Schools' calculated COA accurate reflection of costs?

[mikecougarmd]

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I've got 3 acceptances right now and a 4th waitlist and I'm trying to sort through all the variables to choose which school will be best for me.

How accurate have you found the COA determined by the schools to be? Will I really need that much for housing or does that number put me in a rat-infested apartment? Will I have to live on rice and ramen or is the food budget luxurious? I'm just wondering what your experiences are as I try my best to compare apples to apples to see how costs will sort out between schools.

I don't have any debt right now. I own a car. I'm happy to have a roommate or two; I just want my own room in a place that's in good repair. I like to eat well but I'm not a fast food junkie. I already have a laptop that I'll continue to use. I suppose I won't use up the books and supplies budget as I'll limit the books I actually purchase.

The schools in questions are Medical College of Wisconsin, Univeristy of Toledo, Ohio State, and Virginia Commonwealth. I'm OOS for all schools though I can get in-state tuition after one year at both Ohio schools.

Anything else I should consider as I evaluate these COAs?

 

[TMP-SMX]

I've got 3 acceptances right now and a 4th waitlist and I'm trying to sort through all the variables to choose which school will be best for me.

How accurate have you found the COA determined by the schools to be? Will I really need that much for housing or does that number put me in a rat-infested apartment? Will I have to live on rice and ramen or is the food budget luxurious? I'm just wondering what your experiences are as I try my best to compare apples to apples to see how costs will sort out between schools.

I don't have any debt right now. I own a car. I'm happy to have a roommate or two; I just want my own room in a place that's in good repair. I like to eat well but I'm not a fast food junkie. I already have a laptop that I'll continue to use. I suppose I won't use up the books and supplies budget as I'll limit the books I actually purchase.

The schools in questions are Medical College of Wisconsin, Univeristy of Toledo, Ohio State, and Virginia Commonwealth. I'm OOS for all schools though I can get in-state tuition after one year at both Ohio schools.

Anything else I should consider as I evaluate these COAs?

Cost of gas depending where you plan on living near or far from the school itself. Take a look at the financial aid websites to compare their CoA. If you don't have that many bills to pay (high end phone bills etc.) then you should be fine. A huge portion is going to depend on what your rent will be.

I would choose a school based on who has the cheapest tuition (usually in-state public school). The actually CoA numbers are going to depend on the school and what the average rent is for the area. For the most part they are generous enough and for many cases they can increase it if necessary if you give them a budget or for emergency expenses.

 

[mikecougarmd]

Cost of gas depending where you plan on living near or far from the school itself. Take a look at the financial aid websites to compare their CoA. If you don't have that many bills to pay (high end phone bills etc.) then you should be fine. A huge portion is going to depend on what your rent will be.

I would choose a school based on who has the cheapest tuition (usually in-state public school). The actually CoA numbers are going to depend on the school and what the average rent is for the area. For the most part they are generous enough and for many cases they can increase it if necessary if you give them a budget or for emergency expenses.

I've got all the CoAs laid out in a spreadsheet with 4 year totals tabulated. I'm not too worried about the budget being insufficient. I'm worried more about being able to make comparisons between the four schools and if the respective COAs are what a typical student would need. So I guess my question is more like "Did you find that you needed several thousand dollars less than what your COA indicated or were you barely scraping by on that much?" Can I take the school provided COA at face value and use it to compare with others? How much tweaking needs to be done?

The way the various schools breakdown the COA makes it hard to compare. Some separate everything out line by line while others lump everything associated with living costs into a single number. I suppose I could break it all down but that's no fun!

 

[Habeed]

Let's make this as simple as possible. Despite your spreadsheets, you are going to find that in practice some expenses will be much higher, and some much lower. You really can't predict 4 years in advance.

The school has a total yearly budget called the CoA. Then, they have tuition and required fees. Subtract from the CoA the tuition and required fees, and there's your living allowance money.

Now, the school group health insurance is usually the most practical option, so subtract that cost as well. Finally, look on message boards to figure out the average cost of rent that the students at the school pay for 1 room out of a 2 bedroom apartment. Subtract 12 months of that from your budget.

Now, that's the money you have to live on. What you are going to find is that different schools can vary that amount of money by $10,000 or more. No, it doesn't make sense, but it's how it's done.

As for total costs : don't worry too much about that if you are considering a difference for all 4 years of less than 40k. You'll be able to pay that back. Ultimately, you should be worried about matching to a residency of your choice, and so you should pick a medical school based on those considerations. Obviously, a better specialty can pay $40k+ more per year than a less desirable one, or you might just love it so much that you don't mind working extra hours. Either way, the cost difference becomes a drop in the bucket.

 

[mikecougarmd]

Thanks Habeed. That's the answer I was trying to get at without having to do all the calculations. I'll break it down and let everyone know what I find out.

 

[mikecougarmd]

Well these are some interesting numbers I've come up with.

