Q&A about becoming a psychologist

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WhoNeedsAShrink

WhoNeedsAShrink

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Hi. I just turned 27, and I am a bit interested in becoming a psychologist. I have a B.S. in b.s. with 21 credits of that in psychology. I had a pretty decent GPA. For the past several years I've been a LEO, and I've always been tempted to become a psychologist even in undergrad. I didn't because I wasn't great at math and all the statistics and research methods courses intimidated me. That said, I took a stat course a couple summers back, understood it, and did well. Anyway, I've never been to a psychologist or any kind of therapist for that matter although I did have a pre-employment screening once by a psych so I have little to no personal experience with the area.

If you were out in the working world for going on six years, and all that time held an interest in the mental health field would you pursue it? Maybe another route? I was accepted to a community counseling M.S. program last fall, but I've yet to take a course because 1) I make about as much money now than I would as a counselor, and 2) it's hard to find time to go over and take the classes as I certainly wouldn't quit and do that program full-time. I wouldn't mind doing so to pursue a clinical doctorate specifically a Psy.D. I also am not all that enthusiastic about the limitations of being a master-trained counselor although I would like to take the courses.

I really don't want a Ph.D., and I don't want to get in depth in the research side of things so I'm guessing a Psy.D. is a better choice for me. How did all of you finance this? Would you do it again? Is it doable in less than five years? What are the best workplace options, i.e. pvt practice, hospital, etc?

Thanks for the read. 👍
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Define pretty decent GPA. Also take a practice GRE, see where you fall before you start getting too ramped up. Good news is that the Psy.D. from a professional school is less competitive to get into than a Ph.D. or Psy.D. program at a university that provides funding, bad news is that it is horribly expensive and the opportunity costs may make it cost prohibitive when compared to keeping your current career. However don't let that discourage you, as there are creative paths that exist that can make this a reality.

It's about being an educated consumer here. Pour over the threads, there is a lot of valuable information on this website and you can find considerable information in the insiders guide to graduate programs in clinical psychology which is the tabla rasa for getting into these programs for the most part. It's a competitive field even at the professional school level, although less competitive to get in... still you will find yourself needing to compete for internship placements etc.

Good luck,

Mark
 
There are plenty of clinically focused Ph.D programs. There are many more differences between the two besides than the larger focus on research. Plus, this is a science, so you will have to learn stats, methodology, design, and how to properly understand and critique research no matter whcih degree. Ph.D programs will generally just give more opps to do your own research. Nonetheless, as I said, there are plenty of clinically focused Ph.D programs that prepare you well for practice and dont neccearily have the goal of churning out academics. If your SOLE goal is to do psychotherapy, I would look at other, less entinsive options than the doctorate (ie., MSW, degree in mental heath counseling, etc). Generally speaking, doctoral level individuals might have a deeper grasp of in-depth therapy work, but Im not sure the literautre bears out that they are neccearily better therapists than masters level folks.

Ph.D. programs usually provide tuition remission and stipend to fund you. Psy.d programs generally do not (except Baylor, which is more research intensive than most psyds from what im aware), so you will go into extraordinary debt. Earaning potrential doesnt neccearily justify the loans you will take out at some of the profesional schools, which have bad reps anyway. Do a search if you want a gazzillion discusions about that issue:laugh:

The best workplace option is your preference based on your personality, desired lifestyle, and the population you want to work with. Noone can answer that for you. However, it should be obvious the advantages and disadvantages of each (ie., Making your own schedule vs madatory work hours. Steady salary vs keeping referal base up to mainatain income. Dealing with the masive headache of doing your own billing and fighting with 3rd party insururers vs not having to worry about all that).

Average timeline is 5 plus one for intership for thr Ph.D (6 years). and 4 plus one for intership for the Psy.D (5 years).

PS: I would also add the your screename is a rather deragatory term for psychologists and psychiatrists. Do you know the origin of the term?
 
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Really, if you're offended by an internet user name, you might want to see a shrink. LOL. Sorry, but I think the PC bull of feigned offense over terminology in common use is a bit ridiculous. Get over it, move on, and remember what we do only looks easy.

