It would be laughable to consider psychiatry, right? Though it sounds highly appealing to me, my undergraduate major was psychology, and I haven't taken chemistry or physics classes since high school, where I struggled more with them than with writing, etc. I read an article on psychiatry over in the psychology PhD forums that made me doubt my whole planned career path (clinical psych). Given my area of talent, med school seems out of reach for me, but I just need to hear it.
Realistically, if you're not a "hard sciences person"...
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IMHO hard sciences is not the most important thing in medicine though you have to do well in it to pass the classes with at least a B, do well on the MCATs, and then get into medical school. Hard sciences aren't used much in medschool.
Biological sciences are the main thing in being a medical doctor. There's a difference in mindsets in mastering those things. Some people dont' like the hard sciences but are able to deal with them.
Biochemistry and organic chem are the real difficult classes, at least for me. The good thing was that I thought biochem was difficult but it was interesting material because your'e dealing with the building blocks of life itself. Orgo, on the other hand, past the first 1/3 of it just became industrial applications that weren't relevant to being a medical doctor, so after that it just was hell that I didn't like and didn't think it was worth it but had to pass it.
As for math, I was never a lover of it but I always did well in it despite not liking it. Odd. I remember in middle-school kicking everyone's butt in class in one of those standardized exams to see how the students were doing vs. everyone else in the country. The only thing I can attribute this to and I'm grasping for straws is I had a teacher in middle school that didn't like me and she tried to single me out and humiliate me (no I'm not joking on this).
Biological sciences are the main thing in being a medical doctor. There's a difference in mindsets in mastering those things. Some people dont' like the hard sciences but are able to deal with them.
Biochemistry and organic chem are the real difficult classes, at least for me. The good thing was that I thought biochem was difficult but it was interesting material because your'e dealing with the building blocks of life itself. Orgo, on the other hand, past the first 1/3 of it just became industrial applications that weren't relevant to being a medical doctor, so after that it just was hell that I didn't like and didn't think it was worth it but had to pass it.
As for math, I was never a lover of it but I always did well in it despite not liking it. Odd. I remember in middle-school kicking everyone's butt in class in one of those standardized exams to see how the students were doing vs. everyone else in the country. The only thing I can attribute this to and I'm grasping for straws is I had a teacher in middle school that didn't like me and she tried to single me out and humiliate me (no I'm not joking on this).
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Similar position here, currently trying to decide whether I make an attempt to pick up studies in the medical field. Once upon a time I had planned to do an undergraduate degree in Nursing and then (hopefully) transfer into medicine. I kind of figured even though I'm really, really bad at Maths, Physics, and Chem, a Nursing degree would at least give me enough of the basics to pass the entry exam for Medicine. Looking through some of the MCAT study questions, I'm not so sure. I certainly don't want to waste my time studying in a field I don't really want to work in, if it's not eventually going to lead me into a field I do.
The more info I seem to get on the subject, the more confusing it all gets. I'm thinking if I do decide to give it a go, I'll make an appointment with a Uni course counsellor to fully discuss not only my options, but my realistic chances, before I commit to X number of years study, and a hunking great big debt (especially considering I attempted to do Clinical Psychology studies previously, and couldn't get past first year Stats 🙄). Maybe you could think about doing the same? (The speaking to a course counsellor bit, not the failing first year stats').
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I'm not a hard sciences person by any means. I actually hate them. I find them dry and uninspiring. But I'm capable of jumping the hoops and performing well in those classes in spite of my discomfort and extreme disinterest. If you want to be a shrink, you need to fit a similar pattern.
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i am a social scientist, so no you don't have to be a hard science person, whatever that means. BUT, as things currently stand, to get into medical school you do need to take pointless courses and an exam which currently focusses on science (social sciences will be in the New MCAT however) than discriminate against minorities and poor people and have nothing do to with medical school or being a doctor, and certainly not a psychiatrist. But they are hurdles to overcome. If you cannot get through said courses, yes you will not be able to get into medical school. No one said you had to like them or have an aptitude. It would help, but you would probably just have to work alot harder.
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No one is born a "hard sciences person" in my opinion. You become one by learning about it and, once you acquire some proficiency, coming to enjoy it. You will have to do the premedical requirements if you want to apply to medical school (at least 1 year of physics, chemistry, biology, and organic chemistry plus any additional requirements like biochemistry that some schools may want). If you just can't stand those classes and don't like the though of learning, say, to read EKGs on a cardiology rotation, or learning what the biological basis of diabetes is, etc etc you will probably be miserable in medical school.
Once you are out of medical school, though, I get the sense that knowing your small corner of medications and their indications/contraindications and having great interpersonal skills matters way more than being a master of the Krebs cycle.
Once you are out of medical school, though, I get the sense that knowing your small corner of medications and their indications/contraindications and having great interpersonal skills matters way more than being a master of the Krebs cycle.
Man, the one thread I could have contributed and my seniors beat me to it.
The only thing I can think to add is that many people who would make fine physicians get weeded out early in the hard sciences courses. They get thrown in with high aptitude students who have strong backgrounds in math and chemistry and they get outclassed.
They automatically assume this is their inherent deficiency. I agree with Bartelby. The characteristics of success in these course is not inborn--though perhaps for actual brilliant scientists there may be some innate genetic component. But for getting through these premed and preclinical med school classes it comes down to foundation, study skills, and huge amounts of hard work.
