To what extent can someone buy their way into med school?

[Pluto98]

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For undergrad, a large donation can get a kid into a school. Is it similar for med school? Would a top ten medical school accept someone with a 490 MCAT and no volunteer/shadowing experience if their dad donated 10 million dollars/ a new wing for the library?

 

[paradoxic_toxic]

With enough money you can buy your way into anything

 

[LizzyM]

The school needs to be relatively sure that Junior can pass the boards and graduate in 4 or 5 years. Classes are so small that every student who fails out is magnified when looking at as the proportion of unsuccessful students in a class. (unlike undergrad where it is not uncommon to have 20-40% fail to graduate in 5 years, it is highly unusual to have >5% flunk out or fail to complete the degree in 5 years).

Someone whose relative (parent, grandparent, aunt/uncle) has a history of supporting the school monetarily in a big way is going to get "every consideration" in the admissions process. That can mean that the kid gets an interview when it otherwise would not have been warrented. That means that someone who knows the score might speak up on behalf of the candidate but at the same time, there are those who will speak out against a candidate that is seeming to get an edge based on family connections rather than abilities.

That said, I've been in on a few situations where a candidate whose LizzyM score was a full 10 points lower than our average (equivalent to a 508 rather than a 518) was admitted over my objections and the student pleasantly surprised me by graduating in 4 years and matching well.

 

[Pluto98]

The school needs to be relatively sure that Junior can pass the boards and graduate in 4 or 5 years. Classes are so small that every student who fails out is magnified when looking at as the proportion of unsuccessful students in a class. (unlike undergrad where it is not uncommon to have 20-40% fail to graduate in 5 years, it is highly unusual to have >5% flunk out or fail to complete the degree in 5 years).

Someone whose relative (parent, grandparent, aunt/uncle) has a history of supporting the school monetarily in a big way is going to get "every consideration" in the admissions process. That can mean that the kid gets an interview when it otherwise would not have been warrented. That means that someone who knows the score might speak up on behalf of the candidate but at the same time, there are those who will speak out against a candidate that is seeing to get an edge based on family connections rather than abilities.

That said, I've been in on a few situations where a candidate whose LizzyM score was a full 10 points lower than our average (equivalent to a 508 rather than a 518) was admitted over my objections and the student pleasantly surprised me by graduating in 4 years and matching well.

What if the student had a 490 MCAT for example or if the student had a 508 but a DUI? Clearly a 508 is enough to pass in med school. What did the other people in the room say to argue that this candidate should be admitted?

 

[Princeton Medical Student]

A more interesting thing to look at is to see how stats correlate with family income
A lot easier to found a charity when your daf is a successful CEO
A lot easier to have 10000 hrs of volunteering when you are on a trust fund
A lot easier to have 30 different activities when you dont need to commute 1.5 hrs to school
Etc

 

[LizzyM]

A more interesting thing to look at is to see how stats correlate with family income
A lot easier to found a charity when your daf is a successful CEO
A lot easier to have 10000 hrs of volunteering when you are on a trust fund
A lot easier to have 30 different activities when you dont need to commute 1.5 hrs to school
Etc

So true. Just read a really good nytimes story on the hardships of applying to medical school when money is tight.

‘I Have a Ph.D. in Not Having Money’ (Published 2019)

Medical school is expensive for everyone. But for low-income students, the hidden costs can be prohibitive.

www.nytimes.com

 

[LizzyM]

What if the student had a 490 MCAT for example or if the student had a 508 but a DUI? Clearly a 508 is enough to pass in med school. What did the other people in the room say to argue that this candidate should be admitted?

I can't remember ever seeing a DUI ...

It would be highly unusual for a 490 to get an interview. I can think of only one instance. That person was admitted and eventually graduated but it was not pretty. Was neither rich nor a legacy but had other things that stood out positively.

Any "much lower than our average" is going to generate conversations that almost always come down to "high risk/high reward" or "has made a tremendous turn-around most recently" or "made a very good impression at interview".

 

[SeaHusky]

Relatedly, how have you seen legacy (parent attended the medical school) influence medical school admissions decisions?

Edit: in the absence of donations

This almost assuredly depends on the school. A physician I work closely with (faculty at my alma mater) told me that one of his colleagues (chair of a department) had a daughter apply (IS, high stats, etc.) and wasn't even granted an interview. She went on to attend Stanford Med.

