Several Questions for Third-Year DO interested in Psychiatry

[jimdugba]

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I'm a third year osteopathic student and I think I've finally decided on a specialty... psychiatry. That being said, I still have a ton of questions on setting up my 4th year rotations, polishing my application, and picking a residency.

Just for reference my stats are:
USMLE Step 1 - 236, COMLEX Step 1 - 585
Very average didactic and clinical grades (however, with great clinical evaluations/comments )
Basically no relevant extracurricular activities other than hobbies I enjoy

First question I have is with relatively competitive scores but a weak application otherwise, would I be "safe" applying primarily to MD University programs? I'm willing to be in pretty much any area of the country as long as the program is located near a relatively large city.

Second question I have is about away rotations. Based on what I've been reading, opinions on the importance of away/audition/sub-I rotations is mixed. What are other osteopathic students' experience with away rotations and how it impacted your application process? How many did you do? What Type did you do? My plan right now is to do at least 2 away rotations of some kind. I only had one outpatient Psych rotation and I'd like to secure another specialty LOR.

Third question I have is about USMLE Step 2/COMLEX Step 2. Is it advisable that I take USMLE Step 2? or should I just take COMLEX? I'm fairly confident I can do well if I put in the long hours necessary. But I don't want to do unnecessary work or risk getting a bad score if its not going to help me... unless I do exceptionally well.

Thank you for listening to my questions guys. Below is a list of University programs I found that have a least a couple DOs in their listing for current residents. I hope it helps others in the same position I am.

Baylor University
University of Iowa
KU - Kansas City
THE Ohio State University
Loma Linda University
Loyola University -Chicago
University of South Florida
University of Arizona
University of Florida
University of Texas -Austin, hook em
The U - University of Miami
Drexel University
University of Illinois - Chicago, tons of Carribean students
Stony Brook University
Oregon Health Sciences University
Medical College of Wisconsin
Creighton University
University of Wisconsin - Madison
Vanderbilt University
University of Rochester
Wake Forest University
University of Minnesota
Indiana University
Michigan State University
SUNY Upstate
University of Maryland
University of Hawaii
UCSF Fresno
University of Nevada - Las Vegas; Mostly DO residents
University of Louisville
Tuft's
LSU
Virginia Commonwealth University
Wright State University
University of Virginia

 

[SartoriousMeansTailor]

Congratulations on choosing Psychiatry! I'm a DO applicant for this year's match, so I was pretty much in the same boat as you last year. I applied both osteopathic and allopathic and in hindsight I should've saved my $ and just applied allopathic. My board scores weren't as high as yours for Level/Step I and I only took COMLEX Level II, which I somehow did ridiculously well on. I'd say that taking USMLE Step II isn't very important unless you have your heart set on very specific programs. I would recommend that you have passing scores on both COMLEX Level II and the PE as early in the application process as you can - you're less of a risk that way.

As far as auditions went, I did two (plus one at the end of 3rd year). They were a challenge to set up b/c my school isn't very flexible so I ended up auditioning at places that weren't necessarily my top choices at the start of 4th year. I would say that one audition was critical to me getting an interview, as well as providing me the insight that led me to rank that program very highly. The other audition was key to my decision to cancel my interview with that program...so that's also a "win" in my book. I had a strong personal statement that I think worked in my favor, since several programs specifically commented on it.

As far as "DO-friendly" psychiatry programs go, I wouldn't just limit yourself to programs with DO residents listed on their websites. I received interview invitations from programs with no DOs. My sense is that all but a few elite programs are very open to DOs, so if you apply broadly I would think you would do fine. I would also look at dually-accredited programs, since they won't be affected by the merger and do offer the opportunity to rank them through the osteopathic match if there are still two matches next year...if they are at the top of your list.

Best of luck in your search and feel free to PM me if any questions arise or if you just want someone to bounce ideas off of.

 

[st2205]

First question I have is with relatively competitive scores but a weak application otherwise, would I be "safe" applying primarily to MD University programs? I'm willing to be in pretty much any area of the country as long as the program is located near a relatively large city.

You should be fine on paper so long as there are no red flags or bad letters/comments.