After subtracting out rent and utilities I have a huge disparity in estimated food/transportation/personal expenses estimates between the four schools. I've tried to match them as carefully as I can and get good estimates of rent for the various cities. Even so, I have a 120% difference in estimated cost between the cheapest and most expensive schools.

Here are the numbers I came up with:

Cost of living excluding rent/utilities (4 years):
MCW: $24,700
Toledo: $34,566
VCU: $54,710
OSU: $36,608

So somehow these schools have a huge range in what they budget for food, transportation, and personal costs.

VCU's costs seem a bit outrageous. They say things like $540/month for food and household costs and $450/month for transportation. I'm inclined to think MCW's cost are more realistic if they're actually requiring people to live on that much and they make it by ok. Or maybe food really is twice as expensive in Virginia!

 

[TMP-SMX]

I think you are putting too much thought into this. Go to the school with the lowest tuition, the location you like the best, and the school has the best education. Streaming video lectures are also a plus.

 

[Habeed]

Ok, that's what they let you SPEND.

It's not what it COSTS. There's a difference. However, usually, if the school lets you SPEND more to live on per year, then it might cost somewhat more to live on in that area.

That's why I had you subtract out the rent from those numbers : rental rates vary by 150% for the same size apartment, depending on location.

Personally, all else being equal, I'd favor the school that let me borrow more money to live on. Sure, it's more debt, but in practice, since you don't have to make payments until you are earning a high income, it means that you will have a better lifestyle during 4 years of your life.

And you don't have to borrow the full amount, you can turn some of the money back in.

 

[mikecougarmd]

I think you are putting too much thought into this. Go to the school with the lowest tuition, the location you like the best, and the school has the best education. Streaming video lectures are also a plus.

It'd be nice if it were that easy. Those 3 factors you list are not all found in the same school of those I'm accepted at. If I get in at Ohio State off the wait list it's easy: best location, best price, best school. After that Toledo is the cheapest, MCW the one I liked best, and VCU the more expensive but perhaps nicest location.

 

[mikecougarmd]

Ok, that's what they let you SPEND.

It's not what it COSTS. There's a difference. However, usually, if the school lets you SPEND more to live on per year, then it might cost somewhat more to live on in that area.

That's why I had you subtract out the rent from those numbers : rental rates vary by 150% for the same size apartment, depending on location.

Personally, all else being equal, I'd favor the school that let me borrow more money to live on. Sure, it's more debt, but in practice, since you don't have to make payments until you are earning a high income, it means that you will have a better lifestyle during 4 years of your life.

And you don't have to borrow the full amount, you can turn some of the money back in.

I realize that the COA is the most I can spend and not necessarily what it costs. That was the whole point of this thread: to figure out how accurate you guys find the estimates to be.

I disagree on borrowing more. People talk like another 10, 20, or 50K in debt is no big deal but there's a whole heck of a lot I could do with that extra money in 10 or 15 years. It's more in my retirement fund, more for my kids, more for charity, etc.

Thanks for your input, guys. Perhaps you could tell me how it seems to go for you and your classmates, e.g. "Everyone at State Med School X usually takes out all they can" or "At my school most everyone is able to knock off a few thousand from the COA."

 

[Habeed]

That's impossible to quantify.

And, while I'm a cheapskate most of the time, I still disagree with your philosophy. That's how you end up accumulating millions of dollars...and never spending it on anything cool, dying and leaving it all to medical bills or your descendents. You only live your life once, and 'save save save' when you don't need to means that you miss out on opportunities you won't get again.

Rental and insurance rate is the best quantifier there is : no matter where you live, your car will cost about the same to maintain and drive. Food from Walmart grocery would be within 10%-20% of the prices anywhere else in the U.S. Your books and computers and supplies all come from the internet (if you're smart) and so you pay the same price no matter where you live.

So basically, find out the rental and insurance rates and you'll have your answer.

 

[TMP-SMX]

I realize that the COA is the most I can spend and not necessarily what it costs. That was the whole point of this thread: to figure out how accurate you guys find the estimates to be.

I disagree on borrowing more. People talk like another 10, 20, or 50K in debt is no big deal but there's a whole heck of a lot I could do with that extra money in 10 or 15 years. It's more in my retirement fund, more for my kids, more for charity, etc.

Thanks for your input, guys. Perhaps you could tell me how it seems to go for you and your classmates, e.g. "Everyone at State Med School X usually takes out all they can" or "At my school most everyone is able to knock off a few thousand from the COA."

You could post in the allopathic class threads for each school you are thinking about and they could give you an answer. I assume you are in state in Ohio, so I'd highly suggest you stay in Ohio unless you get some amazing scholarship to the other schools. I also agree with you that it is a better idea to only take out what you need. There is no reason to take out the full amount of your CoA each year unless you have huge expenses or some other situation.

If you are worrying about not having enough leeway in your CoA keep in mind that it can always be increased if you have an emergency need or some other important expense. This is something you would talk to the FA Office about.