What are my chances?

[Ruminant]

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I was curious to know what your opinions are of my chances. First, I'll be applying this june as soon as the application comes out for the class of 2004. My overall gpa is a 3.702 and my science gpa is a 3.43. I received a 9V,10B,10P,R which is a 29. I am a California resident and would preferably go to a CA med school if I can. I am half Peruvian and half filipino. I am not sure if I would be considered a URM but I did attend MMEP. I also attended another premed summer program as well. I have volunteered in a hospital for a year, and have shadowed a family physician for a month. I also play some intramural sports such as basketball and soccer. I have also had a job during the school year. I have 5 letters of rec, 1 from my employee, 1 from the family doc i shadowed who happened to be a DO (not sure if that might hurt me for MD schools), 1 good one from an english teacher, and 2 science. So what are my chances to get in particularly at a CA schools? Thanks for any replies.

 

[UCLAMAN]

What other extra curriculars do you have? Any research? What exactly did you do in these summer programs?

I'd say those numbers give you a shot at the UC's. But it will be a crapshoot. you may get an interview at a few or may not get an interview at any. I'd say the numbers shouldn't prevent you from getting an interview at a uc. However, you would really need to demonstrate some uniqueness as far as your extra curriculars are concerned to snag an interview at a UC. I mean...everyone plays IM sports. So hopefully you have more unique experiences.

The other cali schools...stanford, usc and loma linda...

Stanford may be difficult to get an interview at with just those experiences(keep in mind. i don't know all the details of who you are. those summer programs may have been very unique or you may have other things that make you unique. I'm just going off of what you posted). I am Pilipino as well and we are not considered URM. Have no clue about being preuvian though. USC may be hard too...I hear they are trying to snag people with higher mcats. Loma Linda has a pref for sda's but you may very well get an interview there with those numbers.

A 29 isn't bad. Your gpa is fine. Its difficult to say what will happen. But I'd be willing to say that it is definitely possible to get several cali interviews. I think with those numbers getting cali interviews is gonna come down to how unique of a person u can paint yourself to be on your essays and through your extracurriculars. Then again...I guess thats how it goes for every school in the US.

Good luck!!!!

 

[Ruminant]

Thanks for the advice UCLAMAN. At my summer programs I actually got to shadow several doctors so I thought that was cool. I'm just in a couple of clubs as far as extracurricular activities go. I am actually interested in USC and Loma Linda since their averages for their mcats and gpa are a bit lower than then UCs.

 

[UCLAMAN]

Shadowing is good, but remember...for the most part...many applicants have shadowed physicians. Take the time to really examine what makes you unique and make sure you convey it when you apply. I'm sure there is something!

🙂

 

[LoneCoyote]

Unfortunately, South Americans are not considered URM right now even if you did MMEP. There was another thread about this not long ago you can check out if you're interested... it starts out talking about being from Turkey but if you keep going it evolves into a big discussion on Hispanics and the URM definition.

http://www.studentdoctor.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=61718&highlight=Hispanic+URM

I think UCLAMAN gave you some good advice. I am also a California applicant applying this June and have heard very similar things about UC admissions from friends who have gone thru it. Maybe, if you are going to have a lag year out of school while you're applying, you can look for a health related internship, research, or something "unique" to talk about in the interviews. Good luck 🙂

 

[Ruminant]

There seems to be this idea of having something unique to say about yourself. What can you do to stand out? I think MMEP is a unique program and have much to say about that. What else could I do?

 

[sunflower79]

Welcome to SDN, ruminant...

I'm not sure what these "what are my chances" threads do for the OP (original poster) just before applying other than ease the nerves... but I suppose that's a worthy cause.

I'm going to call it like I see it, don't take it personally:

Overall your package looks average. You didn't mention any volunteering. If you were too busy doing paid work that's fine though, if it's research even better. Try to shine on your PS (personal statement), i.e. take whatever is unique about you and/or whatever you're passionate about and weave a story that only YOU can tell.

Don't pin your hopes on a CA school, if only because like UCLAman said it's a crapshoot and says nothing about your qualifications. You will get in somewhere if you play your cards right, i.e. apply early and spread your bet over a range of schools.

