Summer Research Program vs research at university

[dichloromethane]

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What are your thoughts on 10-week summer research program vs participating in research at your home university?

I posted a thread earlier deciding whether to do research or take summer classes. I decided research, but now I'm faced with another problem.


I'm all about research. This is something I really want to do. It's not to pad my app. I may even continue research in med school.

Should I go for the 10 week research program? Or should I just do research in a lab over the summer at my home uni?

Benefits to research program:
1. get to meet a bunch of cool people from across the country with similar interests - network
2. pretty decent stipend - better than nothing
3. chance to live on another school's campus(might be a plus depending where i get accepted)
4. programs are selective, so there maybe a + for the application
5. guarantee to present a poster
6. some programs have lunch-and-learns and other workshop classes
7. depending where i do research - might be a 1up if i apply to the school

Benefits for research at home university:
1. Start building friendship with PI for a potential letter
2. long term research(although the summer research program would probably let me break into research anyway)
3. possibly for credit
4. I get to shadow, volunteer, do other things while doing research, see friends.


I'm torn. What will look better? Personally, I see pros and cons of either. The only way I can decide is from the viewpoint of medical school.

Thoughts?

 

[Nymphicus]

Research at your home institution is normally much easier to continue with after the summer period.

That's the biggest downside of doing a summer program, in my opinion.

 

[darkjedi]

I'm a big fan of exploring new places and meeting new people, so I probably would've done the summer research program.

I do agree that it will be easier to continue something more significant at your home institution, as 10 weeks is a very limited amount of time to produce something of significant value.

Can't you do some research at your home institution during your school year after doing this program?

 

[dichloromethane]

I'm a big fan of exploring new places and meeting new people, so I probably would've done the summer research program.

I do agree that it will be easier to continue something more significant at your home institution, as 10 weeks is a very limited amount of time to produce something of significant value.

Can't you do some research at your home institution during your school year after doing this program?

Sure I can. I'm just trying to decide for the summer. I do think that participating in research at a top school would look more impressive than my home school(average top 50 flagship university)

Plus I would love to spend the summer at Stanford, UCSF, or Upenn 😍


On the other hand..if I stay home and do research - not only will I build ties and be able to continue that research, but I can also take a summer class or two(boosting my GPA), volunteer, and shadow.

 

[Narmerguy]

I'm a supporter of doing research at your home institution because you can work on a project long term. Summer gives you a unique block of time where you can research full time, and being able to do that multiple times and/or throughout the semesters allows you to accomplish really cool projects. I also agree, you develop a very strong relationship with your PI which will make for a great letter.

I'm actually curious if adcoms are even aware of how difficult it is to get some of the summer research programs and if it would actually give your application a boost over a student that just researched at their home institution.

 

[wizedw]

Is it possible for you to do both. My research at my home institution turned into a summer fellowship with the same PI (continued the same project, but I got the perks of the summer program aka $, presentation experience, fancy extra activity)

 

[darkjedi]

Sure I can. I'm just trying to decide for the summer. I do think that participating in research at a top school would look more impressive than my home school(average top 50 flagship university)

Plus I would love to spend the summer at Stanford, UCSF, or Upenn 😍


On the other hand..if I stay home and do research - not only will I build ties and be able to continue that research, but I can also take a summer class or two(boosting my GPA), volunteer, and shadow.

My point was that if I were you I would try to do a summer research program and then segway into a research project while you're studying at home. You can even potentially leverage your summer research to 'prove your worth' to PI's that may be hesitant to take on undergrads. You can very easily produce significant research even while studying in school.

Spending a summer at another institution also gives you an opportunity to get another recommendation letter, which may or may not help at that institution if you apply to them.

 

[dichloromethane]

My point was that if I were you I would try to do a summer research program and then segway into a research project while you're studying at home. You can even potentially leverage your summer research to 'prove your worth' to PI's that may be hesitant to take on undergrads. You can very easily produce significant research even while studying in school.

Spending a summer at another institution also gives you an opportunity to get another recommendation letter, which may or may not help at that institution if you apply to them.

I can do that too, and I will.

 

[OCDOCDOCD]

Definitely do research at your home institution year round if you can. There are many advantages to home institution research over SURFs:

- You get to work on a project for the long term instead of coming in for 10 weeks, getting a piece of a project done, and then never coming back. This is far more impressive since it shows you can stick with something, you get experience with research at all stages, and if things work out you may even get a conference presentation or paper out of it, or at least a thesis.

-You'll (hopefully) get a much better LOR from your PI since they'll have known you for years, not weeks. Adcoms generally want letters from people who have known you for at least a year.

-It's a lot easier to get into a lab at your home institution than a SURF.


Also keep in mind that the following are not advantages of SURFs:


- "Competitiveness". Yes, SURFs are all very competitive. No one cares. It'll be obvious from your AMCAS application how qualified you were at that point in time, thus the SURF is redundant if that's your goal. On top of that, the selectivity of the programs is outweighed by the superficial exposure to research you'll get.

- "You'll get to be in multiple labs (if you do multiple SURFs)". Again, no one cares. Depth is better than breadth in this case.

- "You'll make connections". No you won't, at least not any connections that matter.

- "Doing a SURF at an institution makes it easier to get accepted there". This is sometimes true if you're interested in grad school (St. Andrews, for example, offers automatic admission to their graduate program if your lab liked you enough). But for med school it doesn't matter. The PI you study under isn't going to be pulling any strings for you. Often PIs don't even know anyone in the medical school (unless they're part of the medical school obviously).

