St. George’s contract with NYC's HHC

[happypremed1]

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I just read about St. George's $100 million contract with NYC's HHC that allows their students to train at NYC's 11 public hospitals. Here's the link: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/05/nyregion/05grenada.html?pagewanted=all

This is disgusting. I can't believe I missed out on this…

So does this mean, TouroNY will have big problems in securing core rotations in Manhattan in the coming years? If Caribbean schools can establish solid rotations, would Caribbean med schools be good alternative to MD/DO schools?

 

[costales]

I just read about St. George's $100 million contract with NYC's HHC that allows their students to train at NYC's 11 public hospitals. Here's the link: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/05/nyregion/05grenada.html?pagewanted=all

This is disgusting. I can't believe I missed out on this…

So does this mean, TouroNY will have big problems in securing core rotations in Manhattan in the coming years? If Caribbean schools can establish solid rotations, would Caribbean med schools be good alternative to MD/DO schools?

You might want to look at this thread by DocEspana, who was a Touro student:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/new-york-resolution-on-carib-students-clinical-spots.811756/

 

[moto_za]

The articles 5 years old...

 

[DrEnderW]

That article is from 2008. The contract expires in early 2013 and Touro NY is attempting to secure HHC for their rotations. It would make sense since they are the med school in the Harlem area but who knows what will happen. Regardless, the school has rotations sites just across the water in NJ and in Staten Island.

 

[darklabel]

You might want to look at this thread by DocEspana, who was a Touro student:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/new-york-resolution-on-carib-students-clinical-spots.811756/

I tried reading it but wow, it basically became an IMG vs DO thread. Will never understand that justification besides the fact that IMGs only care about something as vain as the "MD" title (Even though it isn't a true MD title) instead of the DO title.

 

[hallowmann]

I just read about St. George's $100 million contract with NYC's HHC that allows their students to train at NYC's 11 public hospitals. Here's the link: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/05/nyregion/05grenada.html?pagewanted=all

This is disgusting. I can't believe I missed out on this…

So does this mean, TouroNY will have big problems in securing core rotations in Manhattan in the coming years? If Caribbean schools can establish solid rotations, would Caribbean med schools be good alternative to MD/DO schools?

What's so disgusting? SGU needs places to rotate its students at, and so it is paying a hospital system in need of money for rotation spots. Now, in an ideal world this wouldn't need to happen, but it seems like win-win for the HHC because they are getting money and at the same time getting a guaranteed supply of US-born physicians applying to and likely matching in their hospitals that are usually ignored by AMGs.

Now if you want to bring up an issue like how they sometimes cram tons of students into scarcely supervised services, that's something else, but them paying for rotations is no different than what many (if not most) DO schools do. Personally, I think its an inherent problem with the system that so many places have to pay for rotation sites, but can you really blame SGU for playing our game? I don't know, maybe you can blame the HHC for getting state money to train foreign students, but beyond that...

As far as Touro-NY being in trouble, I doubt it. The article is old, and honestly there are tons of hospital affiliates that Touro has. Maybe they won't all be in Manhattan, but they'll be nearby. That said, I hope their new Midtown campus has enough spots planned out.

SGU might be (or maybe I should say might have been) ok for people who just want to stay in NY/NJ, but everywhere outside of that region (and even in many residencies in that region) DOs have a much higher match success rate, and have more options with AOA residencies. On top of that, have you seen the SGU tuition and how expensive it is on those islands? Its like $30k/semester for tuition alone. That's double what I'm paying at a DO school within an hour drive of my immediate family. Thats just one of many reasons I (and pretty much everyone) would (and did) choose a DO school over SGU.

 

[user3]

Caribbean schools will go extinct soon, and DO schools will rise further in competitiveness.

 

[Mehd School]

If Caribbean schools can establish solid rotations, would Caribbean med schools be good alternative to MD/DO schools?

Unless there is a crazy boom in available GME spots (read: never), they will never be a "good" alternative. They will never be more than a calculated risk that can do good for some and do bad for many more.

 

[DrEnderW]

What's so disgusting? SGU needs places to rotate its students at, and so it is paying a hospital system in need of money for rotation spots. Now, in an ideal world this wouldn't need to happen, but it seems like win-win for the HHC because they are getting money and at the same time getting a guaranteed supply of US-born physicians applying to and likely matching in their hospitals that are usually ignored by AMGs.