Good luck! 🙂

 

[Ruminant]

Actually sunflower I did mention volunteering in my original post. I have volunteered at a hospital for a little over a year now.

 

[sunflower79]

Originally posted by Ruminant
There seems to be this idea of having something unique to say about yourself. What can you do to stand out? I think MMEP is a unique program and have much to say about that. What else could I do?

It's not what you can do, it's what you've ALREADY done with your life. You have a history of life experiences that are interesting and that make you unique. When I wrote my PS, it took me a long time to figure this out and when I did, I was rewarded with more than just a great PS.

Unfortunately I know nothing about MMEP but if that inspired you it can be a jumping off point, although since many others have gone through it I wouldn't make it the main focus.

 

[sunflower79]

Originally posted by Ruminant
Actually sunflower I did mention volunteering in my original post. I have volunteered at a hospital for a little over a year now.

oops!

Sorry, I was skimming. Anyway, after reading more carefully my comments still stand. It's tough competition out there, and--correct me if I'm wrong--what you've written so far hasn't convinced me that you have done something to distinguish yourself from the others. But don't feel obligated to try to convince me. I'm just offering food for thought.

cheers,
sunflower79

 

[Ruminant]

I'm just curious to hear other people's experiences that make them unique. To be honest I don't see what is the big deal with uniqueness. It's either the committee likes your whole package and what you have to say or they don't. I believe it's just a matter of how you word it in an interview. I think my experiences are unique in itself and don't have to do something extraordinary to stand out. I mean honestly, what else could I do besides maybe doing research.

 

[maoeris]

Your experiences are okay. What I believe you should do is really try to figure out why you want to be a doctor. Also you may want to consider what makes a good doctor and characteristics one would use to describe a doctor. For example you may consider a doctor: a leader, compassionate, humanity serving and inquisitive. Then you may want to brainstorm how you have developed some of the qualities that a future docotor should have. For humanity serving you could describe how you served soup to the sick etc. This way you can define your uniqueness. Again I agree with the previous poster that UC's are definitely competitive, and knowing what makes you stand out will help when it comes down to being accepted or waitlisted.

 

[LoneCoyote]

Originally posted by Ruminant
I'm just curious to hear other people's experiences that make them unique. To be honest I don't see what is the big deal with uniqueness. It's either the committee likes your whole package and what you have to say or they don't. I believe it's just a matter of how you word it in an interview. I think my experiences are unique in itself and don't have to do something extraordinary to stand out. I mean honestly, what else could I do besides maybe doing research.

Well since I am not sure yet if the UCs will see me as unique enough I will not post my own experiences. But here's some of the stuff (not research related) that my friends who got in had done.... did health related volunteering internationally, had a common theme in their volunteer experiences like women's health or working with the homeless and underserved communities, took a year off after college and did Americorps, played 4 years of varsity sports and spent summers coaching basketball for inner city youth. I agree with what Sunflower said earlier. It is not so much what you do but how you market it into your own story. You make it clear that you are very involved and passionate about something, whether it is your volunteer work, flying kites, whatever. I wouldn't freak out that you haven't done enough. I would just use the next couple of months to start working on your personal statement and thinking about the expereinces you have had and how they have shaped your career goals.

I agree with you too that they are looking at your whole package, but with so many applicants at the UCs they can be very picky. If your package is similar to many of the other applicants, i.e. decent scores, some typical college activities, some volunteering, and write a personal statement that is adequate but doesn't stand out much, the package may not grab them and you may not even be given a chance to interview. Believe me, I feel your pain on this whole thing... being a CA resident is both a curse and a blessing... we have great schools but they are the hardest to get into. Good luck.

 

[UCLAMAN]

Originally posted by Ruminant
I'm just curious to hear other people's experiences that make them unique. To be honest I don't see what is the big deal with uniqueness. It's either the committee likes your whole package and what you have to say or they don't. I believe it's just a matter of how you word it in an interview. I think my experiences are unique in itself and don't have to do something extraordinary to stand out. I mean honestly, what else could I do besides maybe doing research.

Hmm...theres a problem with that. You won't be getting interviews at all if you really don't convey what makes you unique and what makes you a asset to the medical profession.

