Tell me about your LOR's

[Postictal Raiden]

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How many, and who wrote them?

I'll have 5:

English Professor
Genetics Professor
Dev. Bio Professor
Osteopath physician
Pre-med committee

 

[fluorescing]

How many, and who wrote them?

I'll have 5:

English Professor
Genetics Professor
Dev. Bio Professor
Osteopath physician
Pre-med committee

I have 9:
- 1 from my undergraduate honors thesis advisor
- 1 from my undergraduate physics professor who volunteered to write me a very strong letter because she believes I am going to be a great doctor one day
- 1 from another undergraduate physics professor
- 1 from an undergraduate history professor. I took 3 classes with him, and one of them was a graduate seminar
- 1 from the chief of medicine of the hospital where I work
- 1 from an ER physician
- 1 from another ER physician
- 1 from a DO ER physician who is the medical director of the ER at another hospital where I don't work
- 1 from a PhD who is the current supervisor at my current full-time job

 

[WillburCobb]

- 1 from a social psych prof. whose lab I worked in for 2 years and who I had as an instructor
- 1 from my Endocrinology prof. I was 1 of only 4 students (out of a class of 40+ which included grad students) who had an A going into the final and was excused from taking it, so hopefully its a stonger letter
- 1 from my Cell Bio and Histo prof. I had her as an instructor 3 years ago and she didn't remember me when I asked her about a LOR. She talked to me for over 30min just getting to know me then said she'd look through her old class records and if she had any issues writing me a LOR she'd let me know. I don't know how strong of letter this will be but unfourtunately it was my best option for a second LOR from a "hard" science prof., beings I was a "non-science" major.
- 1 from my current supervisor at work
- 1 from an internal med DO I shadowed
- 1 from the former dean of the college from which I gradutated (for PCOM)
- Possibly one from an MD who I've known for 15 years, if for some reason the DO flakes

 

[UCFMD]

Nine? Yeah that's a bit excessive.

 

[wjs010]

you do realize that 5 or 9 is WAY too excessive right? You only need a few LOR, especially if one of them is from the pre med committee. I have 3:

- pre med committee
-DO
-MD

 

[fluorescing]

Nine? Yeah that's a bit excessive.

I'm not planning to use them all at the same school. I look at individual school and their letter preferences and then decide. It's good to have options.

 

[fluorescing]

you do realize that 5 or 9 is WAY too excessive right? You only need a few LOR, especially if one of them is from the pre med committee. I have 3:

- pre med committee
-DO
-MD

I don't have a committee letter.

 

[circulus vitios]

Academic adviser, physics professor, bio professor (wrote it myself), philosophy instructor, and I'm trying to get a letter from a DO program director whose residents I shadowed.

 

[UCFMD]

I'm not planning to use them all at the same school. I look at individual school and their letter preferences and then decide. It's good to have options.

Sounds like a lot of work on the gamble that you are correctly identifying which letters will please which adcoms the most.

There's a difference between having options and being excessive past the point of there being any real benefit. What did the one EM doc say to have his letter sent to certain schools, opposed to the other EM docs?

 

[fluorescing]

Sounds like a lot of work on the gamble that you are correctly identifying which letters will please which adcoms the most.

There's a difference between having options and being excessive past the point of there being any real benefit. What did the one EM doc say to have his letter sent to certain schools, opposed to the other EM docs?

Well, they are all strong letters--all 9 of them. I think this is the important distinction. All of the letter writers know me well.

All of the doctors sent their stuff to Interfolio and the AMCAS letter service. They don't know which schools I'm sending their letters, and they don't know how many schools I'm applying to.

It's not really a gamble. Most schools specify what they like to see. I basically covered all the bases. Some schools prefer to have more physician letters while others want professors. Some schools want that non-science letter. Some schools want to know about the applicant's real life experiences.

 

[UCFMD]

Well, they are all strong letters--all 9 of them. I think this is the important distinction. All of the letter writers know me well.

All of the doctors sent their stuff to Interfolio and the AMCAS letter service. They don't know which schools I'm sending their letters, and they don't know how many schools I'm applying to.

