USMLE to go from 3 steps down to 2 steps

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The USMLE is going to be changed from a 3 step to a 2 step process as shown below. The exact timing of this implementation should be determined at the FSMB spring meeting next week.


USMLEA.gif


USMLEB.gif



Here is some background on the rationale:
http://weill.cornell.edu/mdphd/bm~doc/changes-to-the-usmle-an-a.pdf

http://www.apcprods.org/mtg/2008/Sat.FocusGroup3.ppt#276,20,USMLE

http://www.im.org/PolicyAndAdvocacy...USMLEMovestoTwoGatewayExams(June20,2008).aspx
 
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are they gonna reimburse the cost of the stupid USMLE 2 CS???
 
A change of this magnitude will take years to implement.It shouldn't be a problem for students...there will be notice way ahead of time when these changes will occur so people will have the option to take the current format before a certain deadline. I just worry if they are unnecessarily messing with the exam.CS is a joke and there is a certain loss of basic science info after we take step 1 so the committee has a point.
 
It doesnt sound like they will make the exam pass/fail. The so called gateway 1 exam/exams will need to be taken before residency so D.O's and IMG's should be able to take these exams and compete against others for residency spots.
 
It doesnt sound like they will make the exam pass/fail. The so called gateway 1 exam/exams will need to be taken before residency so D.O's and IMG's should be able to take these exams and compete against others for residency spots.

The issue is that IMGs/DOs can currently somewhat overcome the downfalls of not being a US-senior during the match with excellent board scores. How can one demonstrate this with a pass/fail test.

In all, I love this new concept from my brief readings!
 
I'm just glad I'm past that point.

Taking a combined step 1 and 2 would be very painful indeed.
 
The issue is that IMGs/DOs can currently somewhat overcome the downfalls of not being a US-senior during the match with excellent board scores. How can one demonstrate this with a pass/fail test.

In all, I love this new concept from my brief readings!

I agree, but where does it say the new exam will be Pass/fail?
 
I agree, but where does it say the new exam will be Pass/fail?

I'd assume that it will be pass/fail because the way the USMLE is used for residency placement was not the original intent. I'm too lazy to look this up, but I thought that was the major reason for changing to a combined step. Maybe this will put more emphasis on doing well in school (ie. class rank/grades ??)
 
I'd assume that it will be pass/fail because the way the USMLE is used for residency placement was not the original intent. I'm too lazy to look this up, but I thought that was the major reason for changing to a combined step. Maybe this will put more emphasis on doing well in school (ie. class rank/grades ??)

It sounds from what they wrote that there is a real drop off in basic science knowledge by the time residency comes around and that people sort of cram and take step 1 and once they pass are happy to leave the basic science knowledge behind. Having a combined step 1 and 2 can integrate everything before you start residency.There are other reasons for the change but they didn't imply the test would change to a pass/fail format....at least i didnt see it.
 
On Friday I passed by a random cardiologist who was muttering about how med students and residents have forgotten all their biochemistry and that is why they have trouble practicing medicine. Maybe he was on the committee that is making these recommendations.
 
A chief resident who went to a meeting where they discussed this topic informed our group that these suggested changes won't take effect until about 2016/2017. Incoming classes for the next few years still have to worry about the Steps
 
A chief resident who went to a meeting where they discussed this topic informed our group that these suggested changes won't take effect until about 2016/2017. Incoming classes for the next few years still have to worry about the Steps

I heard the same, though our administration is starting to prepare for the change. Both M1/M2 classes are taking "practice" comprehensive exam at the end of the year for the first time. They said the entering class of 2012 will probably have to deal with the new step.
 
I hope they don't make it pass/fail. I'm sorry, but some medical schools are definitely harder than others, and the grading in 3rd year particularly is extremely subjective, and it is necessary to have some sort of objective measuring stick to compare people with. Of course USMLE scores should not be used in a vacuum/by themselves when picking residents or fellows, but I think they have a place. By the way, I had OK, but not super great, USMLE scores, so I'm not just some dork with 260 USMLE's with no clinical skills just saying this out of self interest.
 
