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I'm not sure I understand the questions -- It seems like there are 2 unrelated issues here.
1. You applying to medical school. As far as this goes, you just need to apply broadly and see where you are accepted. If it is past the deadline, then NO you are not going to get an interview. But there are certainly some programs that haven't reached the deadline yet.
2. Your husband - why not just wait and see if he is actually fired before worrying abou this? I don't think he is going to be fired just for one thing - it would need to be a pattern of things. After all, he is training and mistakes happen. Plus, where he relocates to will be dependent on if and where you go to medical school.
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SeekingNewRes
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This can't be the whole story... Why would he be on probation for a serious illness? Is that like, "oh I'm sorry you have cancer, but we're going to have to take disciplinary action."
Plus, I can't imagine a program where attempting OMM would be grounds for expulsion...
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SeekingNewRes
He was on probation because he had some trouble when he returned to work. Since then, his performance has been fine. I never thought OMM was that big a deal either, but they are apparently terrified of DOs, and think they are witchdoctors.
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Blade28
I'm curious - what happens in "rib raising"? How do you do it?
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SeekingNewRes
The patient lies on their back and you put your hands under them. You apply pressure (specific places) to release the muscles that are in spasm. Great for COPD, bronchitis, any situation where the patient could use more excursion.
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The problem is that, if your husband is in an allopathic residency program, his superiors are responsible for anything that he does. Osteopathic manuipulations are not part of allopathic residencies, so this would be similar (although obviously to a much lesser degree) to a medicine resident deciding to perform open surgery on a patient. If osteopaths in my program want to practice OMM, I encourage them to arrange electives in osteopathic programs to do so. By performing OMM, your husband puts his superiors in a bad position -- supervising him for something that they are not trained in.
As far as your original question, I don't believe there is any central clearinghouse of open FP slots. You could look up last year's match results -- programs with open spots in the match last year might not have filled them. You could ask his current PD to email other PD's for open spots. Or, you could start with FREIDA and contact programs that interest him directly.
Good Luck!
As far as your original question, I don't believe there is any central clearinghouse of open FP slots. You could look up last year's match results -- programs with open spots in the match last year might not have filled them. You could ask his current PD to email other PD's for open spots. Or, you could start with FREIDA and contact programs that interest him directly.
Good Luck!
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SeekingNewRes
Thanks for the FRIEDA tip. We understand the legal implications of his actions. It was a mistake. He got carried away trying to help when the oxygen didn't work.
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I'd suggest looking into osteopathic IM residencies. There are plenty of them and many will have unfilled slots. It sounds like your husband wants to incorporate OMT into practice anyway. Secondarily, he should look somewhere that has a medical school nearby. Check out DO-online.org.
I have to admit, I don't think your telling us the whole story. Its an anonymous forum. You might get more useful advice about the whole situation by sharing more information. I just don't buy the whole getting fired for doing rib raising . Nor do I buy the part about the dramatic results.( "...just thrilled that she could now breathe"...give me a break.) These kind of miraculous claims for OMT make DO's look bad on a whole and personally just tend to push my buttons.
Anyway, I hope things work out.
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SeekingNewRes
This is the whole story: He had some trouble when he returned to work after his illness, thus the probation. Subsequent work was just fine. The attendings for the last rotation gave him good reviews. We thought he had dodged that bullet, but 3 weeks later submitted they a fail. Apparently it WAS that big a deal to someone in that department. A fail, while on probation, equals termination. They have to comply for legal reasons. His advisor was not happy.
As for the "miracle" aspect, it's simply true.
The COPD patient was blue with purple nails. Oxygen didn't help. He did the rib raising, she turned pink and smiled. Why do you find it hard to believe that a procedure is effective?
Yes, we will be looking for a DO res for him. And yes, obviously, it needs to be near a med school. Forgive my shortness but I'm very frustrated at having to suddenly move cross country and give up my dream school.
As for the "miracle" aspect, it's simply true.
The COPD patient was blue with purple nails. Oxygen didn't help. He did the rib raising, she turned pink and smiled. Why do you find it hard to believe that a procedure is effective?
Yes, we will be looking for a DO res for him. And yes, obviously, it needs to be near a med school. Forgive my shortness but I'm very frustrated at having to suddenly move cross country and give up my dream school.
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I guess I could buy into the miracle aspect in so far as vigorous chest PT would also dramatically improve someone with significant atelectasis. But I don't want to turn the thread into a heated debate over the merits of OMT for hospitalized patients.
I can see the above program directors point about the problem with doing OMT with allopathic supervision. In FP, we bill OMT as an outpatient procedure, so I suppose we should take the risks and benefits seriously, and there should be some knowledgable oversight that the person doing it displays proficiency.
The website I gave will list all osteopathic programs in the country as well as how many unfilled spots each has. Click on "opportunites". Good luck.
