Pre-Med Powerhouses?

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Dr.J.D

Dr.J.D

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What are some really good, affordable pre med schools " powerhouses"? And what are some of the stats to get in?

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Dr.J.D said:
Does it help to get into these schools, in the med school application process?
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Most of the premed powerhouse schools (WashU, jhu, ucla, etc.) are very rigorous and debatably cutthroat competitive. If you can survive the environment, you'll do very well. If not, you may suffer to the point of no return.

Attend at your own discretion.

Edit: The above is from personal experience and based on the outcomes of many friends.
 
Dr.J.D said:
Does it help to get into these schools, in the med school application process?
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Colleges don't help students get into med school. Questions about which "premed school" should a student go to are often nonsense.

Do you live in a lucky state? Do you have colleges that you like and have visited? Do your parents have a college fund for you? If not, do you know what their budget is for you for college? Do you have the test scores and GPA to get into the better schools and/or to maybe get scholarship awards to make them affordable?
 
Dr.J.D said:
Does it help to get into these schools, in the med school application process?
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...depends. If you're gunning for competitive research-oriented medical schools, being from these feeder undergrads that have plentiful premed resume-building opportunities helps a lot. But it's not like they are the only path. If you have a good state flagship option that is going to be a lot less expensive, less competitive/intense, and still has lots of research, volunteering etc then that might be the best option.
 
Dr.J.D said:
What are some really good, affordable pre med schools " powerhouses"? And what are some of the stats to get in?

Appreciate it 😀
Click to expand...

there is no point in going to a difficult school if you could go to an easier one and get a better gpa. most of us learned this the hard way. gpa's are all looked at identically more or less, as ridiculous as that sometimes is.

with the grades you posted in the other thread, i would just worry about getting into a mid tier school. focus on one thing at a time.
 
hiei said:
there is no point in going to a difficult school if you could go to an easier one and get a better gpa. most of us learned this the hard way. gpa's are all looked at identically more or less, as ridiculous as that sometimes is.

with the grades you posted in the other thread, i would just worry about getting into a mid tier school. focus on one thing at a time.
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Yea, I'm trying to get my grades up, but what do you mean by mid tier pre med schools? Can you please give me a few examples?
Thanks!
 
Dr.J.D said:
Yea, I'm trying to get my grades up, but what do you mean by mid tier pre med schools? Can you please give me a few examples?
Thanks!
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i just meant mid tier colleges. those top pre med schools on that list are pretty competitive schools to get into (i only took a glance but i saw rice, jhu etc). those will be difficult to get into unless you have stellar stats but it honestly doesnt really matter where you go

in my opinion it is less likely that those schools prepare you more or make you a better medical school candidate, but rather that those schools attract top tier students and a large proportion of those students go into the medical field. so again, dont worry about what school will be good for pre med. none of them will be good if you do poorly and i would honestly rather go to a less cutthroat environment if it meant my gpa would be higher
 
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hiei said:
i just meant mid tier colleges. those top pre med schools on that list are pretty competitive schools to get into (i only took a glance but i saw rice, jhu etc). those will be difficult to get into unless you have stellar stats but it honestly doesnt really matter where you go

in my opinion it is less likely that those schools prepare you more or make you a better medical school candidate, but rather that those schools attract top tier students and a large proportion of those students go into the medical field. so again, dont worry about what school will be good for pre med. none of them will be good if you do poorly and i would honestly rather go to a less cutthroat environment if it meant my gpa would be higher
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Oh ok, I understand what you mean. I live in NY, so I guess SUNY schools would be in my range.
 
I went to a prestigious school. It was a complete fluke - no one in my family ever thought of such a thing and it took a lot of poking and prodding the parents just to let me apply. I learned so much from that experience that I have no regrets. But my GPA took a serious hit from the experience and I can from this application process that GPA is much more important that prestige (keep in mind I was not premed as an undergrad). I also had to pay most of my own way, and it took 10 years of serious work to pay the debt off. I was unable to go back to school at the time and I felt like I was so far behind others who went to cheaper schools in-state. There's no reason not to apply to a prestigious school if you have the opportunity and your parents (or the school) will fund the opportunity. But if your ultimate end goal is medical school, you will likely have a better chance to get great grades and participate in research opportunities at a state school (especially a large one that is known for research). Again, I have no regrets - I certainly wouldn't be who I am today without that experience. But I don't want anyone to make the same decision with a different end goal in mind.
 