Now if you want to bring up an issue like how they sometimes cram tons of students into scarcely supervised services, that's something else, but them paying for rotations is no different than what many (if not most) DO schools do. Personally, I think its an inherent problem with the system that so many places have to pay for rotation sites, but can you really blame SGU for playing our game? I don't know, maybe you can blame the HHC for getting state money to train foreign students, but beyond that...

As far as Touro-NY being in trouble, I doubt it. The article is old, and honestly there are tons of hospital affiliates that Touro has. Maybe they won't all be in Manhattan, but they'll be nearby. That said, I hope their new Midtown campus has enough spots planned out.

SGU might be (or maybe I should say might have been) ok for people who just want to stay in NY/NJ, but everywhere outside of that region (and even in many residencies in that region) DOs have a much higher match success rate, and have more options with AOA residencies. On top of that, have you seen the SGU tuition and how expensive it is on those islands? Its like $30k/semester for tuition alone. That's double what I'm paying at a DO school within an hour drive of my immediate family. Thats just one of many reasons I (and pretty much everyone) would (and did) choose a DO school over SGU.

I completely agree with what you are saying.

To answer your question, I think people are "disgusted" by the idea of SGU (and other Caribbean schools) buying rotation sites for multiple reasons. Grossly overinflated tuition, coupled with a failure rate notably higher that US schools, allows the excess of money that allows purchase of these sites. The purchase of rotations sites by Touro NY or NYIT (or MD schools in the area wanting to expand sites) at this scale would not be possible unless admissions standards were dropped so low and class sizes increased to such a level that a significant portion of students would not graduate. Furthermore, they are a foreign medical school populated by students (whether US born or not) that chose to leave the country to train. It is an interesting practice that they are allowed to displace US trained medical students when their representative schools want those rotations sites. Touro NY is making a strong push to be the medical school in Harlem and provides an astounding amount of community service to the area. It would be great if the school could have rotation sites in Harlem. With that being said, I understand your point that SGU's money is just as green and that's how the system is set up.

 

[costales]

Last year DeVry tried to send its AUC students to Texas. It asked Texas regulators for permission to negotiate deals with Texas hospitals. The request was met with fierce opposition from the eight Texas med schools, and the Texas legislature passed a law prohibiting foreign schools from operating in the state. (The law specifically forbids the state agency from granting them the necessary paperwork).

 

[hallowmann]

I completely agree with what you are saying.

To answer your question, I think people are "disgusted" by the idea of SGU (and other Caribbean schools) buying rotation sites for multiple reasons. Grossly overinflated tuition, coupled with a failure rate notably higher that US schools, allows the excess of money that allows purchase of these sites. The purchase of rotations sites by Touro NY or NYIT (or MD schools in the area wanting to expand sites) at this scale would not be possible unless admissions standards were dropped so low and class sizes increased to such a level that a significant portion of students would not graduate. Furthermore, they are a foreign medical school populated by students (whether US born or not) that chose to leave the country to train. It is an interesting practice that they are allowed to displace US trained medical students when their representative schools want those rotations sites. Touro NY is making a strong push to be the medical school in Harlem and provides an astounding amount of community service to the area. It would be great if the school could have rotation sites in Harlem. With that being said, I understand your point that SGU's money is just as green and that's how the system is set up.

I wish the system was a bit different. It would likely (hopefully...) bring down tuition if med schools didn't have to pay for rotations. But that's just the system we live in right now.

 

[Seth Joo]

I just read about St. George's $100 million contract with NYC's HHC that allows their students to train at NYC's 11 public hospitals. Here's the link: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/05/nyregion/05grenada.html?pagewanted=all

This is disgusting. I can't believe I missed out on this…

So does this mean, TouroNY will have big problems in securing core rotations in Manhattan in the coming years? If Caribbean schools can establish solid rotations, would Caribbean med schools be good alternative to MD/DO schools?

That's from five years ago, I would think going DO is definitely much better than going to a Caribbean school. Some other foreign schools it might be a different story. If you cannot rotate in NY, so what? There are 49 other states in the Union.

 

[NYEMMED]

Here is another old article from 2010 about NY medical schools banding together to end foreign medical student rotations

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/23/nyregion/23caribbean.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0