Residency? Can I do it?

[Absentminded]

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I just realized I had been posting in the wrong forums since I am an "old fart". I'm 32, in an auditing career working for the government. It's ok pay, but my wife should have tried to be a trophy wife instead since she won't ever get a job and I don't make enough for her to do that. That said, I don't have any prospects of buying a home or anything in the next 10 years anyway. Another odd tidbit, my religion influenced me away from my love of biology and science and led me onto a JD CPA track since they believe they can tell your future...ugh. For some reason I never questioned my faith until I was in my late 20's... The end result is I left the faith and I am completely MISERABLE in my job and have no exit opportunity since I work for the gov. I find myself reading medical research articles instead of working. I can hardly even make myself work anymore. So I am thinking that rather than spend another 35 years doing what I don't like I should bite the bullet and get into my original love. Oh yeah...and I have 3 kids under 10.

I don't have too many qualms about school itself, I can work out daytime stuff and studying at night. The main concern I have is surviving residency with a family. To further complicate things, I have problems with excessive daytime sleepiness and sleep with a CPAP at night. I can possibly have surgery and fix the apnea issue, but I may still have to take stimulants to stay alert. I don't see how I could survive night call in my current state. BUT, I don't have any trouble staying awake if a lot is going on or if I am on my feet though. In fact, if I didn't have a desk job I would probably not even need the stims, but I don't know that for sure. I don't need them on the weekend, but I can also just take a nap for 15 minutes or so in the afternoon and I am good.
Finally, if I work nights there is no way in hades that I am going to be able to sleep during the day in my home with 3 kids! They don't shut up! Ever!

So, are there specialties that don't really have night call or hours? Does it even matter as an intern or resident in the sense that you get shuffled around between specialities? Can I get into MD PhD for research without a residency? (Am I totally nuts?)

Thanks.

 

[notbobtrustme]

There are a few specialities that have shift-work or moldable hours, but for the majority of your training (med school + residency) you'll have little control over your hours.

 

[cnhampton]

I would suggest that if you are serious about wanting to do research, then the MD may not be the best route for you to take, particularly with your concerns about spending time with family and night call / shifts / etc. This isn't a criticism - please don't take it as such. Your particular interests and availabilities may be better suited to a PhD program and directed towards the bench end of clinical research, rather than direct patient care. Similarly, NP or PA programs might offer something more reasonable for your schedule, and the pay is considerable. What does your wife think of the idea of medical school and residency?

I totally agree with not wanting to spend another 35 years in a profession that you hate (I'm 36 and looking at the same situation), and think it's commendable that you are reevaluating and seriously considering your options. Best of luck to you!

 

[QofQuimica]

So, are there specialties that don't really have night call or hours?

Yes.

Does it even matter as an intern or resident in the sense that you get shuffled around between specialities?

You have very little control over your work life as an intern or resident. While in residency, you should expect to work many nights, weekends, and holidays in nearly any specialty.

Can I get into MD PhD for research without a residency?

Yes, you could just do a post doc like a regular PhD. But that would be a darn stupid thing to do. If you don't want to do residency, and you do want to do research, just get the PhD.

(Am I totally nuts?)

I'm not qualified to answer that question. 😛

All kidding aside, you're way overstating the issue. Will you have to work hard, long, unpleasant hours as a resident? Sure. But you have kids, so you don't need me to tell you that being chronically tired and sleep-deprived probably won't kill you, even if you do sometimes wish it would. After residency, you have a lot of control over your schedule just based on what kind of job you choose.

You want to be a researcher, so here's an experiment: try staying awake at night and sleeping during the day for a week and see how it goes. Then switch back to days like usual. But in for a dime, in for a dollar here, because doing it for just one or two nights won't cut it. My inpatient rotations as an intern typically had me flipping back and forth every week or so, and in my experience, you really need 2-3 shifts to get over the "jet lag" and adjust to being on the night schedule. If you're doing ok after being awake 5-7 nights in a row, then there's your answer.

 

[TriagePreMed]

I just realized I had been posting in the wrong forums since I am an "old fart". I'm 32, in an auditing career working for the government. It's ok pay, but my wife should have tried to be a trophy wife instead since she won't ever get a job and I don't make enough for her to do that. That said, I don't have any prospects of buying a home or anything in the next 10 years anyway.

Then be prepared to make even less and potentially lose her and your kids along the way because medicine requires 100% of your time and attention while in school and residency. It also puts you into massive debt and in the poverty meant mostly for younger people without obligations. Sure, people have made it through med school with a family, but they typically have a supportive spouse that's willing to foot at least part of the bill and accept a more humble lifestyle.

If I were you, I'd seriously give consideration to the PA route because it's fast and you will earn good money. If you like anesthesia, maybe an AA would be even better for you. If your love is purely science, then go to a Ph.D. At least you won't worry about debt although expect to be in lab 10+ hours, and if your boss is a tough to work with, you will be in Monday to Saturday for 14 hours a day (my lab next door is like that). You will also be in poverty due to the earning potential. At best, 4 years for a Ph.D, but realistically 6 or 7. Then depending on the field, I've seen post-docs working from 3 to 6 years on a lab being underpaid.

Seriously, consider the consequences of every action. You have a wife and children. You can no longer put yourself first.

For my curiosity, what was your faith? Scientology?

 

[Absentminded]

The faith was mormonism. They give something called a patriarchal blessing. Oh the stories I could tell.... They're nice people though. The link sums it up...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriarchal_blessing

After talking to my wife, I think we might be able to pull it off. The youngest will be 5 by the time I hit the intern year. We're used to being students, so the school part should be ok too. Looking at everything from a student loan perspective, my debt load would be very close between phd, md, and pa. I figure I might as well go for one with the most opportunity... Nothing is set in stone yet. I still have a lot of thought and a few pre-reqs to put in before I get too far in. Either way I need a career that is more engaging and with fewer cubicles.

 

[TriagePreMed]

The faith was mormonism. They give something called a patriarchal blessing. Oh the stories I could tell.... They're nice people though. The link sums it up...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriarchal_blessing

After talking to my wife, I think we might be able to pull it off. The youngest will be 5 by the time I hit the intern year. We're used to being students, so the school part should be ok too. Looking at everything from a student loan perspective, my debt load would be very close between phd, md, and pa. I figure I might as well go for one with the most opportunity... Nothing is set in stone yet. I still have a lot of thought and a few pre-reqs to put in before I get too far in. Either way I need a career that is more engaging and with fewer cubicles.

Ph.D programs are free and pay stipend, so I don't know how you are computing the debt of MD to be equal to a Ph.D.