- "You get paid". A couple thousand bucks isn't going to help you get into medical school, it isn't going to help your CV, and you'd probably make more money working a seasonal job over the summer.

- "You get a poster". SURF posters are at the bottom of things to show for time spent doing research. They're better than just saying "I have X years of research experience", but they're not viewed as real posters. With year-round research you'll almost certainly be able to do a thesis, you stand a chance of getting to present a poster at a professional conference (which actually is impressive), publishing an abstract, or even getting a publication.

- "It'll make it easier to get into a lab at your home university". Yes, but this implies that this is ever difficult. Professors generally love undergrad researchers. They're free labor. Most of the people I knew who got into a lab in undergrad (including me) did so by cold calling professors and with no prior research experience. The one exception was a girl who got into one of my labs after doing a summer research program at her home university, and even that was unnecessary because we absolutely would have taken her if she had just written an email that said "I want to do research".


The only reason you should ever do a SURF is if you go to a small liberal arts college that has few or no faculty doing research, and thus your only hope for getting research experience is doing a SURF.

 

[cuculici1]

Definitely do research at your home institution year round if you can. There are many advantages to home institution research over SURFs:

- You get to work on a project for the long term instead of coming in for 10 weeks, getting a piece of a project done, and then never coming back. This is far more impressive since it shows you can stick with something, you get experience with research at all stages, and if things work out you may even get a conference presentation or paper out of it, or at least a thesis.

-You'll (hopefully) get a much better LOR from your PI since they'll have known you for years, not weeks. Adcoms generally want letters from people who have known you for at least a year.

-It's a lot easier to get into a lab at your home institution than a SURF.


Also keep in mind that the following are not advantages of SURFs:


- "Competitiveness". Yes, SURFs are all very competitive. No one cares. It'll be obvious from your AMCAS application how qualified you were at that point in time, thus the SURF is redundant if that's your goal. On top of that, the selectivity of the programs is outweighed by the superficial exposure to research you'll get.

- "You'll get to be in multiple labs (if you do multiple SURFs)". Again, no one cares. Depth is better than breadth in this case.

- "You'll make connections". No you won't, at least not any connections that matter.

- "Doing a SURF at an institution makes it easier to get accepted there". This is sometimes true if you're interested in grad school (St. Andrews, for example, offers automatic admission to their graduate program if your lab liked you enough). But for med school it doesn't matter. The PI you study under isn't going to be pulling any strings for you. Often PIs don't even know anyone in the medical school (unless they're part of the medical school obviously).

- "You get paid". A couple thousand bucks isn't going to help you get into medical school, it isn't going to help your CV, and you'd probably make more money working a seasonal job over the summer.

- "You get a poster". SURF posters are at the bottom of things to show for time spent doing research. They're better than just saying "I have X years of research experience", but they're not viewed as real posters. With year-round research you'll almost certainly be able to do a thesis, you stand a chance of getting to present a poster at a professional conference (which actually is impressive), publishing an abstract, or even getting a publication.

- "It'll make it easier to get into a lab at your home university". Yes, but this implies that this is ever difficult. Professors generally love undergrad researchers. They're free labor. Most of the people I knew who got into a lab in undergrad (including me) did so by cold calling professors and with no prior research experience. The one exception was a girl who got into one of my labs after doing a summer research program at her home university, and even that was unnecessary because we absolutely would have taken her if she had just written an email that said "I want to do research".


The only reason you should ever do a SURF is if you go to a small liberal arts college that has few or no faculty doing research, and thus your only hope for getting research experience is doing a SURF.

There are a lot of misconceptions in your post. I have done two summer research programs while in undergrad, and both experiences have been invaluable. First, yes you will make connections. One summer I did research for a dean of UCLA David Geffen Medical School, and she wrote my LOR. The second summer, I went to a 2 week research workshop with some of the leading researchers in the field. Additionally, I was able to publish an abstract, as well as submit a publication to a journal in both of those summer programs. That is in addition to doing several talks and poster presentations. One summer, most of the students in my program had the opportunity to present their poster/abstract at a national conference if they felt like it.

The advantage to summer programs is that they force you to be productive, meet deadlines, and have your PI actually help you succeed. In this sense, they are conducive to gaining valuable research experience as an undergrad so that you are actually contributing to the intellectual process of research, rather than simply executing procedures. Gaining experience during a summer program will also help you get into labs during the school year if you choose, since you develop skills and produce an end result that professors at your home university can appreciate. It is probably the best way to get your foot in the door in the research world, since many home university labs don't really involve their students in posters/abstracts/conferences/talks as much as many summer programs.

 

[FirstAndFinal]

I vote that you do research at another institution during the summer (the summer program) and then look for an opportunity in the fall at your home institution. The connection at a top school will always be helpful. Could result in a letter of rec. or you could end up working with someone who has influence in the admissions committee or if you decide to do a gap year later you can reconnect and be a tech in a lab at that school, etc. Building a solid connection with an elite institution is always a plus. That extra connection versus an extra 3 months in one lab is well worth it.

 

[Tropicana100]

I would go with the home institution. Away research projects are sometimes just scut work that doesn't guarantee publication. Posters are very minor in the research world. I would really look into that and talk to both PI's to see what you can get out of those projects in terms of writing papers. Personally, I think you should find a mentor at your home institution that you can develop a relationship with and discuss your desire to get a first author publication and work with in the clinical setting, essentially setting yourself up for a strong LOR.

 

[SavantFtw]

I did 10 weeks worth of research this past summer and I am continuing it now.
I recommend that path. 🙂