Impact madness! LOL. just for funn...
3) Don't be a dick. Work well with people in lab, so even if you don't get first author, you'll be able to work with other people on their projects, and they will be MUCH MORE inclined to help you on yours, especially on the first author project, so to speak. Not to mention if you make a substantial contribution, you'll have more opportunities to chip in for a secondary authorship =P
and above all, HARD WORK IS CRITICAL.
Couldn't agree more. The worst thing anyone can do is to be enemies with the grad students. If they aren't willing to teach you anything then you won't be able to do anything. Also grad students like to talk, a lot, so you have one shot to get on their good side or else everyone will dismiss you (I've seen it happen and its not pretty).
Here are just some observations that I have seen. Take them simply as a single observer's point of view, but they are pretty simple.
1). If a lab has not published in the past 3-5 years, then it probably won't publish anything while you are there.
2). Follow the money. If a lab is getting new funds then the PI is probably onto something and will be willing to spend money to try and produce results.
3). Professors who are new and are trying to get tenure will be very willing to let undergrads have responsibilities that are not normally given to undergrads. The PI will be desperately trying to publish (so you know papers will be coming) and the PI usually has to train the grad students and is normally more than willing to train undergrads as well.
4). Know the material. It doesn't take too much to sit down and get a rough understanding about whats going on in the lab. Having an understanding and being able to contribute maybe a comment or two in group meeting will go a long ways towards establishing trust (must be ligit contributions, nothing will sink your ship faster than stupid comments).
5). Be seen but not heard. Its best to just absorb whats going on around you when you start in a lab. (Once again it all goes back to the trust between you and the grad students or PI). Generally undergrads will not have much to add if they are just starting in a lab. Get a feel for what is expected, then start to add to conversations. Once again Don't Be a Dick, grad students (in general) hate undergrads and being a dick will only further cement that hatred.
6). Work your butt off. Plain and simple, if you show up early in the morning and work late then you will gain respect.
7). Always have something to do. Don't sit around and read ESPN or SDN while in lab, that looks really bad. Either be working on your project, find something to clean, or be reading scientific articles that are relevant.
8). If you really want to get published find a specific area that your group is working on that you can specialize in. For example, if your group has to learn how to do a specific assay and no one is really sure how to do it (or if there is something that is going wrong and no one knows why), then you take initiative and try to learn how to do the assay (or whats going wrong) by reading journals, talking to other groups. If you show initiative, then the people in your group will trust you with more and more things.
9). Just as Rome wasn't built in a day, so to you will not become king of the lab (to borrow a term from "Bones") over night. It takes time, but each day inch closer and closer to your goal by building trust and showing responsibilities.
10). Focus on what has been given. I ran across an article (maybe it was here on SDN or elsewhere) but it said that often those who want more responsibility in life often are not taking care of the things that they are responsible for. An example that I have seen: an undergrad wanted more responsibility and he was confused why he wasn't able to get more work (more involved) in lab. Well ends up that the guy had been asked to order paper for the printer (pretty petty task), well he never did and after a week of having no paper the grad students ordered it themselves, needless to say he was not given more responsibilities.
11). Don't kiss ass. There is nothing that grad students hate more than an undergrad kissing the PI's ass and going over their heads. Judge how the grad students interact with the PI and go from there. Some groups go get beers with their PI; in other groups, the PI will be in lab 15 minutes a week and thats all the contact that they have with the grad students. Just use judgement on when to go to the PI, sometimes its necessary or beneficial, but not normally.
12). Know what you are doing. The final thing I will say about gaining trust is know why you are doing something. If you are using a mass spec machine, you should probably know why you are using it, if or what kind of separation you are using and why. Example: I was shadowing a friend in her lab and I was asking her some questions about what she was doing and why she was using this chemical as opposed to another (I was trying to learn the technique not throw her under the bus) and she had no idea on any of these simple "science" questions, and her PI was standing right there and had a look of horror on his face. So simply, don't horrify your PI by not knowing what you are doing.
12*). Just a note, even if you are not getting paid for your work that does not mean that you are not costing the lab money. Because depending on what materials you are using, you can be really blowing through money just in materials and so if you screw up you could potentially lose the lab thousands of dollars.
