Residency and Time

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Pomacentridae

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Hi,

I matched to a residency program in a location I' m not too thrilled about. Seeing as I will have to spend 4 years in this location and will be going on 32 years old by the time I finish residency, I've become a bit gloomy thinking about how much of my time will be spent in this location. I worry about making friends and dating prospects in this area. I feel like my late 20s and early 30s are the time to enjoy myself and find someone to settle down with in a hip, populated, vibrant city or metropolitan area... That's out of my reach now. Is 4 years a long time in the great scheme of things(especially when those 4 years are that sweet spot of transitioning from late 20s to early 30s)? Also just because I complete residency in one location doesn't mean I'm locked into that area for life, right?
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The field of medicine seems to attract personalities that feel their life will be worth living once they hit some magical point on their life path (finished with residency, finished with fellowship, finished with first marriage etc etc). Your life started a long time ago. You should be doing your best to enjoy it and live it now.

People also assign a lot of emphasis on location in terms of assessing their chances of living life and loving it. No one likes to hear it but the rules to this are simple: 1) be attractive 2) don't be unattractive.
If you look like a supermodel and live in the middle of nowhere your dating prospects will probably be better than an average joe in LA.
Beautiful people in cornfields and ganglands find each other. Fortunately, some get lost in the tall husks and gunsmoke and are left for the rest of us to snare. Get out there and give it a try at least before you write the entire place off for 4 years.
 
There are decent people and fun things to do everywhere. Medicine attracts too many young people who feel like anything other than NYC/DC/SoCal/Miami is equivalent to living on Mars and that all of the population is ignorant racist rednecks. They go there with a crappy attitude and automatically hate everybody, and surprise surprise, they have a miserable time and all they ever talk about is leaving. If you go with an open mind and are willing to meet different kinds of people, then you will be ok. If you don't, you will suffer and everybody will find you unbearable. Your choice.
 
24blue8 said:
The field of medicine seems to attract personalities that feel their life will be worth living once they hit some magical point on their life path (finished with residency, finished with fellowship, finished with first marriage etc etc). Your life started a long time ago. You should be doing your best to enjoy it and live it now.

People also assign a lot of emphasis on location in terms of assessing their chances of living life and loving it. No one likes to hear it but the rules to this are simple: 1) be attractive 2) don't be unattractive.
If you look like a supermodel and live in the middle of nowhere your dating prospects will probably be better than an average joe in LA.
Beautiful people in cornfields and ganglands find each other. Fortunately, some get lost in the tall husks and gunsmoke and are left for the rest of us to snare. Get out there and give it a try at least before you write the entire place off for 4 years.
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Perfect time for me to post this again:

my fave from Thich Nhat Han:
"Dwelling in the present moment." While I sit here, I don't think of somewhere else, of the future or the past. I sit here, and I know where I am. This is very important. We tend to be alive in the future, not now. We say, "Wait until I finish school and get my Ph.D. degree, and then I will be really alive." When we have it, and it's not easy to get, we say to ourselves, "I have to wait until I have a job in order to be really alive." And then after the job, a car. After the car, a house. We are not capable of being alive in the present moment. We tend to postpone being alive to the future, the distant future, we don't know when. Now is not the moment to be alive. We may never be alive at all in our entire life. Therefore, the technique, if we have to speak of a technique, is to be in the present moment, to be aware that we are here and now, and the only moment to be alive is the present moment. "I know this is a wonderful moment." This is the only moment that is real. To be here and now, and enjoy the present moment is our most important task.

I think location has more affect on dating than what the quoted poster said, but, you can find someone anywhere. Maybe even inside your own hospital! I don't recommend ****ting where you eat as they say, and safest bet if you don't someone who works in the hospital is a resident in an entirely different program, if all else fails. Otherwise there eligible people in the cornrows. Or, the time will go by quickly between work and your hand and early 30s is not to late to move to a "hip" town and start dating as an attending.

In fact, you might be less bummed being stuck inside unable to do fun things if you live in a boring place. I would be way more depressed paying a ton to live somewhere hip and having to watch all the cool events fly me by.
 
Let me get this straight, so you felt like your twenties is a time for enjoying your self and having fun yet you decided to go to medical school? That seems mighty counter-intuitive my friend. Looks like you picked the wrong time field four years ago if that is the case.

