Starting Out/ Considering Career with Animals

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scott87

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I am 27 years old and since graduating high school I have work a slew of low paying, crappy, retail and food service job. So finally I decided to step down from full time at the grocery store and go back to school. I'm currently finishing up my first semester at community college. I've only taken two classes in general studies so far.

Around the same time I also started volunteer as a dog walker at an animal shelter. I've realized I enjoy doing this kind of work more than I have ever enjoyed anything I have done.

So now I am wondering what I can do with this information? It seems that 98% of careers with animals pay so poorly that it is hard to justify the years of school required to get them... Vet techs make about 30,000 and shelter workers make even less... Last year I made 32,000 working 6 days a week at grocery store and I still ran out of money and had to move back in with my mom... Then full fledged vets make about 80,000?

It's not that I want to get rich working with animals, I realize that is not possible, but I do want to be able to support myself with out going into crazy debt and having to live in the worst apartment available.

So my question is where should I start? Should I stick with my community college for gen eds or should I transfur to a vet tech school? I also need to make a living while I am in school...
 
scott87 said:
I am 27 years old and since graduating high school I have work a slew of low paying, crappy, retail and food service job. So finally I decided to step down from full time at the grocery store and go back to school. I'm currently finishing up my first semester at community college. I've only taken two classes in general studies so far.

Around the same time I also started volunteer as a dog walker at an animal shelter. I've realized I enjoy doing this kind of work more than I have ever enjoyed anything I have done.

So now I am wondering what I can do with this information? It seems that 98% of careers with animals pay so poorly that it is hard to justify the years of school required to get them... Vet techs make about 30,000 and shelter workers make even less... Last year I made 32,000 working 6 days a week at grocery store and I still ran out of money and had to move back in with my mom... Then full fledged vets make about 80,000?

It's not that I want to get rich working with animals, I realize that is not possible, but I do want to be able to support myself with out going into crazy debt and having to live in the worst apartment available.

So my question is where should I start? Should I stick with my community college for gen eds or should I transfur to a vet tech school? I also need to make a living while I am in school...
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I'm afraid if you go into vet med, the bold will most definitely happen. You can mitigate that by going to your IS school if you have one, but someone going out-of-state has to dish out $250,000-$300,000.. without interest. That's a lot of money, and it takes a long, long time to pay that back.

Vet med is a career that you really, really need to be passionate about in order to make it through, and the debt load knocks a few people back. As for salaries, someone out in the workforce can answer that a lot better than I can, but I think I heard that averages out of school is around $60,000?

If you are really interested in vet med as a career, have you thought about shadowing a vet locally? That way you could get a taste of what vet med is about, and they could answer questions that you had as well.

I'm not sure how to advise you school wise except that if you want to pursue vet med, than maybe you could take a few science classes (Bio, Chem, AnSci) and see how you like them.

Goodluck! :luck:
 
scott87 said:
It's not that I want to get rich working with animals, I realize that is not possible, but I do want to be able to support myself with out going into crazy debt and having to live in the worst apartment available.

.
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There is no such thing in vet med. You will go into crazy debt, have lots of loans and have to live paycheck to paycheck type of deal. This is true for both vet techs and veterinarians.
 
I was offered 45K back in February-ish (In that particular state, would be ~22K after taxes). For 6 days a week/4 nights on call, no production, pretty much practicing as a solo vet for weeks at a time. I turned it down, thinking I had plenty of time to find something else. Needless to say, I'm kicking myself now that graduation is 2 weeks away and I have nothing.

Moral of the story: Yes its a lot of debt, which didn't freak me out too much...until I realized there are so few jobs out there right now and so much competition. Maybe it will be better in 4 years, but who knows. The job situation is definitely something to be aware of and keep in mind if you are just starting on the path to vet school.
 
cowgirla said:
I was offered 45K back in February-ish (In that particular state, would be ~22K after taxes). For 6 days a week/4 nights on call, no production, pretty much practicing as a solo vet for weeks at a time. I turned it down, thinking I had plenty of time to find something else. Needless to say, I'm kicking myself now that graduation is 2 weeks away and I have nothing.

