My daughter was fortunate to get accepted to Stanford and USC with a Trustee Scholarship. Money is not a major issue, but she maybe interested in premed and high GPA is essential for medical school admissions. I think it might be harder to get a higher GPA in Stanford than in USC because of the tougher competition. She visited both universities and likes them both. Does the school prestige give her any edge? Which school would give her a better chance at medical school admissions provided that she does the same amount of work in both?
Premed at Stanford vs. USC
- Thread starter mo2017
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Not sure what the overall costs would compare out to be, or how prestigious the trustee scholarship is (if it is really rare/prestigious, my opinion could easily be reversed), but between those two I would always choose Stanford. Going to a top ranked school like Stanford will allow your daughter to be involved in activities and network with individuals in an astounding manner that will likely benefit her whether she ends up wanting to apply to medical school or not (many many people go into college wanting to be a doctor and large amounts drop out quickly). By no means is USC a bad school, but having a great school such as Stanford on her application or resume in the future will likely garner her great connections and an automatic jump in her competitiveness. I wouldn't worry about GPA, if your daughter is smart enough to get into those universities, and is able to stay focused and motivated, she should be fine. Not to mention the discussion of top schools like Stanford possibly inflating grades to make their graduates look even better (http://www.dailycal.org/2013/03/11/...t-grade-inflation-through-new-grading-system/).
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First of all, congratulations for her acceptances! I did not attend Stanford and USC, but I want to share my thoughts.
The school prestige seems to offer some advantage (not just medical admission but probably also for summer internships and other programs), but it is a minor factor compared to GPA, MCAT, research, and extracurricular accomplishments.
With that said, it heavily depends on her interests, ambition, willingness to take initiatives and to overcome challenges. If she is highly driven to take advantage of opportunities being offered, perceiving college experiences as an avenue to grow and mature, personally and academically, then Stanford will more likely satisfy her appetite. However, if she is not driven or ambitious, perceiving college experiences as simply nothing more than a step prior to medical school, then Stanford could seem overwhelming and rather unappreciated.
In short, if she is willing to go above and beyond and to take advantage of opportunities to grow and mature, she will most likely adapt and enjoy more at Stanford. Rather than asking which institution is the best for medical school admission, focus on your daughter's mindset, perspective on college, interests, and motivation.
The school prestige seems to offer some advantage (not just medical admission but probably also for summer internships and other programs), but it is a minor factor compared to GPA, MCAT, research, and extracurricular accomplishments.
With that said, it heavily depends on her interests, ambition, willingness to take initiatives and to overcome challenges. If she is highly driven to take advantage of opportunities being offered, perceiving college experiences as an avenue to grow and mature, personally and academically, then Stanford will more likely satisfy her appetite. However, if she is not driven or ambitious, perceiving college experiences as simply nothing more than a step prior to medical school, then Stanford could seem overwhelming and rather unappreciated.
In short, if she is willing to go above and beyond and to take advantage of opportunities to grow and mature, she will most likely adapt and enjoy more at Stanford. Rather than asking which institution is the best for medical school admission, focus on your daughter's mindset, perspective on college, interests, and motivation.
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for what it's worth, big name schools are not always difficult to succeed in. harvard and stanford are notorious for grade inflation (aka EASY to do well). other schools (such as princeton) are quite the opposite. i'd say go where she would be happiest as this is where she will do best
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If money is not an issue, and she enjoys both schools equally well, then go to the best school she got into! She'll do fine at either -- she didn't get in by accident, the schools selected her out of thousands of other potential candidates.
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Stanford gives out a higher fraction of A's per semester than almost any other school in the country.
http://www.gradeinflation.com/Stanford.html
Really, I think anyone would be foolish to pass up on Stanford in this situation, if money is not an issue as you claim. Also, what's with parent posts these days?