Four years will pass quickly. Life is worth living outside of miami/southern california/new York. You will even appreciate the extra money you'll have living in a lower cost area, trust me. Bucker up and enjoy this free time before residency starts and stop moping above this.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
 
Four years goes by quick, especially in residency. And you can definitely move after residency -- it's an SDN myth that your residency needs to be geographically where you want to settle down. Some people do want to settle where they train because 4 years is enough to put down roots for some, and you potentially might get more traction seeking an interview with local practices who will know people in your program, but that really doesn't mean you won't be able to move elsewhere for your career. There are some fields which are more in demand than others, and some markets are more saturated than others of course, so the issue of finding your ideal job is very much about trade-offs, for which geography can be a big one, but you still should have multiple choices for relocation.
 
Don't worry about it. I did residency in a "boring" place and managed to make friends, have some fun outside work, meet my wife, and start a family. You can definitely make it work. Although, it's not like you will have a surplus of free time anyway.

It was really nice having an affordable place to live and a bit of extra money due to the lower cost of living. Also, essentially no traffic - huge plus not having to spend precious time commuting.

As long as you like your program and get along with your fellow residents, you be fine wherever you are.
 
costales said:
https://www.aamc.org/data/448492/c4table.html
Overall, 52.9 percent of the individuals who completed residency training from 2005 through 2014 are practicing in the state of residency training.
Click to expand...
But not because they had to... Of that number I would bet 95%+ could have also found employment elsewhere. So don't lets buy into the myth that where you do residency is where you'll end up.

That being said, I would agree that certain coastal cities in certain specialties are harder nuts to crack, and that's where the trade offs I mentioned above come into play -- you might not get to do exactly what you want to do where you want to do it or may need to swallow other big pills in terms of schedule, commute, salary to make the geography work.
 
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How is this possible with the invention of the internet? If you go to a dating website you will have ENDLESS number of options, including in small towns. And if you are a doctor...women will be willing to TRAVEL to date you. You're so naïve.
 
j4pac said:
How is this possible with the invention of the internet? If you go to a dating website you will have ENDLESS number of options, including in small towns. And if you are a doctor...women will be willing to TRAVEL to date you. You're so naïve.
Click to expand...

Oh please.
That's only if you're attractive.
 
Doctor4Life1769 said:
Oh please.
That's only if you're attractive.
Click to expand...

Lol. What's attractive? You do not have to be Dr. McDreamie to be attractive. Appearance is a very small part of attraction. Sure...it helps. An average looking physician can be an absolute machine. a below average looking physician can still get tons of play if they know what they are doing.
 
j4pac said:
Lol. What's attractive? You do not have to be Dr. McDreamie to be attractive. Appearance is a very small part of attraction. Sure...it helps. An average looking physician can be an absolute machine. a below average looking physician can still get tons of play if they know what they are doing.
Click to expand...

I keep attracting MILFs. I must be doing it wrong, or right, depends.
 
Doctor4Life1769 said:
I keep attracting MILFs. I must be doing it wrong, or right, depends.
Click to expand...

I'd take it as a big compliment.

Dude in his early 20s (I'm early 30s) just told me that he likes shagging older women because "they are more confident and know what they want." I'd have to say knowing myself, that's definitely the difference between my younger self and my current self.

I'm no MILF, but comparing notes, an older woman isn't going to bother with you unless she thinks you look like you're strong enough not to get broken from a rough ride and you seem smart enough to learn.

My problem, is they all talk big game but when push comes to shove they can't handle even a little shove.
 
Chances are good that you will find at least a few people who are single and attractive no matter where you are going, but if you really can't, I agree that online dating is a viable option.

In the worst case scenario that you can't find a suitable mate during residency, yes, relocation is definitely doable. I thought about moving out of state when I graduated residency and even interviewed at a couple of places, but I had put down roots in the area of my residency and decided I preferred to stay there. I think that's the main reason so many people stay where they trained in residency - because a lot of us end up buying a house during residency, getting married, maybe having a kid or two, and you decide you don't WANT to move.

If you do end up having to move away to find someone to date, well, 32 is not THAT old. If you're a woman who wants children, yes, you'd have to hustle if you don't want to run into issues with advanced maternal age, but I'm in my early 30s now and I don't think I have one foot in the grave just yet. 🙂
 
Doctor4Life1769 said:
Perhaps we should engage in some SDN dating.
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I guess theoretically that sort of thing has been known to happen in the lounge.
I think SDN could do more to have an adjunct medical matchmaking service, like OKCupid but for med professionals.
Maybe a subforum of "Positions Wanted"? :corny:
That's if you meant SDN.