13). How do you find a good lab (I come full circle). A great way is to ask a trusted elderly science professor. Typically (and I say typically realizing that this is not the case always) elderly professors will not be as heavily involved in their own research but they will have an ear to the ground as to what is going on in each lab. If you know this elderly professor well (or any professor) you should go to them and ask them, who is doing good research and where could I get significant research experience.
13*). (I know that I will get no award for brevity, so I will continue in my thesis). Research experience >>> first authorship. Now let me explain this. If you are looking towards getting into medical school or MSTP or MD/PhD then you might (if MD/PhD then you will) be asked about your research. Now if you say, "I was first author" (or 2nd or 4th or whatever) and they ask, "Oh could you explain your project and how you contributed?" And if you respond with "oh, well I mainly did grunt work, but I was Nth author, look." Then you are toast. Its much better to go into those interviews being able to say, I was given these responsibilities (actual research experience) but I not fortunate enough to get a publication, then the interviewers will look much more favorable upon this. You can get publications and be in lab 3 hrs/ week while others can be working 30 hrs/week and never get a pub. (Life isn't fair, this is why everyone says its luck because it is) And whats even more important than just know techniques (because even monkeys can learn techniques) is learning what questions need to be asked and how one goes about answering those questions <----- most important thing to learn in research.
I think I'm on 14). Now here is something I am unsure about so take this with a grain of salt. (Any comments would be gladly accepted on this issue). There will be lab drama. There always is. Grad student X hates undergrad Y and threatens to kick him out. Or PostDoc Z gets on everyones' nerves and Grad Student J calls them out on it. Whatever the case, it will happen. Its best to be as neutral as possible in whatever situation, but of course thats not always possible. DONT PLAY BOTH SIDES, this will bite you in the ass because "grad students always talk" and you will be found out. So keep your head down when possible.
14*). Also related to this, is the blame game. Things go wrong and PI or PostDocs or Grad students have to blame someone. The last thing that you should do is point figures (its just not professional). If your PI comes to you and is telling you that you completely screwed up the experiment because some concentration was wrong (even though it was the other undergrad) sit there and take it and then afterwards go and talk with the other undergrad. (Sounds stupid, but the PI will trust you more because you were willing to be corrected and as long as you are humble and promise to do it right next time then he will trust you more; also the other undergrad will be thankful to you for not ratting him out and others in your lab will see what happened and the will know whose fault it really is and things will trickle up (maybe not specifically that situation but character traits) to the PI)).
(I've noticed that these paragraphs keep getting longer and I use too many parenthesis) (Also by the time that I finish this post, this thread will be on the 3rd page) But I'm on a roll so I will continue <most of the bad things that have happened have happened to me, so I'm trying to share my knowledge so that others don't have to go through these thing> Also I'm still in the general area of telling how to get publications.
15). Rule 1 for when you are looking at a new lab to perhaps join. If all the grad students are foreign then there is a chance that the PI works the students awfully hard. (Not so sure how true this is but this is what I have been told by my grad students and others). So investigate a little if everyone is foreign to makes sure you are not getting into an environment that might not be the best for you.
16). Now I've talked quite a bit about labs where there are grad students and post docs, but there are labs where there are no grad students just the PI and undergrads. Now these labs can go two ways: 1) The PI is heavily involved or 2) the PI is not involved. I will speak to the first and comment on the second later. When the PI is heavily involved this can be very good and a great learning experience. The PI will take time to teach you protocol and techniques and if you show interest your responsibility can increase. This is an excellent place to learn about "What question ought to be asked and how to answer those questions" because you can ask the PI, why are we doing this or what made you choose this chemical instead of that chemical. [Just a note on these labs, you need to be careful that the PI is not simply using the undergrads for sheer grunt work. I have seen several who only have undergrads do mindless, repetitive work which is great but learning is not taking place].
Keys to striving in these labs are hard work and following the instructions of the PI to the letter. Since the PI is the only one above you, it is key to gain his trust.