The campus life at Stanford is second to none, and the prestige of the degree can help out a lot later in life. (She will still need a good GPA from Stanford to get into med school, but in a borderline situation for a job interview or professional school application, the Stanford name helps.)
http://www.gradeinflation.com/Stanford.html
Really, I think anyone would be foolish to pass up on Stanford in this situation, if money is not an issue as you claim. Also, what's with parent posts these days?
The campus life at Stanford is second to none, and the prestige of the degree can help out a lot later in life. (She will still need a good GPA from Stanford to get into med school, but in a borderline situation for a job interview or professional school application, the Stanford name helps.)
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Exactly and thats from 2005. The average GPA is likely the same or even higher today.
Go to Stanford.
(not to mention she'll have way more research/leadership/clinical opportunities at Stanford)
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For anyone who goes to USC, is it considered "dangerous" to go there? I know it's not in the best kind of neighborhood. I've always kind of wondered about this.
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Parenting much?
It might be a decision your daughter should make on her own and ask herself on the forums. She might just be saying she wants to be premed to make you guys happy. Who knows how plans might change in college.
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Yes and no. There is a really safe perimeter within a mile or so of campus where the majority of students live. Outside of that, the safety varies by street. There is a huge police presence and I personally found it safer than JHU. It's no Stanford in terms of safety but then you also get to have a very active social life.
I did a residency and a fellowship at USC, and although the hospitals I worked at were not near the campus, I did occassionally visit the undergraduate campus . I currently live about 10 minutes from Stanford, and while I have no formal affiliation with them, I do attend conferences and other events there. Based on what I have seen of both universities, I would go to Stanford. It's a no brainer. Stanford is a much better school, the campus and setting are beautiful, and the connections and opportunities are second to none. The atmosphere on campus is wonderful. USC doesn't even come close, and the neighborhood around USC is not the best. If it were a choice among Harvard, Yale, or Stanford, I would probably still choose Stanford. But USC isn't in the same league as Stanford. If she changes her mind about medicine, at Stanford she is on the same campus as one of the best business schools in the country, one of the best law schools ( alternates with Harvard for the # 2 spot; Yale is # 1 ) , and in the very heart of Silicon Valley and the high-tech industry. The only consideration would be the scholarship money, but if money is not a consideration, it should be Stanford all the way.
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Helicopter parenting, is a very prevalent issue, especially amongst high achieving students(HS); With the increasing competitiveness of admissions, its incidence will only increase, even amongst demographics where previously it has been absent. It's almost statu-quo now.
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I agree, but I don't think that advising a 17 year old high school student constitutes "helicopter parenting". In my opinion, calling admissions departments on behalf of your children is inappropriate, but doing research and soliciting advice on issues important to them is not.
Certainly, the quality of the advice that one's parents can offer will vary, depending on their experience and wisdom. But speaking for myself, I would have done well to have listened to my father's advice in high school, college, and beyond. A lot of wisdom is gained from having 20, 30, or 40 more years of life experience.
In my medical group, we have a mentoring program. New physicians are assigned a senior doctor to advise them during their first few years in practice. The newer doctors are genreally very appreciative of the program, and of the advice and help that they get. If it's ok for physicians in their 30's to get advice from strangers, it's certainly ok for teenagers to get advice from their parents.
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I concede. Parents advising children, is certainly not helicopter parenting, however, parents should take care to allow children adequate independence so that they can develop a personality of their own. I certainly wasn't calling out the @OP as a helicopter parent, I was responding to the general phenomenon that parents are increasingly becoming more and more involved with their child's education at the collegiate level.
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Stanford no question. Even if she decided to not do medicine, Stanford will give her more opportunities.
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Stanford all the way--for the name, opportunities, research, and especially grade inflation. My best friend is at USC and took 2 upper division courses at Stanford (physiology and biochem i think?): he said the upper div courses at stanford were much easier to get an A than at USC and easier than gen bio at USC (anecdote i know).