Moral of the story: Yes its a lot of debt, which didn't freak me out too much...until I realized there are so few jobs out there right now and so much competition. Maybe it will be better in 4 years, but who knows. The job situation is definitely something to be aware of and keep in mind if you are just starting on the path to vet school.
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That is for a Vet job or vet tech?

It seems it would take a lifetime to pay off your debt... So i guess you would just have to be okay with having that monthly payment forever. As long as I could afford to live in a decent place, pay the bills and have a little savings and modest budget for entertainment (pets, video games, movies, eating out) I'd be happy.
 
scott87 said:
It seems it would take a lifetime to pay off your debt... So i guess you would just have to be okay with having that monthly payment forever. As long as I could afford to live in a decent place, pay the bills and have a little savings and modest budget for entertainment (pets, video games, movies, eating out) I'd be happy.
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I would highly suggest that you start off by going and observing a veterinary practice first. See what it is that vets and vet techs really do.

As for how well you will be able to live off a vet salary... I can't really say. I can tell you that most vets I have spoken to who are recently out of school have more than 1 job. Some of them because they want to just get rid of the loans, some of them because they really need that 2nd job to even be able to make loan payments.
 
cowgirla said:
I was offered 45K back in February-ish (In that particular state, would be ~22K after taxes). For 6 days a week/4 nights on call, no production, pretty much practicing as a solo vet for weeks at a time. I turned it down, thinking I had plenty of time to find something else. Needless to say, I'm kicking myself now that graduation is 2 weeks away and I have nothing.
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Which state takes 51% of a 45k income in taxes????? You need a new tax preparer!
 
From where you stand right now, I would continue to take some gen ed classes and see if anything else sparks your interest. You can always volunteer with animals in your free time from another, better paying field.
 
If you know you're interested in working with animals and aren't sure what you'd like to do beyond that, I highly recommend this book: http://www.amazon.com/Careers-Anima...954&sr=8-2&keywords=careers+for+animal+lovers

It outlines dozens of different animal related careers, including what they involve, what kind of education is required, how to begin getting experience in those fields, etc. It's a quick read and includes a lot of different career paths, including some that I would never have thought of on my own. It was published in 2000 so any job prospects or salary information it gives will likely be a little outdated, but it's a good place to start and get ideas for fields you'd like to look into more.
 
Financial wise it's not great yeah. But there has to be some pros to working in vet med...

Shadowing a vet is a great idea, but most of the vets I shadowed loved their jobs and were happy in it regardless of the financials. One (small animal vet who owned her practice) was living pretty luxuriously and the other (large animal vet) was in no way living luxuriously but she was just happy and said what she is earning is enough for her. However, they graduated some years ago so it may be that things are getting worse for vets. Every time I shadowed I got so optimistic and happy about this career, but this forum says otherwise lol. And people in this forum know what they are talking about.

Isn't there anyone who can say "the debt is doable?"
I'm scared lol.
 
catnips said:
Isn't there anyone who can say "the debt is doable?"
I'm scared lol.
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You should be scared, haha. It's definitely doable but that depends on a lot of different factors: how much debt you'll have beforehand, how much you're going to be taking on, do you have savings or help from family for living expenses, what field do you want to pursue/job prospects, etc. I don't think saying everyone is going to be struggling to the same extent is a valid statement, but nearly everyone will have some hardship because of it.
 
that redhead said:
You should be scared, haha. It's definitely doable but that depends on a lot of different factors: how much debt you'll have beforehand, how much you're going to be taking on, do you have savings or help from family for living expenses, what field do you want to pursue/job prospects, etc. I don't think saying everyone is going to be struggling to the same extent is a valid statement, but nearly everyone will have some hardship because of it.
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That's way better than "you will always struggle"! 🙂 I will remain scared though haha. Still can't seem to give up on this field, like a lot of us here.
 