My extreme caution and determination to win at the premed game took me from C-'s in high school chemistry and math to all high A's in premed courses. The key was that I was patient in my own development. First I made sure my algebra skills were up to snuff by taking college algebra over again. I took introductory science courses for nursing majors at a community colleges. And even though it maybe uber-dorkish I read the history of each field I was studying along with the intro course. My MCAT physical science section ended up being the thing that got my score to the good enough range. I developed an instinct for those hard sciences through years of effort.
Many of us who come to this late or half hazardly while whittling through career options fail to appreciate the need for preparation. The go in without the necessary skills and they get shot to pieces.
Stats would be good measure of your math preparation. If you can't to do stats level math you're in trouble flat out.
There's just too many narratives out there that will fluff you into thinking you can follow your dreams or chase your bliss or some silly type of ****. The reality is like any challenging path. You have to face your weaknesses. You have make the cut.
My opinion having worked for many snotty physicians is that if you don't like patient care you shouldn't be here. The point being that for some getting a nursing degree would be the right first step. Make some good money with flexible scheduling while verifying your interest in medicine.
Nurses don't like it when I say this. But the fact is that it is accessible to a whole bunch of people who wouldn't make the academic cut in medicine. Whether that cut measures what it should or what it's effect is at large is beside the point, it is there, and doesn't mind failing you.
The only thing I can think to add is that many people who would make fine physicians get weeded out early in the hard sciences courses. They get thrown in with high aptitude students who have strong backgrounds in math and chemistry and they get outclassed.
They automatically assume this is their inherent deficiency. I agree with Bartelby. The characteristics of success in these course is not inborn--though perhaps for actual brilliant scientists there may be some innate genetic component. But for getting through these premed and preclinical med school classes it comes down to foundation, study skills, and huge amounts of hard work.
My extreme caution and determination to win at the premed game took me from C-'s in high school chemistry and math to all high A's in premed courses. The key was that I was patient in my own development. First I made sure my algebra skills were up to snuff by taking college algebra over again. I took introductory science courses for nursing majors at a community colleges. And even though it maybe uber-dorkish I read the history of each field I was studying along with the intro course. My MCAT physical science section ended up being the thing that got my score to the good enough range. I developed an instinct for those hard sciences through years of effort.
Many of us who come to this late or half hazardly while whittling through career options fail to appreciate the need for preparation. The go in without the necessary skills and they get shot to pieces.
Stats would be good measure of your math preparation. If you can't to do stats level math you're in trouble flat out.
There's just too many narratives out there that will fluff you into thinking you can follow your dreams or chase your bliss or some silly type of ****. The reality is like any challenging path. You have to face your weaknesses. You have make the cut.
My opinion having worked for many snotty physicians is that if you don't like patient care you shouldn't be here. The point being that for some getting a nursing degree would be the right first step. Make some good money with flexible scheduling while verifying your interest in medicine.
Nurses don't like it when I say this. But the fact is that it is accessible to a whole bunch of people who wouldn't make the academic cut in medicine. Whether that cut measures what it should or what it's effect is at large is beside the point, it is there, and doesn't mind failing you.
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I just had a thought, OP. From what I've been reading in the other forums, a number of people have done Summer school courses in stuff like Physics and Chemistry in preparation for sitting the MCAT (or GAMSAT/UMAT in my case). Maybe you could consider doing some short courses in the 'hard sciences' subjects , just to see how you get on. You never know, you might be better at it than you think once you've been given a proper grounding. 🙂
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Hello OP, I started med school at age 30, many years out from college. I bought a high-school physics book, dusted off my college organic chemistry book, and re-read those all the way through for the MCAT. Since you haven't taken college organic chem or physics, you will probably have to enroll in a post-bac program which is what medical schools will require from people who have no premed courses.
See how you do in a post-bac program first. If you work really hard at it and can handle science, then you can get through it and some programs are affiliated with a med school and can fast-track you into it.
I agree with the other posters here.
Good luck!
See how you do in a post-bac program first. If you work really hard at it and can handle science, then you can get through it and some programs are affiliated with a med school and can fast-track you into it.
I agree with the other posters here.
Good luck!
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I was scared of the calculus and organic, and I'd been out of college 5 yrs when I decided to go to med school. So I re-entered university, backtracked one class in math, and started basic chem over again, and re-took physiology. So that it would all be fresh as I hit the harder courses. I got myself an excellent tutor in calculus, and I audited organic in the summer session. So when I started it in the fall I already new the terms, concepts, and I'd done much of the homework already.
Then I made the best decision: I enrolled at the local community college and left the university. There, I got full access to the professors - not just TA's. The professors taught the labs, and the professors were retained based on teaching - not research. And the office hours gave me opportunity to ask enough "what if" questions to really cement my understanding. I took microbiology, engineering physics 1 + 2 and Organic 1 + 2 at the community college. When I went to med school, I found I better understood the concepts than many of my peers who'd aced the classes in big universities - because I could manipulate the concepts, not just answer the test questions.
Then I made the best decision: I enrolled at the local community college and left the university. There, I got full access to the professors - not just TA's. The professors taught the labs, and the professors were retained based on teaching - not research. And the office hours gave me opportunity to ask enough "what if" questions to really cement my understanding. I took microbiology, engineering physics 1 + 2 and Organic 1 + 2 at the community college. When I went to med school, I found I better understood the concepts than many of my peers who'd aced the classes in big universities - because I could manipulate the concepts, not just answer the test questions.
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IMHO, it's better to take certain science classes in a community college vs. a University if it's one of those weed-out programs where the institution has it's guns set on making sure over 95% of those pre-med don't make it to medschool.
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