Second question I have is about away rotations. Based on what I've been reading, opinions on the importance of away/audition/sub-I rotations is mixed. What are other osteopathic students' experience with away rotations and how it impacted your application process? How many did you do? What Type did you do? My plan right now is to do at least 2 away rotations of some kind. I only had one outpatient Psych rotation and I'd like to secure another specialty LOR.

I didn't do any. The opinions on always certainly varies and the general consensus is that it doesn't matter but there are many opinions on this. Doing an away may help you get your foot into the door at one program and may not do anything for the other. It may even close doors (not unheard of) -- but then the question is if the program didn't like you and ranked you accordingly after a rotation, is that a place you'd want to be? In the end, the advice never really applies broadly to all situations and you'll have to feel it out. Lots of the SDN truisms due not hold true for anything my program does and I'd presume we're not the only ones where that's the case.

Third question I have is about USMLE Step 2/COMLEX Step 2. Is it advisable that I take USMLE Step 2? or should I just take COMLEX? I'm fairly confident I can do well if I put in the long hours necessary. But I don't want to do unnecessary work or risk getting a bad score if its not going to help me... unless I do exceptionally well.

Your step 1 is good. I think that should be sufficient. Sure, a good step 2 could help, but it may have meaningless significance.

 

[J ROD]

You should be fine from what I have seen this year. Just make sure to apply to enough schools that are not as competitive. You are competitive but also DO. So, it should be fine as long as you don't reach too far. Maybe add 10 extra programs. The process is random.....very random.

 

[Dharma]

Do auditions if you really want to see what's up with a program or if there is a place you definitely want to be and plan to shine at. Other than that, not necessary. Don't sweat it.

I wouldn't worry about the extracurricular thing either. Your application is only "weak" if you have low board scores (and yours are quite nice), bad LORs (sure that's not gonna happen), clinical failures, or huge unexplained gaps in your education. I had next to zero EC padding on my resume besides my work prior to medical school (which was mostly non-medical).

As far as programs go, I can add a few for you:
Thomas Jefferson
Temple
UVA
Case Western UH
Maimonides
Beth Israel
SLR
UCONN
Northwell (formerly NSLIJ)
SIUH
RWJ (Rutgers)
Buffalo
Hopkins


That's just off the top of my head. But don't let DO-friendly set the tone. I received invites from places that don't have any DO's in the program (e.g. UNC). You have solid scores. Get those LORs early (I'd try for 2 psych), take USMLE Step2 (I've had PDs mention it FWIW), and knock the PE out early. Best of luck!

 

[jimdugba]

Do auditions if you really want to see what's up with a program or if there is a place you definitely want to be and plan to shine at. Other than that, not necessary. Don't sweat it.

I wouldn't worry about the extracurricular thing either. Your application is only "weak" if you have low board scores (and yours are quite nice), bad LORs (sure that's not gonna happen), clinical failures, or huge unexplained gaps in your education. I had next to zero EC padding on my resume besides my work prior to medical school (which was mostly non-medical).

As far as programs go, I can add a few for you:
Thomas Jefferson
Temple
UVA
Case Western UH
Maimonides
Beth Israel
SLR
UCONN
Northwell (formerly NSLIJ)
SIUH
RWJ (Rutgers)
Buffalo
Hopkins


That's just off the top of my head. But don't let DO-friendly set the tone. I received invites from places that don't have any DO's in the program (e.g. UNC). You have solid scores. Get those LORs early (I'd try for 2 psych), take USMLE Step2 (I've had PDs mention it FWIW), and knock the PE out early. Best of luck!

Hey, thanks a ton homie. I think I just needed some reassurance that I was doing the right thing! So did you end up doing any away rotations at all? I'm thinking I may just do 1 or two to try and secure another letter.

 

[jimdugba]

Congratulations on choosing Psychiatry! I'm a DO applicant for this year's match, so I was pretty much in the same boat as you last year. I applied both osteopathic and allopathic and in hindsight I should've saved my $ and just applied allopathic. My board scores weren't as high as yours for Level/Step I and I only took COMLEX Level II, which I somehow did ridiculously well on. I'd say that taking USMLE Step II isn't very important unless you have your heart set on very specific programs. I would recommend that you have passing scores on both COMLEX Level II and the PE as early in the application process as you can - you're less of a risk that way.