I'm sure there are schools who take legacy more into account, but I don't think any one of them will openly admit it.

 

[Kardio]

Honestly, from my real life experiences and perusings of SDN, it looks like medical school admissions tends to be much more meritocratic than admissions at UG schools.

 

[82Scout]

Honestly, from my real life experiences and perusing of SDN, it looks like medical school admissions tends to be much more meritocratic than admissions at UG schools.

With that being said those who are financially better off tend to have an easier time getting the stats to gain admission by merit. It may be different for medical schools (doubtful), but I know some law students who gained admission because of their parental connections.

 

[Pluto98]

I can't remember ever seeing a DUI ...

It would be highly unusual for a 490 to get an interview. I can think of only one instance. That person was admitted and eventually graduated but it was not pretty. Was neither rich nor a legacy but had other things that stood out positively.

Any "much lower than our average" is going to generate conversations that almost always come down to "high risk/high reward" or "has made a tremendous turn-around most recently" or "made a very good impression at interview".

Thank you for your response. Do committees tend to speak differently about people who are financially disadvantaged/applied with FAP? I feel like they say they take this into account but do they really?

 

[LizzyM]

Thank you for your response. Do committees tend to speak differently about people who are financially disadvantaged/applied with FAP? I feel like they say they take this into account but do they really?

I've not heard this mentioned except in a positive way to say that the applicant "showed grit" or had a "long distance traveled" or "pulled themself up by their bootstraps" . I've never heard it said that we should admit someone because they are poor and our school is expensive.

 

[Goro]

Relatedly, how have you seen legacy (parent attended the medical school) influence medical school admissions decisions?

Edit: in the absence of donations

These usually yield a polite interview, followed by an even more spot spot on the waitlist, followed by an even more polite rejection at the very end of the cycle.

Thank you for your response. Do committees tend to speak differently about people who are financially disadvantaged/applied with FAP? I feel like they say they take this into account but do they really?

We don't admit people at my school merely because they are poor. It's because we think that they will make a good doctor, and we also like come from behind stories. No med school is doing anyone any favors by admitting people who are at high risk for failing out.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

Relatedly, how have you seen legacy (parent attended the medical school) influence medical school admissions decisions?

Edit: in the absence of donations

My son was a double legacy where I did my residency and my wife got her MD. It was his first choice. We donated thousands. 3.5 cgpa and 3.6 sgpa. 32 avg Mcat, well within schools metrics. Got permanently waitlisted. Needless to say donations ceased immediately. Guess several thousand is not enough. He went elsewhere and is now a 2nd yr resident. BTW, school makes a.big deal about alumni support and legacy applicants.

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

My son was a double legacy where I did my residency and my wife got her MD. It was his first choice. We donated thousands. 3.5 cgpa and 3.6 sgpa. 32 avg Mcat, well within schools metrics. Got permanently waitlisted. Needless to say donations ceased immediately. Guess several thousand is not enough. He went elsewhere and is now a 2nd yr resident. BTW, school makes a.big deal about alumni support and legacy applicants.

so schools make big deal about alumni support and legacy applicants but then won't give any preference when admitting? I am confused.

 

[mwsapphire]

My son was a double legacy where I did my residency and my wife got her MD. It was his first choice. We donated thousands. 3.5 cgpa and 3.6 sgpa. 32 avg Mcat, well within schools metrics. Got permanently waitlisted. Needless to say donations ceased immediately. Guess several thousand is not enough. He went elsewhere and is now a 2nd yr resident. BTW, school makes a.big deal about alumni support and legacy applicants.

Were the donations just for your son though? Or did you donate anyway, before junior expressed interest in med school?

 

[Kardio]

With that being said those who are financially better off tend to have an easier time getting the stats to gain admission by merit. It may be different for medical schools (doubtful), but I know some law students who gained admission because of their parental connections.

Can’t comment on the law school thing, but re. the bolded:
I agree with you. I also think they’re more likely to understand the more subtle bits of this process (how to network, write about themselves, interview, etc.) However, they had to work very hard to make themselves competitive for school too - and I don’t want to take credit away from them.

