Transferring (non-APA to APA program)

[psych.dreamer]

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I've recently gotten accepted into a PhD Clinical Psychology program. I was informed during the interview (and from their website) that it was NOT APA accredited (although it is designed to meet APA standards and requirements for KY licensure). I didn't realize how many complications that could cause in the future for internships, post-doc, licensure, etc. until I started reading some forums. I'm already signed up for classes and everything though (today is supposed to be my first day).

There is a PsyD program located about an hour from where I live that is definitely APA accredited, and they seem to have high internship matching and licensure rates. It looks good. I wouldn't be able to start this program until next Fall now, though. So my question is, should I stick with the program I'm in for now and attempt to transfer the credits a year from now (I don't know how likely/not likely it is to transfer them in from a non-APA program, especially since they are online courses, and since I would be switching from PhD to PsyD) *OR* withdraw from the program entirely and wait to apply to the PsyD that I'm interested in.

What are your thoughts?

 

[smalltownpsych]

The APA accreditation process by which a cohort of students have to attend a non-accredited school in order for that school to receive accreditation is just one more Catch-22 type of scenario that seems to happen a lot in our field. Which one costs more? What happens if you are in the inaugural cohort of a school that does get APA accreditation? Are you then grandfathered in in some way? Probably not for some of the license boards that I have dealt with. Maybe you should work on getting some more research experience and apply to a fully-funded and fully-accredited program.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

There really isn't a way to, "transfer" from one program to another. Typically a program will only accept a handful of credits from another institution (if they accept any credits at all). You'd have to re-apply and then after being accepted look at what credits they may be willing to waive.

If you aren't planning on staying at the first program, you probably shouldn't start there because it will cost time/effort/money/etc. that you won't be able to recoup.

 

[erg923]

I've recently gotten accepted into a PhD Clinical Psychology program. I was informed during the interview (and from their website) that it was NOT APA accredited (although it is designed to meet APA standards and requirements for KY licensure). I didn't realize how many complications that could cause in the future for internships, post-doc, licensure, etc. until I started reading some forums. I'm already signed up for classes and everything though (today is supposed to be my first day).

There is a PsyD program located about an hour from where I live that is definitely APA accredited, and they seem to have high internship matching and licensure rates. It looks good. I wouldn't be able to start this program until next Fall now, though. So my question is, should I stick with the program I'm in for now and attempt to transfer the credits a year from now (I don't know how likely/not likely it is to transfer them in from a non-APA program, especially since they are online courses, and since I would be switching from PhD to PsyD) *OR* withdraw from the program entirely and wait to apply to the PsyD that I'm interested in.

What are your thoughts?

withdraw

 

[psych.meout]

I've recently gotten accepted into a PhD Clinical Psychology program. I was informed during the interview (and from their website) that it was NOT APA accredited (although it is designed to meet APA standards and requirements for KY licensure). I didn't realize how many complications that could cause in the future for internships, post-doc, licensure, etc. until I started reading some forums. I'm already signed up for classes and everything though (today is supposed to be my first day).

There is a PsyD program located about an hour from where I live that is definitely APA accredited, and they seem to have high internship matching and licensure rates. It looks good. I wouldn't be able to start this program until next Fall now, though. So my question is, should I stick with the program I'm in for now and attempt to transfer the credits a year from now (I don't know how likely/not likely it is to transfer them in from a non-APA program, especially since they are online courses, and since I would be switching from PhD to PsyD) *OR* withdraw from the program entirely and wait to apply to the PsyD that I'm interested in.

What are your thoughts?

Wait, are the courses at the Non-APA program in which you are slated to begin all online?

Is this an online only doctoral program?

 

[erg923]

Wait, are the courses at the Non-APA program in which you are slated to begin all online?

Is this an online only doctoral program?

I'm pretty sure I know which program he's referencing, and no, it's not online, but I think it has online pieces.

 

[psych.meout]

I'm pretty sure I know which program he's referencing, and no, it's not online, but I think it has online pieces.

Ah, ok, still sounds pretty dicey to me to have a doctoral program with any online components, right?

 

[MCParent]

withdraw

Yup.
Probably you would not be able to transfer course credit and it would be a waste of money and time.

 

[entitlement]

I am with the "withdraws." Definitely not worth the time, trouble, and money, especially knowing that it is a large online component.