Mark
 
👍 It was probably not meant to be offensive.
Markp said:
Really, if you're offended by an internet user name, you might want to see a shrink. LOL. Sorry, but I think the PC bull of feigned offense over terminology in common use is a bit ridiculous. Get over it, move on, and remember what we do only looks easy.

Mark
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relax. I didnt say I was offended. I said it was a deragatory term.
 
Back to my original question, what would be the best path for a nontraditional student wanting to enter the mental health field? I know what is best for one may not be best for another, but if you're six years out of college, engaged in the workforce with a good, enjoyable job where do you go from there? I've never done research. I even avoided classes in college that called for substantial research, and although I don't mind doing it as a component of a degree plan it's not where I want my career to go nor do I have any thing relevant to mention when applying to Ph.D. psych programs. I've looked over some admissions websites, and I really just am not in a position to compete with that kind of thing.
 
-Get research experience (paid or volunteer)--look at universities, medical schools, and hospitals.

-Get clinical experience (paid or volunteer), though this generally isn't as important as research experience.

-Take psych classes if you haven't (especially common prereqs--stats, research, personality, social, abnormal, developmental, tests and measurement, history and systems)

-Study for the GRE.
 
I agree. The path is really the same no matter what age you are, as you have to have certain prereqs and experiences (ie., research) to compete with the rest of the crowd. I would argue that clinical expererience is less important from an admission standpoint, since, at this point, you cant really do much that parellels the training you're going to get in a doctoral program (eg., assessment, testing, diagnosis, treatment planning, therapy). However, I would strongly advise getting at least some clinical experience for personal growth, and so you can learn what its like to work with psychiatric populations. If you're only considering a psyd. (and I would urge you to think carefully before making that decision), I would advise getting more clinical expereince and just some research. You still need some of both though. Is your undegrad degree in psych? If not, you will at least have to take the prereqs before you apply to doctoral programs. Generally, stats, research design, abnormal.

If you want to make the career switch, you will probably have to cut down to at least half-time (I would think) at your current job so you can use the other 20-25 hours/week working in a research volunteer position and obtaining minor clinical experience/exposure. That is, unless you wanna start putting in 60 hours a week before grad school. Since you will get plenty of those weeks during, not sure if you'd want that now.
 
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Geez. In that amount of time I could just take the few prereqs I don't have and go to med school and become a psychiatrist which is probably a much more viable option. I seriously don't give a flip about getting into research especially if that's just to blend in with the rest of the crowd. Thanks.
 
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Thats true, but is that what you want? Psychiatry (which has a much much different perspective and role) is still 4 years of med school plus 3-4 years of residency (8 years). And....you have to cut up dead bodies...😀 Goodbye therapy and hello med checks...lol. Thats a generalization, but doing anything beyond very short term supportive therapy as a psychiatrist is rare these days. The insurance companies dont want to reimburse M.Ds when psychologists or MSWs can do it for slightly cheaper.
 
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WhoNeedsAShrink said:
Geez. In that amount of time I could just take the few prereqs I don't have and go to med school and become a psychiatrist which is probably a much more viable option. I seriously don't give a flip about getting into research especially if that's just to blend in with the rest of the crowd. Thanks.
Click to expand...


you could always go for an msw.
 
WhoNeedsAShrink said:
Geez. In that amount of time I could just take the few prereqs I don't have and go to med school and become a psychiatrist which is probably a much more viable option. I seriously don't give a flip about getting into research especially if that's just to blend in with the rest of the crowd. Thanks.
Click to expand...

Wow, that's an attitude. Did someone tell you this was going to be easy?
 