I hope they don't make it pass/fail. I'm sorry, but some medical schools are definitely harder than others, and the grading in 3rd year particularly is extremely subjective, and it is necessary to have some sort of objective measuring stick to compare people with. Of course USMLE scores should not be used in a vacuum/by themselves when picking residents or fellows, but I think they have a place. By the way, I had OK, but not super great, USMLE scores, so I'm not just some dork with 260 USMLE's with no clinical skills just saying this out of self interest.

from what i was told, it WILL be pass/fail. Supposedly the steps were never intended to be used for screening purposes for residency placement as they have turned into. This is supposed to rectify that problem however programs will then just default to shelf scores adding to the anxiety after every course. They'll always find some objective manner in which to differentiate applicants.
 
From page 43 of the Cornell pdf (above Table 1):

Pass/fail scoring is not under consideration outside the Clinical Skills examination, and individual Step scores will continue to be reported to students and schools in the current manner.
 
I hope they don't make it pass/fail. I'm sorry, but some medical schools are definitely harder than others, and the grading in 3rd year particularly is extremely subjective, and it is necessary to have some sort of objective measuring stick to compare people with. Of course USMLE scores should not be used in a vacuum/by themselves when picking residents or fellows, but I think they have a place. By the way, I had OK, but not super great, USMLE scores, so I'm not just some dork with 260 USMLE's with no clinical skills just saying this out of self interest.

The NBME though takes the position that it was ALWAYS meant to be pass fail, and that the residency use of the numerical system was a bastardization of the test. Passing this test supposedly shows a minimum level of proficiency but beyond that it was never agreed that the grading reflects very much. Certainly not that that someone with a 260 will be a "better" resident than someone with a 230. It's possible that's true, but never empirically demonstrated, and that makes the NBME uncomfortable. With any "grading" system, people seize on it because they don't have too many objective things to look at. But if the test itself is flawed in that it's designed to show nothing but minimum proficiency, you are on very dangerous footing when you decide someone who knows more of the minimum stuff is equivalent to a superstar. More often it reflects having more study time (as in the case of the offshore folks who do well with many more months of studying), or better memory/cramming skills. Not really something that tells you who will be the better dermatologist. So the NBME is trying to avoid this abuse of their test data by combining the tests, make them later in the process (so residencies won't have them in time to make a decision), and maybe even make them pass fail. So the residencies will have to find something else to look at, but at least the NBME can sleep easy knowing that their test isn't being used for something they never intended and can't empirically support.

At any rate the rate at which this is going to happen will be extremely slow to implement, and will have lots of repercussions for residencies which have to revamp their application process, so anyone already out of high school is unlikely to have this impact them, IMHO. But I agree with the prior poster who suggested that removing this kind of stuff from the decision kills the non-US med students
 
I agree with the poster above, who said that if USMLE is made pass/fail, the residency programs will just start looking a shelf exam scores, and/or will ask to see the MCAT scores.
 
or someone at an uber-competitive med school with either super high admissions standards, or that just has a stiff grading scale, that gives few honors, but who just missed AOA or something...
grades are NOT the same when comparing different med schools.
 
are they gonna reimburse the cost of the stupid USMLE 2 CS???

I hear ya.... Robbery I say!!!
A grand is not only outlandish is it almost blackmail.
Pay us or you can't make your dream of being a physician a reality. 😡
 
A quick skimming of this article left me quite confused as to the relevance of Figure 4. Why are the fleet positions during the Battle of Jutland being included in a discussion of USMLE changes?... 😕

I think the point of the article might be to point out that knowledge retention was apallling after one took Step 1.

in theory I can cram for a 99, but the week after have the memory of a goldfish, am i better than someone whose cramming skills arent as keen?

