Question About Shelter Dogs

[168135]

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About once a week, I go to the local animal shelter and walk the dogs. I used to go and clean cat cages but I'm allergic to the chemicals that they use 😛

I have never owned a dog, and just started to get used to being around them a few years ago. I have a couple of questions about dog walking!

3 of the 4 shelter dogs that I have walked pull a LOT on their leash. Halfway through their walk, I manage to get them to stop pulling by tugging on their leash when they start pulling, making them stop when they are pulling too much, not giving them much slack, and praising them when they do manage not to pull. It works, but is it appropriate? Is there anything else that I should be trying, or should I not bother doing anything because I'm only walking them one a week?

Thank you 🙂

 

[Electrophile]

Our shelter drives me crazy since they say they want all dogs put on a harness (hello, Iditarod anyone?). Probably the simplest is a no pull harness that has the ring for the leash on the front instead of the back. I personally prefer prong collars and that's what I use for my own foster dogs, but the PC police often don't like them usually because they don't understand them. 🙄 I am not a big fan of the Halti/Gentle Leader head halters as there is a serious risk of neck injury with those if you have a real excitable dog, but I've used them in some situations. But any in case, make sure you have someone very knowledgeable show you how to use them as harnesses in particular aren't real intuitive and prong collars and head halters can be misused.

 

[168135]

I haven't even seen a harness or a prong collar at the shelter. We just hook their leash on their collar and away we go.

 

[nyanko]

It's really hard to train a dog with just a regular flat collar, because it's difficult to administer correction with one of those. I agree that a prong collar is the way to go for training leash manners.

What you are doing is fine if all you have is a flat collar. You should leave a note in some kind of communal area for the volunteers saying which dogs you are trying to train and discussing it with the other dog walking volunteers so that everyone is on the same page and maybe you can do the dogs some good so they can get homes easier. 🙂

 

[smilesoup]

Sorry to go off-topic, but what is the most appropriate method of training a dog to walk nicely? My miniature schnauzer pulls like crazy, and he's three years old. We've tried to get him not to pull by using a variety of methods (tugging on the leash and rewarding, shortening the leash, stopping straight in our tracks until he gives the leash some slack, etc.), but which works best/is the most humane?

 

[PrimalMU]

I think the best method for leash training depends on the trainer and the dog. I've personally had good luck using a choke chain high up on the neck (make sure you put it on the the right direction). It seems to work better than normal collars and doesn't seem to distress the dog any more than a regular collar would. I think prong collars are good for the larger, stronger breeds that have a higher pain tolerance (rotties, etc).

I wish I knew more about training dogs. I do know, however, that consistency is the most important thing, regardless of which method you use.

 

[PrimalMU]

Sorry to go off-topic, but what is the most appropriate method of training a dog to walk nicely? My miniature schnauzer pulls like crazy, and he's three years old. We've tried to get him not to pull by using a variety of methods (tugging on the leash and rewarding, shortening the leash, stopping straight in our tracks until he gives the leash some slack, etc.), but which works best/is the most humane?

One method I've heard of is as soon as the dog starts to pull, immediately do a 180 degree turn. I think I saw it on Its Me or the Dog on Animal Planet, haha.

Another thing you might try is exercising your schnauzer first. I know there are mixed feelings regarding Cesar Milan, but I think he's spot on when he tells his clients to exercise their dog before training.

 

[twelvetigers]

Yeah, that lady with the red lipstick and patent leather belts (on Me or the Dog) always does a 180 when the dog starts to tug. It seems like it would work if you could manage it!

 

[PrimalMU]

Mmmhmm... I think it would work better with dogs to tend to lunge. Wouldn't work too well with dogs that constantly pull, cuz you'd never make it 3 feet!

 

[ri23]

The idea of doing the 180 turn is that it forces the dog to pay attention to your actions (which it can't do if it is pulling). It can certainly be tedious at first, as your seemingly walking in circles.

I utilize a prong or choke collar, depending on the dog, but as others have said you have to know how to use them. As the dog gets slightly ahead of me, but not to the end of the leash I say "easy". The response to this command should be that the dog slows down/waits for me. If the dog doesn't respond I do the turn, thereby giving a jerk to the dog that isn't paying attention. You never want to reprimand the dog when you give your command, rather the reprimand should come with the word no.

My dog is actually trained on a shock collar, which is another collar that requires proper knowledge in order to train effectively. The collar has a positive/reward tone, a negative tone, and a negative tone followed by an electrostatic shock. Therefore, once the dog starts associating the shock with the negative tone you very rarely have to use the correction. I really only use the collar for off-leash walking, but it is a great way to immediately correct a dog no matter if they are close or far away.

 

[sms25]

I have a crazy pit bull that we adopted from the shelter when he was one year old. He pulled like crazy with a regular collar to the point of choking himself, so we tried a choke collar (he was in obedience classes and they recommended we try it). Didn't work. The vet suggested a gentle leader. He didn't pull, but for the most part he refused to walk and rolled around on the ground. We tried that a few weeks, but he never got better with it. Then the trainer recommended a prong. We put the thing on him and he didn't even try to pull. He just walked with us and when he gets distracted we try a 180 a couple times to get his attention. Now he walks awesome (with his prong).

