Radiology -- a field of the past

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

jamaroqui

Membership Revoked
Removed
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2008
Messages
20
Reaction score
0
I would say that only fields "safe" from future detrimental cuts are Interventional Cardiology, Electrophysiology, etc.... Radiology is a thing of the past... you absolutely will not be able to make decent money in Rads, careful...
What a ridiculous waste of time and effort into finishing a Radiology residency.


The Need for Outsourcing Radiology




By Ashutosh Shelat
Today there is growing demand for the limited supply of radiologists in the US, the UK, and other developed nations. Due to these demands and the rising use of technology, radiology is being outsourced to several developing nations such as India and China. This is a response to two concurrent major predicaments: the need for early diagnosis of diseases through radiology, and a bottleneck in providing medical care due to delays in performing radiological procedures [1].
According to radiologist Dr. Piyush Vyas [2], the reduced workload on the US has led to decreasing job security and less demand for radiologists. However, abroad, increased demand for services provides developing nations with more information and new opportunities for growth in the medical field. Outsourcing as a whole will help develop the economies of these nations, Vyas says, while encouraging growth of infrastructure and promoting peaceful relations with other nations that consume their goods and services, such as the US.
Radiology is a discipline of medical science that uses electromagnetic radiation and ultrasonics for the diagnosis and treatment of injury or disease. Ionizing radiation consisting of alpha, beta, gamma, or x-rays is the principal source of evaluation based on radiology. In essence, the radiation ray passes through the part of body being examined and then produces a static image on a film. Also, dynamic images as taken by fluoroscopy or cineradiography help record movement in internal organs or in blood vessels [3]. Indeed, many new uses for radiology are expanding the medical fields.
Evidence seems to show that outsourcing radiology is a needed solution to our problem in America.
The benefits of outsourcing are easily viewed in surrounding and developing countries. Specifically, when we talk about radiology in these distant nations we must understand that only teleradiology, or radiology data that can be transmitted using radiographic images and consultant text from one location to another, can be discussed. However, since most radiology can be modified to fit this format we worry less about the technical terms and more about the consequences of this radiology.
When radiology is transmitted to other countries, it has very many positive and productive effects. One benefit, concerning the outsourcing of anything from one industrially developed country to another less developed nation is the cost reduction factor. With decreased costs in nations such as India and China, the Western consumer gets a "better bang for the buck," and ultimately will, in fact, return the demand and supply shortage back to equilibrium with increased quantity supplied and decreased costs. Outsourcing also helps increase productivity, create jobs, and fund improved living conditions, over the long-term in such growing nations. One example concerns the improved aspects of Indian healthcare due outsourcing radiology work to India. These include weekend and nighttime coverage for all patients, enhanced patient outcomes, and workflow. The Indian Clinical Lab focusing on teleradiology also is able to more deeply address those cases which require intensive team interaction [4]. As is evident, there are several obvious motivations for outsourcing radiology for the welfare of the general public.
However, a more important reason to outsource concerns those individuals who are unable to pay high medical bills, or who are suffering poorer radiological care because of the bottleneck in providing services to patients. For example, consider the UK, where there is a shortage of approximately 5000 radiologists. Because of this shortage, there is an average waiting period of approximately two months for radiology diagnostics. Also because of this shortage, medical practitioners are dealing with the current shortage by still employing equipment of which 30% is out-of-date [4].
Outsourced radiology is a needed tool in the technological revolution of this age to keep pace with the ever-increasing number of patients and outpatients. It also contributes to a variety of developments in other countries and helps take pressure off the doctors in countries like the US and UK. With an increasing use of teleradiology and other multinational health fronts, hopefully the general health and health awareness of the public will dramatically increase.
Sources
  1. Scan delays 'put patients at risk'. BBC News, World Edition [online]. August 8, 2002. Available at: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/2178277.stm. Accessed December 5, 2004.
  2. Vyas, Piyush. Radiologist. Personal Communication. November 2004.
  3. Radiological Society of North America, 2004, Oakbrook, IL. Available at: www.RSNA.org. Accessed November 2004.
  4. Outsourcing Radiology. Outsource2India. Available at: http://www.outsource2india.com/services/radiology.asp. Accessed November 2004.
  5. Folland, Goodman, and Stano. The Economics of Health and Health Care. 3 rd Edition. Upper Saddle River, New Jersey: Prentice Hall; 2001.
Copyright © 2002-2006 JPHAS at the University of Illinois at Chicago. All rights reserved.
 
you must be a cardiologist
 
Nah, just some kid who likes to stir up controversy.

