weightlifting/working out

[abcxyz0123]

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I was just wondering...are most neurosurgeons really skinny and frail because they don't have the time to lift weights/work out and eat right....or is it because lifting weights might be harmful for your ability to do surgery (i.e. might tire out your muscles so much that doing a 12 hour surgery the next day without any fatigue/tremors would be close to impossible?)

I'm honestly curious about this, because I want to become a neurosurgeon in the distant future...but I want to know if surgeons are advised against doing too much strenous exercise because it might put a patients life at risk due to excessive muscular fatigue?

 

[Ignatius]

Hehehehehehe,
I was wondering about the same thing. One gets barely time to sleep and eat, how does life look in general for a NSG resident; is there anyone who could describe an average week: the time spend in the hospital, and the few hours out of it?
( I KNOW IT VARIES ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS, but it would be nice to hear the insight of someone who is actually living it - by the way - how do you find the time to write on these forums??)

Cheers

 

[markneil]

i know an attending neurosurgeon who is pretty built (think terrell owens type of body but shorter, maybe 5'11''). he is a high-energy type of person so i guess your question has to do more with personality types rather than thinking about how it will affect a surgery outcome. like anybody else, one should strive for a healthy, balanced life, especially for such a demanding field. how is a frail or overweight body going to handle such a stressful environment? asking about muscular fatigue is silly -- it's like asking the why one should not lift weights or run when one is training for a triathlon...because of muscular fatigue?? stay healthy and your patients will be in better hands.

 

[curious1]

Most residents are too busy operating to work out. Most attendings are too busy screaming at residents and banging their secretary to work out. By the time you at 60 and you can relax a little, you're too old and tired to start working out.

 

[abcxyz0123]

i know an attending neurosurgeon who is pretty built (think terrell owens type of body but shorter, maybe 5'11''). he is a high-energy type of person so i guess your question has to do more with personality types rather than thinking about how it will affect a surgery outcome. like anybody else, one should strive for a healthy, balanced life, especially for such a demanding field. how is a frail or overweight body going to handle such a stressful environment? asking about muscular fatigue is silly -- it's like asking the why one should not lift weights or run when one is training for a triathlon...because of muscular fatigue?? stay healthy and your patients will be in better hands.

ah, thanks for your reply. But i don't think asking about muscular fatigue is silly at all. Of course people train for a triathalon--but their training regiment does not consist of running 40 miles the day before. They take breaks, especially before the big day. This is what I was asking about. When you're an attending or resident, you don't perform surgery once every two weeks. I know that theres no harm in working out if you don't have to do a serious operation for a few days. But what happens if you are the type who constantly likes to lift weights and such, and you do work out the night before a big operation? Muscular fatigue has to come into play the next day, especially when youre doing extremely long surgeries and trying to muster ever last bit of dexterity you've got towards the end. This is what i am wondering about. Is it an unwritten rule that one should not physical overexert themselves too much when a surgery is coming up, or do surgeons not even care?

 

[Blake]

I know an attending who works out everyday (1 hour before coming to work.). He never mentioned any muscular fatigue/tremors while operating. Most residents I've met weren't really fit though, and they're not that far from being skinny and frail like me...

The ortho guys, on the other hand...

 

[MossPoh]

This would defintley depend on the type of weightlifting though. As for a triathalon they generally taper near the end so they are doing a bit less. Now when I think of weightlifting I think of the powerlifting I've done in the past...which means deadlifts and other very grip intensive exercises. The next day I have difficult time even closing my hands all the way, not to mention if I don't have enough chalk when lifting my hands are usually bleeding anyway.

 

[curious1]

This would defintley depend on the type of weightlifting though. As for a triathalon they generally taper near the end so they are doing a bit less. Now when I think of weightlifting I think of the powerlifting I've done in the past...which means deadlifts and other very grip intensive exercises. The next day I have difficult time even closing my hands all the way, not to mention if I don't have enough chalk when lifting my hands are usually bleeding anyway.

obviously this kind of activity is incompatible with operating.