If you meant you and I, well, @Doctor4Life1769, it's true I've been feelin' the Batman avatar, the claim that you like to ride dirty, and your snarky attitude towards the medical hierarchy for while now. It's true I fit the crazy hot girl stereotype, and I like rebels. Plus that Ludicrous song is dope.

Don't let my wordy posts put you off. I will totally own that I talk too much unless my mouth is full. 😛
Also, my sense of humor is outrageous.
 
Crayola227 said:
I guess theoretically that sort of thing has been known to happen in the lounge.
I think SDN could do more to have an adjunct medical matchmaking service, like OKCupid but for med professionals.
Maybe a subforum of "Positions Wanted"? :corny:
That's if you meant SDN.

If you meant you and I, well, @Doctor4Life1769, it's true I've been feelin' the Batman avatar, the claim that you like to ride dirty, and your snarky attitude towards the medical hierarchy for while now. It's true I fit the crazy hot girl stereotype, and I like rebels. Plus that Ludicrous song is dope.

Don't let my wordy posts put you off. I will totally own that I talk too much unless my mouth is full. 😛
Also, my sense of humor is outrageous.
Click to expand...

I'm down.
 
So...apparently "doctorsonly.com" is already taken and it's not a dating site. But "doctormingle.com" is available!
 
As someone who lives in a "boring" place, but has decent access to NYC, let me tell you, it really honestly makes minimal difference. Do you want to know what residency is like socially?

You rev yourself up to go out, make plans. For us sometimes it's hopping into a car and partying in NYC until someone is sober enough in the wee hours of the morning to get us back home. HOWEVER, do you know what the actual partying is usually like. Yes, drinks, and dancing. If you're single, trying to pick up a lad or a lass. But, probably >50% of the time, you sit around commiserating about how much residency sucks. Even when you have a "pact" to not "talk shop", conversation will eventually end up talking about the hospital/staff/other residents/attendings/dumb policies.

Understand that by the time you start residency, you will have to rev yourself up to go out. I guarantee you (and I'll Paypal you $20) if you find yourself after 3 months of the s*** of being an intern being able to just randomly go out, I underestimated how burnt out I am. Because it actually becomes a HUGE decision. Knowing that you basically are delaying the heap of work you will eventually return to and make "sacrifices" just for that night out. Normally you have pending discharges to work on, or labs/reports to follow up, which can sometimes be removed by 1 day, but then it just piles up. On top of the fact that if you overdo it (which can happen when you are like a caged beast freed from the hospital), you will be hungover the next day, and basically waste that day. OR, have to go in for a 1/2-shift or whatever your residency policy is. Which is worse. (Ever want to vomit 2x before 11AM, but kept it in just so you could finish notes?)

The cliche of "Netflix and chill" becomes more of your essential lifeblood than partying, trust me. (That $20 Paypal bet still on the table). And when you live in a boring place like me, socializing will go back to my initial point, in that you will commiserate w/ your fellow interns/residents at a bar somewhere and just gripe/vent/"rag sesh" about how much residency sucks.

Dating? You work at one of the worst singles bars in the area! The hospital!! lol If I could go a day w/o flirting or being flirted w/ by a coworker (unit clerk, nurse, RT, PT, SLP, nutrition, etc), it would be a rare day. Granted you have to feel "immune" to the gossip world of the microcosm of the hospital to start dating someone there, but I am not. The "don't eat where you s***" rule is a fundamental principle w/ me - although there ARE quite a few pleasant hotties on the floors.

All in all, residency is almost not WHERE you do it, but WHOM you do it w/. If you have solid camaraderie and your batch is filled w/ like-minded individuals you enjoy being around... party central, suburbs, boondocks that doesn't even have a Walmart and got running water a year ago, DOESN'T MATTER. You CAN date off the Internet. I have. It's not horrible. And lastly good luck finding all the energy you THINK you'll have to be actively social and enjoying the night life. If I pay you $20 in November, I'll consider it a donation to your social fund, party by proxy. But I doubt it! 😛
 
The best my dating life has ever been was when I lived in the smallest, ****tiest little college town for fellowship (as compared to big cities for med school, residency, and fellowship #2). You'll be fine.
 
Gfliptastic said:
As someone who lives in a "boring" place, but has decent access to NYC, let me tell you, it really honestly makes minimal difference. Do you want to know what residency is like socially?