As far as auditions went, I did two (plus one at the end of 3rd year). They were a challenge to set up b/c my school isn't very flexible so I ended up auditioning at places that weren't necessarily my top choices at the start of 4th year. I would say that one audition was critical to me getting an interview, as well as providing me the insight that led me to rank that program very highly. The other audition was key to my decision to cancel my interview with that program...so that's also a "win" in my book. I had a strong personal statement that I think worked in my favor, since several programs specifically commented on it.

As far as "DO-friendly" psychiatry programs go, I wouldn't just limit yourself to programs with DO residents listed on their websites. I received interview invitations from programs with no DOs. My sense is that all but a few elite programs are very open to DOs, so if you apply broadly I would think you would do fine. I would also look at dually-accredited programs, since they won't be affected by the merger and do offer the opportunity to rank them through the osteopathic match if there are still two matches next year...if they are at the top of your list.

Best of luck in your search and feel free to PM me if any questions arise or if you just want someone to bounce ideas off of.

Hey thanks a lot for the tips Sartorius. I'm registered for the PE in April and the COMLEX in June so getting those in time for applications shouldn't be an issue. You said you did some "audition" rotations... were these just general adult psychiatry rotations or were they Sub-I rotations. I don't know if I'm quite prepared for a sub-I yet without any inpatient psych experience.

 

[SartoriousMeansTailor]

You said you did some "audition" rotations... were these just general adult psychiatry rotations or were they Sub-I rotations.

My core rotation in 3rd year was adult inpatient. At the end of my 3rd year I did a child rotation that is typically geared to 4th years (requires all core rotations to be completed) to make sure I actually liked psychiatry, so that was just a regular rotation. I tried to "treat it like a Sub-I" b/c I wanted to get a LOR from that rotation (giving me a total of 2 Psych LORs). In 4th year, I did a Child Inpatient Sub-I at a place I was interested in checking out for residency. I also did an Adult Inpatient Sub-I at a place I was considering...and then ended up not interviewing b/c it wasn't a good fit for me.

I think if you're going to do an "audition" early in your 4th year b/c you would like to try to get a second LOR, you'd be fine with inpatient even without a ton of experience. A lot of the day-to-day work of inpatient psych is the same as on other services (in my opinion) and consists of H&Ps, daily progress notes, and discharge summaries. The acuity is typically higher than you'd see in outpatient psych, but the pathology is similar (although a different mix). I think if you are ok with inpatient in general and psych outpatient, you should be able to pick it up pretty quickly. And of course be up-front about what experiences you've had prior - no one can fault you for not having had a certain type of experience yet.

 

[Davole]

I disagree with those saying that Step 2 doesn't matter. I'm going through the cycle now and given what I've read on here, it seems like those who were hurting for interview invites were more likely to not have Step 2 complete. Might be better to be safe than sorry.

 

[kirkirkir]

To piggyback on this thread, does anyone have advice for 3rd year electives?

 

[st2205]

I disagree with those saying that Step 2 doesn't matter. I'm going through the cycle now and given what I've read on here, it seems like those who were hurting for interview invites were more likely to not have Step 2 complete. Might be better to be safe than sorry.

Step 2 or Level 2? If we're talking about COMLEX then I'd say absolutely have that done as soon as reasonably possible. If you've already done well on Step 1 then just having Level 2 COMLEX should be fine.

 

[SartoriousMeansTailor]

I disagree with those saying that Step 2 doesn't matter. I'm going through the cycle now and given what I've read on here, it seems like those who were hurting for interview invites were more likely to not have Step 2 complete. Might be better to be safe than sorry.

I would absolutely agree if an applicant is geographically-restricted. If not, I think you can do without it and just focus on getting your COMLEX Level 2 and PE done (unless you think you're going to have an amazing score +/- enjoy taking multiple-choice tests). I personally didn't take Step 2, turned down multiple interview invitations, and would be happy to match to any of the programs I ranked.

 

[Dharma]

Hey, thanks a ton homie. I think I just needed some reassurance that I was doing the right thing! So did you end up doing any away rotations at all? I'm thinking I may just do 1 or two to try and secure another letter.

I hear ya boss. Was in your shoes this time last year, emailing and PM'ing people further down the line on this journey, asking questions and trying to figure this thing out. You're doing the right thing.