Admissions aren’t perfect, but I think they generally try to see our application holistically. For example, I didn't “check the box” on all ECs, and was worried about that going into the application season. In the context of my life, it was reasonable that I not have that specific box checked - I received interviews and was never grilled on it in any of them.

 

[tessellations]

Relatedly, how have you seen legacy (parent attended the medical school) influence medical school admissions decisions?

Edit: in the absence of donations

My boss, who is a physician, told me that one of his old coordinators who was a double legacy to a mid-tier school and had a LOR from him (also an alum) didn’t even get an interview. I think her stats were fairly average and she had good experiences. He was mad enough about it to call the admissions director to complain after the cycle was over!

 

[theKingLT]

So true. Just read a really good nytimes story on the hardships of applying to medical school when money is tight.

‘I Have a Ph.D. in Not Having Money’ (Published 2019)

Medical school is expensive for everyone. But for low-income students, the hidden costs can be prohibitive.

www.nytimes.com

Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of important truths in that article, and I fully support reducing financial barriers to and during med school, but it always irks me when a journalist conveniently forgets to mention relevant facts that contradict their point. She does a great job of pointing out MCAT and application costs, but fails to mention FAP. Then highlights the national debt average, while the protagonist of her article probably isn't paying tuition with Harvard's need based aid system.

Sorry for the off topic post. I agree that med schools are much stricter with the whole donations=acceptance thing but I'm sure there are still some cases. I shadowed an ortho doc a few years ago who was pretty bitter about his alma mater not accepting his son after many years of donations but the son got accepted elsewhere anyway

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

I can't remember ever seeing a DUI ...

It would be highly unusual for a 490 to get an interview. I can think of only one instance. That person was admitted and eventually graduated but it was not pretty. Was neither rich nor a legacy but had other things that stood out positively.

Any "much lower than our average" is going to generate conversations that almost always come down to "high risk/high reward" or "has made a tremendous turn-around most recently" or "made a very good impression at interview".

I've heard some stories of Special Forces types getting interviews and acceptances like this...and yes, they frequently struggled in the preclinical years. Guy said they shone on the wards, though. Can't really think of anything other than that - or maybe sharing a last name with the library, a big one - that could get you that kind of pull. Being related to someone very politically powerful?

 

[Angus Avagadro]

so schools make big deal about alumni support and legacy applicants but then won't give any preference when admitting? I am confused.

Dont be confused . As the lawyers say, " they were being less than candid"

 

[Angus Avagadro]

Were the donations just for your son though? Or did you donate anyway, before junior expressed interest in med school?

We donated for years. As I mentioned above, I believe the school was being less than candid. Donate to a school if you believe its the right thing to do. Dont think it holds any sway, unless you donate a lab or a wing.

 

[tall_expat]

Relatedly, how have you seen legacy (parent attended the medical school) influence medical school admissions decisions?

Edit: in the absence of donations

My buddy was a triple legacy at this one school. 2 siblings + 1 parent who did residency and is current faculty and are also donors. He interviewed but was waitlisted.

 

[Princeton Medical Student]

Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of important truths in that article, and I fully support reducing financial barriers to and during med school, but it always irks me when a journalist conveniently forgets to mention relevant facts that contradict their point. She does a great job of pointing out MCAT and application costs, but fails to mention FAP. Then highlights the national debt average, while the protagonist of her article probably isn't paying tuition with Harvard's need based aid system.

Sorry for the off topic post. I agree that med schools are much stricter with the whole donations=acceptance thing but I'm sure there are still some cases. I shadowed an ortho doc a few years ago who was pretty bitter about his alma mater not accepting his son after many years of donations but the son got accepted elsewhere anyway

FAP is not that big of an issue.
The big issue is the disadvantages that students face when they have to commute 2 hours to school, have to work part/full time through college just to afford living, and are then also expected to have the same amount of volunteering hours as those living on campus on a daddy's trust fund. FAP isn't that great anyway.

 

[LizzyM]

Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of important truths in that article, and I fully support reducing financial barriers to and during med school, but it always irks me when a journalist conveniently forgets to mention relevant facts that contradict their point. She does a great job of pointing out MCAT and application costs, but fails to mention FAP. Then highlights the national debt average, while the protagonist of her article probably isn't paying tuition with Harvard's need based aid system.