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BombsAway said:
I see a disproportionate number of BYU kids at my interviews...
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this is what i mean. i wouldn't be surprised if pre med is a joke there. and these people are getting all the interviews 🙁. obviously conjecture but still, GPA is so subjective and shouldn't be standardized across schools....

the fact that even a high MCAT can't overcome GPA sometimes is unfortunate and makes little sense to me (barring the GPA not being abysmal of course)
 
BombsAway said:
I see a disproportionate number of BYU kids at my interviews...
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Where have you been interviewing? Schools that are near the state of Utah? MD schools? DO schools?

wouldn't be surprised if pre med is a joke there
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BYU is a decently ranked school. It's fully accredited. I'm not sure why someone would think premed there would be a joke.
 
PreMedMissteps said:
Where have you been interviewing? Schools that are near the state of Utah? MD schools? DO schools?


BYU is a decently ranked school. It's fully accredited. I'm not sure why someone would think premed there would be a joke.
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Its a pretty decent school, acceptance rate is not too low nor high.
 
Dr.J.D said:
Its a pretty decent school, acceptance rate is not too low nor high.
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this is what i mean. i wouldn't be surprised if pre med is a joke there [BYU]. and these people are getting all the interviews 🙁. obviously conjecture but still, GPA is so subjective and shouldn't be standardized across schools....
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It's a good school. No reason for anyone to think that that being premed there would be a joke. I'm not Mormon, so I don't have some sort of bias, but I'm surprised that someone would think that being premed there would be a joke and that their students' GPAs would be less authentic.

@hiei if you're going to be a doctor, you need to first work on getting rid of biases like this.
 
PreMedMissteps said:
It's a good school. No reason for anyone to think that that being premed there would be a joke. I'm not Mormon, so I don't have some sort of bias, but I'm surprised that someone would think that being premed there would be a joke and that their students' GPAs would be less authentic.

@hiei if you're going to be a doctor, you need to first work on getting rid of biases like this.
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jeez don't get so worked up. if you're going to be a doctor, you should take minor things less seriously
 
If anything it seems like you'd want to go to a school with less pre-meds because you wouldn't be competing with other students for opportunities like research, rec letters, TAing, volunteering, etc.
 
If you come from a strong K-12 background (lots of APs, IBs, strong SAT/ACT score, etc) and have the resources / scholarships / whatever to attend a top school, that's probably your best bet. However, these types of students will also do very well at their flagship state schools, and likely will get into the same caliber of medical school. Go where you want and you'll likely do well.

If you have a weaker K-12 background and get into your state school and a top school, know that you'll be competing against a lot of people who may have a leg up on you early on because of their socioeconomic/educational background at top schools, and this can especially make a difference for your freshman year GPA. In this case, you have to decide whether to attend your state school where there is a wider spread of people and you might find it easier to stand out or go to a top school knowing you might fall short of expectations that you set for yourself. This is not to say that you shouldn't go to the top school, just that you should be aware that there are a lot of highly advantaged people who will be your classmates who have had access to resources you did not during your earlier formative years. You should just be informed about your situation before you go.

Things that are important for a premed school in rough order of importance are as follows:
1. "Fit" (an intangible, yes I know, but if you're happy in your environment, you'll do your best work)
2. Cost
3. Track record for getting people into medical school
6. Access to opportunities (research, shadowing, volunteering, etc) and advising
5. Prestige
6. Grade inflating vs. deflating
7. An associated medical school

There's a whole state school vs. top school debate that continues to surface everywhere on SDN and there is never going to be a consensus (nor should there be as there is no objectively correct answer). As long as you keep in mind the above and decide wisely, you'll be okay. Fit is, again, far and away the most important thing.
 
hiei said:
there is no point in going to a difficult school if you could go to an easier one and get a better gpa. most of us learned this the hard way. gpa's are all looked at identically more or less, as ridiculous as that sometimes is.

with the grades you posted in the other thread, i would just worry about getting into a mid tier school. focus on one thing at a time.
Click to expand...

If you feel confident in your ability to do well, it's definitely worth it to go to a top 20, especially if that top 20 ug has a top 20 medical school attached to it. It's basically risk-reward so you need to determine if you can do well or not (and be honest with yourself)

1.) It helps with MCAT prep (to be clear, it's not a requirement to do well)
2.) Actually school is factored into GPA consideration, but going to a t20 vs state flagship doesn't make too much of a difference
3.) And most importantly, if your school has a med school they often look more favorably on applicants from their own undergrad

Pt 3 is really the reason you should consider going to a t20 (with 1+2 being a bonus). The only t20s you should avoid are schools like Princeton because #3 doesn't apply. Obviously if you don't think you can get a 3.8+ then don't go.
 