I did not go on any aways. (It may be just me, but I've grown to almost loathe the term 'audition'). This is mostly because I did not want to lug my wife and kid all over the place nor did I want to be away from them and our homelife either. (Time is most definitely the most valuable asset we possess). Had I been single (or even without a kid for that matter... sorry hun...) I would have done an away or two, probably not for the sake of auditioning per se, but likely for solid experience and of course to land a LOR (bc who doesn't want that?). I don't think it's a necessity though. If it's the experience you're after, I say go for it, but let that be the main motivation. Anything lesser isn't worth it IMO and comes with the risk of having an off-month and effectively reducing your chances. Trust your gut.

I still say take USMLE Step 2. The game is changing. While I landed some decent interviews, I also didn't hear back from some places that would've been definite in years past. Now, that could be for any number of reasons but IMO it's an indication of increased applicant pool. Why limit yourself when you already have a slight knock against you in this game? (Yeah, the DO thing, as much as I hate to admit it). Go in with everything you can possibly do and forget about those things you have no control over. You should have no problem hitting a 250 on that USMLE btw.

 

[OldPsychDoc]

And now on top of that I'm starting to get the "I just took it but the score won't be back in time" e-mails.
Folks, you really do hurt yourselves by putting this stuff off. Especially if you have a marginal Step I.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

And now on top of that I'm starting to get the "I just took it but the score won't be back in time" e-mails.
Folks, you really do hurt yourselves by putting this stuff off. Especially if you have a marginal Step I.

(Applicant via e-mail)

Dear Dr. Training director:

I just took my step II and I know it will not be back until after the match, but I wanted you to know that I took it. You see, I really wanted to make sure I did well on it so I gave myself extra time to study.


(Training Director’s inaudible thoughts)

“Yah, well I wanted to make sure you did well on it too. Bye bye.”

 

[jimdugba]

And now on top of that I'm starting to get the "I just took it but the score won't be back in time" e-mails.
Folks, you really do hurt yourselves by putting this stuff off. Especially if you have a marginal Step I.

I hadn't really thought about that. Thanks for mentioning it. I'm scheduled to take USMLE June 27th right now, so I'm guessing I'll be straight in those regards... from what I remember, I think it took 4 weeks to get my step 1 score back. Do you remember how long it took you to get your scores???

 

[law14]

I'm a third-year DO student who just decided on psych, so I'm in the same situation you were in a year ago. Similar board scores (about 10 points lower on each), similarly bare CV, also willing to live wherever as long as it's near a big city (but preferably somewhere warm. Currently freezing my way through rotations in the Midwest). Where all did you end up applying? Did you take both Step and Level 2? Did you do audition/away rotations? How was interview season? General advice you wish you'd had a year ago?

 

[postbacpremed87]

In the same boat as those above. USMLE Step 1: 239 /COMLEX: 601. I decided to take USMLE Step 2 (early June, goal is 249) because it's just another opportunity for a PD to see quality work from an applicant. Good luck to everyone. I will be focusing on programs in the midwest and southeast. I cannot believe the application opens in 6 months and that interviews will start trickling in less than 9 months from now. I am so ready to start my career in Psych.

 

[postbacpremed87]

And now on top of that I'm starting to get the "I just took it but the score won't be back in time" e-mails.
Folks, you really do hurt yourselves by putting this stuff off. Especially if you have a marginal Step I.

Are you in the boat of DO students taking Step 2 if they have above average scores on Step 1? I just feel like it is a good thing to have both scores on interview day. Idk.

 

[OldPsychDoc]

Are you in the boat of DO students taking Step 2 if they have above average scores on Step 1? I just feel like it is a good thing to have both scores on interview day. Idk.

Yes--endeavor to have at least one Step 2--USMLE or COMLEX, I personally don't care which--in your file by interview time.

 

[abcdior]

Yes--endeavor to have at least one Step 2--USMLE or COMLEX, I personally don't care which--in your file by interview time.

if come rank time an applicant doesn't have his/her ComlexPE/Step 2 CS on file. do you:
1. not rank them
2. ask them if they have taken it/got score back
3. don't care

?