As for area around USC, from my experience, if you are smart and do not walk the streets farther than 2 blocks off campus alone at 2 AM while showing off your iphone 5S and macbook pro, you should be perfectly fine. Most people who are affected are situationally unaware and do something like that. Also police & DPS presence near USC is relatively high so dont worry about crimes on campus or even within 1 block of campus. I've walked to and from the library to my apartment (1 block off) in the wee hours of the morning hundreds of times and never once got robbed/mugged/attacked. 🙂
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Parent wants kid to go into medicine, but is concerned that it'll be harder to get a good GPA at a more competitive school.
Lucky day, I get to log this thread into both my "Yes major and University rigor matters when it comes to GPA" and "Parents pressuring kids to go into medicine" collection banks
Lucky day, I get to log this thread into both my "Yes major and University rigor matters when it comes to GPA" and "Parents pressuring kids to go into medicine" collection banks
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Bang. Exactly.
If we are strictly speaking on what university will provide better academic experiences, while USC is a very respectable school Stanford is on its own level.
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A Stanford degree will obviously help her, but a USC degree certainly will not hurt her. If she likes USC better then it's perfectly reasonable to go there but speculating about grade inflation is not a good reason to make that decision. Otherwise, she can totally make the decision about which school feels like a better fit and feel confident about that choice.
There are 13 USC undergrads and 8 Stanford undergrads in my class at a top med school. As far as admissions, I don't see a huge difference.
There are 13 USC undergrads and 8 Stanford undergrads in my class at a top med school. As far as admissions, I don't see a huge difference.
Yes, but the Stanford campus and surrounding area is much nicer, and it's only 40 minutes into San Francisco. If you're at USC, you still have to travel about 40 minutes to get to anywhere worthwhile, and then you're still in Los Angeles, which is just a big, hot , flat wasteland, IMO. But that, of course, is a matter of taste; some people love LA.
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Stanford is the best school in the world and she should go there.
/thread
/thread
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Nope. Harvard is still the best and always will be
www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2014/reputation-ranking
That being said, Stanford is the obvious choice in this situation
Do you really have that much knowledge or experience with Stanford? Ask anyone who goes/went there, pretty much everyone stays on campus all the time because it is so great and they don't even feel the need or desire to go off campus. But if they do, they have tons of food options in palo alto and san jose, as well as all the activities those areas offer, also multiple beach spots a short drive away, and of course san francisco a quick drive or caltrain ride to the north.
So you are talking about living in palo alto at more of a later age, not the same thing as someone who would be going in as a freshman undergraduate student. Those are two very, very different situations. I know many, many Stanford students, undergrad and grad, and absolutely zero have ever complained about a lack of things to do, or campus/pa being a boring area.
And they really complained that they didn't enjoy their time at Stanford? That they didn't actively choose and enjoy to spend their time doing all the things the campus area has to offer, and then didn't enjoy exploring the bay area or going to the beaches during other times? If so, fair enough, but that's something I never have heard, and I would very confidently bet that if the OP's daughter went to Stanford, she would completely enjoy her time there and the area.
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Go to stanford
Said by a prideful Trojan
Said by a prideful Trojan
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Gen chem is curved to a C same withh bio at usc, I think the curve is better at Stanford (though a stronger student body )
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Wow, interesting. I remember some Ivy League douche on here giving me static for suggesting Stanford was better than Princeton or Yale.
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Is the scholarship for both schools? I'm a bit confused. Go where the money is at. I've made it into some pretty great med schools (even with a late application) and I went to the University of South Carolina, which is less "prestigous" than either of those schools. Med school is going to be unbelievably expensive. Save that money so that you don't have to take out loans. I would say that neither school is really going to give her "an edge." Med school admissions is not really a prestige game. She has to work hard and pursue her passions wherever she goes. But a high GPA is required to get admitted into med school, and they really don't care where it comes from. I would follow the money. (Opens up a lot of opportunities).
