Texas Residency for Out of State Student

[TexasTwoStep]

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I'm a M3 and would like to get your opinion on what it would take for me to get a IM residency in Texas. I'm your average run of the mill med student and didn't do too hot on Step 1 with a score of 210/87. Although I'm sure it's not the norm, after skimming some of these forums during the past couple of days, it seems that everyone has a 230+.

I'm pretty interested in UT-H, UT-SA, and UTMB programs but wasn't able to find any stats or preference for out of state students. Likewise with a score of 210/87, is it recommended for me to take Step 2 early on b/c it seems that I'm not that good at standardize testing so I'm not sure how much higher it would be. Also I do have some interest in Cardio and so would this step I score come back to haunt me down the line or is it pretty much a clean slate once your in residency?

Just wandering if anyone else has any input on what I can do or if you've heard similar stories. I did a search of the past couple years and could not find anything more than people's opinion of the schools based on their interview etc. My out of state school also doesn't have the best record of sending students to Texas, which may in part be due to the personal preference, but I guess I'd like to know if there's anything I can do to help my cause. Thanks.

 

[jdh71]

Of course everyone is >230 posting step scores . . . on the interwubs is series biznis . . .

Apply all over texas . . . obviously UTSW and Baylor will be out with that kind of score, but you never know about anywhere else. I thought A&M Scott and White was a super-kick ass program when I interviewed there. And don't forget about the community programs.

 

[Cards21aceking]

Of course everyone is >230 posting step scores . . . on the interwubs is series biznis . . .

Apply all over texas . . . obviously UTSW and Baylor will be out with that kind of score, but you never know about anywhere else. I thought A&M Scott and White was a super-kick ass program when I interviewed there. And don't forget about the community programs.

Just for kicks, what's your take on UTSW and Baylor as far as out of staters are concerned. I know that they're tough to get into, but it seems to be hard to get an honest beat on either of them. Figure Jdh is about as realistic this board can get some times. If you can throw general score ranges, that'd be even better, but if not, that's cool too. thanks

 

[theunderdog]

Of course everyone is >230 posting step scores . . . on the interwubs is series biznis . . .

Apply all over texas . . . obviously UTSW and Baylor will be out with that kind of score, but you never know about anywhere else. I thought A&M Scott and White was a super-kick ass program when I interviewed there. And don't forget about the community programs.

what do you mean by "community" programs? the other types are teaching programs?

 

[jdh71]

Just for kicks, what's your take on UTSW and Baylor as far as out of staters are concerned. I know that they're tough to get into, but it seems to be hard to get an honest beat on either of them. Figure Jdh is about as realistic this board can get some times. If you can throw general score ranges, that'd be even better, but if not, that's cool too. thanks

I don't know. I'm no expert, and my application was . . . complicated . . . but you need to know that competition to get into the better IM programs is getting higher and higher every year. It seems the magic golden ticket for the BIGS, at least last year was AOA. Second seemed to be med school reputation . . . also, seemed like most people matching into the BIGS had at minimum a 230 step I, and most (read almost all) were easily over 240, with 250s not uncommon, most had honored medicine as well as most of their other cores, and most had some sort of research . . . not to mention "food-chain letters".

It's probably helpful to understand that these folks represent, oh I don't know . . . the top 500-1000 candidates or so and the BIGS fight like cats and dogs for all of them, and everyone else just kind falls into spots along the wayside.

I'd say to get a shot at UTSW or Baylor you'd need the 230, more like 235+, good letters and I mean GREAT letters, probably an honor in medicine form a school they know and trust, and I'm pretty sure merely having AOA gets you an interview about anywhere.

For my money though . . . and part of this is because I'm laid back, not a gunner, and will be happy doing hospitalist medicine if I decide not to do Pulm/CC, your mid-tier university program is perfect. You got all kinds of chest grabbers and short-of-breathers and what-have you to get good at bread a butter IM - just the same as any of the BIGS. The more rep your IM program the easier it is to find fellowship, and most mid-tier university programs will have all of your fellowships giving you a fighting chance for doing anything you want.

I don't know everyone has a strategy, and for some it was to "better" than everyone else on paper. Which works as far as that goes. For me I wouldn't have been happy at a BIG - not my kind of peeps. I would know because I ran into many of them on the interview trail.

geeeez. did that answer the question?