HELL YES!!! Well a better crammer anyway, (definitely NOT a better DR)
 
Whether people like it or not the USMLE at this time is an objective measure of performance. People may not like it because it wasn't designed per se to compare a 230 vs. 260 but what else do we have? Class rank and test scores within the school...highly variable. As someone who was at the top of my class at a small medical school, I learned through the interview process that regardless of how stellar my qualifications were my accomplishments during medical school were not highly regarded because programs felt that it wasn't an apples for apples comparison to someone from a top tier medical school. Shelf exams....not all schools use these in the same way. Some schools place these as large components of the clerkship grade while others use it as practice for Step II.

While I understand that the USMLE has it's flaws, I think it does provide an objective measure for residency programs to look at. For those who went to smaller med schools and interested in competitive residencies it provides an equalizer. Why eliminate something that allows for that?

Many residency programs use USMLE scores as a screening tool. If an applicant reaches the cut off he/she may be invited for an interview. @ some programs the faculty members conducting interviews are unaware of the scores of the applicants sitting in front of them. The applicants have already been sceened so the board score is irrelevant @ that point. A minimum score had to be obtained in order to secure an interview invitation.

Cambie
 
I think the point of the article might be to point out that knowledge retention was apallling after one took Step 1.

in theory I can cram for a 99, but the week after have the memory of a goldfish, am i better than someone whose cramming skills arent as keen?

HELL YES!!! Well a better crammer anyway, (definitely NOT a better DR)


Yeah, I understood the point of the article overall. What I didn't understand was why they included a diagram of a naval battle from WWI in it.
 
Right now, Step 1 and 2 are two of the top factors for IMGs. I already thought it's weird how we're judged on just two exams. If Gateway 2 is done in PGY1 year, then will IMGs be judged on just one exam?
 
The NBME though takes the position that it was ALWAYS meant to be pass fail, and that the residency use of the numerical system was a bastardization of the test.

This is often mentioned, but to me does not make much sense. If that's the case, why did they ever create a numerical scoring system? Regardless...

More often it reflects having more study time (as in the case of the offshore folks who do well with many more months of studying)...

Another often mentioned factoid, which is not necessarily true. In fact, Charting Outcomes from the NRMP shows this is basically not true. The mean USMLE score for matched US seniors was just higher than that for indepentent applicants. I get plenty of applications from students from the "Big 4" with crappy USMLE scores. It's not clear to me that foreign grads (carib or otherwise) do better because they have more time to study.

So the NBME is trying to avoid this abuse of their test data by combining the tests, make them later in the process (so residencies won't have them in time to make a decision), and maybe even make them pass fail. So the residencies will have to find something else to look at, but at least the NBME can sleep easy knowing that their test isn't being used for something they never intended and can't empirically support.

The NBME tried to switch to P/F. Residency programs basically rebelled against that idea. If the NBME switched to P/F it's not clear that would help -- I can tell you for certain that if the steps were P/F, IM would have created it's own test and likely so would each specialty. Then you'd have to pay to take that exam too, and we'd use those scores for interviews / ranking.

Although it is later in the season, taking the new Gateway A is likely to become manditory for residency apps. Competitive programs will simply state that a score on Gateway A is required for an interview. I expect all students will need to complete Gateway A before or during the application season.

Basically, this is a mixed bag for students.

The good news: The new system is cheaper overall, and CS is gone.
The bad news:

  1. You only get "one shot" now (where before if you screwed up step 1, you could take step 2 early and hope to improve)
  2. You only get your score late in the game (i.e. let's say you "know" you want to do rads when getting into med school. Now, if you score a 190 on Step 1 at the end of 2nd year, you basically know you need to focus your third year rotations elsewhere. In the future, if you get a 190 on Gateway A at the end of third year, it's a bit too late to redeploy.
  3. You now have twice as much to study for a single exam. Theoretically there is only supposed to be "clinically relevant" basic science on the exam. Is the Kreb's cycle clinically relevant? I'd say it isn't. However, it does explain why people with ischemic limbs/bowel/severe hypotension develop lactic acidosis, so you could argue that it is. Ca you imagine studying for both Step 1 and Step 2 for a single exam?
  4. The medical schools demanded from the NBME that specific subject / shelf exams remain available for them -- so they will still be administering a comprehensive Step 1 like exam at the end of second year. We will see if medical schools decide to put these scores in Dean's letters. If so, you are really no better off.
 