 

[OldPsychDoc]

if come rank time an applicant doesn't have his/her ComlexPE/Step 2 CS on file. do you:
1. not rank them
2. ask them if they have taken it/got score back
3. don't care

?

It's a calculated risk. With US grads, the pass rate is so high with PE/CS that if everything else from the interview, LORs, etc is positive, we'll usually assume "pass"--but programs have been burned before, and there's nothing worse than matching someone who isn't eligible to begin working (or even, in many cases, to graduate!) It will drop you in our rankings pretty substantially in favor of those who actually have gotten it done!

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Programs can ignore step IIs and get away with it most of the time. The thing is, if you do this long enough it will one match come to bite you. We look silly when we had hundreds of applicants with step II done and we select someone who doesn’t graduate and we have to scramble post soap. If you have been through this for no good reason, you start to think step II is important.

 

[postbacpremed87]

Programs can ignore step IIs and get away with it most of the time. The thing is, if you do this long enough it will one match come to bite you. We look silly when we had hundreds of applicants with step II done and we select someone who doesn’t graduate and we have to scramble post soap. If you have been through this for no good reason, you start to think step II is important.

...and having Step 2 done early means you are closer to being done with medical school. It is great for all parties involved. I am a little "high on Psychiatry" right now because I have finally made my decision and talked about it with my spouse. I briefly entertained Path/Rads/Neuro. Ultimately, they could not pull me away. Hopefully I see some of you on the interview trail this upcoming interview season.

 

[law14]

...and having Step 2 done early means you are closer to being done with medical school. It is great for all parties involved. I am a little "high on Psychiatry" right now because I have finally made my decision and talked about it with my spouse. I briefly entertained Path/Rads/Neuro. Ultimately, they could not pull me away. Hopefully I see some of you on the interview trail this upcoming interview season.

Same here! I was between psych and internal, mostly. It feels great to have finally made a decision.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Just drink our Kool Aid and all will be fine. I think it was a couple of years ago; someone mentioned that telling your family you were going into psychiatry was analogous to coming out. Not sure which one is easier for parents to take, but that is their problem of course.

 

[postbacpremed87]

Just drink our Kool Aid and all will be fine. I think it was a couple of years ago; someone mentioned that telling your family you were going into psychiatry was analogous to coming out. Not sure which one is easier for parents to take, but that is their problem of course.

I've done well in school and have above average Step scores and I am starting to get the, "That's what he is going into?".

 

[Geraltofrivia]

[]

 

[splik]

I really think these posts are in poor taste. We haven't even had the match for this year and people are posting about next year already. It gets worse every year. Remember it's not what you know, it's who you don't annoy - and people these ridiculous posts are annoying. How in the hell are you going to get an accurate assessment if you haven't even taken all your exams, finished your clerkships, and refuse to disclose your medical school (all important information). Please post back in the summer when you have a much firmer idea of what you want to do, know your grades, have taken step 2, and so on. All that neurosis would be much better channeled into actually studying for your exams and getting the most out of your clerkships. In the mean time all the information you desire is already on this forum.

 

[mcworbust]

I really think these posts are in poor taste. We haven't even had the match for this year and people are posting about next year already. It gets worse every year. Remember it's not what you know, it's who you don't annoy - and people these ridiculous posts are annoying. How in the hell are you going to get an accurate assessment if you haven't even taken all your exams, finished your clerkships, and refuse to disclose your medical school (all important information). Please post back in the summer when you have a much firmer idea of what you want to do, know your grades, have taken step 2, and so on. All that neurosis would be much better channeled into actually studying for your exams and getting the most out of your clerkships. In the mean time all the information you desire is already on this forum.

 

[law14]

I really think these posts are in poor taste. We haven't even had the match for this year and people are posting about next year already. It gets worse every year. Remember it's not what you know, it's who you don't annoy - and people these ridiculous posts are annoying. How in the hell are you going to get an accurate assessment if you haven't even taken all your exams, finished your clerkships, and refuse to disclose your medical school (all important information). Please post back in the summer when you have a much firmer idea of what you want to do, know your grades, have taken step 2, and so on. All that neurosis would be much better channeled into actually studying for your exams and getting the most out of your clerkships. In the mean time all the information you desire is already on this forum.