What people here are trying to tell you is that volunteering at a hospital does not make you unique. EVERYONE has volunteered at hospitals.(well...maybe not everyone...but the majority have) Have you held leadership positions somewhere? Have you organized heatlh fairs? Have you been a tutor? Have you organized toiletry drives for the homeless? Do you have research? Has it been published? Any scholarships or awards for it? Have you had experiences with healthcare in a foreign country? Have you been involved in a hospice program having to care for the terminally ill? Are you fluent in sign language for the deaf? Are you a master pianist? Any awards to show for that? Are you an accomplished martial arts black belt? Have you created a science tutorial cd for inner city elementary children? Do you play ice hockey even though you are a cali resident? These are all things that will make you unique. There are a billion other things that can make you unique. You have to take the time as sunflower said to assess what makes you unique. What do those experiences say about you? What have you learned about yourself from those experiences?

I fear that you think doing some volunteering and shadowing coupled with a good gpa and decent mcat will get you in. Wrong...what will get you in is what makes you different. What will get you in(especially with those numbers) is what makes you different from the other people who have the same stats as you. You MUST convey that in your essays or you won't get interviews.

With that said...it isn't merely wording. If you write an essay about how great it was to shadow physicians it really won't fly very far. Remember, EVERYONE has shadowed a physician. The point is...based on the very little info that you have posted about yourself you really aren't a very unique applicant. If you think the MMEP program makes you unique...how? What personal stories can you convey about your unique experience? How would your shadowing experience differ from everyone else's shadowing experience?

Are you a unique person? Yes! I am sure you have had unique experiences that you can write about. Remember, i'm just judging you by what little info you have posted.

But you are unique. Everyone is! Sometimes it takes time to reassess your life, look back and figure out what is extraordinary about you.

You stated that you feel "your experiences are unique in itself"...
I guess the real question you should be trying to answer is....How? How is volunteering and shadowing unique? What other experiences have you had? How do those experiences convey your uniqueness?

Good luck with your introspection!!!

 

[dreaminOfMD>.<]

Very well said UCLAMan!

Anyhow Ruminant, you really should think of uniqueness as a big deal. Consider the thousands upon thousands of applications they recieve. How will you portray yourself on those pieces of paper so that the admissions committe will pick YOU for an interview? Remember, all you are to them before the interview is papers in a file. Like UCLAMAN has said, EVERYONE shadows and everyone volunteers...stand out! Make yourself seen to them by showing them what your all about😉 ! I truly believe that uniqueness has become the key to medical school admissions. It's so damn competitive that what used to be considered pretty stellar is now becoming the boring standard.

Use who you are to open up their eyes to your application...and once again, yes, you must take it as a big deal. If you carry an attitude where you don't really think it is a big deal then that attitude won't get you too far...especially in a field like this.

Good luck

 

[Jet915]

Ruminant,
I have similar numbers to you and I go to UCSD. I think uniqueness really counts. You dont want to portray yourself as a typical "cookie cutter" applicant. In my application and secondaries, I really tried to to portray what I thought were my unique qualities. Some of which were my political activities at school, writing opinion pieces for my school paper, photography, various interesting jobs I've had and getting my master's degree at UCSD etc............as well as the "typical" premed stuff like premed club and volunteering. The result: 10 interview invites, an acceptance, a healthy number of waitlists........and one of the invites was at UC Davis which I have in a couple of weeks. I feel pretty happy with the outcome and really happy about getting atleast one UC. Like everyone else says though, it's really a crapshoot. Also, I applied to alot of schools (36) so that might have something to do with it too. Apply to alot if you can. Hope that helps...

Jetson

 

[Ruminant]

Thanks everyone for the advice. I believe I have done enough activities considering I am still a junior in college and don't have the time to do what some nontraditional applicants can do to beef up their application. For every student that has gotten in because they are "unique", I think there is also a student that has gotten in who has similar activities and stats as me. Maybe not to a UC, but I'm sure to another med school. I will try to see how I am unique, but do not intend to take a year off just to be "unique". We'll see how it goes.

