UWSMPH vs Iowa vs UNC-Chapel Hill vs Emory (MD/PhD)

[MoveUp221]

UWSMPH vs Iowa vs UNC-Chapel Hill vs Emory vs Columbia (MD/PhD)

First, I'm super thankful and blessed to be where I'm at. Any of the options I have I know will be fine. I just wanted to ask for input, and pull out of the schools I really don't want to go to, so I can give others a chance. Personally, I value being closer to my family, also have realized I'm more of a small/medium-sized city person. Also throughout this process have realized I vibe more with the less pretentious institutions. Mostly trying to figure out how much prestige matters vs the other quality of life factors. Due to second look date conflicts, I'm only going to 2 second looks anyway.

Columbia
-Honestly given the current craziness at Columbia I'm not keen to go here.
-I've realized gig city is not my preference when I have other options
-Super expensive to live in NYC
-Far from family
-Great research in my area, but I'm not sure it will still exist by the time I get to PhD lol
-Stuffy, prestigious vibe, not really my thing
-2-4-2 isn't my preferred curriculum structure

University of Wisconsin-Madison
Pros:
-Great MD/PhD program, great people, super kind & down to earth
-Like the 3-4-1 curriculum, also great clinical continuity during the PhD
-P/F preclinical and unranked during preclinical
-Strong public health curriculum in MD
-Close to family; I really like the area & all the outdoor activities / bikeability
-Med ed path of distinction
-I actually like winter and winter activities

Cons:
-More expensive cost of living than some other options (but still relatively affordable)
-Fewer research mentors in my area (broad public health)
-Only school without a typical school of public health? Public health is combined with the med school
-The PhD is broadly in "population health," not the typical health behavior/health policy / epi / etc deparmental split

Carver College of Medicine / University of Iowa
Pros:
-Nice, kind people
-Full school of public health / more mentors, fellow students during PhD
-Very inexpensive to live
-Like the midwest college town vibe
-Lots of potential research mentors
-Also relatively close to family
-3-4-1 curriculum
-Medical spanish and French program options, volunteering with mobile clinic, good clinical continuity in the PhD part of program
-Med ed path of distinction
-Snow!
-Medical humanities program -- side interest of mine

Cons:
-Name is less prestigious? Least prestigious match list of the options?
-Graded preclinical
-Fewer people get F30s
-Less snowy activity options than Madison,

UNC-Chapel Hill
Pros:
-More prestigious option, especially in my area of research
-Many, many faculty research mentors / larger labs / more publication potential?
-Students seem to publish really well
-Nice, close-knit MD/PhD program
-Can do a couple clinical rotatioins before PhD
-Lots of integrated public health concepts in the med curriculum
-P/F preclinical (not sure if it's ranked)
-Med ed path of distinction -- but it's kind of hard to get into?

Cons:
-In the south, far away from home / family, I'm really not southern
-Funding issues during PhD seem common for my area of research
-2-4-2, less clinical continuation during PhD
-More strict rules / mandatory class in med school
-Will have to do more classes during the PhD
-No graduate student union (poor support compared to other options?)
-Triangle area is more expensive than Iowa & Madison
-Really hot, sticky weather in summer (I like being able to go outside a lot in the summer)

Emory
Pros:
-More prestige than Iowa/Madison, esp in my area of research
-3-4-1 curriculum
-Lots of mentors for my area of interest

Cons:
-South, not super keen to live in Atlanta (also really hot in the summer?)
-Red state issues / culture
-Culture: More southern, just feels . . . more strict?
-Furthest from home
-More of a small/medium-city sort of person
-Just didn't get great vibes, i don't know if I'd really fit in well.


Basically, definitely leaning more towards Iowa/Wisconsin/UNC, but basically wondering how much to weigh personal preference for the living situation / location vs the research available. And does prestige really matter? Long-term I'll probably want to end up in the Midwest if possible. Also about the 3-4-1 vs 2(ish)-4-2.Thanks!

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[dimplesage]

First of all congrats on all the great options!

As a fellow MD/PhD applicant, I feel you on your current dilemma of location vs. research. If you want to end up in the Midwest, do you want to go somewhere else first before going to the Midwest, or do you love it enough there that you want to do MD/PhD training and residency/etc there too?