"Post back in the summer"? Really? You do know applications open in 21 weeks, right? And interview season starts at the beginning of fall...why would I wait until application season is underway to ask where I should look at applying? Why would I wait until after I have taken step 2 to ask whether I need to take step 2 and by when? Why would I wait until I've finished my clerkships to ask whether/where I should do away rotations? ...You sound like you're harboring some resentment toward the match. Care to share what mistakes you've made this season so we can avoid them?

 

[Merovinge]

"Post back in the summer"? Really? You do know applications open in 21 weeks, right? And interview season starts at the beginning of fall...why would I wait until application season is underway to ask where I should look at applying? Why would I wait until after I have taken step 2 to ask whether I need to take step 2 and by when? Why would I wait until I've finished my clerkships to ask whether/where I should do away rotations? ...You sound like you're harboring some resentment toward the match. Care to share what mistakes you've made this season so we can avoid them?

Your attempt to psychoanalyze Spilk made my day. Might want to check post history before firing your shot into the dark.

 

[law14]

Your attempt to psychoanalyze Spilk made my day. Might want to check post history before firing your shot into the dark.

Congratulations on having nothing better to do with your life than be a petty internet troll who makes everyone's day more annoying by pointing out trivial mistakes made on obscure sdn forums. You've demonstrated that you're clearly SO much smarter and wittier than I am!

Regardless, I maintain that the poster in reference is clearly bitter about something in his life, as he made a fairly aggressive and totally unsolicited attack on third year medical students interested in psychiatry simply bc we were asking for advice regarding residency...on a forum designed for medical students with questions...on a page titled "several questions for a third year DO medical student interested in psychiatry." But WE are the ones using the page inappropriately?

This forum was designed to facilitate the asking and answering of questions-- not snide comments and petty arguments over when and where questions should be asked, and who should answer them. If you don't have a med school/residency-related question to ask or answer, your comments should really be taken elsewhere.

Forgive me for thinking that I, as a third year DO medical student interested in psychiatry with several questions, had found the appropriate page on which to ask them.

As future psychiatrists, we really should be in the business of building people up and helping people, not pointing out each other's mistakes for the sole purpose of pointing out each other's mistakes. (And yes, I know I'm being a bit hypocritical since I'm engaging you, but it's immensely frustrating that I'm being attacked for being a third year DO medical student interested in psychiatry who is asking several questions on a page titled "several questions for a third year DO medical student interested in psych.")

Have a blessed day.

OP and others in 4th year and beyond- I would still greatly appreciate you passing along any advice or information you wish you'd had as a third year about to enter the psychiatry match process.

 

[OldPsychDoc]

...
OP and others in 4th year and beyond- I would still greatly appreciate you passing along any advice or information you wish you'd had as a third year about to enter the psychiatry match process.

In general, it is a good idea on any internet forum to read along for awhile before beginning to post. If you had, you might have found that the two members--@splik (2853 posts) and @Merovinge (337 posts)--at whom you (16 posts) have taken umbrage, have been around here for quite awhile, have many previous posts with excellent content, and are not unsupportive of students--MD or DO--with questions. In addition, you might have found that the answers to your questions are already substantially answered in previous posts--without needing to force an early start to the next application cycle before the current one is resolved.

 

[law14]

In general, it is a good idea on any internet forum to read along for awhile before beginning to post. If you had, you might have found that the two members--@splik (2853 posts) and @Merovinge (337 posts)--at whom you (16 posts) have taken umbrage, have been around here for quite awhile, have many previous posts with excellent content, and are not unsupportive of students--MD or DO--with questions. In addition, you might have found that the answers to your questions are already substantially answered in previous posts--without needing to force an early start to the next application cycle before the current one is resolved.

This page is not titled "Fourth year/current application cycle questions". It is for third year DO students who are newly interested in psych who have questions. If you don't want to answer questions from third year DO students interested in psych, then why did you click on this page? Furthermore how does my question hinder the ability of fourth years to ask their questions on a separate page?? Additionally what questions do fourth years need to ask at this point? Interview season is pretty much over. And if you'd follow your own rule and read others' posts carefully before commenting, you'd notice that my questions were directed only at the OP, as he/she is someone with scores and a situation almost identical to mine who can provide advice more tailored to my situation than the generic information found on other pages. Where exactly would I find those questions answered elsewhere on this forum by jimdugba?