Now as to labs where the PI is hands off without grad students. These are tricky labs. They can be great, they can be horrible. These labs will generally have an upperclassman who "oversees" the lab. (I have no idea how many of these actually exist but this probably applies to all hands-off labs) These labs are really tough to screw up but also really tough to accomplish much in. In general I think these are excellent labs to learn how to "think for yourself" in. But these are labs where you can display leadership (and once you are the "overseer," dealing with everyone's problems). Generally these labs will not turn out the most research papers but these can be excellent places to gain experience.
Now since I love rankings I will put some rankings out (note these are just from my experiences which is limited to one school and the stories that I have read here on SDN) (*These are only meant as a rough guide, to truly understand a lab, nothing replaces your own background checks).
Most likely to be producing papers:
1. Young teachers (on tenure track) w/ grad students
T2. Tenured teachers w/ grad students
T2. Teachers (on tenure track) w/o grad student but PI is involved
4. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad students but PI in involved
5. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad students and PI is NOT involved
Mostly likely for student to be ignored:
1. Tenured teachers w/ grad students
2. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad students and PI is NOT involved
3. Young teachers (on tenure track) w/ grad students
4. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad student but PI is involved
5. Teachers (on tenure track) w/o grad students but PI in involved
Most room for "aggressive expansion" (to quote the joker):
1. Young teachers (on tenure track) w/ grad students
2. Teachers (on tenure track) w/o grad students but PI in involved
3. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad students and PI is NOT involved
4. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad student but PI is involved
5. Tenured teachers w/ grad students
Best Environment for a Go Getter, A self Motivated person (these people will feel stifled by grad students or PIs watching over their shoulder):
1. Young teachers (on tenure track) w/ grad students
2. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad students and PI is NOT involved
3. Teachers (on tenure track) w/o grad students but PI in involved
4. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad student but PI is involved
5. Tenured teachers w/ grad students
Best Environment for Students who like step by step instructions and are very by the book (there is nothing wrong with these people they will make great doctors) (they will feel completely lost and will become ignored in large labs where they might be tossed to the wind):
1. Teachers (on tenure track) w/o grad students but PI in involved
2. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad student but PI is involved
3. Tenured teachers w/ grad students
4. Young teachers (on tenure track) w/ grad students
5. Teachers (not on tenure track) w/o grad students and PI is NOT involved <Stay away from this lab, you will drown>
Closing words of advice:
Don't feel bad sometimes it is best to move on from one lab to another.
Finding out which type of lab will help you be the best that you can be which will lead to publications or significant research experience or both!
Make sure that the lab can have side projects. If the lab only uses one machine and the machine is always being used, then you could sit and do nothing. (I had a friend who had this happened to him, he had fun sitting doing nothing 40hrs/week all summer).
If you dont like the subject then you wont like the research and you wont work hard and you wont get published. Start with what you like and work from there (I understand small schools and this is not always possible but PIs at smaller schools are a little bit more willing to work with you so that you are interested in the research)
Oh, the first week always sucks. Just gut through it, it will get better.
Bench research is not for everyone, you dont have to love it. You can go to your med school interview and they ask you about your research and if you explain it and then volunteer the information that you did not enjoy it, the interviewer will not look down on you for this but will respect your life decision because bench research is not for everyone. But with this being said, bench research is only one type of research and if you hate bench research then you won't necessarily hate all research. So its ok to close the door to bench research but don't be naive and close the door to all research.
Well, I should end my treaties here. I apologize for my brevity (PM me if you would like me to expand on any subject, I don't want to burden this wall anymore). (The brevity thing above is a joke). Finally, I once again state that these are simply my observations and should be taken as observation and helpful words of advice not as set in stone law. I myself have worked in a lab with a young PI (on tenure track) with grad students and in a lab of a tenured PI w/o grad students and he was not involved. I have shadowed quite a few labs and seen how other labs work, but do not claim all knowledge in those other labs. Also, every lab, every university is different and these rules could be completely null in some places, but I doubt that hard work and politeness will fail you. I myself have 3 first author papers and am working on more (I saw this not to brag but to simply give credence to what I saw). However, I have only finished two years of undergrad and thus anything about medical school is what I have been told by trusted sources who could be wrong but I have only tried to pass on credible information. I hope that this is helpful to anyone who is interest and I apologize for any typo's its 3 a.m. at this point in time.
Wow 7 pages in Microsoft word (I have said too much!)