I can see the above program directors point about the problem with doing OMT with allopathic supervision. In FP, we bill OMT as an outpatient procedure, so I suppose we should take the risks and benefits seriously, and there should be some knowledgable oversight that the person doing it displays proficiency.
The website I gave will list all osteopathic programs in the country as well as how many unfilled spots each has. Click on "opportunites". Good luck.
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First its probation after an illness. Then it's illness, followed by "some trouble when he returned to work," followed by probation. And of course we're expected to take away that from a month's effort on rotation it was one OMM incident, which happened to result in a favorable outcome, was the source of failure? There had to be a pattern or something.
You're omitting important information and its devaluing the DO profession. I'm sorry for your situation, but please be more forthcoming, and will you share the name of this hospital after your husband leaves.
You're omitting important information and its devaluing the DO profession. I'm sorry for your situation, but please be more forthcoming, and will you share the name of this hospital after your husband leaves.
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SeekingNewRes
I was not deliberately hiding his trouble when he returned, I was just trying to be brief. Sorry for the confusion: I should have been more clear. His memory was not quite up to snuff and he made some errors his first few weeks back.
I do believe it was from that one incident. He doesn't make a habit of doing OMM, he just felt compelled to help this woman. When he came out of the room he reported it to the R2. She freaked out and said "You could have broken her spine!" Clearly she doesn't know much about OMM but is terrified of it. As I said before, the attendings liked his work but this R2 decided to fail him. He overheard her on the phone convincing someone that OMM was dangerous. The issue, as I understand it, is a legal one. Because he doesn't have a DO preceptor, it's not a legit modality. And since he was on probation, that failure forced a termination, again from a legal perspective. The program has to protect itself. I am not blaming the hospital, I just wish that R2 had realized the implications of her complaint.
I do believe it was from that one incident. He doesn't make a habit of doing OMM, he just felt compelled to help this woman. When he came out of the room he reported it to the R2. She freaked out and said "You could have broken her spine!" Clearly she doesn't know much about OMM but is terrified of it. As I said before, the attendings liked his work but this R2 decided to fail him. He overheard her on the phone convincing someone that OMM was dangerous. The issue, as I understand it, is a legal one. Because he doesn't have a DO preceptor, it's not a legit modality. And since he was on probation, that failure forced a termination, again from a legal perspective. The program has to protect itself. I am not blaming the hospital, I just wish that R2 had realized the implications of her complaint.
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you're trying to blame this whole thing on the OMM incident. but you've told us a bunch of other things that went wrong leading up to it. all of this is unfortunate we undertand, and i can see why you're frustrated. but just realize that from a neutral perspective, your story doesn't seem to revolve entirely around the OMM incident, but sounds like you're trying to rationalize it that way.
one more thing...please remember that your pre-med scores don't guarantee a med school "anywhere you want". those scores are a dime a dozen at some of the top programs. and scores alone don't guarantee an acceptance. you really need to be more specific about where you're looking to apply. location and school reputation make all the difference.
one more thing...please remember that your pre-med scores don't guarantee a med school "anywhere you want". those scores are a dime a dozen at some of the top programs. and scores alone don't guarantee an acceptance. you really need to be more specific about where you're looking to apply. location and school reputation make all the difference.
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There are people here in Poland with scores like that, so you might not get in "anywhere".
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My GPA was about the same as yours and my MCAT score was higher. It's not a blank check that gets you in anywhere. This isn't a brag; just wanted to let you know that while you'll likely get in somewhere with those stats, they really are nothing special at the desirable schools.
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Ever hear the adage- If you don't have anything positive to say don't say anything at all? If not, you just did.
Why not take what she is saying at face value? Stranger things have happened re: him being let go. Life isn't always fair- some people get dealt bad hands- as if I should have to point this out? If you all haven't learned this fact from what you see in medicine- then you haven't learned d--k!
Good luck to you
Why not take what she is saying at face value? Stranger things have happened re: him being let go. Life isn't always fair- some people get dealt bad hands- as if I should have to point this out? If you all haven't learned this fact from what you see in medicine- then you haven't learned d--k!
Good luck to you
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i'm sorry to hear about your situation.
i say this only to help determine the most realistic and fesible plan of action, but your stats, while they are solid, are certainly no guarantee that you will get into ANYWHERE you want to go...prospective med students these days are rather acomplished and a very select group (and a small one at that) can consider themselves guaranteed whereever they want to go...if most of all you've got is numbers then you need to proceed with caution b/c the whole package certainly exists.
in other words, you are likely to get into med school but perhaps not just anywhere you want to go. unless of course you have some personal ties (pedigree etc) w a particular institution.
i am not trying to be mean b/c i am sure that you are a lovely applicant but given the complexity of your situation, you don't want to overestimate anything...it's better to anticipate the worst possible senario and then be pleasantly suprised when things work out your way.
so, if you do not have some "under the table/neputism" type situation working for you, i would suggest letting your husband land a residency first (asap) so that the geographical location can be determined.