The debt is scary but most people in any professional school will come out with significant debt. Students at top tier law schools are easily paying $45k a year, and trust me, they are not easily finding jobs. The ABA actually released a statement a couple years back telling people to not attend law school because there were no jobs. I think it's important to make the decision about school with your eyes wide open when it comes to the amount of money it takes, but it seems like everyone is hopelessly pessimistic. The vets around my house drive nice cars and live in a desirable neighborhood. None of them are struggling to keep their power on. It also does depend on what you want to do. For example, if you want to do shelter medicine, your pay will be less, so take that into consideration. Obviously go to your IS if possible, but if you have to go OOS, then you're just gonna have to make peace with having a large amount of debt. Sorry, veered a little off topic.
 
I spent a lot of time in shelters before and during school, and applied to some shelter jobs as well as private practice jobs after school, and can pretty confidently say that at least in Pennsylvania, there is no pay difference between shelter and private practice.
 
I would say I have a nice lifestyle but I paid off all of my debt within 8 years of graduating and have been debt free for 8 years. If I still had the debt I would be doing ok but as you get older you want to do more than just ok.-you want to save for retirement, take an occasional vacation, buy a house. I don't have children and do not plan to have children but I can't imagine trying to raise a family on as much debt as most students have these days.
 
TXvet said:
I would say I have a nice lifestyle but I paid off all of my debt within 8 years of graduating and have been debt free for 8 years. If I still had the debt I would be doing ok but as you get older you want to do more than just ok.-you want to save for retirement, take an occasional vacation, buy a house. I don't have children and do not plan to have children but I can't imagine trying to raise a family on as much debt as most students have these days.
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If I may ask, how much debt did you have coming out? It sounds like you graduated nearly 20 years ago, and while starting salaries were lower then, I imagine debt load was too. Honestly not trying to be confrontational--just looking for some perspective.

Also, I'm curious as someone attending A&M (assuming you're an alum) who should graduate with under $150K before interest, and that includes graduate debt.

Thanks!
 
remi4301 said:
Students at top tier law schools are easily paying $45k a year, and trust me, they are not easily finding jobs. The ABA actually released a statement a couple years back telling people to not attend law school because there were no jobs.
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That's really the difference though: their governing organization recognized that there was a problem and publicly acknowledged it, ours continues to deny or sugarcoat the problem, our schools continue to graduate more and more vets every year, and many vets and pre-vets are still being told that there's a shortage of vets, despite the scarcity of jobs. If being pessimistic means that everyone pays attention and considers their options, I don't think that's a bad thing.
 
epivetlove said:
Also, I'm curious as someone attending A&M (assuming you're an alum) who should graduate with under $150K before interest, and that includes graduate debt.

Thanks!
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That amount is doable as long as you have a decent job (particularly if there is a second household income) because you won't really need to take out much plus loans. The serious doom and gloom mostly applies to people who go to schools with higher COA who have to do it all in loans. Once you get to the point where an average vet salary allows you to barely cover monthly interest payments, that's when it gets really ugly. The higher the loans, the more interest you have just from the volume of the principal, AND the higher interest from plus loans, and a ton capitalizing at repayment... And without being able to pay down the principal (or worse, not even touching it), you'll have a huge tax bill at the end. This is still assuming that the job market doesn't get worse than it is now... And it's hard right now.
 
BlackDog17 said:
That's really the difference though: their governing organization recognized that there was a problem and publicly acknowledged it, ours continues to deny or sugarcoat the problem, our schools continue to graduate more and more vets every year, and many vets and pre-vets are still being told that there's a shortage of vets, despite the scarcity of jobs. If being pessimistic means that everyone pays attention and considers their options, I don't think that's a bad thing.
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That and giving an example of people making even stupider career decisions isn't really a case builder for ours...
 
catnips said:
Isn't there anyone who can say "the debt is doable?"
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Yeah...

In state tuition at $18k a year...

A SO taking care of all living expenses so that it really is just $18k a semester...

No undergraduate debt...

Pretty sure a change in any of these three would shift the equation a bit.
 
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A few vet students I know (who are attending OOS schools) have seen financial advisers and have "10 year plans" to have 100% of their debt paid off. I'm not sure if that's actually doable or not, as I haven't needed to heavily look into it myself yet. From what I understand, most debt is manageable assuming you make wise decisions and live frugally for a while. No, you can't take that vacation or get a new car...YET. Having $300,000 in debt is suffocating, but that's a very extreme case. The average salary for a vet seems to be hovering around $60k. Certainly not something to sniff at, but there are careers with less education/debt that get paid significantly more. Keep in mind that seems to be the average for small animal practice, and can vary. Other positions for vets can make more/less, but you are looking at specializing and increased job competition.

