so what was the percentile of the last shelf exams?

[iamhotok]

---

Members do not see this ad.

does any know the figures? thanks.

 

[geromine]

I attached the table for physio. National average is set at 70.

 

[Samoa]

I attached the table for physio. National average is set at 70.

Hey, I thought that was just for MY school. Are you saying that's the average of all the students taking it this year?

Edit: Oh, I get it now...you DO go to my school. Doh! Boy do I feel dumb.

 

[Bevo]

out of curiosity, where did you find that file?

 

[EctopicFetus]

Generally, all of the shelf exams are set to an average of 70 with a SD of around 8. That being said the national averages have been rising. For example, the average last yr for Path was around a 72.5 or a 73.5 (cant recall). I got that info from my Path prof who in turn got the info from NBME and posted it in on our private school site. If interested I might be able to find it and post it.

 

[Bevo]

I knew that the shelf average was always set to 70. But we've never been given the percentile with each score like this file gives.

Would be interesting, from a personal standpoint, to see how I've really done next to my american counterparts.

 

[Samoa]

I knew that the shelf average was always set to 70. But we've never been given the percentile with each score like this file gives.

If you have the average and standard deviation, that's all you really need. 1 SD (8 points away from the mean in either direction) means that you did better/worse than 84% of your fellow test takers across the country. 2 SD (16 points in either direction) means you did better/worse than 97.7% of other test takers. Although if the true average keeps going up, and they don't reset the norm, then it all pretty much means nothing.

 

[orthoman5000]

If you have the average and standard deviation, that's all you really need. 1 SD (8 points away from the mean in either direction) means that you did better/worse than 84% of your fellow test takers across the country. 2 SD (16 points in either direction) means you did better/worse than 97.7% of other test takers. Although if the true average keeps going up, and they don't reset the norm, then it all pretty much means nothing.

This doesn't always work because the curve is not perfectly bell shaped. Is it really the average going up, or the median? The average should stay at 70 since 70 is defined as the average. The median for each test varies though.

For an example on the biochemistry shelf this year a 70 was 38th percentile, while on the physiology shelf a 70 was 52nd percentile.

 

[Samoa]

This doesn't always work because the curve is not perfectly bell shaped. Is it really the average going up, or the median? The average should stay at 70 since 70 is defined as the average. The median for each test varies though.

For an example on the biochemistry shelf this year a 70 was 38th percentile, while on the physiology shelf a 70 was 52nd percentile.

If they re-normed the test every year, then a 70 would always be 50th percentile. So if you're correct, then they must not be doing that. And if they aren't doing that, then neither the scores nor the percentiles mean very much.

 

[orthoman5000]

Yeah I guess the averages could be rising if it's based on a data set from several years ago.

 

[Samoa]

Well, I've been doing some reading, and apparently the distribution IS gaussian, and they DO re-norm each year. So perhaps what's rising is the raw score. I can't explain how a 70 could correspond to 38th percentile, though, regardless of whether it's a scaled or raw score.

The only thing that makes sense to me based on my own scores is if my class's average raw score is about 60%, and if the curve was based on the numerical difference between that and the class average for our block exams. And I think I read somewhere that the national average for raw scores is 60-65%, but maybe that was for the USMLE.

Now I have a headache. Who came up with this cr@p? Let's hunt them down and make them write on the board a hundred times: "I will not torment medical students with unnecessarily complicated test scoring." Who's with me?

 

[geromine]

hey does anyone have the data on biochem, can you send it to me
they didnt give us the national biochem performance chart. What's mean? What's 99th percentile?
That chart was for our school's physio, stuff on top is just for our class but the chart itself applies to everyone that took the test.

Did anybody else feel that they totally bombed the biochem test and then they got a good grade or was it just me?

 

[Bevo]

every here always feels that way after biochem. But unfortunatly, our school doesn't give us anything like that. We just get our score. Dont know if its curved or raw or what.

 

[Samoa]

Depends on what you mean by "totally bombed." You, I suspect, mean "passed, instead of getting honors like I normally do". 😉

 

[iamhotok]

geromine, which school do you go to?

the class average is only 66? ross has an average of 65 each year.

and i find that it is hard to believe that only one percentile is below 52. that certainly won't be the case for all the caribbean med. schools.

 

[Samoa]

The reason for the low average is that the material taught in the physiology class here is not what the NBME tests. Our physiology class is completely hard core, but gives us very little practice interpreting lab tests and diagnosing problems. It's a great class, taught well, that gives us an excellent understanding of physiology, but it doesn't prepare us for the shelf.