Sorry for the off topic post. I agree that med schools are much stricter with the whole donations=acceptance thing but I'm sure there are still some cases. I shadowed an ortho doc a few years ago who was pretty bitter about his alma mater not accepting his son after many years of donations but the son got accepted elsewhere anyway

As has been discussed on other threads, many people are not covered by FAP despite having limited resources. Does Harvard medical school have a need based aid system for medical students? Whatever a school offers to undergrads is not necessarily replicated in its medical school.

 

[AnonymousDoctorGuyPerson]

This is a n=1 experience.

Knew a girl in undergrad who was a legacy at a top med school. Her grandfather and father both attended said med school, and when her grandfather passed away a large chunk of money was donated to the said school that ended up building a wing or building (I forget the details) with his name on it. As such, she thought she was a shoo-in for this school and was honestly a little cocky about it. I don't know her grades, but I know she pretty much never did any volunteering and scored around the 50% percentile on the old MCAT scale (which she thought was good enough). Needless to say, she didn't get in and stopped pursuing medicine altogether.

However, if she was at least a decent student and showed a little more devotion to medicine I'm sure she would've gotten a seat over others there.

 

[theKingLT]

As has been discussed on other threads, many people are not covered by FAP despite having limited resources. Does Harvard medical school have a need based aid system for medical students? Whatever a school offers to undergrads is not necessarily replicated in its medical school.

Ya I was referring to the med school which is entirely need based, and anecdotally I've heard it's quite strong. I didn't apply there in my cycle so I dont know all the specifics but I remember it having one of the lower national debt averages and they waive parental contribution for anyone under $100,000 income with scaling on anything higher. How an article about financial barriers, with a particular focus on a few harvard med students, fails to mention this, is beyond me.

As for FAP, the problems you mention are precisely why it should be discussed in such an article. Assuming the author has the intention of accurately portraying the med ed process from a personal financial perspective in order to promote awareness and change, it's silly to not include a key part like FAP that needs fixing.

 

[AnonymousDoctorGuyPerson]

So true. Just read a really good nytimes story on the hardships of applying to medical school when money is tight.

‘I Have a Ph.D. in Not Having Money’ (Published 2019)

Medical school is expensive for everyone. But for low-income students, the hidden costs can be prohibitive.

www.nytimes.com

"Hardships of applying to medical school when money is tight" - I feel that. Had my entire application in late since the funds I had for it had to go elsewhere then had to wait for a loan to distribute to cover the primary/secondary costs. When I tell my international friends the costs of applying to med school in the US they look at me like I'm living in some horror-fantasy novel.

 

[theKingLT]

FAP is not that big of an issue.
The big issue is the disadvantages that students face when they have to commute 2 hours to school, have to work part/full time through college just to afford living, and are then also expected to have the same amount of volunteering hours as those living on campus on a daddy's trust fund. FAP isn't that great anyway.

Well the article sadly does not address those bigger issues. On the pre-med side it focuses on the costs of test prep, mcat fees, and application fees, all of which are partially or fully covered by FAP. Both it's strengths and weaknesses should be discussed in the article but instead the author chooses to ignore it to paint an innacurate picture of discrimination. I'm not saying there's not financial discrimination in the process, I'm saying the article does a poor job of representing the situation which is a disservice to addressing the bigger issues.

 

[LizzyM]

Ya I was referring to the med school which is entirely need based, and anecdotally I've heard it's quite strong. I didn't apply there in my cycle so I dont know all the specifics but I remember it having one of the lower national debt averages and they waive parental contribution for anyone under $100,000 income with scaling on anything higher. How an article about financial barriers, with a particular focus on a few harvard med students, fails to mention this, is beyond me.

As for FAP, the problems you mention are precisely why it should be discussed in such an article. Assuming the author has the intention of accurately portraying the med ed process from a personal financial perspective in order to promote awareness and change, it's silly to not include a key part like FAP that needs fixing.

A need based system is different than the program being offered to undergrads at some schools such that tuition is zero if your family income is modest. Also, need based aid includes loans so it is not exactly free.

The point of the story is that students who have little starting out have to pinch pennies to meet the many expenses, anticipated and otherwise, that go along with being a student in higher education for eight years or more.