If I ever get accepted, I intend on spending my summers working full time. I want to be able to make a dent in my loans ASAP. Perhaps even use my summer paychecks to cover a chunk of my room and board during the school year. The last thing I want to do it use my loan money to cover every last expense I have if it's not necessary.
 
Minnerbelle said:
That amount is doable as long as you have a decent job (particularly if there is a second household income) because you won't really need to take out much plus loans. The serious doom and gloom mostly applies to people who go to schools with higher COA who have to do it all in loans. Once you get to the point where an average vet salary allows you to barely cover monthly interest payments, that's when it gets really ugly. The higher the loans, the more interest you have just from the volume of the principal, AND the higher interest from plus loans, and a ton capitalizing at repayment... And without being able to pay down the principal (or worse, not even touching it), you'll have a huge tax bill at the end. This is still assuming that the job market doesn't get worse than it is now... And it's hard right now.
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Thank you for the input. I'm currently interested in the government sector (public health). Job prospects are good for DVM + MPH holders, but as you've mentioned...who knows what it'll be like in 4 years when I graduate. :/ I will also probably be the sole breadwinner, 'cause ain't no one going to marry me willingly, lol. But that probably also means no kids, which I'm cool with.

twelvetigers said:
Yeah...

In state tuition at $18k a semester...
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Don't you mean "per year?" I thought OKState was one of the more affordable schools?
 
BlackDog17 said:
That's really the difference though: their governing organization recognized that there was a problem and publicly acknowledged it, ours continues to deny or sugarcoat the problem, our schools continue to graduate more and more vets every year, and many vets and pre-vets are still being told that there's a shortage of vets, despite the scarcity of jobs. If being pessimistic means that everyone pays attention and considers their options, I don't think that's a bad thing.
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The funny thing is, I think attendance actually increased. But, yes, I agree, misleading pre vets to think there are lots of jobs just waiting for them to graduate isn't doing anyone any good. Something needs to be addressed. In my opinion, I feel there is a difference in pessimism and realism. But maybe I'm just inferring incorrectly and reading everyone's realism as pessimism, I dunno.
 
bunnity said:
I spent a lot of time in shelters before and during school, and applied to some shelter jobs as well as private practice jobs after school, and can pretty confidently say that at least in Pennsylvania, there is no pay difference between shelter and private practice.
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That's awesome. Around where I live, the shelter vets are usually just part time because they have to work in private practice in order the pay the bills. They definitely don't get paid anywhere close to the same amount.
 
pinkpuppy9 said:
A few vet students I know (who are attending OOS schools) have seen financial advisers and have "10 year plans" to have 100% of their debt paid off. I'm not sure if that's actually doable or not, as I haven't needed to heavily look into it myself yet. From what I understand, most debt is manageable assuming you make wise decisions and live frugally for a while. No, you can't take that vacation or get a new car...YET. Having $300,000 in debt is suffocating, but that's a very extreme case. The average salary for a vet seems to be hovering around $60k. Certainly not something to sniff at, but there are careers with less education/debt that get paid significantly more. Keep in mind that seems to be the average for small animal practice, and can vary. Other positions for vets can make more/less, but you are looking at specializing and increased job competition.

If I ever get accepted, I intend on spending my summers working full time. I want to be able to make a dent in my loans ASAP. Perhaps even use my summer paychecks to cover a chunk of my room and board during the school year. The last thing I want to do it use my loan money to cover every last expense I have if it's not necessary.
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This is full of various issues. First, even in state students have a high average loan burden - typically around $150k. 2nd - having a 10 year plan requires students to not be on ibr or paye. A monthly payment at standard avg loans is about $1500 post tax dollars a month. If they are relying on payment plans like paye, then they will have a high tax burden at the end of 20 years. If the government continues debt relief. And they are still students without jobs or any idea of what their income will be. It's great to have a plan but even the best plans may not succeed
 
pinkpuppy9 said:
A few vet students I know (who are attending OOS schools) have seen financial advisers and have "10 year plans" to have 100% of their debt paid off.
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Well yeah... But just be careful extrapolating things like that without knowing the person's full financial situation and making sure that you're in a comparable position. If yes, then great. You may not become someone who seriously regrets their decision to go to vet school just purely due to financial struggles. If not, you may be sad later.


