UCLA vs. CCLCM

[happykid123]

Hello everyone! Thanks for your help as April 30th very quickly approaches - would find your advice helpful!

The Choice: UCLA vs. CCLCM

UCLA
Pros:

• Nationally ranked program
• Embedded within a university, so there's lots of interdisciplinary work available
• Close to family
• Great weather
• Abundant opportunities beyond research

Cons:

• Higher stress with clinical grades, shelf exams
• Curriculum changes
• Large class = perhaps less personal (?)

CCLCM
Pros:

• Low stress environment with no clinical grades or exams
• Small class size = personalized attention
• Abundant time for research
• Wonderful mid-western kindness

Cons:

• Far away from family
• Air travel health concerns for me and family amidst COVID19
• Not nationally ranked
• Not so great weather
• Degree is from Case Western, not the Cleveland Clinic

Cost is not too different between the two for me, so I really want to choose the school with the best program especially in this new Step 1 P/F era.

Thank you!!

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[deleted972488]

One thing to keep in mind is that on the surface the cost may not be too different, but CCLCM is a 5 year program, so by going there you'd be delaying earning a physician salary by one year, effectively making it significantly more expensive.

 

[Etopn23]

I would be happy too, the Geffen and CCLCM.... I would choose UCLA since I much prefer the west coast however if you want to do research IMO CCLCM is the better option.

Your options are wide open at either program.

 

[happykid123]

One thing to keep in mind is that on the surface the cost may not be too different, but CCLCM is a 5 year program, so by going there you'd be delaying earning a physician salary by one year, effectively making it significantly more expensive.

Hi @PapayaJambalaya !
Thanks for your comment. I probably would extend UCLA to be five years as well to take advantage of some of the cool programs; that being said, would that change your answer?

 

[nymedschoolfan]

UCLA is a much better place to live than CCLCM and you ave family in LA which is nice

 

[deleted972488]

Hi @PapayaJambalaya !
Thanks for your comment. I probably would extend UCLA to be five years as well to take advantage of some of the cool programs; that being said, would that change your answer?

I see. Personally I would still choose UCLA because I'd rather live in LA than Cleveland, especially if you have family in the area.

 

[seeinghowitgoes]

CCLCM matches at least as well as UCLA and Cleveland Clinic’s brand is excellent across the country within medicine. Both are powerhouses for research and well-known, so the whole “not nationally ranked” thing should play zero role.

Location is a tough one - anecdotally a lot of my friends from Cali who were in the Midwest for Med school go back, so I think knowing you’d prefer the weather and life out there is definitely a point for UCLA. That said, there is benefit to getting out of your comfort zone for a few years - it’s why I left my home state for grad school and residency despite wanting to be nearer to family, and those are also the times I’ve grown the most. Ultimately, you can always go back to Cali (look at Cclcm’s match list - plenty head west). I think it’s a wash as to what you prioritize (being near family and comfort now or getting away from the known and finding growth in a new place).

As for research, the way cclcm is setup gives you a lot of flexibility to actually pursue that interest, but UCLA definitely has more interdisciplinary stuff going on as a university. That is to say, I think you’ll be able to succeed in the extra-clinical stuff at either one and each will have its own challenges (finding the right project at cclcm if you want something super interdisciplinary and finding the time at UCLA to do as much work).

Sorry saying all this basically is me just saying ultimately don’t think you can pick incorrectly, and don’t overthink the negative things too much even those can be positives if reframed.

 

[globalhealthpremed123]

UCLA -- don't underestimate the better weather and family for support

 

[nymedschoolfan]

UCLA -- don't underestimate the better weather and family for support

100% agree, if it was Chicago or NYC I'd have more thought but Cleveland.. should've seen the episode where they tried to hype it up on the Bachelor.

 

[TAVR4life]

One thing to keep in mind is that on the surface the cost may not be too different, but CCLCM is a 5 year program, so by going there you'd be delaying earning a physician salary by one year, effectively making it significantly more expensive.

CCLCM is free tuition so no it’s not necessarily more expensive unless you’re getting a significant scholarship at UCLA also. You won’t be able to pay back your student loans in one year of having an attending salary. In fact the debt nearly doubles by the time you have paid the loans off as an attending. Can do an extra degree for free in that extra year and apply for research grants at CCLCM especially if you’re already planning for five years.

The comment by OP about CCLCM not being nationally recognized doesn’t make sense, you’re a student of two major powerhouses in medicine, Cleveland Clinic (often ranked #2-4 best hospital in the US with new campuses in London and Abu Dhabi) and Case Western (which is historically a top 20-25 ranked medical school). The prestige and brand name are there.

The MD degree is awarded from Case Western for accreditation purposes but it does have Cleveland Clinic listed on the MD degree and you graduate with “Special Qualifications in Biomedical Research” (also on the degree) which is equivalent to Honors in Research. Case Western medical school is actually on the Cleveland Clinic campus.

No grades and no tests plus USMLE Step 1 being P/F is a huge plus, allows you to really relax a bit more while focusing on getting research publications and drastically increases your chances of getting into a top speciality. The match list is impressive, several competitive specialities matching at Harvard, Hopkins, Stanford, Duke, Yale, Cleveland Clinic, Mayo, etc.

Obviously Los Angeles >> Cleveland but cost of living will be much cheaper in Cleveland.

 

[deleted972488]

CCLCM is free tuition so no it’s not necessarily more expensive unless you’re getting a significant scholarship at UCLA also

They said cost would be about the same, so I assumed that meant a significant scholarship at UCLA, given CCLCM's free tuition. Regardless, they said they would probably take 5 years at UCLA as well so my entire point is moot.

 

[Klyx]

This is reductive, but the choice here seems to be between better location vs lower stress clinical rotations. Both are important and can serve as legitimate reasons to pick one excellent program over the other. Regarding the ungraded clinicals at CCLCM, you should confirm that they have no internal rankings or AOA. Also, there is always a possibility that they may introduce grades now that Step 1 is P/F, and medical schools will be under even more pressure to stratify their students.

 

[TAVR4life]

Match list for CCLCM

CCLCM Class of 2019 Match Results

CCLCM Class of 2018 Match Results

CCLCM Class of 2017 Match Results

 

[TAVR4life]

This is reductive, but the choice here seems to be between better location vs lower stress clinical rotations. Both are important and can serve as legitimate reasons to pick one excellent program over the other. Regarding the ungraded clinicals at CCLCM, you should confirm that they have no internal rankings or AOA. Also, there is always a possibility that they may introduce grades now that Step 1 is P/F, and medical schools will be under even more pressure to stratify their students.

No AOA and no internal ranking.

Research publications and USMLE Step 2 CK scores are likely going to be major factors.

 

[Yhwach]

I'd pick CCLCM because no grades is a sweet deal

 

[thetheatrecat]

This is reductive, but the choice here seems to be between better location vs lower stress clinical rotations. Both are important and can serve as legitimate reasons to pick one excellent program over the other. Regarding the ungraded clinicals at CCLCM, you should confirm that they have no internal rankings or AOA. Also, there is always a possibility that they may introduce grades now that Step 1 is P/F, and medical schools will be under even more pressure to stratify their students.

In terms of your suggestion that they would introduce grades, this will not happen. Our faculty have been advocating for P/F Step 1 for years. They have also informed us that grades will not be introduced-it's against what CCLCM stands for.

OP-if you have any questions you want to ask a current CCLCM'er, feel free to DM me. I love CCLCM and I think it's the best place for me, but it's certainly not perfect for everyone.