as soon as you have a sense of what his real options are, start applying to that region. i don't know about deadlines and if you're past them, you may have to take the yr off.
if you do take the yr off, i highly suggest that you completely infiltrate the nearest med school by doing research or getting a job there and getting to know important people there....in other words, build some ties w the school.
or, you could do it the other way around...have your husband follow you. he can take this yr off (do research or something) and hit up the most fesible program nearest your school...his start date might be more flexible than yours. i actually think this may be a better idea since it's harder to get into med school than im or fp residency. those residencies are nice b/c there are soooo many programs in a partcular location (as opposed to radiology or something) and there will at least be one that is not competitive.
the thing is, you guys are gonna have this problem again when YOU apply for residency and/or fellowship and/or he tries to find a job. this is what happens when you're married to another person in the midst of their medical training ...
i have met many MD couples who have had to postpone or rearrange or change plans b/c of their partner. in fact, i am one of them...i postponed my application to residency by a year so that my husband could catch up to me with his medical training. i have no doubt we will have to make these compromises over again during fellowship.
this set up is not ideal but that's what you sign up for when you marry another professional.
i say this only to help determine the most realistic and fesible plan of action, but your stats, while they are solid, are certainly no guarantee that you will get into ANYWHERE you want to go...prospective med students these days are rather acomplished and a very select group (and a small one at that) can consider themselves guaranteed whereever they want to go...if most of all you've got is numbers then you need to proceed with caution b/c the whole package certainly exists.
in other words, you are likely to get into med school but perhaps not just anywhere you want to go. unless of course you have some personal ties (pedigree etc) w a particular institution.
i am not trying to be mean b/c i am sure that you are a lovely applicant but given the complexity of your situation, you don't want to overestimate anything...it's better to anticipate the worst possible senario and then be pleasantly suprised when things work out your way.
so, if you do not have some "under the table/neputism" type situation working for you, i would suggest letting your husband land a residency first (asap) so that the geographical location can be determined.
as soon as you have a sense of what his real options are, start applying to that region. i don't know about deadlines and if you're past them, you may have to take the yr off.
if you do take the yr off, i highly suggest that you completely infiltrate the nearest med school by doing research or getting a job there and getting to know important people there....in other words, build some ties w the school.
or, you could do it the other way around...have your husband follow you. he can take this yr off (do research or something) and hit up the most fesible program nearest your school...his start date might be more flexible than yours. i actually think this may be a better idea since it's harder to get into med school than im or fp residency. those residencies are nice b/c there are soooo many programs in a partcular location (as opposed to radiology or something) and there will at least be one that is not competitive.
the thing is, you guys are gonna have this problem again when YOU apply for residency and/or fellowship and/or he tries to find a job. this is what happens when you're married to another person in the midst of their medical training ...
i have met many MD couples who have had to postpone or rearrange or change plans b/c of their partner. in fact, i am one of them...i postponed my application to residency by a year so that my husband could catch up to me with his medical training. i have no doubt we will have to make these compromises over again during fellowship.
this set up is not ideal but that's what you sign up for when you marry another professional.
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Unfortunately this is true. Make sure you research the schools in the area you will be (eventually) attending. My school only accepts one "out of state" applicant every year; thus you may have to sit out and acquire residency status in order to be accepted "anywhere". Just a friendly warning about the way things work.
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SeekingNewRes
Thanks for MedicineMan and the others who have given me the benefit of actually hearing what I'm saying. I committed the unthinkable on the internet: Posting While Panicked. In doing so, I inadvertently left out some details and overstated others. I never meant to imply I could walk into Harvard - I don't want to go there anyway. And there is a lot more to both of our stories, of course, but what I really needed was links to vacancy listings. Thanks to those who provided real help. Now that the initial shock has worn off we are feeling much better about the situation, so I'm leaving the forums and returning to real life.
Take care!
Take care!
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What, life and this forum are incompatible?
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Not to rehash this subject, but Im an intern at a rather large southern allopathic hospital and I encountered a situation the other day where I offered to treat one of my co-interns patient's with some OMT and it was very well-received by the other intern and our attending (and the patient).
I can see how this would not be the case everywhere, and I would caution the osteopaths out there to: a) not forget your training, it can be useful, and b) check with your higher-ups before doing these therapies, just as if you were going to start a new Abx or insert a central line (I wouldnt call it the equivalent of a medicine resident performing surgery, however...).
Understand that people may nopt want you to do it, and be okay with that. If you are already on thin ice, probably shouldnt try and make a name for yourself.
The preceptor/modality legal issue is ludicrous. Anyone who uses that excuse is just looking for any reason to boot you, in all honesty.
I hope this goes well for you.
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I don't know about that. OMT is a medical procedure. It is billed as a procedure in the same way as removal of a skin lesion or injection of a knee is a procedure. If you want OMT to be treated as a legitimate modality of treatment then you can't just assign it to be done willy nilly by an intern or medical student (as is often the case in D.O. hospitals) without some proper supervision.
