Volunteering/Shadowing for non-trads?

[RHeff]

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Do you think it's a glaring mistake if I don't have any clinical experience on my app? I work a full-time, 50+ hour a week job that basically prevents me from volunteering in a hospital or shadowing a doctor.

Does what I'm doing now affect whether or not the clinical experience is a big deal? I work in education...

 

[RHeff]

I guess I should also point out that I have plenty of non-clinical volunteer experience -- international service trips to Mexico and Ecuador, weeks volunteering in Appalachia and New Orleans, time in soup kitchens, etc...

 

[familyaerospace]

Clinical experience is pretty important.

You can always try to volunteer on the weekends at a free clinic or at a hospital (of course this all depends on your schedule).

Shadowing also depends on your schedule. You might be able to arrange to shadow a hospitalist who works over nights (I know, probably not ideal) or you might be able to find a family practice or an emergency room that will let you do some shadowing on the weekends.

I've heard of some NTs who will take a day off of work to shadow. I don't know how common that is, but it's a possibility.

 

[sgtbrushes]

Volunteering outside of a clinical setting is wonderful. Not having any clinical experience at all is definitely going to hurt you. Where do you live? I live in a major metro area, and there are "Urgent care centers" open on Saturdays and several hospitals that are open 24/7. I'm a full-time student now, but when I used to work M-F 8-5, I did shadowing on Saturdays. You definitely need to work something out to get clinical experience.

 

[QofQuimica]

Do you think it's a glaring mistake if I don't have any clinical experience on my app?

Yes. You wouldn't apply to med school without having taken a year of bio or physics, would you? Some kind of clinical experience should be considered as a prereq along the same lines. How are you going to convince the adcom that you want to be a physician if you've spent no time around patients and physicians?

I work a full-time, 50+ hour a week job that basically prevents me from volunteering in a hospital or shadowing a doctor.

Does what I'm doing now affect whether or not the clinical experience is a big deal? I work in education...

Unfortunately, a busy schedule does not give you a pass on completing any prereq, including clinical experience. All applicants, trad and nontrad, are busy. All applicants, trad and nontrad, have to make time for things that really matter. This is one of those things, and you need to figure out a way to make some time for it. That doesn't have to involve a huge weekly commitment. A couple of hours per week would be reasonable for someone with a heavy schedule like yours. But do set something up and get some clinical hours in before you apply.

 

[RHeff]

Thanks for the replies. What's the best way to get clinical experience that matters? Could I just talk to the volunteer office at one of my local hospitals?

Edit - I know that may seem like an obvious question, but I'm concerned about ending up in a volunteer role that doesn't help enhance my application and exposure in the field. Thanks...

 

[MCAT guy]

Thanks for the replies. What's the best way to get clinical experience that matters? Could I just talk to the volunteer office at one of my local hospitals?

Edit - I know that may seem like an obvious question, but I'm concerned about ending up in a volunteer role that doesn't help enhance my application and exposure in the field. Thanks...

lol. I volunteered for 200 hrs. Volunteering you are just around medicine which I guess is good, it's not like I'm learning any medicine though, so I guess exposure is a good word to use.

They ask me to volunteer then I do it. Is it menial and seemingly insignificant? Well, probably. But they ask, so I do it.

 

[Dianyla]

I work a full-time, 50+ hour a week job that basically prevents me from volunteering in a hospital or shadowing a doctor.

So do I. Do it anyway.

Hospitals operate 24x7. Volunteering in the ED is often a good choice for nights or weekend only availability.

 

[familyaerospace]

Thanks for the replies. What's the best way to get clinical experience that matters? Could I just talk to the volunteer office at one of my local hospitals?

It would be a good start. Most of us here work and find a way to squeeze in a few hours a week to get clinical exposure.