 

[Goro]

This is a n=1 experience.

Knew a girl in undergrad who was a legacy at a top med school. Her grandfather and father both attended said med school, and when her grandfather passed away a large chunk of money was donated to the said school that ended up building a wing or building (I forget the details) with his name on it. As such, she thought she was a shoo-in for this school and was honestly a little cocky about it. I don't know her grades, but I know she pretty much never did any volunteering and scored around the 50% percentile on the old MCAT scale (which she thought was good enough). Needless to say, she didn't get in and stopped pursuing medicine altogether.

However, if she was at least a decent student and showed a little more devotion to medicine I'm sure she would've gotten a seat over others there.

Indeed. We Adcoms have strong allergies to entitlement.

 

[LizzyM]

In the absence of family donations, how do you see legacy affecting medical school admissions?

There is no hard and fast rule. It can vary by school and within a school by year.

Bottom line: You can't change the past. Don't count on getting a boost if you are a legacy. Perhaps you 'll be pleasantly surprised but at least you won't be disappointed.

 

[tri99]

"Hardships of applying to medical school when money is tight" - I feel that. Had my entire application in late since the funds I had for it had to go elsewhere then had to wait for a loan to distribute to cover the primary/secondary costs. When I tell my international friends the costs of applying to med school in the US they look at me like I'm living in some horror-fantasy novel.

I feel that big time, against the advice of others I only applied to 6 schools this cycle due to financial restrictions. While my stats were reasonably in reach for ~10 additional med schools, I had to ask myself "can I justify spending $160 for a 1/100 shot at a school I know nothing about (except what is on their website)?" And as someone who comes from a middle-class family, I can't imagine the other barriers one who is truly disadvantaged faces before ever making it to that point.

 

[Biscuitboy11]

My son was a double legacy where I did my residency and my wife got her MD. It was his first choice. We donated thousands. 3.5 cgpa and 3.6 sgpa. 32 avg Mcat, well within schools metrics. Got permanently waitlisted. Needless to say donations ceased immediately. Guess several thousand is not enough. He went elsewhere and is now a 2nd yr resident. BTW, school makes a.big deal about alumni support and legacy applicants.

Ditto. Daughter applied to school where my wife and I were both undergrads and med school (top 10-20). Not big donors, but steady. Daughter did not get interview, was in the top quartile for our school’s stats. Now M1 at top 10 school with a bit of money thrown in. As I mentioned to the school in a mildly snarky note, the whole thing was kind of dumb on their part. 1)no one would bat an eye at an interview given her stats/application. 2)if yield is a thing, I bet alumni applicants are more likely to accept an offer than others. 3)if you know a qualified applicant has doc parents, you know you won’t need to spend money on financial aid and you can use the money elsewhere. 4) my perception was that she might have been better off not mentioning physician parents- I can just picture the eye-rolling when reading about double legacy parents. 5)ended up being the silent R- would it have killed them to send a nice note?
All’s well that ends well. BTW, daughter took no science classes in undergrad, then eventually worked full time as a scribe and later at a psych hospital while taking evening science classes. Wife and I had nothing to do with her application/applying (stubborn independent kid).

 

[Goro]

In the absence of family donations, how do you see legacy affecting medical school admissions?

At my school it might yield an interview, but it's the candidate's app that will seal the deal, not the family connections.

 

[AnonymousDoctorGuyPerson]

3)if you know a qualified applicant has doc parents, you know you won’t need to spend money on financial aid and you can use the money elsewhere.

Now I know you didn't mean this in a negative way, but the premise of point 3 is kind of one of the major issues of entering medicine, no? It's essentially saying a kid from a high-income family is a preferred candidate (all else being equal) since they're less of a burden.

 

[Biscuitboy11]

Now I know you didn't mean this in a negative way, but the premise of point 3 is kind of one of the major issues of entering medicine, no? It's essentially saying a kid from a high-income family is a preferred candidate (all else being equal) since they're less of a burden.

