SullivanCotter

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Masttt91

Masttt91

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Does anyone have any recent data for surgical and nonsurgical pods from the Sullivancotter survey. I’m negotiating a contract and would like to compare their data since they use Sullivancotter.
 
The offers above 200k so it’s not the worst. I would just really like to know how far off I am from the data they use.
 
Masttt91 said:
The offers above 200k so it’s not the worst. I would just really like to know how far off I am from the data they use.
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Well since they are using not accurate to the market numbers then who cares. What are you willing to accept?
 
Are we allowed to post any MGMA data? I have 2024 data (based on stats from 2023).
 
Enjoy
MGMA Podiatry.jpg
 
Hybrocure said:
Wait I thought 120k was supposed to be competitive
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It totally is.
You have to take in the big picture... possible bonus after 500k collections (if you do enough grafts), Amazon holiday gift card, logo beanie with associate mill emblem, and possible raise or possible talk of "partnership" after 3-5 years. 🙂
 
Does MGMA include sum of benefits in their total compensation number? So the salary is less but with benefits thats what it adds to?

I thought thats how they do it. But im open to being wrong on that.
 
DYK343 said:
Does MGMA include sum of benefits in their total compensation number? So the salary is less but with benefits thats what it adds to?

I thought thats how they do it. But im open to being wrong on that.
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No, MGMA doesn't include benefits... it says that on their website and a few thread on here. (basically too hard to quantify benefits, they explain it in TCC section)

MGMA and podiatrists is like talking about NBA salaries for NCAA tourney college players... maybe 10% of us get a job that'll use MGMA, lol.
 
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This is why you get foot & ankle certification
 
MortonExtension said:
Until it’s not. Eventually will be saturated too I feel
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Anyone can open up anywhere, true, but there's only so many facilities in rural areas which means further travel or less access to specialists. A lot of patients I see don't wanna drive to the "big" city 20-30 minutes away. Less facilities also means less competition from outside hospitals who may have interest in hiring a pod(s). The large issue PP faces is insurance paneling. It's the reason a prior pod left the area that I now service through the hospital. I ran into it early on where a large payor said there was enough access to podiatry in the area so we consistently had to single case agreement for the fracture and infection cases that ended up here. Rural isn't perfect and is heavily dependent on how the hospital is run. We're very profitable because we have a great community that values us existing. Can't be said for all rural facilities.
 
Rural areas also appreciate you much more. No one cares about you in big cities where there are 10 more pods just down the road. Also Ortho F/A hates us but you likely won’t find one in rural areas.
 
MortonExtension said:
Until it’s not. Eventually will be saturated too I feel
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It is getting there. It happens fast.

20 years ago, MSG ortho jobs were easy to create cold calling.
Hospital jobs were there - even in cities (some not open to hiring DPM, though).
VA and IHS jobs were limited... and not too desired for pods.
Pod group jobs doing most of their surgery and get ABFAS fast were easy to find (a lot of minimal/non-op DPMs).

15 yrs ago (when I was in training), MSG ortho jobs were pretty easy to create cold calling.
Hospital jobs were tougher... most pods went out to suburbs or rural-ish (some not open to hiring DPM, though).
VA and IHS jobs paid low, not too desired for pods.
Pod group jobs doing most of their surgery were still fairly easy to find (a lot of minimal/non-op DPMs).

10 years ago, MSG ortho jobs were getting fairly difficult to create cold calling.
Hospital jobs were scarce in the city... DPMs going to rural (some still not open to hiring DPM, though).
VA and IHS jobs paid a bit more (parity), suddenly fairly desired for pods... more and more VAs got a pod or added more.
Pod group jobs doing most of their surgery were fewer and fewer (fewer minimal/non-op DPMs).

5 years ago, fellowships became more normal to try to "get an edge" in the saturated job market.
MSG ortho jobs were rough to create cold calling.
Hospital jobs were VERY tough to find, pretty hard even for true rural/CAQ type (some not open to hiring DPM, though).
VA and IHS jobs paid more, highly desired for pods.
Pod group jobs doing most of their surgery were fairly hard to find (a lot DPMs in the groups all did own surgery).

...it sadly doesn't take a wizard to know how things are now (MSG, rural/CAQ hospital... even VA/IHS jobs fairly hard... city/urban/suburb hospital almost impossible)... or how it will probably be in 5 or 10 more years. . It helps to be "flexible [desperate?] on location," but even that's no guarantee anymore. We just have waaay too many "foot and ankle surgeon" supply. Get your fishing boots out. It's flooded. 🎣🐟🎣
 
Thank you @MicroPod! That definitely helps. @Retrograde_Nail do you have any guesses how far off SullivanCotter is from MGMA? Based off MGMA I should be making 290k-300 🤷‍♂️
 
Masttt91 said:
Thank you @MicroPod! That definitely helps. @Retrograde_Nail do you have any guesses how far off SullivanCotter is from MGMA? Based off MGMA I should be making 290k-300 🤷‍♂️
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20 percent easy.

And remember MGMA is not your base salary that's talking compensation so they're assuming that you are bonusing. So you don't say oh this is what I should be making. Production matters. When determining the contract it's trying to figure out a balance of the salary and production. Sometimes it makes sense to bet on yourself and have them be uneven sometimes people want more stability.

And again remember very small sample size because so few podiatrists are employed in this type of RVU model. But if you're saying 50th percent $350,000, the RVU value obviously matters but it comes out to saying okay the average person is doing 7,000 RVUs at $50 per.
 
Here are some general numbers

20th 5400 RVU $285k
50th 6700 RVU $330k
80th 8500 RVU $400k
 
PeaJay said:
Here are some general numbers

20th 5400 RVU $285k
50th 6700 RVU $330k
80th 8500 RVU $400k
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That implies 52, 49 and 47 per RVU....
 
PeaJay said:
Pays less to be more productive?
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Some hospital systems we worked through in residency do this. $/RVU increases from one level to another but then drops off. For example, 5-7k would be $51/rvu, 7-10k would be $54/rvu but over 10k would be less than $51. Not sure if it was hospital metrics on time spent with patients or they just didn't want you getting too much "bonus".
 
Bluecollarmed said:
Some hospital systems we worked through in residency do this. $/RVU increases from one level to another but then drops off. For example, 5-7k would be $51/rvu, 7-10k would be $54/rvu but over 10k would be less than $51. Not sure if it was hospital metrics on time spent with patients or they just didn't want you getting too much "bonus".
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Yeah they should do that. Protect the doctor from themselves. At least if done in theory to prevent burnout
 
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