Transitional Year Internship???

[FatKid]

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Hi everyone,

Obviously, many Anesthesia programs are now going to full 4 year programs, but there are still some 3 year programs out there beginning in PGY-2.

In order to be able to apply for the PGY2-4 3-year programs what type of an internship do I need to do?

Internal Medicine? Surgery? or will a transitional year suffice?

Thanks

 

[Icefrog]

Hi everyone,

Obviously, many Anesthesia programs are now going to full 4 year programs, but there are still some 3 year programs out there beginning in PGY-2.

In order to be able to apply for the PGY2-4 3-year programs what type of an internship do I need to do?

Internal Medicine? Surgery? or will a transitional year suffice?

Thanks

You can do any of the three you listed. You just need to make sure your intern year meets the requirements for anesthesia, which is something like 6 months of inpatient care, 1 month of ER, and 1 month of ICU.

 

[FatKid]

You can do any of the three you listed. You just need to make sure your intern year meets the requirements for anesthesia, which is something like 6 months of inpatient care, 1 month of ER, and 1 month of ICU.

Hi Icefrog. Thanks for your reply.

Do you know what website I can look at to figure out exactly what the internship requirements are for anesthesia?

 

[shift_roro]

Hi Icefrog. Thanks for your reply.

Do you know what website I can look at to figure out exactly what the internship requirements are for anesthesia?

http://www.acgme.org/acWebsite/downloads/RRC_progReq/040_anesthesiology_07012008_u03102008.pdf

Pages 2-3 under "Clinical Base Year"

 

[AnesFuture]

So I have been told that the EM requirement only pertains to people that get their Clinical Base Year Training at the Anesthesia training location (ie Categoricals).

For those that do a prelim or transitional year (advanced) the EM requirement is not necessary because the ACGME accredits the PGY1 programs individually.

All PGY1 programs meet the inpatient and critical care months needed.

Can anyone confirm or deny this?

 

[Icefrog]

So I have been told that the EM requirement only pertains to people that get their Clinical Base Year Training at the Anesthesia training location (ie Categoricals).

For those that do a prelim or transitional year (advanced) the EM requirement is not necessary because the ACGME accredits the PGY1 programs individually.

All PGY1 programs meet the inpatient and critical care months needed.

Can anyone confirm or deny this?

The link that shift_roro provided says that a block of EM is required regardless of whether the CBY is part of a categorical program or is done independently.

When I interviewed for prelims and TYs, some PDs talked about the EM experience at their program specifically because they know it is a requirement for anesthesiology.

 

[AnesFuture]

The link that shift_roro provided says that a block of EM is required regardless of whether the CBY is part of a categorical program or is done independently.

When I interviewed for prelims and TYs, some PDs talked about the EM experience at their program specifically because they know it is a requirement for anesthesiology.

So I think the wording is a little funny, but I am still pretty sure it pertains to the CBY that makes a 3yr Anes program a 4 yr Anes program.

TY and Prelim programs are accredited separately. So if you do an accredited TY program or Prelim program and then do an accredited 3 yr Anes program you meet all requirements to graduate. (This is what all TY and Prelim programs have been telling me).

However for an Anes program to have 4 yr accreditation they must meet the CBY requirements outlined in the link and that's why all Anes programs talk about their EM month during their CBY.

 

[pgy13]

So I think the wording is a little funny, but I am still pretty sure it pertains to the CBY that makes a 3yr Anes program a 4 yr Anes program.

TY and Prelim programs are accredited separately. So if you do an accredited TY program or Prelim program and then do an accredited 3 yr Anes program you meet all requirements to graduate. (This is what all TY and Prelim programs have been telling me).

However for an Anes program to have 4 yr accreditation they must meet the CBY requirements outlined in the link and that's why all Anes programs talk about their EM month during their CBY.

Nope, icefrog is correct

 

[AnesFuture]

Nope, icefrog is correct

hmmm okay. I'm just relaying what prelim program directors and TY program directors have been telling me. And what current residents (CA1 and up) that did advanced programs and never took EM during their CBY have told me (considering they will be graduating with full accreditation and since there are tons of prelim and TY programs that don't offer EM).