It's not really a gamble. Most schools specify what they like to see. I basically covered all the bases. Some schools prefer to have more physician letters while others want professors. Some schools want that non-science letter. Some schools want to know about the applicant's real life experiences.

They care about the content of the letter most importantly. You're assuming the personal feelings of the people reading the letters directly reflects whatever you read online about that school.

For every school you apply to, there will be a combination of letters, of which their content will have the greatest impact on the readers. The greater number of variations, the lesser likely you are to hit that combination. The odds of you picking the best combination of five out of nine, for every school, is astronomically low.

You can have this complex letter arrangement plan all you want, I just don't think its offering you a great advantage over someone who has the standard 2 science, 1 non science, 1 doctor, 1 community, of which are all well written. That person has all of their bases covered to, they just don't have three of each.

Hopefully someone with adcom experience can chime in on this, but this method of letter gathering is seemingly a lot of work for very little, if any reward.

 

[WillburCobb]

Sounds like a lot of work on the gamble that you are correctly identifying which letters will please which adcoms the most.

There's a difference between having options and being excessive past the point of there being any real benefit. What did the one EM doc say to have his letter sent to certain schools, opposed to the other EM docs?

Not all schools have the same requirements for LORs. My stongest letters are from my social psych prof, current supervisor, and possibly Endocrinology prof. If I can submit those and satisfy a schoo'ls LOR requirements then that's ideal. Unfourtunatly those won't work for some schools so I've obtained additional LORs for those schools. I'm sure these letters aren't nearly as strong so if I can avoid submitting them over stronger ones then I will.

 

[fluorescing]

They care about the content of the letter most importantly. You're assuming the personal feelings of the people reading the letters directly reflects whatever you read online about that school.

For every school you apply to, there will be a combination of letters, of which their content will have the greatest impact on the readers. The greater number of variations, the lesser likely you are to hit that combination. The odds of you picking the best combination of five out of nine, for every school, is astronomically low.

You can have this complex letter arrangement plan all you want, I just don't think its offering you a great advantage over someone who has the standard 2 science, 1 non science, 1 doctor, 1 community, of which are all well written. That person has all of their bases covered to, they just don't have three of each.

Hopefully someone with adcom experience can chime in on this, but this method of letter gathering is seemingly a lot of work for very little, if any reward.

It wasn't a lot of work. Most of these people *offered* to write me letters because they really enjoyed working with me or otherwise interacting with me and think I have the abilities to become a good physician in the future.

Why does it matter if I have letters from people with similar titles? They are all strong letters anyway. I think this is what you're not understanding. It doesn't really matter if I use ER doc letter #1 or ER doc letter #2 or physics professor #1 or physics professor #2. It's not like one of them is iffier than the other. I also decided to request letters from people with similar titles in case something catastrophic happens to letter writer #1 and he/she couldn't write the letter. The plan saves me the last minute scramble.

The different letter writers are also likely to highlight different favorable qualities and what a well-rounded person I am in general.

Shrug. You do it your way, and I do it my way. We both have our reasons, and I wish we're both successful in the end.

 

[UCFMD]

Not all schools have the same requirements for LORs.

Come on now.. all variations can be covered by five letters. I'm fine with people being neurotic, but let's not pretend schools have vastly different requirements.

The last thing we need is for people reading this thread to freak out because they only have five. Or because they don't have three from every type of doctor they shadowed..

 

[fluorescing]

Come on now.. all variations can be covered by five letters. I'm fine with people being neurotic, but let's not pretend schools have vastly different requirements.

The last thing we need is for people reading this thread to freak out because they only have five. Or three from every type of doctor they shadowed..

I agree that people shouldn't freak out because they have 5 letters. As long as they meet all the letter requirements of the schools they are applying to and are confident they have strong letters, they are fine.

I also have a couple of additional letters in there because I'm a non-traditional applicant so I have more job-related experiences.

 

[WillburCobb]

The last thing we need is for people reading this thread to freak out because they only have five. Or because they don't have three from every type of doctor they shadowed..

No one should be using this thread (or forum for that matter) to determine how many letters they need - though it will still happen regardless.

 

[circulus vitios]

Well, they are all strong letters--all 9 of them. I think this is the important distinction. All of the letter writers know me well.