You’re right, of course. My rational brain is against legacy preference, just being a parent. However since schools have to run a business, and the present model is what it is, a worst-case scenario for a school that has committed to a no-loan policy would be for 100% of the admitted class to qualify for COA scholarships, and the best would be if 100% of the class had parents with incomes above the scholarship/grant level. The schools only see financials after admittance, so they have no way to predict which way things tip. To rephrase your response, I agree it’s not right, but it’s the way it is.
I still plan to give my med school a good amount of money, because they gave me a great opportunity which I am grateful for. And the money will be earmarked to only be used for student tuition reduction.

 

[LizzyM]

Ditto. Daughter applied to school where my wife and I were both undergrads and med school (top 10-20). Not big donors, but steady. Daughter did not get interview, was in the top quartile for our school’s stats. Now M1 at top 10 school with a bit of money thrown in. As I mentioned to the school in a mildly snarky note, the whole thing was kind of dumb on their part. 1)no one would bat an eye at an interview given her stats/application. 2)if yield is a thing, I bet alumni applicants are more likely to accept an offer than others. 3)if you know a qualified applicant has doc parents, you know you won’t need to spend money on financial aid and you can use the money elsewhere. 4) my perception was that she might have been better off not mentioning physician parents- I can just picture the eye-rolling when reading about double legacy parents. 5)ended up being the silent R- would it have killed them to send a nice note?
All’s well that ends well. BTW, daughter took no science classes in undergrad, then eventually worked full time as a scribe and later at a psych hospital while taking evening science classes. Wife and I had nothing to do with her application/applying (stubborn independent kid).

If she had had the choice of your alma mater or the top 10 school with money thrown in, which would she have chosen? Your school might have seen that she was too good for them and taken a pass as a yield protection. Or they had a mandate to seek more ethnic, academic, economic & geographic diversity that year in particular and your daughter was not going to tick those boxes for them.

Also, the admissions committee does not get any input from the development office so while we may see that your highest education attained was at our school, we will not know whether you've ever given a penny, or a million, to the school.

The silent R is an abomination. It wouldn't kill them to send an email rejection in May or June.

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

how will admissions committee know about legacy/parents contributions? my spouse is an alumni at top 10. we don't give any donations but spouse has working relationship i.e. refers complex cases so generates good revenue. Our child is aiming for that school for next cycle and expecting their stats will be in top 10%.

 

[ThetisAntithesis]

So then why do the schools ask about legacy/connections in the secondary if it doesn't make a difference?

 

[Pluto98]

I've not heard this mentioned except in a positive way to say that the applicant "showed grit" or had a "long distance traveled" or "pulled themself up by their bootstraps" . I've never heard it said that we should admit someone because they are poor and our school is expensive.

But to what extent is this a positive? If it were me, and I saw a kid come from a poor family with good grades/stats, they would be a near auto admit because you know they didnt have the same opportunities in life and it was really "all them". I feel like schools say they take this into account but really to what extent?

 

[LizzyM]

So then why do the schools ask about legacy/connections in the secondary if it doesn't make a difference?

Because sometimes it will tip the balance. And some schools hate to skip over someone who is a multigenerational legacy on their mother's side (different last name).

But to what extent is this a positive? If it were me, and I saw a kid come from a poor family with good grades/stats, they would be a near auto admit because you know they didnt have the same opportunities in life and it was really "all them". I feel like schools say they take this into account but really to what extent?

Again, it can be what tips the balance or it is taken into account in a holistic review. One adcom might argue against admission saying, "but the community service is very light" and someone will counter with, "but this person's family income growing up was $25K and they have been working 25 hours/week in as a waiter in a restaurant -- probably making good tips in that resort town -- from the age of 20... that certainly gives experience dealing with people who aren't always at their best-- and teamwork, too."

 

[Goro]

how will admissions committee know about legacy/parents contributions? my spouse is an alumni at top 10. we don't give any donations but spouse has working relationship i.e. refers complex cases so generates good revenue. Our child is aiming for that school for next cycle and expecting their stats will be in top 10%.

The Admissions dean is likely to let them know.

 

[KnightDoc]

My son was a double legacy where I did my residency and my wife got her MD. It was his first choice. We donated thousands. 3.5 cgpa and 3.6 sgpa. 32 avg Mcat, well within schools metrics. Got permanently waitlisted. Needless to say donations ceased immediately. Guess several thousand is not enough. He went elsewhere and is now a 2nd yr resident. BTW, school makes a.big deal about alumni support and legacy applicants.