WhoNeedsAShrink said:
Geez. In that amount of time I could just take the few prereqs I don't have and go to med school and become a psychiatrist which is probably a much more viable option. I seriously don't give a flip about getting into research especially if that's just to blend in with the rest of the crowd. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Then you should probably look elsewhere...as a portion (often a large portion) of the training involves reviewing, consuming, and producing research.
 
erg923 said:
Thats true, but is that what you want? Psychiatry (which has a much much different perspective and role) is still 4 years of med school plus 3-4 years of residency (8 years). And....you have to cut up dead bodies...😀 Goodbye therapy and hello med checks...lol. Thats a generalization, but doing anything beyond very short term supportive therapy as a psychiatrist is rare these days. The insurance companies dont want to reimburse M.Ds when psychologists or MSWs can do it for slightly cheaper.
Click to expand...

As a matter of fact yes I would rather do that, lol. With time being so precious, however, psychology seemed to be a better avenue. Apparently not.
 
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thewesternsky said:
Wow, that's an attitude. Did someone tell you this was going to be easy?
Click to expand...

Easy? No. Did I think I'd be able to become a mental health practitioner without devoting precious time to performing someone else's research? Yes.
 
Therapist4Chnge said:
Then you should probably look elsewhere...as a portion (often a large portion) of the training involves reviewing, consuming, and producing research.
Click to expand...

Reading someone else's research and putting it into practice is fine with me, but I really don't care to add to the profession myself so yes I'd rather be a consumer.
 
You do realize you could have just put that entire thing on one post instead of several right?

I see you are responding to a lot of the posts. You probably don't realize this, but some of your comments here may cause offense to readers because you don't really recognize the huge distinction between being a psychologist and a psychiatrist. Additionally, the way you approached the situation might have alienated the majority of potential respondents (this is of course a clinical thread where many people love to do research.) and like my grandmother used to say, you catch more flies with honey than vinegar. I would recommend checking out the med school threads because it seems psychiatry is where your interests lie. However, keep in mind that whatever doctoral level graduate school you do pursue, there will be things you like and do not like about each.

I don't mean to cause you any offense, but you sound sort of wishy-washy in terms of your graduate level training. People who are successful in their fields don't just go for a PhD because an MD is longer or go for an MD because they get more money than PhDs (etc) . The happy and successful people go because it's something they feel passionatly about. Come application time, you will be up against people with TONS of research experience (it's nice to have for med school too), tons of prerequesite classes, tons of hours shadowing different doctors (there are people on the high school pre med thread that are insanely qualified already), and people who have been dedicated to this for the past several years instead of deciding to do it on a whim.

I know several people who have just gone to graduate school because they felt that it was the next step or they were "getting too old and would never go back otherwise." And they ended up MISERABLE. If you are so easily swayed from one program to the next just by us telling you you will have to do some research, perhaps it would be better to take some time and get experience that would come in handy for several different types of programs (PhDs, PsyDs, MD, MSW, etc) before you commit the next decade on schooling, and the rest of your life in practice.

Good luck with whatever you do, but just remember, not every PhD program is going to be ALL research. You could spend a good portion of your time on research, but there are so many other wonderful things you can learn while there. You never never know, I used to think I would hate doing research. Then, I finally did it, and found myself enjoying it. So never count it out unless you know for a fact it's something you don't like.

Best Wishes
 
Yeah, someone told me that I would hate research. I didn't. 😉
 
If time is that "precious" to you, I would suggest you skip both grad school and med school/residency. Most people here have a priority of getting the best training they can and learning as much as they can not geting it over with as quick as possible. Would you want to go to a doc with that attitiude?

Second, If you do not have a natural intellectual curiosity regarding researching and understanding complex psychological phenomena, then doctoral level psychology is not for you. Its a science. Whether you are Psy.D or Ph.D, you are still a scientist, and you should have the proper scientific mindset if you want to be in this proffesion. Doing other peoples research is NOT what you do in grad school. You are doing your research with the help of mentor in order to become a better scientist. And hence, a more empirical based and critical psychologist. If you just want to just talk with people and do counseling (which is what it sounds like you're most into) I would urge you to consider the MSW or something similar.