 

[etf]

dude, just go the dr. robert rey (dr. 90210) route and lift weights IN THE OR!

 

[Chronic Student]

Yeah, he combats muscle fatigue by wearing sleevless scrubshirts and practicing really bad karate forms with the anesthesiologist outside of the OR😀

-Mike

 

[TUCOMSam]

I was just wondering...are most neurosurgeons really skinny and frail because they don't have the time to lift weights/work out and eat right....or is it because lifting weights might be harmful for your ability to do surgery (i.e. might tire out your muscles so much that doing a 12 hour surgery the next day without any fatigue/tremors would be close to impossible?)

I'm honestly curious about this, because I want to become a neurosurgeon in the distant future...but I want to know if surgeons are advised against doing too much strenous exercise because it might put a patients life at risk due to excessive muscular fatigue?

I'm curious... where exactly are you in your medical training? Are you in medical school yet? I'm assuming you're not very far along if you're asking this question. Not trying to offend, just making an observation. Working out doesn't fatigue your muscles... it strengthens them... hence the reason for working out. It all depends on which muscle fiber types you are training and to what balance they are trained with respect to the larger, bulkier muscle fiber units. If all you do is 3 reps of a million pounds, chances are, you won't be able to clip that aneurysm with the dexterity of a dainty hummingbird. But your residency training will provide the fine dexterity needed for the procedures by the sheer volume of cases you will complete. Moreover, once you are an attending... chances are you won't be doing multiple cases every day like you seem to assume based on your posting. Many NS's operate 1-2x/wk and that's it. Some have only a primary case once q 1-2 weeks and assist on other days.

 

[abcxyz0123]

....or is it because lifting weights might be harmful for your ability to do surgery (i.e. might tire out your muscles so much that doing a 12 hour surgery the next day without any fatigue/tremors would be close to impossible?)

thanks for the helpful input though.

 

[birdmanblair]

I'm curious... where exactly are you in your medical training? Are you in medical school yet? I'm assuming you're not very far along if you're asking this question. Not trying to offend, just making an observation. Working out doesn't fatigue your muscles... it strengthens them... hence the reason for working out. It all depends on which muscle fiber types you are training and to what balance they are trained with respect to the larger, bulkier muscle fiber units. If all you do is 3 reps of a million pounds, chances are, you won't be able to clip that aneurysm with the dexterity of a dainty hummingbird. But your residency training will provide the fine dexterity needed for the procedures by the sheer volume of cases you will complete. Moreover, once you are an attending... chances are you won't be doing multiple cases every day like you seem to assume based on your posting. Many NS's operate 1-2x/wk and that's it. Some have only a primary case once q 1-2 weeks and assist on other days.

I'm trying desperately not to get off topic, but I feel this must be said. Working out does fatigue your muscles; in fact, this is its "point." I assume that the OP interprets working out as lifting weights, and is making observations about the size (or lack thereof) of neurosurgeons. Since we are therefore talking about lifting for strength/size, something needs to be made clear. The entire point of resistance training for strength/size is to fatigue (read: tear down muscle and deplete them of nutrients) the muscles, and then supercompensate with nutrition and rest. Ideally, you would have recovered to a point above and beyond your previous state before you work out again. I'm a freshman in college, not a medical student; therefore, I probably have less knowledge of anatomy & physio than most on this forum. However, I know that for results, one must train, eat, and sleep.

As for the OP's question, I would assume so. Gaining significant muscle mass, at least for the genetically typical male, requires adequate energy for training (from what I hear, chronic sleep deprivation is rampant), an overabundance of calories spread throughout the day (I have a hard time believing that a surgeon/surgical resident could manage to eat/drink 6+ monstrous meals throughout the day and keep his job), as well as both adequate sleep and stress levels that are kept in check. I'm pretty sure that medicine (particularly surgery, worse still for interns/residents) is one of the worst professions for the last two factors. I doubt that hospital administration/attendings would advise against strenuous physical activity. Neurosurgeons find it difficult to spend sufficient time with their families; imagine having to also cook/prepare all of your muscle-building meals, find the time during the day/night to consume them, and sleep enough hours to adequately recover from training.