How much is "thousands"? In a world where one year's tuition at a private school is over $60K, a few thousand spread over years really isn't enough (as you have seen) to buy special treatment.

If that were not the case, nobody who wasn't a legacy would have a shot at most schools! As people have jokingly said, but it is probably true, the threshold to really have an advantage, if there is one to be had at all, is certainly in the 6 and 7 figures.

So yeah, the school will be fine with or without your several hundred dollar annual donation, and, as you saw, the prospect of donations ceasing immediately did not influence a decision to take a legacy with good but not spectacular stats over someone else who either had better stats, better ECs, better LORs, better essays, whose parents gave even more money, or some combination of those.

 

[Pluto98]

Because sometimes it will tip the balance. And some schools hate to skip over someone who is a multigenerational legacy on their mother's side (different last name).



Again, it can be what tips the balance or it is taken into account in a holistic review. One adcom might argue against admission saying, "but the community service is very light" and someone will counter with, "but this person's family income growing up was $25K and they have been working 25 hours/week in as a waiter in a restaurant -- probably making good tips in that resort town -- from the age of 20... that certainly gives experience dealing with people who aren't always at their best-- and teamwork, too."

That is very insightful! In a similar regard, how is URM status discussed in committee meetings. Are people blatant about it "we dont have enough Black/Hispanic applicants" or is it more of an everyone thinks the same thing but no one says it?

 

[Angus Avagadro]

how will admissions committee know about legacy/parents contributions? my spouse is an alumni at top 10. we don't give any donations but spouse has working relationship i.e. refers complex cases so generates good revenue. Our child is aiming for that school for next cycle and expecting their stats will be in top 10%.

How much is "thousands"? In a world where one year's tuition at a private school is over $60K, a few thousand spread over years really isn't enough (as you have seen) to buy special treatment.

If that were not the case, nobody who wasn't a legacy would have a shot at most schools! As people have jokingly said, but it is probably true, the threshold to really have an advantage, if there is one to be had at all, is certainly in the 6 and 7 figures.

So yeah, the school will be fine with or without your several hundred dollar annual donation, and, as you saw, the prospect of donations ceasing immediately did not influence a decision to take a legacy with good but not spectacular stats over someone else who either had better stats, better ECs, better LORs, better essays, whose parents gave even more money, or some combination of those.

Yep, no disagreement. I dont consider thousands paltry, but you are right, it is a matter of scale. My wife and I were married as students with no financial support from family, so we were in a hole to start out. I dont consider any med school admission worth the cost we now know would be required to get their attention. We still believe the school was less than candid about the whole legacy thing.

 

[ChymeofPassion]

The whole legacy/special interest groups in higher education is an abomination. Isnt it something like 43 percent of the white people at Havard are legacies/special interest, and 27 percent of those would not have been admitted without some kind of connection. Income-disparity has a root cause, and it's funny how these woke politicians refuse to talk about something they've directly benefited from while decrying billionaires.

/rant

 

[Goro]

That is very insightful! In a similar regard, how is URM status discussed in committee meetings. Are people blatant about it "we dont have enough Black/Hispanic applicants" or is it more of an everyone thinks the same thing but no one says it?

At our Adcom meetings, we're not allowed to discuss this.

 

[ASPEN'S NIGHTMARE]

What happens if someone's parents are both alumni of the school, but the parents do not make any contributions at all??

Would this be seen as a negative factor in the eyes of adcoms and have a negative effect on their child's application??

 

[KnightDoc]

What happens if someone's parents are both alumni of the school, but the parents do not make any contributions at all??

Would this be seen as a negative factor in the eyes of adcoms and have a negative effect on their child's application??

I wouldn't imagine it would be a negative, since at worst it would just be seen as another applicant without a significant connection to the school. Most likely, though, while an adcom would know about the double legacy (because they explicitly ask), they wouldn't get a detailed list of what the parents did or didn't contribute.

Why would they punish an otherwise desirable candidate because parents are grads who don't contribute? This would only make sense if likelihood to make future contributions were an admission factor, and I have never heard that's the case.

Bottom line -- if your parents aren't big donors there is probably no difference between relatively small donations and no donation, and you probably don't get a meaningful advantage in either case.