:beat:
 
Not gonna happen in your life time.
 
Jamiroquai > Jamaroqui

Come on, you know this boogie is for real.
 
According to radiologist Dr. Piyush Vyas [2], the reduced workload on the US has led to decreasing job security and less demand for radiologists.


Decreasing workload?!? And what planet are you from? Jamiroquai, if you can even spell the name correctly, what you are talking is 'virtual insanity'.

Funny how the sources cited are from outsourcing firms and a personal communication from a radiologist I have never even heard of. RSNA from november 2007 is sited, can you be more specific? Can you site the specific talk or poster or paper? I don't think so?

I call B.S. Give us your credentials, site some REAL sources, or get lost.
 
Looks to me like he want to match into rads and is trying to scare away some of the competition.
 
Looks to me like he want to match into rads and is trying to scare away some of the competition.


tsk tsk sigh. It is NOT difficult to match into Rads. I know of several people all over the country with average credentials, some IMGs who have not passed step 3 even. It is not difficult to match into Rads. With diligence, that pays off, and scores, LORs, etc.
What is very difficult to match into, is Electrophysiology, Opthalmology and subspecialties, ENT, etc.
If you honestly think that there is money in Radiology, you are sadly mistaken. This field will be spread out amongst several specialties, and outsourced. It is already very difficult to find a job in Radiology in the place of your choice.
I just want people to know the facts, before applying and wasting 5 years of life.
I see that people here are really scared of the truth. Money in Radiology will go down significantly.
 
trollometer9.jpg
 
tsk tsk sigh. It is NOT difficult to match into Rads. I know of several people all over the country with average credentials, some IMGs who have not passed step 3 even. It is not difficult to match into Rads. With diligence, that pays off, and scores, LORs, etc.
What is very difficult to match into, is Electrophysiology, Opthalmology and subspecialties, ENT, etc.
If you honestly think that there is money in Radiology, you are sadly mistaken. This field will be spread out amongst several specialties, and outsourced. It is already very difficult to find a job in Radiology in the place of your choice.
I just want people to know the facts, before applying and wasting 5 years of life.
I see that people here are really scared of the truth. Money in Radiology will go down significantly.
Chicken%20Little%202.jpg


:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


I'm sorry you're too stupid to know how to troll properly, but here's a tip: try it with people who aren't in the field and don't know your scare topic way better than you do. 🙂
 
scare topic??? lol, come up with some better stuff than a dumb picture and name calling. Real mature.
 
tsk tsk sigh. It is NOT difficult to match into Rads.
Please tell that to the current batch of applicants.

What is very difficult to match into, is Electrophysiology, Opthalmology and subspecialties, ENT, etc.

EP is a post fellowship, fellowship not a residency, OPHTHALmology has its own match from other specialties. The things you list are not even in the same league. You clearly don't know what you're talking about, do you?

It is already very difficult to find a job in Radiology in the place of your choice.

Its hard to find a job in locations such as California , NYC, DC, Boston, or any other desireable location, NO MATTER WHAT FIELD YOU PURSUE.

I just want people to know the facts, before applying and wasting 5 years of life.


Why would a 'fellow' concern himself with medical students matching in Radiology.
You are a 'fellow' in what field again? Or maybe you aren't a fellow. You aren't even a resident. Because even a residents from foreign countries have more of a clue about medicine in the United States than you do.


By the way, the interview process is more than halfway over. Do you really think you will convince applicants to cancel their interviews?

If you have beef with the field, why should you care about people in radiology? More importantly, why are you wasting your own time making patently false claims?

😕
 
IR is the 2nd highest paid field in med on avg at around 441,000
diagnostic is 4th at about 40 grand less

demand is currently very high not like in the mid 90's with the HMO shock so salaries are rising despite reimbursements being cut. This is due to an increase demand for studies so radiologist of the future like myself will make a good living just have to work harder for it

BTW the avg board score for someone accepted into rads is a 235 with 25% being AOA that makes it a competitive field
 
BTW the avg board score for someone accepted into rads is a 235 with 25% being AOA that makes it a competitive field[/quote]


oh gosh, turning this into a monetary issue as well as board scores again sigh.
Like I said, I know of several several people that matched into Radiology with ok credentials, pure waste of a doctor if you ask me.
Radiology I mean what significance does it have in society, pretty much nothing. Anybody can read films, let alone read films for a living.
I would MUCH rather a specialist go over a film, such as a Urologist reading a CT scan or IVP, or a Neurologist reading his or her own head CTs or MRIs.
Radiology is a pure waste of a profession, that is goin down soon.
I don't care about applicants applying now, I just think that its a shame and disgrace, a waste of good doctors going into a field, with no job security or nobility whatsoever.
People pursuing the field for the wrong reason, not to mention a waste of a field.
I still have found not one sentence that contradicts what I have stated above. Just a bunch of hot air, not even worth discussing anymore, I clearly have stated my point well.
 