 

[UCLAMAN]

Originally posted by Ruminant
Thanks everyone for the advice. I believe I have done enough activities considering I am still a junior in college and don't have the time to do what some nontraditional applicants can do to beef up their application. For every student that has gotten in because they are "unique", I think there is also a student that has gotten in who has similar activities and stats as me. Maybe not to a UC, but I'm sure to another med school. I will try to see how I am unique, but do not intend to take a year off just to be "unique". We'll see how it goes.

Whats the rush? It is quite the opposite...if you are just a junior you have plenty of time to beef up your application. I used to think like that. I was firm on not taking a year off. I applied the first cycle with wonderful ECs, similar mcat and 3.81 gpa. I got the shaft at 30+ schools. Had I waited a year I would have had a beefed up resume and just gone through this application process once. Adcoms will not look at the fact that you are a junior and give you leeway for a weak resume(not saying you have a weak resume. I haven't seen your full resume so I don't know). They aren't gonna say "well this guy is a junior so he doesn't have to have as many quality ECs so lets accept him." It ain't gonna happen that way. Just keep that in mind.

None of us on these boards are really in a position to tell you what to do. But my only advice to you if you apply this cycle is to make sure that you do not quit any activities you are in and to continue to strive for excellence EVEN WHILE YOU ARE APPLYING. In fact, add activities during the year you are applying. Why? If you do not get accepted anywhere you can immediately reapply the following cycle because you will have beefed up your resume. In the event you get in the first cycle those activities won't be a waste either because hopefully they will be activities you enjoy doing and may even be related to becoming a physician. If one really wanted to become a physician, such medically/humanitarian/leadership building activities would be things you enjoy as it is.

Good luck!!🙂

 

[Ruminant]

UCLAMAN, I'm just curious how many interviews and waitlists did you receive the first time you applied?

 

[UCLAMAN]

Originally posted by Ruminant
UCLAMAN, I'm just curious how many interviews and waitlists did you receive the first time you applied?

30+ schools. Broad range from the UC's to NYMC to MCW to Loma Linda etc.

Only interviewed at 2 schools...Vanderbilt and Loma Linda.

Rejected from both of them. Not even waitlisted.

Thats why I'm so paranoid. It bites going through this process twice. I got 11 interview invites this cycle...from Stanford to Dartmouth to Northwestern etc. I declined one invitation. Since I'm an august mcater I'm still waiting for most of my decisions. Since I got in to NW I don't care about the rest of my interview decisions except for Stanford's. I applied consecutive cycles. See what a difference a year makes?

 

[Ruminant]

Wow that is a big difference. What did you do in that year to have such a dramatic change?

 

[UCLAMAN]

got published, got a scholarship for my research, became a leader in some of the programs i was involved with during the first cycle, began tutoring the homeless in a rehab program. I already had some pretty unique activities for the first cycle. I guess I just needed to show a little bit more leadership and research accomplishments. I also beefed up my mcat, not by too much though. Right now working for kaplan, applying to be a summer camp counselor for camp ronald mcdonald good times in idyllwild. took an anatomy course at the jc this past fall. planning on possibly traveling to the philippines this may.

 

[sunflower79]

Originally posted by UCLAMAN
Whats the rush? It is quite the opposite...if you are just a junior you have plenty of time to beef up your application. I used to think like that. I was firm on not taking a year off. I applied the first cycle with wonderful ECs, similar mcat and 3.81 gpa. I got the shaft at 30+ schools. Had I waited a year I would have had a beefed up resume and just gone through this application process once. Adcoms will not look at the fact that you are a junior and give you leeway for a weak resume(not saying you have a weak resume. I haven't seen your full resume so I don't know). They aren't gonna say "well this guy is a junior so he doesn't have to have as many quality ECs so lets accept him." It ain't gonna happen that way. Just keep that in mind.

None of us on these boards are really in a position to tell you what to do. But my only advice to you if you apply this cycle is to make sure that you do not quit any activities you are in and to continue to strive for excellence EVEN WHILE YOU ARE APPLYING. In fact, add activities during the year you are applying. Why? If you do not get accepted anywhere you can immediately reapply the following cycle because you will have beefed up your resume. In the event you get in the first cycle those activities won't be a waste either because hopefully they will be activities you enjoy doing and may even be related to becoming a physician. If one really wanted to become a physician, such medically/humanitarian/leadership building activities would be things you enjoy as it is.