Danny L said:
If you feel confident in your ability to do well, it's definitely worth it to go to a top 20, especially if that top 20 ug has a top 20 medical school attached to it. It's basically risk-reward so you need to determine if you can do well or not (and be honest with yourself)

1.) It helps with MCAT prep (to be clear, it's not a requirement to do well)
2.) Actually school is factored into GPA consideration, but going to a t20 vs state flagship doesn't make too much of a difference
3.) And most importantly, if your school has a med school they often look more favorably on applicants from their own undergrad

Pt 3 is really the reason you should consider going to a t20 (with 1+2 being a bonus). The only t20s you should avoid are schools like Princeton because #3 doesn't apply. Obviously if you don't think you can get a 3.8+ then don't go.
Click to expand...

1. Not necessarily. Yes, top schools generally have higher MCAT scores on average, but they also have on average better test takers. It's likely more nurture than nature at that point.
2. School is factored into consideration independent of GPA. It's not like they have a scale where 3.6 at Princeton = 3.9 at University of East Dakota. A strong but not stellar candidate at a top school has a better chance of being interviewed at any random med school than a strong but not stellar candidate at a non-top school, but there are so many other factors in play that it's impossible to tell what the effect sizes of each variable are. Prestige helps, but it's the icing, not the cake.
3. Sometimes this is true, but sometimes not. Princeton sends a lot of students to top medical schools. Some top 20s favor their own students but a lot of top 20s are filled with Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Princeton in much higher ratios than their own undergrad students.

Finally, everyone who gets in thinks they can get a 3.8+ at a top school. In reality, only about 1/5th of them at most will.
 
WedgeDawg said:
1. Not necessarily. Yes, top schools generally have higher MCAT scores on average, but they also have on average better test takers. It's likely more nurture than nature at that point.
2. School is factored into consideration independent of GPA. It's not like they have a scale where 3.6 at Princeton = 3.9 at University of East Dakota. A strong but not stellar candidate at a top school has a better chance of being interviewed at any random med school than a strong but not stellar candidate at a non-top school, but there are so many other factors in play that it's impossible to tell what the effect sizes of each variable are. Prestige helps, but it's the icing, not the cake.
3. Sometimes this is true, but sometimes not. Princeton sends a lot of students to top medical schools. Some top 20s favor their own students but a lot of top 20s are filled with Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Princeton in much higher ratios than their own undergrad students.

Finally, everyone who gets in thinks they can get a 3.8+ at a top school. In reality, only about 1/5th of them at most will.
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1.) The transfers I have met thought that the education they got at my school was (far) better and more comprehensive than the one they got at the state flagship/other school they used to go to. At worst that makes the content review for the MCAT easier. This isn't supposed to be a deal breaker by the way, just a minor benefit for going to a t20
2.) Agreed, if that wasn't clear in my comment this was what I was saying
3.) I'm sure a lot of schools consider HYPS feeder schools which is why those ratios are so high. At least for my UG, you basically get IS acceptance odds which is awesome for a t20. Admissions also told us in a presentation that they give kids from my school a bump in things like GPA because they're aware the curriculum is more difficult

Re: everyone thinking they can get a 3.8+. True but if more people were actually honest with themselves I'm sure the number that think they can do well in a t20 drops significantly. You can use AP scores, ACT, and GPA results (and effort put to achieve those things) to estimate but ultimately like I said it's risk vs reward. If you think the risk of having a sub-3.8 GPA is lower than the reward of having that admissions boost then yeah it's worth it.

FWIW pt #3 only matters if you want to go to a t20 medical school. I only wanted to point that out because there's a misconception here that UG has absolutely no impact on admissions but it definitely does however minor it may be.
 
Danny L said:
1.) The transfers I have met thought that the education they got at my school was (far) better and more comprehensive than the one they got at the state flagship/other school they used to go to. At worst that makes the content review for the MCAT easier. This isn't supposed to be a deal breaker by the way, just a minor benefit for going to a t20
2.) Agreed, if that wasn't clear in my comment this was what I was saying
3.) I'm sure a lot of schools consider HYPS feeder schools which is why those ratios are so high. At least for my UG, you basically get IS acceptance odds which is awesome for a t20. Admissions also told us in a presentation that they give kids from my school a bump in things like GPA because they're aware the curriculum is more difficult

Re: everyone thinking they can get a 3.8+. True but if more people were actually honest with themselves I'm sure the number that think they can do well in a t20 drops significantly. You can use AP scores, ACT, and GPA results (and effort put to achieve those things) to estimate but ultimately like I said it's risk vs reward. If you think the risk of having a sub-3.8 GPA is lower than the reward of having that admissions boost then yeah it's worth it.

FWIW pt #3 only matters if you want to go to a t20 medical school. I only wanted to point that out because there's a misconception here that UG has absolutely no impact on admissions but it definitely does however minor it may be.
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I'm 100% in the camp that where you go to undergrad matters. I know that the notion that it doesn't is spread here a lot and every time it is, usually someone will correct whomever is saying that. The sticky part is to what extent it matters, and that answer is different for different med schools.
 
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