 

[Icefrog]

hmmm okay. I'm just relaying what prelim program directors and TY program directors have been telling me. And what current residents (CA1 and up) that did advanced programs and never took EM during their CBY have told me (considering they will be graduating with full accreditation and since there are tons of prelim and TY programs that don't offer EM).

Well, if that's the case, then referring to this paragraph in that document:

"One year of the resident's total training must be the Clinical Base
Year, which should provide the resident with 12 months of broad
education in medical disciplines relevant to the practice of
anesthesiology. The Clinical Base Year usually precedes training
in clinical anesthesia. It is strongly recommended that the Clinical
Base Year be completed before the resident begins the CA-2
year; the Clinical Base Year, however, must be completed before
the resident begins the CA-3 year."

It seems possible that the residents who didn't do EM during their CBY could do it sometime before their CA-3 year.

Also, where are you getting your information? I don't believe there are "tons" of TY programs that don't offer EM, simply because an EM block is required for TY programs to receive accreditation from the ACGME.

The Transitional Year Committee of the Accreditation Council for Graduate Medical Education (ACGME) sets requirements for all Transitional Year programs. These requirements are as follows:

• A minimum of 24 weeks of disciplines that provide fundamental clinical skills (Emergency Medicine, Family Practice, Internal Medicine, OB/GYN, Pediatrics or Surgery) plus:
• A minimum of 4 weeks of Emergency Medicine
• A minimum of 4 weeks (140 hours) of ambulatory care from Family Practice, Internal Medicine, OB/GYN, Pediatrics, or Surgery
• A minimum of 8 weeks of elective

(Taken from the Harbor-UCLA TY program website)

 

[AnesFuture]

Sorry, you're right on the TY programs. It's the prelim programs that don't offer EM many times. But some prelims definitely do.

Like I said, this is what various prelim program directors have told me and why I wanted to double check.

Well, if that's the case, then referring to this paragraph in that document:

"One year of the resident’s total training must be the Clinical Base
Year, which should provide the resident with 12 months of broad
education in medical disciplines relevant to the practice of
anesthesiology. The Clinical Base Year usually precedes training
in clinical anesthesia. It is strongly recommended that the Clinical
Base Year be completed before the resident begins the CA-2
year; the Clinical Base Year, however, must be completed before
the resident begins the CA-3 year."

It seems possible that the residents who didn't do EM during their CBY could do it sometime before their CA-3 year.

Also, where are you getting your information? I don't believe there are "tons" of TY programs that don't offer EM, simply because an EM block is required for TY programs to receive accreditation from the ACGME.

The Transitional Year Committee of the Accreditation Council for Graduate Medical Education (ACGME) sets requirements for all Transitional Year programs. These requirements are as follows:

• A minimum of 24 weeks of disciplines that provide fundamental clinical skills (Emergency Medicine, Family Practice, Internal Medicine, OB/GYN, Pediatrics or Surgery) plus:
• A minimum of 4 weeks of Emergency Medicine
• A minimum of 4 weeks (140 hours) of ambulatory care from Family Practice, Internal Medicine, OB/GYN, Pediatrics, or Surgery
• A minimum of 8 weeks of elective

(Taken from the Harbor-UCLA TY program website)

 

[shift_roro]

when i interviewed for prelims and tys, some pds talked about the em experience at their program specifically because they know it is a requirement for anesthesiology.

+1

 

[Code Brown]

Sorry, you're right on the TY programs. It's the prelim programs that don't offer EM many times. But some prelims definitely do.

Like I said, this is what various prelim program directors have told me and why I wanted to double check.

I think this is a rule that came out with our year (CA0 - I will not be lumped in with the medicine peeps), so it would not apply to the current CA1 and CA2 residents. The PD at my IM prelim program had to switch several peeps' schedules to make sure we all get the EM requirement met (6 Anes prelims).