Right now, Step 1 and 2 are two of the top factors for IMGs. I already thought it's weird how we're judged on just two exams. If Gateway 2 is done in PGY1 year, then will IMGs be judged on just one exam?

Yes, IMGs will be more hosed than they currently are. Which...to be honest...is pretty hosed.
 
Right now, Step 1 and 2 are two of the top factors for IMGs. I already thought it's weird how we're judged on just two exams. If Gateway 2 is done in PGY1 year, then will IMGs be judged on just one exam?

Yes, and interestingly when CS was added (or more specifically, the CSA was added as a requirement for IMG's only) the requirement for TOEFL went away for ECFMG certification. I expect we will see that resurface in some way.
 
It sounds from what they wrote that there is a real drop off in basic science knowledge by the time residency comes around

The current medical education system doesn't train physicians to be life longer learners well and isn't interactive or self-directed enough in my opinion. Sure there is a drop off in basic sciences learned from Step 1 to Step 3. I knew Step 2 would cover some basic sciences so I re-studied some stuff like pharm which paid off big time during clinicals, I guess those questions were just to see how bad the drop off is. The bigger problem is that physicians lose their edge when out of training and patient mortality increases about 1 percent for each year out of training. I believe it, my grandmother was being seen by an FP who made a really wrong comment about warfarin saying that you can't have a stroke when you are on it, . . . really.

I don't think that by having fewer Step examinations that this will make medical students study basic sciences more or somehow retain the info. You only retain what you learn and use. I still remember studying for Step 1 and it sure solidifies your knowledge when you sit down and try to condense what you know. Now students won't be pushed to solidify their knowledge base at the end of basic sciences. I think that third year students will do OK on some Step 1 material, but might not be as good as people finishing their second year or may just be the same.

I really took to heart re-learning basic sciences during third year, everybody at some point or another on a renal elective says, "Wow, I wish I could go back and do nephrology again" because seeing patients helps you remember better. If you don't have a grasp of RTA physiology you basically have a sort of knowledge base that is flimsy.

In the end the first two years of medical school need to be totally overhauled. The system doesn't let students learn at their own pace which often is faster than what a lot of lecturers do. I would:

1. Use a computer based compulsory quizes which must be completed, but not graded which ask students questions from anatomy or pharm or anything randomly during the entire two years. The problem with gross anatomy, and perhaps all courses, is that they are very intense and then nothing after you finish them, it is sort of like you have had it and that's it.

2. Cut lecture time in half. Really. Death by powerpoints is ridiculous and some topics which are interesting and important don't get enough time. I think I got one or two lectures on CHF in med school, which were very intense, but after they are done that is it. And perhaps a year ago I got the pharmacology lectures on drugs for CHF . . . it doesn't make sense in a way to learn pharmacology before pathophysiology. I know that some schools are trying to become more integrated and have a systems based approach, but even that would fail as once you finished with cardio you would be done with it.

The educational experience should approach so fit in seamlessly with how physicians keep up to date, which most of us means reading a couple articles a year on CHF or other topics. What I would for each topic would be to have a primer for a couple of weeks and then refreshers through out the two years.

For example, for cardiology I would teach a two week introduction that involved gross anatomy, pharmacology, and some basic pathophysiology AND give students some material to read for the next cardio class in a year. At the second cardio class I would then do a two week class with a quick review of cardio anatomy, pharmacology, advanced pathophysiology and a review quiz. And then half a year later do a two week course on advanced cardio II with cardio anatomy in relation to surgeries/CAD/clinical procedures which could involved a quick return to the gross lab, do a review of pharmacology, arrythmias, and then advanced adult and pediatric EKG/cardiology and then have a self-learning quiz. Total time would be about 6-8 weeks split over two years, and maybe even something during third or fourth year, but it would be much better retained that six weeks in second year that you would forget. Do this with every course and students would live with their cardio knowledge rather trying to remember what happened a year or a year and a half ago . . . it would only be 4 ot 6 months ago.