Good luck!!🙂

Wow. UCLAman's story sounds like one of those horror applicant stories we premeds hear: great package but no acceptances. Not even at NYMC! I applied two years ago and got waitlisted there 😛 and my stats weren't even as good.

I completely agree that taking a year off is NOT a bad thing. It gives you time to buff up your application, and it will increase your chances of 1) acceptance, 2) not having to reapply and waste time and energy and money. This process is worse than the MCAT (read: you don't want to do this more than once!).

I have never heard anyone say that taking a year off was a bad thing, partly because they all say it's a refreshing break from going through school straight through. So it will likely even be a good thing for you personally. The Real World is completely different from college, and many adcom members appreciate that, perhaps that's why the average age of med students (read: accepted applicants) has climbed.

Again, not forcing anyone to do anyone, but just seconding UCLAman's opinion.

cheers,
sunflower79

 

[Ruminant]

For what it's worth, I do intend on applying to DO schools as well particularly COMP, TUCOM, and AZCOM. I have no qualms about going to DO school as I know much of you might have, because the way I see, it's all the same in the end. Perhaps I will avoid UCLAMANs problem and so many other applicants problems of reapplying again because they may not have applied to DO schools. I do not see it as a backup, but rather as another choice. In fact, I want to go into primary care so it wouldn't make much difference. I have no intention of reapplying again and will make every effort to make some medical school the first time around.

 

[Jet915]

If you are planning on applying to DO as well and would go, then I suggest you apply. Based on your stats, you shouldnt have too hard of a problem getting into DO.

Jetson

 

[Ruminant]

Indeed, I intend to.

 

[abw]

Originally posted by Jet915
If you are planning on applying to DO as well and would go, then I suggest you apply. Based on your stats, you shouldnt have too hard of a problem getting into DO.

Jetson

I have to disagree with that - Don't go into this process thinking of osteopathic schools as an automatic back-up plan. I went into this process looking to go to osteopathic schools or my state allopathic schools. I was told by the one osteopathic school where I interviewed that I had a really strong essay showing my commitment to d.o. (i used that essay on all my d.o. apps). I also had a glowing lor from my own doc who's a d.o., above average stats for all the d.o. schools I applied to, and really unique e.c.'s and leadership. As it turned out, I only got one osteopathic invite. My other 4 invites were from allopathic schools where I my scores were considered below average.

Ruminant, it doesn't seem like you're warming up to the idea of "being unique". My frosh year of college, I read a really good article in the Wall Street Journal about college admissions that I think would apply. In it, they made the point that colleges aren't looking to fill their class with a bunch of well rounded students - instead, they want a well rounded class. The difference between the two is that the first graduates a bunch of people who are all similar with nothing spectacular; whereas the second graduates many different people who are already accomplished in an area and are on their way to making a name or statement.

It's not bad to do activities that everyone else does - everyone does them for a good reason. The point is, that of 5000 applications at school XYZ, 1000 might say the SAME EXACT thing that yours does. What would make the admissions committee reach in and say - wow! ruminant is the one! Furthermore, what will make them say that over the, say 2000, really unique applicants that can bring something extra to the program.

I dreaded taking a year off after college with the thought of all the extra school ahead of me, but it's really the best thing I did. Looking back, I wish I had waited. I can think of all the extra knowledge, poise and experience I could present to my pre-med committe and to the adcoms. I think it gives you a bit of time to grow up.

Good Luck, but don't rush into things. You are unique, I promise. Find out why!!

 

[UCLAMAN]

abw is correct. think of medical school classes as basketball teams. u only need to be maybe 2 or 3 deep at each position. Furthermore of the 2 or 3 point guards on the team one may be more of a passer while the other may be more of a scorer and the third may be more of a defensive specialist.

Forming medical school classes are analogous to forming basketball teams.

Definitely an oversimplification but you get the gist.

