Single vs Married

[rox]

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How do program directors look at a married or engaged applicant for residency? How badly would that affect one's chances?

 

[randomedstudent]

hmmm, it's difficult to answer this without more info. This would be specialty dependent, gender dependent, and program dependent. I guess in general I can't really see being married as a problem except in the most conservative of general surgery programs perhaps, esp. if you're female (they may assume you will be wanting to pop out a kid during residency whether or not this is the case). For a male, I really don't see how it could be viewed as a negative. If anything, it MIGHT be a positive for some programs that are more "family-friendly" in that they might feel you would fit in better if most other residents are married with kids.

Personally, I never understand why people ask this question - and it comes up multiple times each year. I mean what are you going to do, lie? Or hurry up and get married in case it might help you?

 

[Faebinder]

On one hand some will ask you are you married because they feel that if you are then you are more stable.

On the other hand some will ask because if you are then does your SO want to move with you where you are going and will that influence the decision.

Personally, I think the person asking the question does not know what to ask or is just bored.

 

[rox]

Thanks for your input. I am a male to start with. I'm specifically interested in general surgery programs.

Well, the feeling I have is that program directors might think of a married resident as someone simply who would be less commited to the program as compared to a single one due to his/her family commitments. I don't know how true that would be. I'd appreciate any comment to agree with/decline this point.

 

[LADoc00]

I thought marital status questions were prohibited by federal labor laws?? Someone check this.

 

[Winged Scapula]

In the "old days", it was true that an often reported comment by surgical PDs was that the "best resident is an unmarried resident". It probably goes without saying that they also thought the best resident was male.

The reasoning was that married residents, especially those with children, felt a pull AWAY from the hospital and might otherwise be distracted by family issues.

And while this may be true in many cases, I think most PDs don't really care either way these days. A happy resident is generally a good resident...so if you're married, and your spouse works, they might be interested in knowing that he/she has gainful employment opportunities in town, and if you're single with an SO, the same applies.

I generally was interested because I thought my program had room for both married and unmarried residents and also because if they did have an SO coming along, almost always (especially if the SO was female), what SHE thought about the area was important. Frankly, if you're applying to Cali programs and your SO is from Florida and very close to her family, I might wonder if you would be a good fit here...not because you're married but because the location is not ideal for your SO.

Bottom line is that its a) illegal to base matching decisions on marital status and b) I rarely ever heard someone mention it during ranking decisions except when the situation above arose (or the opposite..."his wife loves it here apparently"). I wouldn't worry about it...be honest and forget about it.

 

[Winged Scapula]

I thought marital status questions were prohibited by federal labor laws?? Someone check this.

They are apparently prohibited by federal labor law but given the confusion about whether residency constitutes a job or student status, I am unsure as to the rules in this situation.

Its probably illegal (it certainly is to the use the answer in determining match decisions) but most likely innocent in nature when asked.

 

[LADoc00]

They are apparently prohibited by federal labor law but given the confusion about whether residency constitutes a job or student status, I am unsure as to the rules in this situation.

Its probably illegal (it certainly is to the use the answer in determining match decisions) but most likely innocent in nature when asked.

residency is definitely a job as defined by federal AND state law, no idea how one could argue otherwise considering tons of other occupations have similar on job training arrangements. If a PD asks about marital status etc that is an illegal question.

 

[Winged Scapula]

residency is definitely a job as defined by federal AND state law, no idea how one could argue otherwise considering tons of other occupations have similar on job training arrangements. If a PD asks about marital status etc that is an illegal question.

Well, I think you only have to look at the evidence that some programs (ie, Mayo) have successfully argued that residents are students and that the salary is a stipend are therefore not required to have FICA withheld.

Anyway, its neither here nor there because I agree with you...its a real job and is probably an illegal question. My concern is that most faculty members probably don't know this, and aren't asking because they will use the information in some nefarious way but rather are simply interested in knowing more about the candidate sitting in front of them. The trouble is that we all know people who get their panties in a bunch about these sort of things and will go around telling applicants that program X is biased against/for married people because some clueless faculty member asked.

Signed,

a clueless interviewer who really meant no harm when she asked if you were married.

