question from a PD

[pgy13]

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Just curious...do phone calls from the PD make a difference on your rank list? I've never done it because I found it annoying when I was applying (never quite knew what to say).

 

[NoodleIncident]

It makes no difference at all to me. It's a nice gesture, but it does not influence my rank list. It's amazing to hear that for some people it does matter and that they change their rank list accordingly. You'd figure that someone smart enough to make it through med school would understand the match algorithm and rank programs as they like them and not based on the correspondence they receive. But, to each their own I guess.

 

[Idiopathic]

I can imagine that it would make a difference. I had a debate between programs 3-6 and where to put them, and a nice call from program 6 could have bumped them up, etc. I dont think it would have caused any one program to jump to 1, but it certainly could have affected things.

edit: after reading Noodle's post, I'll clarify that personal communication from a PD might have actually made me 'like' a program more, especially as it got down on the list.

 

[no oxygen]

I agree with Idio..I have to admit that a nice, personal phone call from a PD led me to rank a program that I initially left off my list. Depending on the situation, it can make a difference.

 

[Steel_City]

I do feel that my rank list was definately influenced by the feedback I received from certain programs. For me, it is very important to be part of a program that is excited to have me as their resident. There was only one program that I had heard nothing at all from after my interview. I just figured they weren't that interested so I kind of counted them out on my list. I ranked them, but a little lower than I would have. Go figure...they ended up calling me a few days after rank lists were due so maybe my interpretation isn't 100% on this.

I understand the otherside's point though as it can be a somewhat awkward conversation that ends up on the subject of the weather outside; however it is a phone call that I appreciate.

I guess on the other end of the spectrum, does it matter to you guys if we never call or send thank-yous after our interview? Would you rather have a higher pick that ranked you last or a lesser one who's just dying to be a part of your team. Same deal.

 

[NoodleIncident]

Okay, well lets think about this possibility. A program calls you up or sends you a letter expressing how they would love for you to train there and that you'd fit in great. What if it contacts ALL of the applicants that it ranks and tells them that they are ranked to match? Sure, it may make you feel that you were warmly received and that the program realy likes you, but what if you are # 70 of 70 ranked? I think this makes the argument of the program being really excited about you a little less important. I mean, when we write thank-you's, don't we also gush about how much we like the program even though we know it'll likely be dead last on our list? Even so, I bet a bunch of people change their rank lists in accordance with the letters they receive - and even further based on which person it's from, typed or hand-written, and even signed or stamped signature. And you know what happens when the programs influence us this much? The terrorists win, that's what.

My favorite programs are the ones that say that any correspondence we send after the interview won't matter in ranking and that they do not send out letters before match day trying to lure you or have current residents call you up.

 

[ThinkFast007]

I think it's a great idea to call the students whom you like.

I thought emails from PDs and calls were very influential. True, IF i were ranking say 12 programs and a progrm was number 12 on my list I wouldnt chnge it to #1...but perhaps # 2

seriously though, i think it's a great gesture. It shows interest in the applicant. But as you stated, things coudl be awkward. I would hope that whoever the PD was, would be ready to engage the applicant in nice convo (as that applicant is prolly burned out at answering 'why' he/she wants to attnd that particular program, and all the other stuff that goes along w/ it).

Another thing.. I also thought it was nice when programs in their correspondence to me, made it personal. Sending out form letters is NICE, but that personal touch really shows that you all care. I would rather go somewhere that really CARES and gives a hoot about ME, then just go somewhere just for the name, etc.

Thanks for asking by the way. It shows that YOU as a PD are truly concerned and willing to change/modify whatever it takes to mk the program better! (also something I looked at when ranking programs).

 

[aredoubleyou]

Might make a small difference among programs that its hard to choose which one to rank higher...but nothing significant. Also, I personally strongly prefer emails since I'm never home and its difficult to call from the hospital.

 

[pgy13]

I do feel that my rank list was definately influenced by the feedback I received from certain programs. For me, it is very important to be part of a program that is excited to have me as their resident. There was only one program that I had heard nothing at all from after my interview. I just figured they weren't that interested so I kind of counted them out on my list. I ranked them, but a little lower than I would have. Go figure...they ended up calling me a few days after rank lists were due so maybe my interpretation isn't 100% on this.

I understand the otherside's point though as it can be a somewhat awkward conversation that ends up on the subject of the weather outside; however it is a phone call that I appreciate.

I guess on the other end of the spectrum, does it matter to you guys if we never call or send thank-yous after our interview? Would you rather have a higher pick that ranked you last or a lesser one who's just dying to be a part of your team. Same deal.

Thank you notes do very little to change our match list. We rank based on the interview and academic credentials. Someone might get bumped up a bit if they send a "I'm absolutely, definitely, positively ranking your program first" sort of note, but not much. Most are just generic thank yous, and although they make me feel like we did a good job on the interview day, I've been doing this long enough to know they don't mean much. Some programs like to brag that they only went 20 people down their list or whatever, but we don't try to game our list.

To answer your second question, I guess I would rather get a higher pick (that's why we ranked them higher), but we only rank people we want in the program, so lower ranked/more enthusiastic is fine too.

 

[jennyboo]

Just curious...do phone calls from the PD make a difference on your rank list? I've never done it because I found it annoying when I was applying (never quite knew what to say).

If you have a good understanding of how "marriage algorithms" like the residency match work, then no, being subtly informed in any way about how you are ranked by the residency program (whether by email or phone or letter) does not influence how you rank the program. As a student, I have quite simply listed the programs in the order I wanted to go to them. I appreciate emails but not phone calls as these are awkward, happen at inopportune times, and I may not have a good response to give.

The only time when I thought twice about where I ranked a program after receiving follow-up correspondence was for one where I was emailed by the program and told they were very interested in me and were going to rank me accordingly, but I wasn't sure about them. My thought was, "Hmmm. Maybe I should move them DOWN the list." Not up!

Some people do seem to care about whether they are heavily recruited by a program. I guess the philosophy behind that is, Why go to a place that doesn't seem to want you there? Some people find expressions of interest to be encouraging and want to go to a place that truly wants them.

 

[djipopo]

it may help a little but my rank list is based on so many factors, that a phone call won't help much. if there were any effect it may make me change my lower ranked programs, but definitely not my top 3.

it would however, make me feel all warm and fuzzy inside 😛

 

[BubbleHead]

My top pick provided me with good feedback throughout my away rotation, interview, and ranking process. It would not have mattered if I got a call in late Jan/early Feb so much, if I hadn't had the good communication and positive experience all thoughout my 4th year with this program.

Positive comments from interviewers meant more to me than the phone calls I got near ROL time. Read my application front to back and show up prepared to talk about how I fit or don't fit your program on interview day. Let me tell you how I fit or don't fit. Save the call, my time and yours, if interviewers don't put in genuine effort before or during my interview. I showed up prepared for a job interview every time and I conducted an employer interview each time as well.

One call months later won't hold sway if you didn't impress me during the interview, but it will continue to give me a warm fuzzy feeling in my tummy if I see a continued positive communication throughout the process from a strong front runner program.

Is this horse still dead or what?