 

[milesinfinitus]

Hey dude,
If you're truly interested in getting into a UC (and from your later posts, this might not be the case but...), I would really listen to the previous posters. It sounds like you're kinda blowing off the "be unique" advice, but you gotta realize that getting into a UC is no joke. Look at the admit rates for all the UC's. I havne't looked recently, but I'm assuming they're all well under 10%. I'm also assuming that at least 30% (ok, i'm obviously pulling this number out my a$$) have scores as good or better than yours. I was pretty humbled when I didn't get an interview w/ UCLA w/ a 38/3.7 from a HPYS school. And honestly, I thought my extracurrics were well above average (but then again, whose aren't, rite?😉). Bottom line, there's a reason there are so many Cali kids out at schools in random f@ck places across the country. Getting into a UC med school, or any Cali med school, is uber competitive. My advice to you would be to go save some medically underserved people (children would be better, people seem to be especially responsive to savign the children) in a 3rd world country and milk the hell out of that experience.

 

[Jet915]

Sorry abw if my comments seem harsh. It's just based on my experience. I have a couple of friends applying this year who got several DO interviews but no MD.

Jetson

 

[abw]

Hey!
I didn't think the comments sounded harsh at all. I just know a lot of people think that d.o. is a sure fire safety to get them in if they're stats are good, and I just wanted to say that they weren't. No harm done!

 

[Ruminant]

abw, even though it may not be a backup plan, I think it would not be going out on a limb to say that I have a better chance of making a DO school vs an MD school. I do know about the osteopathic philosophy and have shadowed a DO so it's not like I don't know what it's about. I think Jet915 shares prevalent view among most premeds that seems to be right; DO schools do accept applicants with lower stats compared to MD. I mean just doing a search on accepted stats on the pre-DO board, i was surprised to see several applicants get in with a 3.2 gpa and a below 26 mcat.

 

[moviefreak]

ruminant, your orig question is on your chances of getting into a cali schoool. now, whether you meant do or md--is another matter. people who have posted were frank, pragmatic and had really good suggestions for you and prob assessed the situation fr the perspective of an applicant wanting to get into a UC. as a cali app who wants to get into a UC, i am humbled by co-applicants because usually they have similar or greater and more impressive experiences than myself. indeed, there must be something unique in an app to be picked up fr the many who are equally accomplished. it strikes me as arrogant that you think your experiences are "unique" enough and sufficient enough that you snob exploring and developing the breadth, depth, and possibilities of these experiences. all of which need due time.

 

[UCLAMAN]

Originally posted by moviefreak
ruminant, your orig question is on your chances of getting into a cali schoool. now, whether you meant do or md--is another matter. people who have posted were frank, pragmatic and had really good suggestions for you and prob assessed the situation fr the perspective of an applicant wanting to get into a UC. as a cali app who wants to get into a UC, i am humbled by co-applicants because usually they have similar or greater and more impressive experiences than myself. indeed, there must be something unique in an app to be picked up fr the many who are equally accomplished. it strikes me as arrogant that you think your experiences are "unique" enough and sufficient enough that you snob exploring and developing the breadth, depth, and possibilities of these experiences. all of which need due time.

Ruminant,

I just want to make a comment about the frankness of the posts here. Then again, I guess I can't speak for everyone here but I'd imagine they are thinking along the same lines as me. Whatever I post isn't to rip you down or make you feel stupid or whatever. I hope you don't see it that way. Just trying to tell you the reality of things so you have an idea of what you are up against and can make changes(such as going do or waiting a year, etc.) accordingly. I want you to get better. I want you to get into a UC. But remember, no one improves with sugarcoated answers. Sorta like when you give an essay to a friend to proofread and all they say is "its good!" That is absolutely positively worthless to you. Furthermore, it is certainly your discretion to take everyone's advice or not. Just like someone may not agree with your essay, you are still the final say in what changes and what doesn't change in that essay. I just hope you aren't taking my comments, or anyone else's here personally. I'm fairly sure all of us here wants you to get into the medical school of your choice if it is possible. 🙂

I'm just curious here. Whats the rush? I mean...why aren't you willing to take a year off? (Again, I'm not saying that you should. I'm just curious as to why you wouldn't want to take a year off. I teach DATs and one of my students isn't willing to take a year off to beef up her app. Her line of reasoning is that if she takes a year off, then she won't have the motivation to start dental school again. Yikes! Talk about doing something for the wrong reasons. If being a dentist is what she really wanted to do, then she would never really get so lazy to the point of no longer wanting to attend dental school. I'm not saying this is your reason. I'm just curious as to what yours is.)