EDIT: And when I say "BIGS" I'm including the NE, Hopkins, and UCSF . . . Baylor and UTSW are easily in the top 20. People around here will start fighting about rankings before too long, but . . . whatever . . . I think most people will agree that UTSW and Baylor get to be in the top 20-25. And if I remember right . . . I think UTSW actually had the MOST match into cards out of any resident class a year or two back, but I may have that wrong, and Baylor is one of those places where some of the Gods of Cardiology live. You'll find that upper level IM tends to be all about the cardiology - HA!

EDIT #2: And before everyone jumps all over me . . . you've got to lump in Duke and Penn with the BIGS . . . but there are good university programs all over the place, at least I think so . . .

 

[jdh71]

what do you mean by "community" programs? the other types are teaching programs?

university vs community programs - BOTH teach IM.

Hmmmm . . . good example might be the Methodist hospitals around the country . . . many have a teaching service, some are university based, some affiliated with a university, and some run their own IM program.

 

[A-non-y-mous]

Of course everyone is >230 posting step scores . . . on the interwubs is series biznis . . .

Apply all over texas . . . obviously UTSW and Baylor will be out with that kind of score, but you never know about anywhere else.

You'd be surprised....

 

[jdh71]

You'd be surprised....

I guess, it wouldn't surprise me if they took some of their own with those scores, but coming in from the outside . . .

I am NOT an expert, but I was asked me opinion so I gave it, straight from the hip . . . 😀

 

[Danbo1957]

All Texas IM residencies take out of state med students - can't ignore good talented doctors from around the US who list their programs.

An MCAT score of 210 does not eliminate you, but there will many students matching with higher numbers - a PD will want to see a lot support from other areas in your application.

In Texas, long established community IM programs are as respected as academic IM residencies; although, competitive fellowships may require an academic residency. You should list all Texas programs, but a 210 will be a reach at UTSW or BCM...

 

[BenYossarian]

I think UTSW/Baylor may be out of reach but it doesn't hurt to apply. A few tips if you are interested in cards:

1. UTSA - The PD from UTSW (David Hillis) left last winter to be the Chief of Medicine at UTSA and he's a fairly big name cardiologist (NEJM editor) and he's bring in some other guy from Hopkins, so I think they're trying to build a program down there.


2. Baylor Dallas - Kinda halfway between a community and university program but are affiliated with a large and respected private cardiology group (and physically connected to a heart hospital.) If you know you want to do cards I think being a resident there gets you a foot in the door to the fellowship there. But there's only 9 categorical spots a year so it may be competitive although its definitely under the radar for people not from texas (I think.) Same thing for GI if you change your mind.

 

[Danbo1957]

David Hillis going to UTSA is a real coup for the Medicine program. And, Hillis' taking the Chair at UTSA shows how much talent there is a the top in UTSW Medicine - must be at least five qualified Department Chairmen in the waiting on their staff.

 

[jdh71]

2. Baylor Dallas - Kinda halfway between a community and university program but are affiliated with a large and respected private cardiology group (and physically connected to a heart hospital.) If you know you want to do cards I think being a resident there gets you a foot in the door to the fellowship there. But there's only 9 categorical spots a year so it may be competitive although its definitely under the radar for people not from texas (I think.) Same thing for GI if you change your mind.

I see the strategy angle you are trying to point out, but I thought the categorical program was weak sauce. I'm mean I'm a lazy SOB, but I'd like to feel like I'm actually trained when I come out the other side, ya know?

 

[BenYossarian]

I see the strategy angle you are trying to point out, but I thought the categorical program was weak sauce. I'm mean I'm a lazy SOB, but I'd like to feel like I'm actually trained when I come out the other side, ya know?

yeah...I think the the best reason to go there is if you thought you could match into one of their fellowships and then do private practice.

 

[dragonfly99]

Its been 5 years since I interviewed there, but I agree w/the comments about Baylor Dallas. It looked like a cush place to do a transitional year, and it was the only place I actually saw surgery residents having time to eat lunch, but I felt the categorical IM residency looked TOO easy. They seemed like they had TOO MUCH free time and didn't really have enough admissions. You want to work enough to feel you can handle stuff when you get out of residency. It IS a nice hospital, though, and had a great looking cath lab and they were extremetly nice during the interview. It's worth a look.

I think with 210 USMLE Southwestern is likely to blow you off. Baylor perhaps...but might be a little easier to get an interview there. You can give it a shot. A lot depends on other parts of your application as well.