Resident switch into anesthesiology, please help

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Anestmanwoman

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Hi all,

I am an upcoming PGY1 in internal medicine looking to apply into anesthesia for next year.

I SOAPed into this program. I was going into a surgical specialty and was a very competitive applicant (steps over 250, good letters, HS or more in all of third year, no professionalism problems etc). Anesthesia was always a parallel plan that I enjoyed as well. Now that the surgical specialty will not work out, anesthesia is what I want.

Can anybody assist me with how to handle this? Steps I need to take. It would be so appreciated. PM me if you want as well!
 
Did you try to talk to your home program PD? Maybe the PD if your PGY1 program has an anes program? Also, you will need to apply for R1 positions coming up this year (that way you can start 2017), unless you are willing to repeat an intern year and apply to categorical programs.
 
Hi thanks for the reply.

I'm willing to Apply for a r1 or pgy1 position. I don't mind repeating the first year. Whom should I reach out to for letters and assistance etc?

The program I'm going to has a negative reputation. I'm not sure if they would be willing to help. My home program has no anesthesia.
 
Try to do an anesthesia rotation so you can get your letter/s- maybe you did a rotation as a 4th yr and those guys would be willing to write you a letter. Then you will need to apply this cycle for the match just like last year. Not sure where you can find a list of R positions, maybe someone else on here will be able to help you out. Good luck
 
Thanks. Is it advisable to try and contact programs soon or treat this as if I were an MS4 again?
 
Are you an AMG? Did you soap into a prelim or a categorical IM position? If you're a AMG and prelim, with those scores you will have absolutely no problem finding an R1 position and not having to waste a year.
 
Are you an AMG? Did you soap into a prelim or a categorical IM position? If you're a AMG and prelim, with those scores you will have absolutely no problem finding an R1 position and not having to waste a year.

AMG who soaped into a categorical. The categorical is technically a 1 year contract though, so I can leave after a year. The problem I foresee is not having any support toward being able to leave.
 
If the program is as malignant and unsupportive as you say, the toughest thing will be getting that mandatory PD letter. I would honestly go to him/her early and have an honest conversation with them stating your goals and intentions.
 
AMG who soaped into a categorical. The categorical is technically a 1 year contract though, so I can leave after a year. The problem I foresee is not having any support toward being able to leave.
It might be technically a 1-year contract, but boy did you **** up taking a categorical position in internal medicine without telling them your intentions. The PD might become very unfriendly, including his/her LoR, when finding out that you used them as a prelim program.

This is not surgery. These people don't plan on shedding residents during the 3 years.
 
Hi all,

I am an upcoming PGY1 in internal medicine looking to apply into anesthesia for next year.

I SOAPed into this program. I was going into a surgical specialty and was a very competitive applicant (steps over 250, good letters, HS or more in all of third year, no professionalism problems etc). Anesthesia was always a parallel plan that I enjoyed as well. Now that the surgical specialty will not work out, anesthesia is what I want.

Can anybody assist me with how to handle this? Steps I need to take. It would be so appreciated. PM me if you want as well!

I think there are still open Anesthesia positions, did you apply through SOAP? I think after 45 days are up, you can contact programs with no violation. Gas spots open up all the darn time, I would doubt that you would not be able to find one if you have the scores/credentials you listed. I would try to gt in touch with gas programs after your 45 days are up in order to avoid violations. After that then you should be fine. If your program is truly malignant I would not go talk to your PD about it without first securing a position. People who tell you otherwise are people who have not switched. I was previously in a different specialty, good program but hard core PD. I did not tell my PD I was switching before pretty much securing a spot. PD was not happy and asked me repeatedly to stay and not leave. Beware.
 
I think there are still open Anesthesia positions, did you apply through SOAP? I think after 45 days are up, you can contact programs with no violation. Gas spots open up all the darn time, I would doubt that you would not be able to find one if you have the scores/credentials you listed. I would try to gt in touch with gas programs after your 45 days are up in order to avoid violations. After that then you should be fine. If your program is truly malignant I would not go talk to your PD about it without first securing a position. People who tell you otherwise are people who have not switched. I was previously in a different specialty, good program but hard core PD. I did not tell my PD I was switching before pretty much securing a spot. PD was not happy and asked me repeatedly to stay and not leave. Beware.

How did the new PD accept you without speaking with the then-current PD?
 
How did the new PD accept you without speaking with the then-current PD?

Without any problem. That is a complete and utter myth that PDs need to talk to each other. I had great letters and a great background, I think my application spoke for itself. At some points even for some out of the match positions that did not materialize given that the resident in the program decided to stay, I spoke with the PD's of the program and was told that they were completely fine to keep things confidential - and 1 of these programs was an Ivy league one. And I know quite a few people who have switched without ever informing their PDs other than to give them a 3 month notice.
 