pinkpuppy9 said:
Having $300,000 in debt is suffocating, but that's a very extreme case.
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It might be extreme to you, but there are like 20 schools whose current OOS (and some IS) COA is >250,000... Which I'm sure by the time you go into repayment will be >$300k. Extreme? Maybe, but it's not uncommon. If it doesn't apply to you, great. But it's reality for a lot of people. And if I had to put a bet on it, I think it will be reality for more and more people in the near future.
 
ImageUploadedBySDN Mobile1398785503.322187.jpg


Part of the problem right here...this is what you get in google when you type how much does a veterinarian make?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN Mobile
 
kenggy said:
View attachment 180782

Part of the problem right here...this is what you get in google when you type how much does a veterinarian make?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN Mobile
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That may actually be the true average salary (I don't know, I don't have numbers handy to confirm or deny it, but maybe someone does). But you have to remember that "average" means all vets, no matter how long they've been working or what area of specialty they're in. The problem isn't really the average salary, it's the starting salary for new grads. According to the AVMA's website (https://www.avma.org/news/pressroom...see-drop-in-job-offers-starting-salaries.aspx) in 2012: "The average starting salary for all students accepting employment was $45,575, down 3 percent from $46,971 in 2011." That's not enough to begin paying off more than the interest on many larger student loan burdens, and therein lies the problem.
 
remi4301 said:
In my opinion, I feel there is a difference in pessimism and realism. But maybe I'm just inferring incorrectly and reading everyone's realism as pessimism, I dunno.
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There is a difference between pessimism and realism. And there's also optimism and burying your head in the sand.

The only optimism I'm hearing are coming out of people who haven't taken out the loans yet, who haven't been left hung out to dry in the job market, and/or seem to have select hearing. You cant compare how things were for older vets and today's or even more so future graduates, because the profession has changed. Even among our cohorts, of course some people will be fine. Hell, my world is sunshine and roses. I should be able to pay back my loans without a problem as long as I don't become unemployed. But that doesn't make things okay. That doesn't mean everyone else will be okay. Notice how the current students who say they will be okay add on the caveat that they were lucky.

The problem is that there are a lot of people now with a crushing debt burden. Even at the average debt level, things aren't easy. To top it off, the job market sucks. Average debt without a decent income is non bueno. You have people in the thick of it telling you about their struggles. It's about as real as it gets. You can't just take into consideration just the success stories (or even worse, success hypothetical stories). Sure, consider them, but don't disregard the stories you don't like and assume they don't pertain to you. No one is saying life will suck for all future veterinarians. But it's true that for more and more veterinarians now, life is starting to really suck and a lot of it is financially motivated. It's sad, but that's reality. I don't call myself pessimistic just because I cry when something is actually sad.
 
Just saying. Like I said, I didn't look into it myself. Just a first year at an OOS school is able to do a 10 year plan on 100% loans. Goal of my post was to show the OP that if he/she decides to go down this road, planning can be a life-saver. I never claimed to know the full details of anyone's financial situations.

Minnerbelle is so right in saying older vet generations cannot be compared to today's. My boss/professors graduated vet school WITH NO DEBT. They worked part time and paid their tuition out of pocket. Same with my parents and their undergrad (something a lot of us probably know very well already).
 
kenggy said:
View attachment 180782

Part of the problem right here...this is what you get in google when you type how much does a veterinarian make?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN Mobile
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We are talking about average starting pay, not average overall. Because you start work and you also start dem loan repayments. You may make $100k fifteen years later but that doesn't help you out when you are a new grad.
 
pinkpuppy9 said:
Just saying. Like I said, I didn't look into it myself. Just a first year at an OOS school is able to do a 10 year plan on 100% loans.
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I understand wanting to plan ahead and come up with something like this. But there is absolutely no way that you can come up with a set in stone 10 year plan while you are still in vet school. For one really simple reason: You have zero idea how much money you will be making when you graduate. You have zero idea how much take home income you will have. You have zero idea how much you will be paying in rent/utilities/car/gas/etc when you graduate. Sure you can make estimates, but you should be well prepared that any type of plan you may develop while in vet school could easily need to be completely re-done.
 