 

[psych.dreamer]

There really isn't a way to, "transfer" from one program to another. Typically a program will only accept a handful of credits from another institution (if they accept any credits at all). You'd have to re-apply and then after being accepted look at what credits they may be willing to waive.

If you aren't planning on staying at the first program, you probably shouldn't start there because it will cost time/effort/money/etc. that you won't be able to recoup.

I guess I worded that incorrectly. By transfer, I did mean to just transfer the credits earned in that year, if any of them were accepted. I understand I would have to apply to the program and be admitted first. As for wasting time, effort, and money, and I just feel like I would be wasting time if I didn't take any classes until next year. I'm 24. I've been out of my bachelor's program for over 2 years now and kind of just feel like I'm getting nowhere by now. I know there's people far older than me that pursue these programs, I just hate the idea of putting all classes off for another year.

 

[psych.dreamer]

Wait, are the courses at the Non-APA program in which you are slated to begin all online?

Is this an online only doctoral program?

Yes, the entire first year is supposed to be online. Then the 2nd year is on-campus classes w/ practicum & dissertation. 3rd year is online classes, more practicum and dissertation. 4th year is an internship. It's at University of the Cumberlands (in Kentucky)

 

[temppsych123]

The probability of getting online-only classes to transfer for credits at an APA-accredited program seems...slim. Better off spending this year getting research experience/exposure so you'll be a more competitive applicant to apply to PhD programs. Or, if you're not at all interested in research, looking into master's programs (MFT, MSW, etc.) that can get you where you want to be.

 

[Istilldontknow]

I agree with those saying to withdraw. And as far as your age, im 26 and just starting this year at a psyd program. I would focus on the extra experience you will gain in your "off" years to help you get into a funded and accredited school.

 

[psychstudent5]

I agree with everyone else that withdrawing may be your best bet. The thing is that once you fully engage in the program, even though you are anticipating looking into applying an APA accredited program, it'll be harder to withdraw because of the amount of time, effort and money spent. Also, I don't see many APA accredited programs accepting online course credits. I would take this year to work in a research capacity and focus your efforts on reapplying to accredited AND funded programs.

 

[entitlement]

I'll echo what psychstudent5 and others have said - if you think putting things off another year or two is setting you behind, then spend the extra time getting research experience. Even if you wait a year or two, you would be relatively young or just about the average age of your entering doctoral student.

 

[LETSGONYR]

I was curious and looked at the website. I'd direct your attention to these two sections...

(From the FAQ):
Do you assist in securing an internship, or how do we secure one?
Pre-doctoral internships are organized by the Association of Postdoctoral and Internship Centers (APPIC). The Ph.D. in Clinical Psychology requires that a student complete an internship organized by APPIC.

(From the Admissions --> Internship page):
...APPIC established a policy on Doctoral Program Associates (see link below) which states that, effective with the 2018 APPIC Match (i.e., the 2017-18 application cycle) for internship positions beginning in 2018 or after, doctoral programs must meet any one of the following criteria in order for their students to participate in the APPIC Match or Post-Match Vacancy Service (PMVS):

1. The doctoral program is accredited by the American Psychological Association (APA) or the Canadian Psychological Association (CPA). Regional or state accreditation or designation by any other entity is insufficient to meet this criterion;

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You have to go on various sections of the website to find out, but at least how it's stated now, you're required to complete an APPIC internship and you literally will not be eligible to apply for one. I'd withdraw.

 

[smalltownpsych]

Yes, the entire first year is supposed to be online. Then the 2nd year is on-campus classes w/ practicum & dissertation. 3rd year is online classes, more practicum and dissertation. 4th year is an internship. It's at University of the Cumberlands (in Kentucky)

This type of online program probably won't get APA accredited. My earlier post was assuming a new yet reputable program. This one sounds like they are just another predatory type of school that is after the easy money from student loans. I wouldn't give them a cent.

 

[Ollie123]

Don't think of it as losing a year's worth of time, think of it as saving tens of thousands of dollars.

This program will not help you become a psychologist. The classes are unlikely to be "counted" towards another degree. Moreover, having to send places a transcript from a school like that could very well hurt your chances of being admitted. You aren't wasting a year, you are saving yourself a decade or more of problems/setbacks (excessive loans + limited career options?). Spend it working, read some "psych" books if you want and enjoy your life.

 

[temppsych123]

I was curious and looked at the website. I'd direct your attention to these two sections...