Anecdotally, students tell me that 3-4-1 is slightly better in their eyes, but to faculty and in the long run of a career, the specific curriculum structure doesn't matter it seems. Even if you do a PhD in an area that isn't directly tied to whatever specialty you go to match in, it'll make you super interesting and qualified to residencies. I personally think I would prefer something like 3-4-1, but it's not a major consideration for me.

I've heard that as long as it's an MSTP, prestige doesn't really matter?

I can only really speak to UNC (disclaimer, accepted to UNC), but I do know their history of getting F30s is good and their public health school is amazing. I didn't think I would like Triangle area but it's actually really nice here! I'm biased, but I think it merits visiting in person if you can.

 

[MoveUp221]

Any other perspectives? What factors played into your choice of your MSTP?

 

[hydroflaskhomie]

Congrats on great options. Based on what I'm seeing here, I'd say UNC vs Columbia (but I also wouldn't want to go to Columbia right now based on the firestorm that is happening with research - I am too risk adverse). The only thing that gives me pause is the funding issues UNC has had in the past for people in your degree? Can you expand on that?

UNC is not the deep south - some parts of NC do feel that way but the research triangle area is much more East Coast-y in my opinion.

I would say Wisco would also be on my final list but unfortunately I think for your PhD having a dedicated school of public health/strong mentors is important and therefore that's a serious con.

 

[MoveUp221]

Congrats on great options. Based on what I'm seeing here, I'd say UNC vs Columbia (but I also wouldn't want to go to Columbia right now based on the firestorm that is happening with research - I am too risk adverse). The only thing that gives me pause is the funding issues UNC has had in the past for people in your degree? Can you expand on that?

UNC is not the deep south - some parts of NC do feel that way but the research triangle area is much more East Coast-y in my opinion.

I would say Wisco would also be on my final list but unfortunately I think for your PhD having a dedicated school of public health/strong mentors is important and therefore that's a serious con.

Yeah for UNC the public health school doesn't match the MSTP stipend (37.5k), and the MSTP doesn't cover the difference (Gillings school of public health only pays the NIH rate, which is 28k). They also don't guarantee that PhD students will be funded as RAs, don't guarantee a TA position, and specifically tell PhD students to be prepared to take out loans. The gist I got from the interview day was a) students were from the triangle area and living with family, so rent wasn't an issue, or b) were living with a spouse/partner who made it possible to pay rent. Even though the MSTP technically says they require PhD departments to match their stipend rate, all of the MSTP students in the pubilc health school said that they weren't able to find a mentor who was willing to match the stipend. Also, I know UNC Gillings got a fair amount of USAID funding, and some of their NIH grants have been cut, so the issues with potential future support makes me balk a little.

But overall: 28k is not enough to live off of in the Triangle for the PhD years (cost of living there is higher than in Madison now, actually), which really make me pause. I'd like to actually be able to enjoy my time, and I know I won't be able to enjoy time if I'm not able to pay for basics and have $$$ so I can fly to visit home (the Triangle airport is also weirdly expensive lol). There's other considerations here, too. If I stayed in the Midwest, I'd probably be able to buy a condo. The cost of housing in the Triangle and the home insurance rates in NC would probably make that prohibitive (thanks to the hurricances and state government not regulating the insurance industry).

I guess another consideration, as well, is that UNC doesn't allow transfer credit. I have an MPH already and have taken lots of more advanced stats/epi courses, and would be able to shorten the coursework period of the PhD if I went elsewhere (didn't ask at Columbia since I'm also too risk-averse to walk into their chaos at the moment), but Iowa and Madison would let me transfer much of my prior coursework/be exempt from some course requirements.

 

[MoveUp221]

Also: I can see mentors I'd like to work with at Wisconsin. It's just that the public health program is smaller than at the other places.

 

[hydroflaskhomie]

With that info, I'd say Wisconsin vs Columbia - even though I totally agree with you and would be scared of Columbia right now I would probably say you should do your due diligence and try to discuss your concerns with the program - Columbia's public health school absolutely rocks and it might be worth a couple years of discomfort/uncertainty to have that name on your resume for your entire research career.

Regardless of your politics, it seems like the school is bowing to the administration and will likely have its funding restored so I doubt that you would get somehow stranded. Their med students also seem pretty happy on the MD side of things. But, I get it if NYC is not your vibe; however, I would say make sure you visit because Washington Heights is barely Manhattan (it feels like an outer borough to me).