I'm sure you have your reasons. What are they?

 

[abw]

Originally posted by Ruminant
abw, even though it may not be a backup plan, I think it would not be going out on a limb to say that I have a better chance of making a DO school vs an MD school. I do know about the osteopathic philosophy and have shadowed a DO so it's not like I don't know what it's about. I think Jet915 shares prevalent view among most premeds that seems to be right; DO schools do accept applicants with lower stats compared to MD. I mean just doing a search on accepted stats on the pre-DO board, i was surprised to see several applicants get in with a 3.2 gpa and a below 26 mcat.

Hey, I'm probably not making myself clear. I fully agree with the fact that it's easier stats-wise to get into osteopathic schools. Also, there are on average less applications to those schools, so your chances of getting in are higher. Of course that's a fact - anyone can look that up. Many people use osteopathic schools as a back-up plan, and many use this as a first choice - to each his/her own. It doesn't matter to me how you go about or perceive d.o. schools - everyone does what they gotta/want to do. What I'm trying to say is that your stats being so much higher than the averages at d.o. schools doesn't guarantee you'll get in. Even if you understand the philosophy and have experience. I was trying to use myself as an example, because even though my numbers where higher than the averages of each of the osteopathic schools I applied to, and even though I was motivated towards the field, I was rejected without even an interview from all but one school. All things considered, the average applicant will probably have a much easier time getting into osteopathic schools, but it doesn't always work that way.

Sorry if i come off sounding mean or too frank. It's not meant that way - it's just meant to give you something to think about.

 

[Ruminant]

it strikes me as arrogant that you think your experiences are "unique" enough and sufficient enough that you snob exploring and developing the breadth, depth, and possibilities of these experiences

Moviefreak it's called confidence not arrogance. You do not know my experiences so you cannot make such a blatant statement based on what you have read. I've merely simplified my experiences to give a brief overview.

I'm just curious here. Whats the rush? I mean...why aren't you willing to take a year off?

UCLAMAN, I do not want to waste a year doing whatever just to make my application look better. I neither have the patience nor willingness to spend a whole year basically doing nothing or nonsense, when I could have spent that year in med school. I want to get med school done as soon as possible so I will be below 30 when I'm a practicing doctor. My parents pay for my education, and have no intention of wasting their money further by me delaying a year to get into school. I think I can make some school as I am now and will not accept anything less. By the way, 63% of MMEP graduates do make med school and that is posted on the AAMC site. If I should not make a school, then I'll go into another career. It's all or nothing.

 

[UCLAMAN]

Originally posted by Ruminant

UCLAMAN, I do not want to waste a year doing whatever just to make my application look better. I neither have the patience nor willingness to spend a whole year basically doing nothing or nonsense, when I could have spent that year in med school. I want to get med school done as soon as possible so I will be below 30 when I'm a practicing doctor. My parents pay for my education, and have no intention of wasting their money further by me delaying a year to get into school. I think I can make some school as I am now and will not accept anything less. By the way, 63% of MMEP graduates do make med school and that is posted on the AAMC site. If I should not make a school, then I'll go into another career. It's all or nothing.

But you wouldn't be wasting a year doing "whatever." You would be involved with something. In fact, hopefully you would be involved with a lot of things. Since you would be taking a year off your parents wouldn't be paying for your education. How would you be wasting their money? In fact, unless your parents are millionaires(in which case paying for your education would be chump change) you will never be going to them for educational expenses since you will be taking quite a bit of loans out for med school. As far as the year off...with a little initiative you could get a job at a research lab or as a phlebotimist or something; anything that would pay the bills for the year. 63% isn't 100% so just keep in mind what you would do if you are part of the other 40%.

If you don't get into medical school then you will try another career? Sounds like you don't really give a damn about dedicating yourself to the medical profession. Gees...why do u wanna be a doctor anyways if you wouldn't reapply in the event you got rejected? I mean if medicine was something you really wanted to do you would bust your butt and do anything to get into medical school. So what are you gonna say during the interview when the doc asks you what you will do if you do not get in this year?