All of the doctors sent their stuff to Interfolio and the AMCAS letter service. They don't know which schools I'm sending their letters, and they don't know how many schools I'm applying to.

It's not really a gamble. Most schools specify what they like to see. I basically covered all the bases. Some schools prefer to have more physician letters while others want professors. Some schools want that non-science letter. Some schools want to know about the applicant's real life experiences.

I love how everyone on SDN thinks their LORs are "strong."

 

[fluorescing]

I love how everyone on SDN thinks their LORs are "strong."

I read a few of them. The ones I read are good letters. Honestly, the one that I think may be iffy in that it may not be wholly on topic is the non-science one. But hey, some schools require that, so...

I'm going to take it as a good sign when professors and physicians offer to write letters on top of their research/practice.

 

[WillburCobb]

I love how everyone on SDN thinks their LORs are "strong."

I only think two of mine are strong (one I saw and the other one the letter writer offered to write WELL before I even asked). My other ones I have no idea about.

 

[chiddler]

DO doc
PI of lab
2x sci profs (neuro, biochem lab)
ethnomusicology prof
volunteering lady

this array of letters was recommended to me by my school's LOR workshop. where the "volunteering lady" could be substituted for any volunteering or work related gig.

 

[circulus vitios]

I only think two of mine are strong (one I saw and the other one the letter writer offered to write WELL before I even asked). My other ones I have no idea about.

idk mine can only bench their body weight 🙁

 

[rzoo14]

I have 3. 2 strong science, I do research with one of them and a DO letter. Would that be enough?

After reading that list of 9 letters, I feel like I should ask one or two more professors.

 

[fluorescing]

I have 3. 2 strong science, I do research with one of them and a DO letter. Would that be enough?

After reading that list of 9 letters, I feel like I should ask one or two more professors.

You should get a non-science letter in there just in case the school you want to apply to requires one.

I think you will be solid with the 4. I only have 9 because people offered, and I'm pragmatic in nature.

Hypothetical situation to consider: the DO forgot to date his letter by accident or forgot to sign his letter by accident. You get contacted by schools saying that the letter is incomplete because it's missing the date or the signature. You try to contact the DO for an updated letter, but he is away on a mission trip and has no access to email. He won't return for 6 weeks. Wouldn't it better just to have an extra physician letter on hand in this scenario?

 

[bvo21]

I got 2 science, 1 non-science, 1 from my research pi, and 1 from my dean. All of them are weak except the research LOR.

 

[TwinsFan]

For Osteo Schools this is all you may need:

2 science prof
1 non science prof
1 DO (or MD if that is all you have)
1 volunteering/work experience/research PI
**PCOM dean of science at undergrad?

Maybe you'll have an MD and a DO letter
Maybe you'll have letters from a work supervisor and a volunteer coordinator etc.
Maybe you'll have a committee letter

More than this is unnecessary...
3 strong letters are way better than 4 strong ones and 3 blah ones, because what if they read a couple of weak ones or a weak and a strong one and call it a day, both look worse than all strong LORs.
Also a giant pile of LORs will not impress as they probably will not read more than 2-5 of them (std for most applicants). Just like writing a huge list of all 700+ character EC descriptions having a huge pile of LORs will probably annoy some adcoms. There is something to be said about brevity.

 

[UCFMD]

I have 3. 2 strong science, I do research with one of them and a DO letter. Would that be enough?

After reading that list of 9 letters, I feel like I should ask one or two more professors.

This is the reaction I was expecting.. lol

If a school requires a non science letter, yes. If not, you're fine. Don't think you have to match anyone else though. If you meet the requirements, you're good to go.

 

[WillburCobb]

No one should be using this thread (or forum for that matter) to determine how many letters they need - though it will still happen regardless.

...After reading that list of 9 letters, I feel like I should ask one or two more professors.

Check out the websites for schools to which you plan on applying. If you have questions or need clarification, contact the schools. Then get the best letters you can that meet the requirements for the schools to which you're applying (it could be 4, or it could be 9...). If it helps you feel more secure, ask a few other individuals so you have back-ups; its not neccessary but it won't hurt.