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If you want to attend Harvard Medical School, attending Stanford as an undergrad is an undoubtedly an advantage. If you want to stay in South Carolina, it might not matter where you do your undergrad.
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Really? Because I have a 3.8 from the University of South Carolina and I got into Pitt and UVA. A friend from my university got into Yale and Vandy. From former classes, one got into Harvard. Another into Johns Hopkins, another into Penn.
Wanna re-think that one?
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Only an idiot passes up Stanford for meathead and cheerleader college. Just kidding. I had family and friends go there, so I give them crap ;-)
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Reading comprehension fail?
No one said it was impossible to get into school if you don't attend a top undergrad. Certainly there are people at JHU and HMS that graduated from community colleges, but they tend to be very exceptional people. The average applicant at top medical schools tend to be from top universities.
Also MCAT?
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Only the case at a top 20. Generally, it's not an issue.
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first off, you may have noticed by looking at my avatar that i went to a state school and am graduating from a top medical school...i am on your side of things. chill out. nowhere in my post did i even imply it was impossible to get into a top school from a state school or low tier school. guess you guys are doubting LizzyM? only the biggest deal on this forum. but w/e. dont shoot the messenger.
Still wrong. I have interviewed at schools where their Dean of Admissions have told us that they know the difference between a 3.7 at one school compared to a 3.7 at another. If your schools isn't considered as difficult as say some random top institute, even a completely same set of stats and EC's will look worse because of where you went to school. Some schools even have set groups/people on their committee to look at certain schools or regions because they are tasked with understanding how those schools compare.
Doesn't mean of course that you can't get into top programs from a lower school, and that someone from a top ranked school wouldn't, but that doesn't negate the fact that school does matter at least a bit.
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36. kind of unbalanced... 13, 13, 10 PS/VR/BS.
and not n=1. Basically, these were people who made decent MCAT scores 35+ from USC and made a 3.8 GPA or higher. I got into Duke, Wash U, Emory, and UNC, but I just chose SC over them all because I literally got paid to go there. It's the same story for many of the people I'm talking about from my university. A good student will be a good student wherever you put him/her.
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coming from a top school will give you a boost whether you are applying to Hopkins or a no name state school. that's how it works.
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sit on an adcom and you'll learn how it works. congratulations on your great accetances and glad you can prove (just like me) that you can get into great schools from a state program. keep up the good work
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^ USC is not a "state school". It's a fairly well-regarded private university.
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I'm not saying that big names don't have an advantage in medical admissions. I'm just saying you can get there from a lower tier school. That's all I'm saying. And I just mean that I saved money by going to my state school and ended up in the same place. I just think it's a little strange to throw money down the drain. I also know a lot of people from great schools like Duke and Wash U that end up at our state med school... in the end, it's up to you and your family OP. Where do you think your daughter can excel (i.e. will she standout in an environment where she's "smarter" or one where those around her are extremely ambitious) and do you think that the money saved by going to So Cal will allow you to take out less loans for medical school? Going to a reputable school will of course help in decisions IF she does just as well there. That's a big IF.
Also, @solitarius @jturkel was talking about USC (south carolina), where I went. Not the OP's SoCal USC.
Schools would be stupid to just simply base all of their judgement of you off of MCAT, if it was that perfect, they wouldn't even care about your GPAs. These schools have been around for so long that they know the quality of education specific institutes offer their students, if they know any average joe can get an 3.6 at U of w/e, they will take that into account, and therefore you will be less competitive than someone who earned at a 3.6 at a university that is known to be tougher.
I'm definitely not someone who likes the idea of grade inflation, but even if Harvard does grade inflate, it doesn't necessarily mean that they aren't providing a great education level and learning experiences to their students. There is a reason why these universities consistently are top ranked...
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yah i saw your usc was south carolina. i'm agreeing with you/have personal expeirence withwhat i bolded. all else being equal, you just have an advantage (whether you or like it or not) coming from a top school. i turned plenty town to go to college for free
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