DVMDream said:
I understand wanting to plan ahead and come up with something like this. But there is absolutely no way that you can come up with a set in stone 10 year plan while you are still in vet school. For one really simple reason: You have zero idea how much money you will be making when you graduate. You have zero idea how much take home income you will have. You have zero idea how much you will be paying in rent/utilities/car/gas/etc when you graduate. Sure you can make estimates, but you should be well prepared that any type of plan you may develop while in vet school could easily need to be completely re-done.
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Very true. I'm assuming this student's plan was based on actually having a job out of school :luck:
 
Minnerbelle said:
Well yeah... But just be careful extrapolating things like that without knowing the person's full financial situation and making sure that you're in a comparable position. If yes, then great. You may not become someone who seriously regrets their decision to go to vet school just purely due to financial struggles. If not, you may be sad later.



It might be extreme to you, but there are like 20 schools whose current OOS (and some IS) COA is >250,000... Which I'm sure by the time you go into repayment will be >$300k. Extreme? Maybe, but it's not uncommon. If it doesn't apply to you, great. But it's reality for a lot of people. And if I had to put a bet on it, I think it will be reality for more and more people in the near future.
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Ha... my tuition alone will be >250,00 by the time I graduate. I'm lucky and have superstar parents paying for my cost of living at the moment. I'd probably be living off of ramen and eggs for the rest of my life if they didn't.
 
dovelover said:
Ha... my tuition alone will be >250,00 by the time I graduate. I'm lucky and have superstar parents paying for my cost of living at the moment. I'd probably be living off of ramen and eggs for the rest of my life if they didn't.
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My situation is exactly the same. In fact I just went to UMN's website to look up their yearly tuition . . . totally did not realize you guys pay that much.
 
pinkpuppy9 said:
Just saying. Like I said, I didn't look into it myself. Just a first year at an OOS school is able to do a 10 year plan on 100% loans. Goal of my post was to show the OP that if he/she decides to go down this road, planning can be a life-saver. I never claimed to know the full details of anyone's financial situations.
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this implies that WE didn't plan. I can assure you that was not the case. even with planning, life happens, economies change and job markets and cost of living fluctuate
 
pinkpuppy9 said:
Just a first year at an OOS school is able to do a 10 year plan on 100% loans.
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I didn't realize you were talking about a first year student. Like others have said, it's impossible to figure out whether it's doable or not until you secure a job. That determines your salary, your cost of living, your commute, your benefits (or lack thereof and thus extra things in your budget), etc... But for the sake of argument, let's assume a modest OOS loan of $200,000. On a 10 year plan, that is $2800 per month. If you are one of the lucky peeps who lands a good job with a starting salary of 70,000, your monthly take home income is around $4000. That's $1200 a month to live on including commute, maintaining car/auto insurance, rent, groceries, utilities, and anything that your benefits package lacks (disability insurance, part or all of health/dental insurance, association dues, malpractice, retirement fund, CE). It would be great if every job offered full benefits, but that's not reality. Now that's tight, even in a fairly low cost of living area. It would be really rough in a high cost of living area. Now make the loan bigger, or your starting salary smaller. It gets pretty puke worthy real fast.

Dudes, just gas for me will be $300 per month for my commute. My budget totaled up WITHOUT rent, utilities, or groceries is $975/month... And the only luxury item in there is $50/month for my cell phone bill. This does not include car payments because my car's been paid off already. If you were to have asked me 3 years ago what my bills would be, I would not have expected that. I could not have come up with that number even 3 months ago. I literally needed my contract and google maps to figure that one out.
 