Anybody can read films, let alone read films for a living.

The majority of practicing physicians probably disagrees with you.

I would MUCH rather a specialist go over a film, such as a Urologist reading a CT scan or IVP,

You are entitled to your personal misguided opinions.

Funny, the uros and surgeons I practice with send outside studies for my review before they operate on anything.

or a Neurologst reading his or her own head CTs or MRIs.

Let me make a wild guess, you are a neurologist, maybe one of the ones doing a 'neuroimaging' fellowship ?
 
actually majority of physicians agree....... I mean does it take a Radiologist to say whether or not a guy needs an Ortho procedure? Of COURSE not. What really is the role of the Radiologist?
In some institutions, Radiologists don't even work after hours, only for head CTs or Chest CTs. Therefore, the ER docs read all of the films pretty much.
Anybody, probably even a high school student, could learn how to read a film.
As a matter of fact, with outsourcing, soon Radiologists in the US will not even have much employment opportunity.
As a patient advocate, I would much rather have a film read cheaper and faster out of the country, than in the country paying so much more.


Also, there are so many HORRID radiologists, that either miss things like a stroke, or say idiotic things like
"appendicitis cannot be excluded, rely on clinical correlation"
why order a thousand dollar something scan, for somebody to give me a half assed answer in the middle of the night. That is pure ridiculous.
 
actually majority of physicians agree....... I mean does it take a Radiologist to say whether or not a guy needs an Ortho procedure? Of COURSE not. What really is the role of the Radiologist?
In some institutions, Radiologists don't even work after hours, only for head CTs or Chest CTs. Therefore, the ER docs read all of the films pretty much.
Anybody, probably even a high school student, could learn how to read a film.
As a matter of fact, with outsourcing, soon Radiologists in the US will not even have much employment opportunity.
As a patient advocate, I would much rather have a film read cheaper and faster out of the country, than in the country paying so much more.


Also, there are so many HORRID radiologists, that either miss things like a stroke, or say idiotic things like
"appendicitis cannot be excluded, rely on clinical correlation"
why order a thousand dollar something scan, for somebody to give me a half assed answer in the middle of the night. That is pure ridiculous.
\

So you just joined these forums to come here and bash radiology. Very productive. Why don't you go to a forum with people in the same "fellowship" you are in and have a real discussion on a topic.
 
tsk tsk sigh. It is NOT difficult to match into Rads. I know of several people all over the country with average credentials, some IMGs who have not passed step 3 even. It is not difficult to match into Rads. With diligence, that pays off, and scores, LORs, etc.
What is very difficult to match into, is Electrophysiology, Opthalmology and subspecialties, ENT, etc.
If you honestly think that there is money in Radiology, you are sadly mistaken. This field will be spread out amongst several specialties, and outsourced. It is already very difficult to find a job in Radiology in the place of your choice.
I just want people to know the facts, before applying and wasting 5 years of life.
I see that people here are really scared of the truth. Money in Radiology will go down significantly.

LOL, this dude didnt match radiology. Its ok champ, try again next year.
 
In some institutions, Radiologists don't even work after hours, only for head CTs or Chest CTs. Therefore, the ER docs read all of the films pretty much.

Yep, that is how my hospital runs. They call me for the cross-sectional stuff at home and I overread the plain-films in the morning. 98% of the time I agree with their findings, the 1-2% of missed fractures, pneumothoraces or lung-nodules probably do appreciate that we have this setup.

Anybody, probably even a high school student, could learn how to read a film.

You are right, a high-school student 'could' learn how to read a film (that is after 4 years of college, 4 years of medschool and 5 years of residency :laugh: ).

As a matter of fact, with outsourcing, soon Radiologists in the US will not even have much employment opportunity.

Right. The practice of medicine is regulated by individual state medical boards. The pool of foreign radiologists licensed to practice medicine in a given state is limited (the workaround of having a licensed physician sign off on the work of an unlicensed provider is an illegal practice and few if any hospitals will allow this to go on if they find out about it).