Without any problem. That is a complete and utter myth that PDs need to talk to each other. I had great letters and a great background, I think my application spoke for itself. At some points even for some out of the match positions that did not materialize given that the resident in the program decided to stay, I spoke with the PD's of the program and was told that they were completely fine to keep things confidential - and 1 of these programs was an Ivy league one. And I know quite a few people who have switched without ever informing their PDs other than to give them a 3 month notice.

Huh.
That's interesting.
I won't go into details, but that wasn't my experience when attempting to switch to a different anesthesia program.
Ended up switching to a different specialty, and the former malignant PD's letter didn't seem to matter much as I had enough reasons for them to take me regardless.
 
Huh.
That's interesting.
I won't go into details, but that wasn't my experience when attempting to switch to a different anesthesia program.
Ended up switching to a different specialty, and the former malignant PD's letter didn't seem to matter much as I had enough reasons for them to take me regardless.
What specialty did you switch into?
 
Huh.
That's interesting.
I won't go into details, but that wasn't my experience when attempting to switch to a different anesthesia program.
Ended up switching to a different specialty, and the former malignant PD's letter didn't seem to matter much as I had enough reasons for them to take me regardless.

You switched from anesthesia to something else? Yep some PDs understand that sometimes people change their minds and they are kind. Others not so kind and try to be malignant. I knew my program would not be happy so I knew what I had to do.
 
You switched from anesthesia to something else? Yep some PDs understand that sometimes people change their minds and they are kind. Others not so kind and try to be malignant. I knew my program would not be happy so I knew what I had to do.

I kinda didn't have a choice, so yeah I took what was available to me. I had a connection into the FM program and I took it. Gotta say, I'm definitely happy. But, I also had a good attitude about it going into it.

I had a few programs that were ready to take me (anesthesia - based on other faculty and the initial PD call/letters - we had a switch in PD during my tenure) but after the PD letter, it conveniently didn't work out. Whatevs. I've moved on, life is good now.
 
I kinda didn't have a choice, so yeah I took what was available to me. I had a connection into the FM program and I took it. Gotta say, I'm definitely happy. But, I also had a good attitude about it going into it.

I had a few programs that were ready to take me (anesthesia - based on other faculty and the initial PD call/letters - we had a switch in PD during my tenure) but after the PD letter, it conveniently didn't work out. Whatevs. I've moved on, life is good now.

I'm glad, good for you.
 
I kinda didn't have a choice, so yeah I took what was available to me. I had a connection into the FM program and I took it. Gotta say, I'm definitely happy. But, I also had a good attitude about it going into it.

I had a few programs that were ready to take me (anesthesia - based on other faculty and the initial PD call/letters - we had a switch in PD during my tenure) but after the PD letter, it conveniently didn't work out. Whatevs. I've moved on, life is good now.
It may very well be a blessing in disguise to be in FM now. Or other non-hospital based specialties. Anecdotally FM physicians tend to be some of the happiest physicians I've ever met. You're probably already getting hundreds of job offers in almost any location you want too. You could literally go anywhere in the world. Come to Australia (or New Zealand)! It's pretty good here. 🙂
 
It may very well be a blessing in disguise to be in FM now. Or other non-hospital based specialties. Anecdotally FM physicians tend to be some of the happiest physicians I've ever met. You're probably already getting hundreds of job offers in almost any location you want too. You could literally go anywhere in the world. Come to Australia (or New Zealand)! It's pretty good here. 🙂

Yep.

I didn't really think it was going to turn out that way going into FM, but it's certainly looked more and more that way once I got in. It's why I say what I've been saying. TONS of job offers (a lot more than I had in anesthesia) and yes I did get some international locums offers in NZ. Honestly, I need to make money now else I'd heavily consider it. I actually landed a sweet gig close to where I moved for residency. The area is great, and I can't complain. It's (so far) worked out well. I'll finish up training in a few months and finally start making some real $$.

I've had some of those same former faculty (and the initial PD whom I matched into the program with) that were supporting me contact me within the last few months and ask if I'd be interested in returning to anesthesia at a different program. I don't see the point though. Honestly, I don't really know. I think about it, but at this point I really wonder if I even want to deal with the hassles of a match (if the connections for anesthesia didn't work out last time, I don't see it working this time around?), the hassles of anesthesia training (again), and the question of if I'd have to start over as a CA-1 and deal with the bull**** basic sciences portion of the exam. I know that I'd do well and pass it (I did pretty well with my CA-1/2 ITEs), but I'm honestly "tested out" after taking the MCAT, the Steps, 5 ITEs, and my written board exam in a week.