 

[rox]

Bottom line is that its a) illegal to base matching decisions on marital status and b) I rarely ever heard someone mention it during ranking decisions except when the situation above arose (or the opposite..."his wife loves it here apparently"). I wouldn't worry about it...be honest and forget about it.

I'll take that for granted..This shouldn't be an issue.
Thank you guys. I appreciate it.

 

[Faebinder]

I have been asked about my marital status on EVERY single interview... though not by every single interviewer. Funny eh?🙄

 

[yaah]

I agree with LADoc, I thought that it was inappropriate for programs to ask this question, if they are using it to evaluate candidacy. Same thing with religion, sexual orientation, etc. People probably ask it because they are trying to make conversation, I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that they are evaluating your answer intently.

 

[f_w]

Later, when you interview for real jobs, the question whether you are married and what your spouse does will be right up there with whether you are board certified or not.

One of the top reasons why physicians change jobs early on is that the spouse either can't find gainful employment in the area or just hates the hicktown they got dragged to.

Residency interviewers will frequently ask this question, but that is because they are amateurs in HR matters, not because they have an evil agenda.

 

[Faebinder]

Later, when you interview for real jobs, the question whether you are married and what your spouse does will be right up there with whether you are board certified or not.

One of the top reasons why physicians change jobs early on is that the spouse either can't find gainful employment in the area or just hates the hicktown they got dragged to.

Residency interviewers will frequently ask this question, but that is because they are amateurs in HR matters, not because they have an evil agenda.

Very true. We had an interview for a professor position and every was GREAT. The next day at the final dinner before he leaves back, his wife who came along with him simply stated, "Why are we still here? I don't want to be in this city." You can guess the rest.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Very true. We had an interview for a professor position and every was GREAT. The next day at the final dinner before he leaves back, his wife who came along with him simply stated, "Why are we still here? I don't want to be in this city." You can guess the rest.

She actually said that OUT LOUD at the table,where others could hear her?😱

 

[Faebinder]

She actually said that OUT LOUD at the table,where others could hear her?😱

Yup, and the response from the faculty's wife (who happened to be faculty as well) was sarcastic as well. The guy was embarrassed though.

 

[f_w]

LoL, I guess those two had 'the talk' that night....

(or maybe they should have talked it over before wasting everyones time for the interview trip)

 

[rox]

She probably didn't realize that she hates the town till she tried the dinner..one could conclude. 😀

 

[EUA]

I just ask about marital status if there is a) a ring AND b) an excruciating lull in the conversation OR if the candidate brings it up. Some interviewees just sit there like a lump on a log and it gets to the point where I will talk about the dump I took this morning just to pass the time. I seriously wouldn't have guessed that the question would ever be offensive.... hmm. I don't think it's more offensive than one of my standards: "What do you think your greatest challenge will be during residency?"

Interesting though. Maybe I'll back off the marriage and kids chit-chat with the candidates...?

 

[Faebinder]

I just ask about marital status if there is a) a ring AND b) an excruciating lull in the conversation OR if the candidate brings it up. Some interviewees just sit there like a lump on a log and it gets to the point where I will talk about the dump I took this morning just to pass the time. I seriously wouldn't have guessed that the question would ever be offensive.... hmm. I don't think it's more offensive than one of my standards: "What do you think your greatest challenge will be during residency?"

Interesting though. Maybe I'll back off the marriage and kids chit-chat with the candidates...?

What ever you do... for God's sake.... Don't ask about the hobbies. Who frigging has time for hobbies?

 

[NotAProgDirector]

Residency interviewers will frequently ask this question, but that is because they are amateurs in HR matters, not because they have an evil agenda.

Please don't jump to conclusions. Many of us have evil agendas that we are very proud of and have nurtured for years.

And, I believe it's time for a new avatar for me!

 

[Faebinder]

Please don't jump to conclusions. Many of us have evil agendas that we are very proud of and have nurtured for years.

And, I believe it's time for a new avatar for me!

Hahhahaahaahahha. "The darkside, joined, has aProgDirector."

I need to donate to be able to place an animated gif avatar.