 

[SLUser11]

I'm curious... where exactly are you in your medical training? Are you in medical school yet? I'm assuming you're not very far along if you're asking this question. Not trying to offend, just making an observation. Working out doesn't fatigue your muscles... it strengthens them... hence the reason for working out. It all depends on which muscle fiber types you are training and to what balance they are trained with respect to the larger, bulkier muscle fiber units. If all you do is 3 reps of a million pounds, chances are, you won't be able to clip that aneurysm with the dexterity of a dainty hummingbird. But your residency training will provide the fine dexterity needed for the procedures by the sheer volume of cases you will complete. Moreover, once you are an attending... chances are you won't be doing multiple cases every day like you seem to assume based on your posting. Many NS's operate 1-2x/wk and that's it. Some have only a primary case once q 1-2 weeks and assist on other days.

I was unwillingly drawn to this thread by its title......just want to say that the above quote is one of the dumbest things I've ever read on SDN. Ok, carry on............

 

[cdql]

Yeah, he combats muscle fatigue by wearing sleevless scrubshirts and practicing really bad karate forms with the anesthesiologist outside of the OR😀

-Mike

i saw an episode last week

highlight: dr. rey getting thrashed soundly as he went to different tranining facilities and attempted to "learn" different forms of martial arts (what is the point of spending an hour a week at each of these places to just get one's ass kicked? would it not be smarter to master one of them and then move on to the next?)

lowlight: there was another doctor who's last name is so complicated that I won't even attempt to butcher it (started with an M though) who used to be a bodybuilder (a la Ahnold)

the dude is still pretty big but it was shocking to see what he looked like before residency and what he looked like after

probably hard to dedicate sufficient time to both work and weightlifting

especially if you have a family to look after in between!

 

[Surgeon24]

However, I know that for results, one must train, eat, and sleep.
...
Gaining significant muscle mass, at least for the genetically typical male, requires adequate energy for training (from what I hear, chronic sleep deprivation is rampant), an overabundance of calories spread throughout the day (I have a hard time believing that a surgeon/surgical resident could manage to eat/drink 6+ monstrous meals throughout the day and keep his job), as well as both adequate sleep and stress levels that are kept in check. I'm pretty sure that medicine (particularly surgery, worse still for interns/residents) is one of the worst professions for the last two factors.

Birdmanblair knows what he's talking about.

I'm a PGY-1 resident in general surgery. During medical school, I used to workout seriously (3x a week; big exercises, decent weights), do some extra cardio (3 times a week), eat very well and rest well. It wasn't always easy, but I managed to do it. I have lots of friends who did even better than me (national competition) when they were in med school.
Now that I'm an intern, it's a whole different thing. I still manage to workout, but the results are lacking. Why? Mostly because of bad eating, bad resting, freaking tired. And the more you advance in a surgery residency, the more it becomes difficult (IMHO).

Personally, three things i have noticed from working out and residency:

1-) Never workout the morning if you plan to go to the OR. If you're lifting big weights and using a lot of grip muscles (i.e. deadlifts), your dexterity will suffer for a couple of hours post-training (at least for me).

2-) The strain of a hard workout can drain you. I have always been training hard (i.e. dead tired after the workout). This can drain your energy and you might feel like **** the next day. Proper intensity is key.

3-) Some rotations are easier than others. Working out hard and eating well is easier when you're doing a 8 AM to 6 PM rotation (i.e. ICU, cardiology, and such).

Hope this helps,
You won't be able to be a competitive bodybuilder and excellent neurosurgeon during your residency...but you still can keep your body in 'shape' and do your best to stay healthy. In order to see excellent results from working out, you need to train hard, eat hard, rest hard. If one is lacking, and you will get fat (from eating hard) or hit a plateau.

Bear in mind that a residency in surgery is not considered 'healthy' at all...but you can try and make the best out of it.