This is how my schedule would look like from begining of year 1 to the end of year 2:

Block 1 - 2 weeks cardiovascular
Block 2 - 2 weeks infectious disease
Block 3 - 2 weeks pulmonary
Block 4 - 2 weeks renal
Block 5 - 2 weeks hem/onc.
Block 6 - 2 weeks Gen Pharm.
Block 7 - 2 weeks Biochem Basic
Block 8 - 2 weeks Histo Basic
Block 9 - 2 weeks GI
Block 10 - 2 weeks cardiovascular 2 advanced
Block 11 - 2 weeks infectious disease 2 advanced

etc . . . I missed a lot of courses, but you get the general idea, sort of building on what you learned and switching topics quickly enough that old stuff is retained. I would use short 40 minute computer based multimedia quizes each week, where a certain number would be dropped, but something to evaluate your progress. The biochem faculty would have to do lectures on a rotating basis instead of for a single block each year but with computer technology and multimedia this could enhace learning and retention.

I re-invented how I studied after two years of basic sciences and got 250+ (you don't want to know how much it would make you cry) on CK and I am lesiurely reading through Lange Pharm now, yes it is "Step 1 material" but I realized I have to rotate what I am learning and review or I forget stuff. I wish I was in charge of the first two years, my curriculum would rock! People would ask students, "What are you studying now, pharmacology?" And under my curriculum the answer would be, "Well, we study a lot of stuff I finished a pharm quiz and we are doing Biochem now, but we switch so frequently it feels like we are studying everything!"

Of course not everybody would be in gross lab for example at the same time as people would rotate through via short schedule stints BUT you could look at a kidney again in gross lab after passing a basic renal exam on anatomy and physiology . . . very cool I actually get to appreciate what I am seeing much more.

I would do a similar thing for third and fourth year, have students do a mini-medicine clerkship that is only one month, and rotate in something else, and then come back to medicine for the second month perhaps half a year later, their evaluation file could be updated with more recent clinical evals so students could comeback and do even more spectacularly if they didn't shine on their first "mini clerkship".
 
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Yes, and interestingly when CS was added (or more specifically, the CSA was added as a requirement for IMG's only) the requirement for TOEFL went away for ECFMG certification. I expect we will see that resurface in some way.

I would bet that the CS gets rolled into the new first gate exam at the end of third year as the exam is being worked on constantly and the official purpose of the exam hasn't changed and it appears to be more than just english skills that the testers are looking at, specifically competency in conducting a history and physical which some U.S. students can't do, a small percentage but measurable. For IMGs there will always be pressure to screen for english competency and perhaps now also competency in H and P taking so I am guessing the CS will be a component of the new examination. If the CS portion was removed it would look like the licensing is becoming less strict in terms of making sure physicians communicate well with patients which is a sore point that lead to the examination in the first place.
 
A quick skimming of this article left me quite confused as to the relevance of Figure 4. Why are the fleet positions during the Battle of Jutland being included in a discussion of USMLE changes?... 😕

I asked that same question. Here's the explanation, I guess.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=8058645&postcount=14

Overall I'm still treating any and all of these changes as a "I'll believe it when I see it" type of deal. There are a lot of recommendations that are never followed through, and they've been talking about combining steps and eliminating step scores for years it seems.

If it does change, it will be a serious issue for MD/PhDs, given the Step I pre-clinical, Step II post-clinical mentality that we all have.
 
It took me about 3 days to forget everything I learned for step 1. Doesn't make much difference if those 3 days are in 2nd year or 3rd year. If you don't use it, you lose it.
 
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