You rev yourself up to go out, make plans. For us sometimes it's hopping into a car and partying in NYC until someone is sober enough in the wee hours of the morning to get us back home. HOWEVER, do you know what the actual partying is usually like. Yes, drinks, and dancing. If you're single, trying to pick up a lad or a lass. But, probably >50% of the time, you sit around commiserating about how much residency sucks. Even when you have a "pact" to not "talk shop", conversation will eventually end up talking about the hospital/staff/other residents/attendings/dumb policies.

Understand that by the time you start residency, you will have to rev yourself up to go out. I guarantee you (and I'll Paypal you $20) if you find yourself after 3 months of the s*** of being an intern being able to just randomly go out, I underestimated how burnt out I am. Because it actually becomes a HUGE decision. Knowing that you basically are delaying the heap of work you will eventually return to and make "sacrifices" just for that night out. Normally you have pending discharges to work on, or labs/reports to follow up, which can sometimes be removed by 1 day, but then it just piles up. On top of the fact that if you overdo it (which can happen when you are like a caged beast freed from the hospital), you will be hungover the next day, and basically waste that day. OR, have to go in for a 1/2-shift or whatever your residency policy is. Which is worse. (Ever want to vomit 2x before 11AM, but kept it in just so you could finish notes?)

The cliche of "Netflix and chill" becomes more of your essential lifeblood than partying, trust me. (That $20 Paypal bet still on the table). And when you live in a boring place like me, socializing will go back to my initial point, in that you will commiserate w/ your fellow interns/residents at a bar somewhere and just gripe/vent/"rag sesh" about how much residency sucks.

Dating? You work at one of the worst singles bars in the area! The hospital!! lol If I could go a day w/o flirting or being flirted w/ by a coworker (unit clerk, nurse, RT, PT, SLP, nutrition, etc), it would be a rare day. Granted you have to feel "immune" to the gossip world of the microcosm of the hospital to start dating someone there, but I am not. The "don't eat where you s***" rule is a fundamental principle w/ me - although there ARE quite a few pleasant hotties on the floors.

All in all, residency is almost not WHERE you do it, but WHOM you do it w/. If you have solid camaraderie and your batch is filled w/ like-minded individuals you enjoy being around... party central, suburbs, boondocks that doesn't even have a Walmart and got running water a year ago, DOESN'T MATTER. You CAN date off the Internet. I have. It's not horrible. And lastly good luck finding all the energy you THINK you'll have to be actively social and enjoying the night life. If I pay you $20 in November, I'll consider it a donation to your social fund, party by proxy. But I doubt it! 😛
Click to expand...

QFT.

This is one of the more accurate descriptions of not just 'residency dating' but, hell, residency life that I've come across.

Medical students (and some residents!) worry about the 'social scene' in residency waaay too much. Chances are good that you just won't have the energy for it once residency starts. Merely getting together with some people to chill is difficult (getting everyone's call schedules to line up is like a solar eclipse...it doesn't happen too often) and there's always a sense that you're 'sacrificing' something to come out (namely sleep/getting work done/etc). You'll have a random Tuesday off or something, and usually nobody will be available and you'll have to figure out something to do by yourself - which is usually just ends up involving doing more work. Dating seems like it would totally blow, and I'm always astonished that there are so many people who seem to be getting married as residents (note that the vast majority of these people knew each other before medical school started - I doubt that starting a relationship during residency would go very well).

Big metropolitan areas are overrated for so many reasons. There is no need to flock to huge cities just to find some hipster SO. There are plenty of good people living everywhere, and frankly I think you'll find better marriage prospects outside of the 'hip, urban, vibrant' areas anyway.
 
This is all specialty dependent as well.

Derm or Optho or PM&R typically have a "heavy" PGY-2 year with more call and then more outpatient rotations afterwards. Most weekends off. Even on Rads unless you are on call your weekend will be off.

Now psych is even better. After your intern year the PGY-2 year at some places is exclusively outpatient.

IM/Surgery/Surgical-subspecialties are different.
 
Thank you for that mindful Thich Nhat Han quote.

About to embark on a new period in my life - excited, frightened and nervous - your words reminded me of the importance to see things with a "beginner's mind".
 
MediCane2006 said:
The best my dating life has ever been was when I lived in the smallest, ****tiest little college town for fellowship (as compared to big cities for med school, residency, and fellowship #2). You'll be fine.
Click to expand...
So how many fellows did you bag? haha
 
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