As for psychiatry, that was kind of a curve ball, as you have never mentioned an interest in general medicine, biology, physiology, or pharmacology, etc. This is what med school is. Psych wont even come into the picture until after your 4 years of med school, and even then, its mostly about pharmacology. The psychiatrist is much different provider, with a much different perspective on mental ilness (medical model) and has a much different role (usually more acute) in patient care. If that is what you really had your eye on to begin with, thats fine. But im not sure how you have concluded that this actually a faster way to get you to a (much different) career?
 
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AryaStark said:
You do realize you could have just put that entire thing on one post instead of several right?

I see you are responding to a lot of the posts. You probably don't realize this, but some of your comments here may cause offense to readers because you don't really recognize the huge distinction between being a psychologist and a psychiatrist. Additionally, the way you approached the situation might have alienated the majority of potential respondents (this is of course a clinical thread where many people love to do research.) and like my grandmother used to say, you catch more flies with honey than vinegar. I would recommend checking out the med school threads because it seems psychiatry is where your interests lie. However, keep in mind that whatever doctoral level graduate school you do pursue, there will be things you like and do not like about each.

I don't mean to cause you any offense, but you sound sort of wishy-washy in terms of your graduate level training. People who are successful in their fields don't just go for a PhD because an MD is longer or go for an MD because they get more money than PhDs (etc) . The happy and successful people go because it's something they feel passionatly about. Come application time, you will be up against people with TONS of research experience (it's nice to have for med school too), tons of prerequesite classes, tons of hours shadowing different doctors (there are people on the high school pre med thread that are insanely qualified already), and people who have been dedicated to this for the past several years instead of deciding to do it on a whim.

I know several people who have just gone to graduate school because they felt that it was the next step or they were "getting too old and would never go back otherwise." And they ended up MISERABLE. If you are so easily swayed from one program to the next just by us telling you you will have to do some research, perhaps it would be better to take some time and get experience that would come in handy for several different types of programs (PhDs, PsyDs, MD, MSW, etc) before you commit the next decade on schooling, and the rest of your life in practice.

Good luck with whatever you do, but just remember, not every PhD program is going to be ALL research. You could spend a good portion of your time on research, but there are so many other wonderful things you can learn while there. You never never know, I used to think I would hate doing research. Then, I finally did it, and found myself enjoying it. So never count it out unless you know for a fact it's something you don't like.

Best Wishes
Click to expand...

Actually, yes, I'm totally aware of the distinction between what goes on. I never exactly said that I wanted to perform psychotherapy, yet rather I did say I was interested in being a practitioner of mental health. In fact, the pathophysiology involved is probably more interesting than oh say coursework in operant conditioning.

With regards to your third paragraph there's nothing wishy-washy about it. You mention there are many people who love to perform research. I am not one of those people nor do I have to be. Now, that I'm aware, from all of you practicing or aspiring psychologists, that psychology is highly centered around performing independent research then it is in fact a career not for me as I have made obvious - research isn't for me. Also, no, you're far from offending me so don't sweat that.

What you don't know is exactly how many prereqs I have that I need to go to medical school or that my b.s. degree as I call it, since it does not translate into a particular occupation, was in fact rather biological in nature.

It's not that I'm swayed from psychology as a whole due to a research component, but if that is a requirement of even applything then no I will not participate. I would engage in it throughout my schooling as required, but beyond that I would be done with it. I don't mind perusing a few books and website for the day to day information that I need, but disseminating surveys, compiling statistical data into useful information, and going on with experimental studies simply doesn't suit my interests or personality. Kudos for you for enjoying it. I, myself, would rather engage in other pursuits.

Until next time.
 
erg923 said:
Second, If you do not have a natural intellectual curiosity regarding researching and understanding complex psychological phenomena, then doctoral level psychology is not for you.
Click to expand...

Thank you. That's essentially what I was looking for here.

Oh, and I never mentioned an interest in medicine, biology, or related fields because it wasn't relevant to the posed questions. I will depart now. Thank you for the assistance.
 
Now, dont take that to mean that Ph.D psych is all research and that you have to love it. You dont. But you do have to apreciate the importance of it, and be willing to have the mindset of scientist, not just of a practioner. Psy.d. will require little production of any research, but you still need some background in it, and appreciation of scientific methodology.
 
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