 

[TwinsFan]

I got 2 science, 1 non-science, 1 from my research pi, and 1 from my dean. All of them are weak except the research LOR.

for honesty

 

[fluorescing]

If it helps you feel more secure, ask a few other individuals so you have back-ups; its not neccessary but it won't hurt.

Exactly.

 

[UCFMD]

Then get the best letters you can that meet the requirements for the schools to which you're applying (it could be 4, or it could be 9...)..

This is still insinuating there are a certain combination of schools that altogether will require nine different letters.

For people that follow these threads religiously, don't perceive this information that way. You can cover the requirements for every school with five letters, much less twice of that.

 

[Pose]

I have two science, one nonscience, and one MD. I am pretty sure that one of my science
letters is weak, but not sure of the others. The MD is really gunning for me, so I bet that is a good one.

 

[fluorescing]

This is still insinuating there are a certain combination of schools that altogether will require nine different letters.

For people that follow these threads religiously, don't perceive this information that way. You can cover the requirements for every school with five letters, much less twice of that.

I think you are beating a dead horse.

No one has said that any school REQUIRES 9. 5 strong letters will cover all the schools, but it's not a bad idea to have an extra 2 in case there are problems with the 5 and you are unable to obtain updated letters in time.

In my case, one of my letter writers told me one day, "LET ME WRITE A LETTER FOR YOU. IT WILL BE THE STRONGEST LETTER. YOU NEED TO BE IN MEDICAL SCHOOL NOW BECAUSE YOU ARE MEANT TO DO GREAT THINGS." What am I supposed to say to her? "No, thanks, I already got that handled"?

 

[UCFMD]

I think you are beating a dead horse.

If that is what is required to stop the spread of misinformation, so be it. One person has already commented in this thread and questioned their own situation because of the posts in here.

I also never said nine are required by one school. If you re-read, or perhaps read for the first time, I said combination of schools. There are no combinations that require more than five. The post I responded to implied there could be a combination that would require up to nine. That's not possible in this universe, unless there are tons of special LoR requirements the rest of us don't know about.

 

[WillburCobb]

No one should be using this thread (or forum for that matter) to determine how many letters they need - though it will still happen regardless.

Again, why I posted this and elaborated in a later post how one should determine, for their indivdual situation, how many LORs they need.

If that is what is required to stop the spread of misinformation, so be it. One person has already commented in this thread and questioned their own situation because of the posts in here.

I also never said nine are required by one school. If you re-read, or perhaps read for the first time, I said combination of schools. There are no combinations that require more than five. The post I responded to implied there could be a combination that would require up to nine. That's not possible in this universe, unless there are tons of special LoR requirements the rest of us don't know about.

Nine was stated arbitrarily in that post, not as an implication; there comes a point where only the reader can be held accountable for their interpretation of what they read (especially on an internet forum). And for the record, I can think of at least one combination of schools (MD/DO) off the top of my head where one may actually want a minimum of 9 LORs (depending on how they perceive the quality of each letter).

 

[bpatient]

You can also use the extra LORs as part of updates.

 

[UCFMD]

And for the record, I can think of at least one combination of schools (MD/DO) off the top of my head where one may actually want a minimum of 9 LORs (depending on how they perceive the quality of each letter).

Which combination is that?

 

[fluorescing]

I think if people have strong letters, whether 4 or 10, they would not freak out just by reading this post. It honestly won't hurt to have strong letters on hand. You don't have to use them all, but they are good to have in case problems arise.

 

[WillburCobb]

Which combination is that?

I doubt this would ever occur but hypothetically its possible, especially for non-trads. Several MD programs do not require LORs from specific individuals (e.g., 2 science, 1 non, etc.) but rather encourage applicants to submit letters from people who know the applicant well and can comment on their professional and intellectual abilities (MN being an example of one such school - unless that's changed this year). So lets say a non-trad grew-up and attended college in ND/MN and did an SMP at EVMS (just to make this a bit more realistic) applies to PCOM, DMU-COM, EVMS, UND and U of MN (among other schools) and submits only the min required for each school.