Minnerbelle said:
I didn't realize you were talking about a first year student. Like others have said, it's impossible to figure out whether it's doable or not until you secure a job. That determines your salary, your cost of living, your commute, your benefits (or lack thereof and thus extra things in your budget), etc... But for the sake of argument, let's assume a modest OOS loan of $200,000. On a 10 year plan, that is $2800 per month. If you are one of the lucky peeps who lands a good job with a starting salary of 70,000, your monthly take home income is around $4000. That's $1200 a month to live on including commute, maintaining car/auto insurance, rent, groceries, utilities, and anything that your benefits package lacks (disability insurance, part or all of health/dental insurance, association dues, malpractice, retirement fund, CE). It would be great if every job offered full benefits, but that's not reality. Now that's tight, even in a fairly low cost of living area. It would be really rough in a high cost of living area. Now make the loan bigger, or your starting salary smaller. It gets pretty puke worthy real fast.

Dudes, just gas for me will be $300 per month for my commute. My budget totaled up WITHOUT rent, utilities, or groceries is $975/month... And the only luxury item in there is $50/month for my cell phone bill. This does not include car payments because my car's been paid off already. If you were to have asked me 3 years ago what my bills would be, I would not have expected that. I could not have come up with that number even 3 months ago. I literally needed my contract and google maps to figure that one out.
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this
 
twelvetigers said:
We are talking about average starting pay, not average overall. Because you start work and you also start dem loan repayments. You may make $100k fifteen years later but that doesn't help you out when you are a new grad.
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Yes you're right, I'm saying that people interested in the career or just the general public may take this at face value instead of being realistic as you and others have stated. This is an average that includes all the various jobs and years of experience as a vet but others may not consider that...thus a problem with perception.


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Minnerbelle said:
I didn't realize you were talking about a first year student. Like others have said, it's impossible to figure out whether it's doable or not until you secure a job. That determines your salary, your cost of living, your commute, your benefits (or lack thereof and thus extra things in your budget), etc... But for the sake of argument, let's assume a modest OOS loan of $200,000. On a 10 year plan, that is $2800 per month. If you are one of the lucky peeps who lands a good job with a starting salary of 70,000, your monthly take home income is around $4000. That's $1200 a month to live on including commute, maintaining car/auto insurance, rent, groceries, utilities, and anything that your benefits package lacks (disability insurance, part or all of health/dental insurance, association dues, malpractice, retirement fund, CE). It would be great if every job offered full benefits, but that's not reality. Now that's tight, even in a fairly low cost of living area. It would be really rough in a high cost of living area. Now make the loan bigger, or your starting salary smaller. It gets pretty puke worthy real fast.

Dudes, just gas for me will be $300 per month for my commute. My budget totaled up WITHOUT rent, utilities, or groceries is $975/month... And the only luxury item in there is $50/month for my cell phone bill. This does not include car payments because my car's been paid off already. If you were to have asked me 3 years ago what my bills would be, I would not have expected that. I could not have come up with that number even 3 months ago. I literally needed my contract and google maps to figure that one out.
Click to expand...
This made me take a look at my bills and think about whether I could live off of $1200 a month. I really have no concept of how much health insurance, dues, retirement funds, etc. would cost out there in the real world, but in rough estimation, I think to live on $1200 a month with having to pay for insurance, given how much I currently pay in bills/groceries/gas, I would have to squeeze myself into a house with 4+ roommates in order to be able to attempt to make rent. Not so sure I'd want to be doing that once I'm a vet. Heck, I don't even do that now. And this is considering cost of living is fairly reasonable here. AND I have a short commute and I'm pretty thrifty with my utilities. I'd never ever be able to buy anything other than groceries and very basic personal care items. No new clothes, no impulse purchases for the cat, no books or movies. Would never be able to afford to do anything fun. Probably wouldn't be able to afford to run the air conditioner either. And that doesn't count expenses I pay once or twice a year like car registration and insurance and renters insurance... and probably no room to save for retirement. Not sure getting your loans paid off in 10 years is worth all that. And oops, I totally forgot about the cost of all my prescriptions meds, which probably add up to at least $100 a month with decent insurance. So basically, I couldn't even live off of $1200 a month unless my various insurances were covered by my job, no matter how thrifty I was. Gosh, that's depressing.
 
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