I'd landed an out of match FM spot that had an unexpected opening and is tops in the state and the job I've landed is great. The directors and the faculty have all been great, very reasonable folks - but I also worked hard and it's worked out. I did not take a 5 days a week, no call, clinic-only job. That's a recipe for burn out and would leave me bored.
 
Thank you all for these pointers. Is there anyone here that would be willing to talk to me about this issue in greater detail. Someone who understands how I should approach this issue with when and how to talk to the PDs etc? I don't have much access to good advising at the moment. Please PM me if you can!
 
Thank you all for these pointers. Is there anyone here that would be willing to talk to me about this issue in greater detail. Someone who understands how I should approach this issue with when and how to talk to the PDs etc? I don't have much access to good advising at the moment. Please PM me if you can!

Step 1: Do some soul searching and make absolutely sure that you do not want to become a surgeon. If so, then you need to find the right field as an alternative. Are you sure that anesthesiology is the right choice? Did you explore any other specialties as a medical student that you enjoyed? With your credentials, you would be competitive for a wide variety of fields. Radiation oncology, radiology, dermatology...there's a lot of great specialty choices out there. The key right now is to make a smart, informed decision about your switch. Also, don't forget about some of the subspecialties in internal medicine that are very procedurally oriented. Have you shadowed an interventional cardiologist or EP doc? The latter is fairly surgical in nature with frequent implantation of AICDs & pacemakers. What about a GI doc with advanced endoscopy training? Tons of cool procedures. Check out all of the structural stuff that cardiologists are doing these days (percutaneous valve replacements, PFO repairs, etc.). It's pretty amazing. If you have a surgical inclination, a procedural subspecialty of internal medicine may be a solid choice for you. High income, high demand, reasonable workload, and virtually no midlevel encroachment issues in GI and cards.

Step 2: If you're sure you want to become an anesthesiologist, contact the program director for the anesthesiology residency where you went to medical school. I assume you rotated on anesthesia as a medical student and so they already know you. Tell them your situation. Be honest. Don't worry about them contacting your current program. They will keep things confidential. This is a great way to explore your options. Undoubtedly the program director will know of open PGY-2 positions around the country and get you in touch with the appropriate people.

Step 3: Once you have some promising leads established (i.e., anesthesiology programs that seem genuinely interested in you joining the program as a CA-1), approach your current program director and explain your situation. You have to be careful with this meeting, however. Do NOT give them the impression that you never had any genuine interest in internal medicine. The simplest approach is to say that you were on the fence between anesthesia and internal medicine when you were in medical school. Now that you're an intern, you've realized that you made a mistake in choosing internal medicine. Have some solid reasons for why you wouldn't be happy in internal medicine and feel that anesthesia is a better fit for you professionally. Do NOT bring up your failed match into a surgical subspecialty. Unless your current program director is a complete d-bag, I'm sure he/she will be very supportive in your transition. Most program directors just want people to succeed professionally and understand that people often switch fields. Not a big deal.

Step 4: Interview for CA-1 positions and secure a spot outside the match. Choose wisely. With your credentials you can be picky. Don't settle for a crappy program somewhere. If I were you, I would contact the following programs: University of Michigan, UCSF, Stanford, Hopkins, MGH, Brigham, Duke, Cornell, Columbia, Vanderbilt, WashU, UCLA, and University of Washington. All of these programs are relatively large with excellent reputations nationally. I'm sure you'll find a spot at one of these programs.

Good luck.
 
Step 1: Do some soul searching and make absolutely sure that you do not want to become a surgeon. If so, then you need to find the right field as an alternative. Are you sure that anesthesiology is the right choice? Did you explore any other specialties as a medical student that you enjoyed? With your credentials, you would be competitive for a wide variety of fields. Radiation oncology, radiology, dermatology...there's a lot of great specialty choices out there. The key right now is to make a smart, informed decision about your switch. Also, don't forget about some of the subspecialties in internal medicine that are very procedurally oriented. Have you shadowed an interventional cardiologist or EP doc? The latter is fairly surgical in nature with frequent implantation of AICDs & pacemakers. What about a GI doc with advanced endoscopy training? Tons of cool procedures. Check out all of the structural stuff that cardiologists are doing these days (percutaneous valve replacements, PFO repairs, etc.). It's pretty amazing. If you have a surgical inclination, a procedural subspecialty of internal medicine may be a solid choice for you. High income, high demand, reasonable workload, and virtually no midlevel encroachment issues in GI and cards.