PCOM - college dean/advisor/dept. chair etc. - 1 LOR
DMU-COM - 2 science, 1 MD/DO - 3 LOR
EVMS - 2 science (these are the same as those submitted to DMU), 1 non-science - 1 LOR
UND - 2 profs (again from above), 1 supervisor - 1 LOR
U of MN - 3 from people who know the applicant well and the applicant knows he/she can get stronger LORs from other experiences than those submitted to the other schools - 3 LOR

That makes a total of 9 different LORs. Again this hypothetical and not too likely to occur, but is definitely plausible especially for non-trad applicants. Lastly I've heard of other schools with LOR requirements similar to MN's and I know UND isn't the only school requesting a supervisor LOR, so this isn't just an isolated scenario.

 

[jce0002]

Slightly off topic. Can you submit letters after you've submitted your primary application with ACOMAS like you can with AMCAS?

 

[WillburCobb]

Slightly off topic. Can you submit letters after you've submitted your primary application with ACOMAS like you can with AMCAS?

Yep. Also sorry for the slight de-railing of the thread.

 

[graduate2be]

Two science letters (one of these is my grad school thesis advisor that also taught one of my pharmacology classes)
One DO letter (Also happens to be
One non-science
One community service letter

The SMP program that I am attending does a committee letter for those that request one so I may ask for one after my 1st semester is over... All of my letters are strong and I've been advised by my old undergrad pre med advisor and the SMP program coordinator not to seek any more letters as it wouldn't be a benefit at this point.

 

[Zonagirl]

It seems like many of you have read your LORs!? I was under the impression that you aren't supposed to ever see them?

I have a strong committee LOR (my advisor said it was strong, I haven't seen it).
One from the president of a medical volunteer group who I went on a volunteer trip to Haiti with and have volunteered with for over a year.
One from the podiatrist that I have worked as a medical assistant for for the last year.
One DO letter who I shadowed and have known for over two years now.

I thought even four was pushing it, but I feel a lot better about submitting each one after reading how many everyone else is submitting.

GL friends!

 

[Back 5]

1 DO
1 MD
Inorganic Chem prof
Organic Chem prof
Philosophy/Theology prof
PCOM letter requirement - only for PCOM.

 

[fluorescing]

It seems like many of you have read your LORs!? I was under the impression that you aren't supposed to ever see them?

I have a strong committee LOR (my advisor said it was strong, I haven't seen it).
One from the president of a medical volunteer group who I went on a volunteer trip to Haiti with and have volunteered with for over a year.
One from the podiatrist that I have worked as a medical assistant for for the last year.
One DO letter who I shadowed and have known for over two years now.

I thought even four was pushing it, but I feel a lot better about submitting each one after reading how many everyone else is submitting.

GL friends!

Believe it or not, some students actually write their own letters for their recommenders to put on official letterhead and sign.

 

[Pacna]

I have 7. I just asked everyone that I thought could write me a positive letter at the time. There wasn't any thought to having too many or too few.

I'm glad I did that, as I can now pick which ones are best. 👍

 

[Zonagirl]

Believe it or not, some students actually write their own letters for their recommenders to put on official letterhead and sign.

Haha crap. I guess I don't know how to play the game very well...

 

[chizledfrmstone]

Haha crap. I guess I don't know how to play the game very well...

2 people told me to do this since they were so busy. I declined for various reasons.

I have about 8 LORs right now. From last cycle I learned it is a good idea to have more than you need. It's good to have backups if something comes up. I don't want to not get accepted because someone didn't sign a LOR.

 

[NontradCA]

2 science, DO, behavioral science. I'm fine with just that.

 

[IslandStyle808]

you do realize that 5 or 9 is WAY too excessive right? You only need a few LOR, especially if one of them is from the pre med committee. I have 3:

- pre med committee
-DO
-MD

Three is actually on the low side and five is around the average. Once you hit 7 then I agree with you.

 

[armpitsOFmight]

1 gen chem prof
1 o-chem prof
1 physics prof
1 psychology prof
1 md
1 supervisor
1 letter from the Dean's department that says I was a student in good standing (for PCOM)

I'm just going to send all of these to the med schools I'm applying to and let them sort it out.