 

[bassvp]

I guess I'm still a little confused on the "clinical experience/clinical volunteering" component. I worked retail pharmacy for 3 years (which means I had plenty of interaction with patients and their medications) and I now work hospital pharmacy (where I'm mostly centralized down in the basement/dungeon...but answering questions for nurses and docs). Would my work experience count as clinical experience even though I've been paid to do it?

And as I posted under another thread...if I have the opportunity to volunteer as a pharmacist for a free elderly/indigent clinic...would this count at all? Even though some of these don't have a physician around, you'd assume that the shadowing would cover that aspect and that this would cover the clinical/"I want to help people" aspect.

Thoughts please?

 

[familyaerospace]

bassvp, your work is paid clinical experience.

 

[AcclratngCharge]

I hope you get in bass. I'm kind of like you, except I'm trying to go MD before I finish the PharmD.

 

[NTF]

I work a full-time, 50+ hour a week job that basically prevents me from volunteering in a hospital or shadowing a doctor.

50+ hour job withstanding, an adcom is not going to buy the excuse that you couldn't find 2 hrs/week to volunteer at a hospital, nursing home, or [fill in patient contact setting here.]

So yeah, having zero clinical exposure will hurt your app.

The line of thinking that I've been quoted from an adcom goes like this:
"Would you accept an applicant into the seminary, who said he deeply wanted to be a clergyman, spent hours reading the bible and taking courses, but said he couldn't find the time to go to church?"

 

[ELECTROLITE80]

My premed advisor said that even if you don't have time during the school year to volunteer, whether your reason be focusing on classes and/or working, that your holidays and days where class are not in session need to spent obtaining volunteer hours. Although I had to defer my start date for my postbac coursework until January, I am getting a jump on my volunteer time now and starting in August. My plan is to take 2 days a month off from my job and volunteer until school starts, then I'll go with the plan my advisor suggested.

 

[FuturaDocta]

Clinical experience is basically mandatory. You need every piece of support to convince med schools that you want to work in a clinical setting. Imagine being lined up with a bunch of pre-meds with hundreds of hours in the hospital (some having a job in a hospital). You probably want to at least fit in, right?

Try sending cold emails to at least ten doctors you are interested in shadowing. Also, volunteer anywhere. It can can be in a nursing home, children's hospital, home hospice, burn unit, etc. Be creative and have fun. Don't make it into a checklist and try to learn from your experiences because this is usually the big topic at your interviews.

 

[PharMed2016]

Do you think it's a glaring mistake if I don't have any clinical experience on my app? I work a full-time, 50+ hour a week job that basically prevents me from volunteering in a hospital or shadowing a doctor.

Does what I'm doing now affect whether or not the clinical experience is a big deal? I work in education...

I'm sure you can find some time to volunteer or something. Can you work 40 hours as oppose to 50 hours and use the rest of the time to find clinical exposure?

 

[EdLongshanks]

I have not been accepted anywhere, but I'm not absolutely sure that the "clinical hours are required" mantra of SDN is totally accurate. I have only a very old part-time job in a resthome (25 years ago) and about 60 hours of shadowing with a LOR from my family's doctor. My state school told me that my clinical experience "would not be considered a void." I'm adding in some Saturday hours with a free clinic in town.

Call the free clinics, and when they don't call back, call them again, and again, and again. Eventually they will get tired of your importunity and call you back and let you volunteer, if only to stop your calls. That's what I did.

 

[RHeff]

I'm going to take advantage of the summer months and get some hours in that way. Thanks for the insights.

 

[CookDeRosa]

I work a full-time, 50+ hour a week job.

What do you do for the other 118 hours?

 

[Petypet]

I have not been accepted anywhere, but I'm not absolutely sure that the "clinical hours are required" mantra of SDN is totally accurate. I have only a very old part-time job in a resthome (25 years ago) and about 60 hours of shadowing with a LOR from my family's doctor. My state school told me that my clinical experience "would not be considered a void." I'm adding in some Saturday hours with a free clinic in town.