We got a puppy (boxer mix) this summer and I wanted to try a positive training method. We're taking lessons with a different trainer and using a clicker. He goes for walks and gets loaded with treats (sometimes I just use his food) for staying next to me. When he pulls I call him and the second there's some slack on the leash I click and give him a treat. It took a while for him to stop pulling, but now at 5 months, he's awesome for walks. I picked up a book called "The Power of Positive Dog Training" and I think it's a really good book. I highly recommend it.

I really like the positive training better than using the prong and corrections, but I know there's no way I could have done it with my pit because he was so crazy when we first got him. Now that he's obedient I try to use positive training as much as possible. We're re-training him (with lots of treats) to walk on his regular collar so we won't need to use the prong. So far it's going really well.

 

[Electrophile]

sms25, you bring up an interesting idea. You can actually use both an aversive (prong collar, remote trainer, verbal no 🙄) in conjunction with motivational training and clicker/marker training. When the dog is in the learning phase, corrections aren't particularly fair. This is how you may get handler aggressive dogs because they resent the correction, even though they don't really "get" why. So when a dog is just learning a new cue, like sit or down, it's not fair to them to crank and yank them into compliance. BUT once the dog has been through enough repetitions and is now motivated to work with you and knows and understands the cue for the environment you're asking them to do it in, then you can introduce corrections to be used for when the dog's desire to give you the proverbial finger is greater than its desire for a food/toy reward. Whether you use a prong collar or the latest "gentle" gizmo, it's all a substitute for walking nice and politely on a regular collar or even leash and collar free. So work on shaping the right behavior along with correcting what you don't like.

But yes, The Power of Positive Dog Training (by Pat Miller, if I recall) is an excellent book! 👍

 

[thesonofdarwin]

Probably one of the most important things I try to get owners to comprehend when teaching obedience is being both consistent and observant.

Choker, prong, or whatever, apply pressure/resistance to the collar and immediately, and by immediately I mean immediately rather than 3 seconds later, release the pressure when they stop the bad behavior, such as pulling. If you are both observant and consistent the dog will quickly learn the bad behavior. What typical dog owners do is confuse their dogs by continuing to 'punish' them after the bad behavior has ended.

It amazes people when you can take their dog and perform everything their owner was doing beforehand, but the dog actually learns and listens. Once the dog is clear about what you want, most will listen. Of course there are the troublemakers, they just require more time 🙂

Because of the above, our animal shelter no longer allows the public to walk the dogs unless they are willing to be taught the proper way to enforce good behavior which most individuals aren't. All of our dogs are taught at least a basic level of obedience before being adopted out, and the slow learners are taken through the 8-week course - or at least they are until next week when the only obedience teacher moves to Vet School 😱

* Make sure you aren't punishing, even for <5 seconds, the dog during good behavior.
* DO NOT let the dog win. "But he's choking himself!" All you will do is teach the animal that to get what he wants he only has to endure your resistance until you give up. You are the top dog, make sure there is no confusion. Don't let it dominate you or you create the average disobedient dog that can be found at the top of many American household hierarchies.
* Make sure you are using the trainer gear appropriately... it matters which way the collar goes on and its placement.
* Praise the dog when the behavior is good, but gauge the level of praise such that it won't be distracting to the given dog and initiate further bad behavior.
* Be consistent.

 

[sofficat]

you can't blame the dogs for pulling. they're in a cage all day and FINALLY get some freedom on a walk and they just get too excited. it's good to try to correct them pulling, but don't be hard on yourself if it doesn't work out great. what the dogs need is a yard to run in and be free.... THEN take them for a walk and work on obedience. i do think it is important to try to train shelter dogs, but they HAVE to have a way to get their energy out before they start a training session.

 

[PrimalMU]

Yea, I normally don't bother trying to correct pulling until 10-15 minutes of walking. Usually by that time they've gotten a lot of the pulling out of their system.

 

[168135]

you can't blame the dogs for pulling. they're in a cage all day and FINALLY get some freedom on a walk and they just get too excited. it's good to try to correct them pulling, but don't be hard on yourself if it doesn't work out great. what the dogs need is a yard to run in and be free.... THEN take them for a walk and work on obedience. i do think it is important to try to train shelter dogs, but they HAVE to have a way to get their energy out before they start a training session.

The dogs are always outside in the runs when I go to walk them. The runs are huge and each dog is out there with one or two other dogs.

 

[Electrophile]

One thing I'd like to point out about choke chains/slip collars is that they must be worn up high to even remotely work for pulling and then they often slip. Prong collars are more effective and much more humane. But they are expensive (I use the Herm Sprenger brand, which is about $35 at the local pet store). My Malinois (see avatar) still wears a fur saver choke collar though for swimming as it doesn't get all soggy. This link may be helpful as an intro on how to fit a prong collar:

http://leerburg.com/prong.htm

 

[PrimalMU]

One thing I'd like to point out about choke chains/slip collars is that they must be worn up high to even remotely work for pulling and then they often slip.

Absolutely. For anyone who's not sure about positioning, take a look at the positioning of the collar on show dogs, i.e. above/before the larynx. Otherwise, they'll just choke themselves. The collar should also be positioned so that it slides easily through the ring when tugged.