As a patient advocate, I would much rather have a film read cheaper and faster out of the country, than in the country paying so much more.

Faster than what ? The 1/2 hour turnaround that the on-shore telerad companies provide ? Faster than the instantaneous read I can give on time-critical studies during the day ?

why order a thousand dollar something scan, for somebody to give me a half assed answer in the middle of the night. That is pure ridiculous.

Actually, it is a $3500 scan. And $3300 remains with the hospital that charges the technical fee. No amount of outsourcing will reduce the technical charges, the $900,000 CT scanner has to be written off, the $120,000 service contract and the $45/hr tech have to be paid. Professional fees are a small fraction of imaging cost, something the outsourcing cheerleaders tend to forget.
 
LOL, this dude didnt match radiology. Its ok champ, try again next year.

Rads is NOT THAT COMPETITIVE I reiterate. Ok STRAIGHT out of medical school maybe, but NOT once you are in the system. Secure a prelim, get in a transitional year, and Rads is NOT that hard to get. Plus schedule away elective rotations as a medical student.
I think that the problem is, that alot of people apply with only one score. Individuals with both USMLE Step I and Step II scores which are above average, are more likely to obtain more interviews. People apply with only one score, and are disappointed in the end.
I know of people with mediocre credentials, that matched in Rads. Who in the heck would want to waste 5 years to an insecure and very shaky future.
Rads is NOT that hard to get, I know of people with mediocre credentials that matched into Rads.
 
Rads is NOT THAT COMPETITIVE I reiterate. Ok STRAIGHT out of medical school maybe, but NOT once you are in the system. Secure a prelim, get in a transitional year, and Rads is NOT that hard to get. Plus schedule away elective rotations as a medical student.
I think that the problem is, that alot of people apply with only one score. Individuals with both USMLE Step I and Step II scores which are above average, are more likely to obtain more interviews. People apply with only one score, and are disappointed in the end.
I know of people with mediocre credentials, that matched in Rads. Who in the heck would want to waste 5 years to an insecure and very shaky future.
Rads is NOT that hard to get, I know of people with mediocre credentials that matched into Rads.
You are hopeless. Reiterating the same inane crap has not helped your case. Going off on tangents where your grasp of the material is fabulously weak isn't going to either. As a fourth year student, you are "in the system" as this is the typical time to match in radiology. Those doing prelims and transitional years while applying have a year to occupy themselves somehow if they do match, and face a slightly more uphill battle because they didn't match at the traditional time. Step 2 is not nearly as important to the majority of radiology residency PD's as Step 1, as was noted clearly on a survey of PD's released a couple years back. Delaying Step 2 after a strong Step 1 is par for the course.
 
sigh, there are several who did average on step I and step II who matched into Radiology. There are people with attempts on step I that matched into Radiology, and FMGs also.
I suppose Rads people here get scared and self conscious when the truth comes out.
No you are WRONG in other words INCORRECT
majority of individuals that I know of secured actually MORE interviews during the transitional / Preliminary year. Perhaps due to having everything in hand before most applicants.
Post accurate things, or do not post at all. flux+wannabe Rad UNDERSTAND?
 
sigh, there are several who did average on step I and step II who matched into Radiology. There are people with attempts on step I that matched into Radiology, and FMGs also.
I suppose Rads people here get scared and self conscious when the truth comes out.
No you are WRONG in other words INCORRECT
majority of individuals that I know of secured actually MORE interviews during the transitional / Preliminary year. Perhaps due to having everything in hand before most applicants.
Post accurate things, or do not post at all. flux+wannabe Rad UNDERSTAND?

Why'd you decide to start a flame war in two different threads. Basically posting the same stuff? And why is your very first thread a bashing one? Why do you care so much about Radiologists anyways? Just let them do their own thing. If you're really a Fellow, you should be worrying about bettering yourself and your field, instead of worrying about an entirely different field.
Basically, I'm saying what Hans is saying, you smell like a troll and a fraud.
I dont even know why i'm bothering replying to your thread.
 
I dont even know why i'm bothering replying to your thread.[/quote]

because you are like all the others, enamored by the complexities of the TRUTH
lol. :laugh:
 
I still have found not one sentence that contradicts what I have stated above. Just a bunch of hot air, not even worth discussing anymore, I clearly have stated my point well.
*I* still haven't found one sentence proving you're not a transvestite hooker, so I guess we're even. Unless we decide to count the fact that you're an ignoramus, but I figured I'd give you a mulligan on that one. 😛
 
Top