thread I came across a while ago:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/f-ck-the-nrmp-and-f-ck-the-match.710837/

In it are many tales of applicants receiving love letters and not matching at those programs. And while maybe not included on that thread, there are also many tales of applicants not receiving love letters and matching at their top programs.

Rank lists are done. No amount of worrying you do now will change the outcome. Try to enjoy the last bit of freedom you will have for the next 3 to 5 years.

 

[sanityonleave]

I had a couple love letters of varying stripes but even the ones that said "blah blah blah we're contacting some of our highly-valued candidates blah blah blah" I basically didn't even consider to mean anything. As someone pointed out above, they can send a similar boilerplate e-mail to almost everyone on their rank list without being too disingenuous.

That said, I did have a PD call me and tell me that I was ranked as a guaranteed match (i.e. said I was ranked in their top # and that # was less than the number of positions they offered). That didn't change my ranking either but did make me pay a bit less attention to my rank list below that program -- though you never know and nothing's certain until it's written on paper in an envelope on match day.

I agree with others that I wish there was a blanket policy that programs shouldn't communicate anything about their ranking -- because it just ends up with people getting their feelings hurt when they don't match somewhere or whatever. The match algorithm is designed to give the candidate the best match possible so love letters are completely unnecessary -- it's not like we need to modify our rank lists based on where programs might rank us.

I also didn't send any love letters to programs (even my #1) because I felt like it was silly and my #1 program specifically told us on interview day not to send those e-mails.

 

[rkaz]

I didn't get any such love letters, though I did get a few generic one's with PDs or chief residents telling me that they thought I'd fit well into their program.

I also had a resident contact me as he was interested in gauging my interest in the program. I truly did love this program (as they were one of my best quality programs in a somewhat less desirable location), but I felt uncomfortable with how to respond to the resident to avoid hurting myself on their rank list . My response was that I loved the program and that they were among my top choices, as I would be very happy to come there. (All of that was sincere.) I also provided reasons why I loved the program. However, by telling him indirectly that they weren't my top choice, I don't know if that only hurt me rather than helped. But since he asked about my interest, I felt I had to say something.

 

[swamprat]

I received a letter from a PD 2 days before rol were due basically saying I'm ranked very highly and that they would love to see me there come July. It also actually mentioned something about our interview specific to our convo which was pretty cool. I didn't end up replying because I didn't know what to say back they weren't one of my top programs although I wouldn't be too upset to go there

Edit: I also received an email from a resident at another place I interviewed saying that they thought I was a good fit and to consider them highly. Seemed generic except that I got along very well with this particular resident at the dinner and during the actually interview so that was cool

 

[Psychotic]

I didn't get any such love letters, though I did get a few generic one's with PDs or chief residents telling me that they thought I'd fit well into their program.

I also had a resident contact me as he was interested in gauging my interest in the program. I truly did love this program (as they were one of my best quality programs in a somewhat less desirable location), but I felt uncomfortable with how to respond to the resident to avoid hurting myself on their rank list . My response was that I loved the program and that they were among my top choices, as I would be very happy to come there. (All of that was sincere.) I also provided reasons why I loved the program. However, by telling him indirectly that they weren't my top choice, I don't know if that only hurt me rather than helped. But since he asked about my interest, I felt I had to say something.

You did fine and did not hurt your chances, but for future applicants, I would be very unspecific in these communications to any program not your #1.

Instead of saying "you are one of my top picks" say something like "I would be thrilled to match there" or maybe "pleased" or whatever rolls off the tongue more easily.

Also, just saying "gee, thanks, I think I would be a great fit there, too" would work well.

 

[Euthymia]

None of my responded other than a "Thanks" last week to an email I sent 3 months ago.