(From the FAQ):
Do you assist in securing an internship, or how do we secure one?
Pre-doctoral internships are organized by the Association of Postdoctoral and Internship Centers (APPIC). The Ph.D. in Clinical Psychology requires that a student complete an internship organized by APPIC.

(From the Admissions --> Internship page):
...APPIC established a policy on Doctoral Program Associates (see link below) which states that, effective with the 2018 APPIC Match (i.e., the 2017-18 application cycle) for internship positions beginning in 2018 or after, doctoral programs must meet any one of the following criteria in order for their students to participate in the APPIC Match or Post-Match Vacancy Service (PMVS):

1. The doctoral program is accredited by the American Psychological Association (APA) or the Canadian Psychological Association (CPA). Regional or state accreditation or designation by any other entity is insufficient to meet this criterion;

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You have to go on various sections of the website to find out, but at least how it's stated now, you're required to complete an APPIC internship and you literally will not be eligible to apply for one. I'd withdraw.

I just checked out the APPIC FAQ about this: https://www.appic.org/Match/FAQs/Applicants/Eligibility-and-Participation#q2 You will only be eligible to participate in the match from 2018-onward (relevant to you at this point since you haven't started yet) if your program is accredited or has been granted an initial accreditation site visit by APA/CPA. If that hasn't happened yet (e.g. your program isn't far enough along in the process to get accredited) you won't be able to participate in the match. BIG RED FLAG.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

All good points, although to be fair to the OP, I think the main question is whether it's worth it to stay in the program for a year and knock out some classes while re-applying for accredited programs, or just withdraw now.

As with others who've responded, I would say the latter (i.e., withdraw now). It will save you money, and as the classes are online, the likelihood of them transferring is (at least in my opinion) minimal. Your time would be better spent getting additional research experience, either in a paid RA position, or as a volunteer while also possibly working part- or full-time. And, as Ollie said, maybe just doing some related reading on the side.

 

[psych.dreamer]

Thank you all for the advice and information. Since the majority vote seems to be to withdraw, I have went ahead and submitted my official withdrawal notice to them. Hopefully I can find something Psychology-related to do in the meantime and manage to get into another program.

 

[ClinicalABA]

While it may seem that you are delaying things by not enrolling now, in the end, this decision is likely to save you many years of wasted effort and frustration (as well as tens- or even hundreds of thousands of dollars). I'm sure it was a difficult decision, but I commend you on making a tough choice. Best of luck with your pursuit of further experience and education.

 

[bcliff]

The APA accreditation process by which a cohort of students have to attend a non-accredited school in order for that school to receive accreditation is just one more Catch-22 type of scenario that seems to happen a lot in our field. Which one costs more? What happens if you are in the inaugural cohort of a school that does get APA accreditation? Are you then grandfathered in in some way? Probably not for some of the license boards that I have dealt with. Maybe you should work on getting some more research experience and apply to a fully-funded and fully-accredited program.

Just as a point of clarification, APA will accredit programs that have not graduated a cohort of students. My program received initial accreditation ~15 years ago, and the date of accreditation was at least one semester before the program ever graduated a student. Our DCT was very mindful of that and worked with CoA and current students to ensure that all students earned accredited PhDs.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

It might've changed, and I might be wrong, but I believe it at least used to be the case that the program needed to graduate a class to earn accreditation, but that accreditation status was then retroactive to the date of the last site visit (which may have occurred while the graduated class was still enrolled in the program).

I know they've worked on trying to streamline this and the internship accreditation process in recent years. However, I believe internship sites are still required to have interns on board before they're even allowed to apply for APPIC membership, let alone APA accreditation.

 

[bcliff]

It might've changed, and I might be wrong, but I believe it at least used to be the case that the program needed to graduate a class to earn accreditation, but that accreditation status was then retroactive to the date of the last site visit (which may have occurred while the graduated class was still enrolled in the program).

I know they've worked on trying to streamline this and the internship accreditation process in recent years. However, I believe internship sites are still required to have interns on board before they're even allowed to apply for APPIC membership, let alone APA accreditation.

I may be confused on the retroactive piece. I think you're right, I know that in my university's case, the accreditation visit, which is the date used for determining accreditation status (I think), was before our university ever graduated a student. But, I do think that it was all but guaranteed (If not officially guaranteed/determined) that students who graduated were earning accredited degrees.