 

[law14]

In general, it is a good idea on any internet forum to read along for awhile before beginning to post. If you had, you might have found that the two members--@splik (2853 posts) and @Merovinge (337 posts)--at whom you (16 posts) have taken umbrage, have been around here for quite awhile, have many previous posts with excellent content, and are not unsupportive of students--MD or DO--with questions. In addition, you might have found that the answers to your questions are already substantially answered in previous posts--without needing to force an early start to the next application cycle before the current one is resolved.

I hope you're not this antagonistic toward your patients.

 

[OldPsychDoc]

I hope you're not this antagonistic toward your patients.

I hope you're not this defensive with your attendings.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Now you have done it.

 

[law14]

I hope you're not this defensive with your attendings.

If an attending treated a patient like you're treating me, then yes, I would defend the patient. Patient care > attending ego, and it's unfortunate that you see the two as being of comparable importance.

 

[law14]

I hope you're not this defensive with your attendings.

I think we're letting this get out of hand. While I still feel that I was unfairly criticized for posting perfectly suitable questions on a perfectly suitable forum, I probably wouldn't have let it escalate to this point if I were having a better day. I recently had to deal with an older attending who did things like make fun of and belittle dementia and DD/MR patients, so Im probably still harboring some residual frustration towards older antagonistic attendings as a result of that experience.

Regardless, I'd like to apologize for my part in this escalation and respectfully request that we bring it back to the original topic-- questions for third year students interested in psych.

If you have helpful links or advice related to the psych match and want to post them, I'd truly appreciate it.

 

[Shikima]

Do we really need another cycle of "Year xxxx applications" or "Medical student interested in psych"?

 

[OldPsychDoc]

If an attending treated a patient like you're treating me, then yes, I would defend the patient. Patient care > attending ego, and it's unfortunate that you see the two as being of comparable importance.

Look, it's not an issue of patient care--it's just netiquette. You jumped into a forum essentially without introduction, bumped an old thread, and blasted out a bunch of general questions which have been discussed fairly regularly here over the years*--then you took shots at two long-established members of the forum when they called you on it.

I'm glad you're interested in psych. If you'd taken some time to "listen" on the forum and read through some previous threads*, you'd find that we like answering questions and advising students. (Some of us even stay home on Friday nights doing it...but that might be a sign of something else.) However, to date your only posts here have been on this single thread (and over half of those complaining about how we did or didn't respond as you expected). It's kind of like if you're a new resident showing up at the department holiday party and start demanding answers to questions about hospital policy. You might be more likely to learn what you want to know if you just listen for awhile first.

So, welcome to the forum, I believe you will find it helpful as you prepare for the application process over the next several months, and hopefully you will make valuable contributions in the future as well.

(*these threads, for example: https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/dos-applying-allopathic-2015-2016.1162709/
https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/do-student-what-programs-to-apply-to-have-a-shot-at.1131732/
https://forums.studentdoctor.net/th...riendly-psychiatry-residency-programs.955375/)

... so Im probably still harboring some residual frustration towards older antagonistic attendings as a result of that experience....

Hey, who are you calling old and antagonistic?

 

[postbacpremed87]

I do have to back up OldPsychDoc here. He has answered so many of my questions through threads and PMs. I should have paid him a retainer or something. This sub forum is probably the most helpful one on SDN. I've always had helpful replies.

 

[law14]

Thanks for the links. I wish y'all had just posted a polite "Welcome to psych! Here are some links where a similar topic has been discussed previously if you're interested" and kept things positive. I may not know the "netiquette" of sdn, but I know that it's not good manners where I come from to call someone "annoying," "neurotic," and "ridiculous" just for asking a question on a forum they stumbled upon which looked similar to their current situation. Bullying people who are new to your site and your profession is no way to make them feel welcome. I expect this from surgeons, but not psychiatrists . No hard feelings though, and thanks again for the links.

 

[Blitz2006]

I've done well in school and have above average Step scores and I am starting to get the, "That's what he is going into?".

So just show them the stats: https://www.aamc.org/services/eras/stats/359278/stats.html

and tell them you're entering the hottest specialty over the past 3 years. End of Discussion.

Trust me it works, I do it all the time.