Step 2: If you're sure you want to become an anesthesiologist, contact the program director for the anesthesiology residency where you went to medical school. I assume you rotated on anesthesia as a medical student and so they already know you. Tell them your situation. Be honest. Don't worry about them contacting your current program. They will keep things confidential. This is a great way to explore your options. Undoubtedly the program director will know of open PGY-2 positions around the country and get you in touch with the appropriate people.

Step 3: Once you have some promising leads established (i.e., anesthesiology programs that seem genuinely interested in you joining the program as a CA-1), approach your current program director and explain your situation. You have to be careful with this meeting, however. Do NOT give them the impression that you never had any genuine interest in internal medicine. The simplest approach is to say that you were on the fence between anesthesia and internal medicine when you were in medical school. Now that you're an intern, you've realized that you made a mistake in choosing internal medicine. Have some solid reasons for why you wouldn't be happy in internal medicine and feel that anesthesia is a better fit for you professionally. Do NOT bring up your failed match into a surgical subspecialty. Unless your current program director is a complete d-bag, I'm sure he/she will be very supportive in your transition. Most program directors just want people to succeed professionally and understand that people often switch fields. Not a big deal.

Step 4: Interview for CA-1 positions and secure a spot outside the match. Choose wisely. With your credentials you can be picky. Don't settle for a crappy program somewhere. If I were you, I would contact the following programs: University of Michigan, UCSF, Stanford, Hopkins, MGH, Brigham, Duke, Cornell, Columbia, Vanderbilt, WashU, UCLA, and University of Washington. All of these programs are relatively large with excellent reputations nationally. I'm sure you'll find a spot at one of these programs.

Good luck.
Great advice overall.

Just a slight concern/question -- I thought the match was "all in" now, unless there different rules for someone in OP's position (e.g., applying as a PGY-2)?
 
Th
Step 1: Do some soul searching and make absolutely sure that you do not want to become a surgeon. If so, then you need to find the right field as an alternative. Are you sure that anesthesiology is the right choice? Did you explore any other specialties as a medical student that you enjoyed? With your credentials, you would be competitive for a wide variety of fields. Radiation oncology, radiology, dermatology...there's a lot of great specialty choices out there. The key right now is to make a smart, informed decision about your switch. Also, don't forget about some of the subspecialties in internal medicine that are very procedurally oriented. Have you shadowed an interventional cardiologist or EP doc? The latter is fairly surgical in nature with frequent implantation of AICDs & pacemakers. What about a GI doc with advanced endoscopy training? Tons of cool procedures. Check out all of the structural stuff that cardiologists are doing these days (percutaneous valve replacements, PFO repairs, etc.). It's pretty amazing. If you have a surgical inclination, a procedural subspecialty of internal medicine may be a solid choice for you. High income, high demand, reasonable workload, and virtually no midlevel encroachment issues in GI and cards.

Step 2: If you're sure you want to become an anesthesiologist, contact the program director for the anesthesiology residency where you went to medical school. I assume you rotated on anesthesia as a medical student and so they already know you. Tell them your situation. Be honest. Don't worry about them contacting your current program. They will keep things confidential. This is a great way to explore your options. Undoubtedly the program director will know of open PGY-2 positions around the country and get you in touch with the appropriate people.

Step 3: Once you have some promising leads established (i.e., anesthesiology programs that seem genuinely interested in you joining the program as a CA-1), approach your current program director and explain your situation. You have to be careful with this meeting, however. Do NOT give them the impression that you never had any genuine interest in internal medicine. The simplest approach is to say that you were on the fence between anesthesia and internal medicine when you were in medical school. Now that you're an intern, you've realized that you made a mistake in choosing internal medicine. Have some solid reasons for why you wouldn't be happy in internal medicine and feel that anesthesia is a better fit for you professionally. Do NOT bring up your failed match into a surgical subspecialty. Unless your current program director is a complete d-bag, I'm sure he/she will be very supportive in your transition. Most program directors just want people to succeed professionally and understand that people often switch fields. Not a big deal.

Step 4: Interview for CA-1 positions and secure a spot outside the match. Choose wisely. With your credentials you can be picky. Don't settle for a crappy program somewhere. If I were you, I would contact the following programs: University of Michigan, UCSF, Stanford, Hopkins, MGH, Brigham, Duke, Cornell, Columbia, Vanderbilt, WashU, UCLA, and University of Washington. All of these programs are relatively large with excellent reputations nationally. I'm sure you'll find a spot at one of these programs.

Good luck.


Thank you so much. I will do all of this. Only thing is no home program. But I will work on this.
 
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