Call the free clinics, and when they don't call back, call them again, and again, and again. Eventually they will get tired of your importunity and call you back and let you volunteer, if only to stop your calls. That's what I did.

I highly support this post. I currently volunteer (working 60-70 hours/week getting my PhD) Friday nights from 5-8 and will do so for about 100-150 hours. However, after talking with several ADCOM at my school (whom I had the fortune of meeting on the golf course) they said it volunteering/shadowing is a buffer. Most applicants have it, some dont. Is it a necessity if all is well on the applicants resume, no. But it doesn't hurt and it gives you one more leg to stand on when they ask you how do you know you want to be a physician.

 

[EdLongshanks]

I highly support this post. I currently volunteer (working 60-70 hours/week getting my PhD) Friday nights from 5-8 and will do so for about 100-150 hours. However, after talking with several ADCOM at my school (whom I had the fortune of meeting on the golf course) they said it volunteering/shadowing is a buffer. Most applicants have it, some dont. Is it a necessity if all is well on the applicants resume, no. But it doesn't hurt and it gives you one more leg to stand on when they ask you how do you know you want to be a physician.

I think it was Q who said that applying to medical school without doing any clinical work was like applying to seminary without ever having attended church.

I'm not sure that it's totally required to be a nurses aide before anyone will believe that you want to heal the sick, but I do think that a person who wants to be a doctor should have shown some interest in helping somebody, somewhere before they were 23 years old.

Now, I am 47 years old, it's not really fair to compare my volunteer resume against someone half my age. Most people in their twenties would not be able to even get into a Lions or Kiwanis club. But someone who wants to help people would have done so in some way before they graduated college, even if it was stacking sandbags during a flood.

 

[QofQuimica]

I think it was Q who said that applying to medical school without doing any clinical work was like applying to seminary without ever having attended church.

I'm not sure that it's totally required to be a nurses aide before anyone will believe that you want to heal the sick, but I do think that a person who wants to be a doctor should have shown some interest in helping somebody, somewhere before they were 23 years old.

Now, I am 47 years old, it's not really fair to compare my volunteer resume against someone half my age. Most people in their twenties would not be able to even get into a Lions or Kiwanis club. But someone who wants to help people would have done so in some way before they graduated college, even if it was stacking sandbags during a flood.

I agree. If you're the volunteering type, you will have a long record of community service, regardless of your age. There are dozens of high school students volunteering at the hospital where I'm rotating this summer, never mind premeds.

And Ed, I would argue that you *do* have some significant clinical experience, including a LOR from a physician. So you really aren't in a position to use yourself as an example of someone who might "beat the odds" in terms of getting accepted without having any clinical experience. 🙂

 

[EdLongshanks]

I agree. If you're the volunteering type, you will have a long record of community service, regardless of your age. There are dozens of high school students volunteering at the hospital where I'm rotating this summer, never mind premeds.

And Ed, I would argue that you *do* have some significant clinical experience, including a LOR from a physician. So you really aren't in a position to use yourself as an example of someone who might "beat the odds" in terms of getting accepted without having any clinical experience. 🙂

Oh, I guess I hadn't thought of it that way. I was thinking of carrying bedpans around a hospital or putting in a line on an ambulance. I hadn't thought of all my children's surgeries, getting a first-aid/CPR certification, shadowing a doctor for a few weeks, and frankly, helping my wife during 3 home-births (very, very stupid DON'T try this at home!!! ) but when you think of it, I suppose I have seen my share of bodily fluids. Then, of course, there are all the hospital visits that a minister does as a habit. I hadn't counted those.

Really, if you include those sorts of experiences as clinical, then you would have to say that it would be surprising if someone wanted to get into medical school without every seeing any of this. Really, why would you think you could be a doctor if your friends get sick and you don't even know or help, if you have never carried a red-cross first-aid card, or know how to do CPR.

You all have a point.