Gees...no patience huh? Medicine definitely isn't for you bro. What are you gonna do about the long hours of residency? Are you not gonna have the patience for that? What about the enormous volumes of information you will need to learn in med school? No patience for that either? What about patients you may have trouble communicating with? No patience? What about HMO's an dinsurance companies who may shaft a patient? Will you have the patience to fight for what your patient needs? I'd say medicine involves a lot of patience.

Becoming a doctor isn't a race. Its not about having an MD when you are 28 so you can brag about it.

Granted I don't know you personally. I've never walked a mile in your shoes. So I don't know. But from what you've been posting here it sounds like you are getting into this profession for the wrong reasons. Maybe you should get your mind right before you attempt to apply.

 

[Ruminant]

UCLAMAN, it's not your place to say medicine is not for me and I do not want to be a doctor before 30 so I can "brag" about it. Just because you made a medical school does not mean you are the official know how about making a school. Given you do have experience with the process, you're experience is only one out of many. So please, do not make outrageous statements that I should get "my mind" right before applying to med school because I know why I want to go into medicine.

 

[Louweezel]

hello ruminant,

i just wanted to share my experience with you so you know where these other sdners are coming from. i'm a cali resident who goes to school on a full-tuition scholarship out of state - not at an ivy, but a decent private school nonetheless. i have pretty decent numbers if i say so myself, a 3.91 total gpa (3.88 bcpm) and a 37 on the MCAT (12V, 12P, 13B, P). i have made the dean's list every semester, and will graduate summa cum laude in may barring any extreme academic disasters.

i have wanted to be a doctor, and nothing else, since i was 2. i volunteered at rainbow children's and babies hospital with cancer kids and also during summers at community hospitals. i also volunteered non medically with 3-5 year olds at a daycare. i do odd volunteering things like habitat for humanity, cleaning up cleveland's west side and reading to elementary school children from time to time.

i did a summer of research as part of a competitive scholars program where not only did i get to shadow any doctors in the physician directory that i wanted (i saw a LOT of stuff those 10 weeks), i also had the abstract of my research presented at a national meeting of the pediatric academic society and a publication will hopefully be accepted in the next couple of weeks.

i currently work as a teaching assistant for a biology lab, as well as previously having worked as a church pianist.

i'm involved in student organizations ranging from cultural groups to honor societies to residence hall councils, with actual leadership positions. i'm also part of a select group of students known as the college scholars who work on fostering leadership, scholarship and service as a three year interdisciplinary program.

yes, i have in fact organized a health fair (on complementary medicine actually in University Hospitals of Cleveland). i play the piano at least decently (i won a piano when i was 12 years old in an international competition in asia). i have lived in 3 different countries in 3 different continents and have traveled to many different places in the world. i had pretty much a guaranteed shot at getting into oxford or cambridge, had i stayed in england.

i had done a fair amount (not all of this though) by my junior year in college. and what is the point of this drivel and my life story by the way you are probably asking?

i hoped that i might at least have a chance of getting even an interview at a UC school/school in california.

the result was 3 rejections without any interviews.

i couldn't have come across as "arrogant" in my interviews or anything, since I DIDN'T EVEN GET ANY!

yes, i did get accepted to medical school, at some wonderful places. yes, i am still going to be the best damn doctor i can be. but these sdners are offering sound advice. it is true that they don't know you or your whole story. they are responding to the info you have shared with them. none of us wants to discourage you or see you fail, that's why we're offering our advice.

i personally am going straight from undergrad to med school. i am currently 20 years old. not that i am against taking a year off to discover myself, but i am happy with how things have turned out right now. you stated that you hoped for a UC school - they do stress individuality. you seemed not too concerned with being unique - sdners were merely offering a year off as a way to help and bolster that uniqueness that UCs seem to want. i am sure that other people with similar stats and activities to you got in, but there are MANY of these similar applicants. the ones that got in were the lucky ones. why leave it up to luck and just hope for the best? why not take every action possible to try to ensure success?

ultimately you know yourself better than anyone else. i hope you won't take my words as a discouragement or in any spirit of meanness. i am just saying that despite all my efforts, UCs didn't like me too much. you really want to do everything you can to give yourself the best chance.

i wish you the very best of luck.

UCLAMAN, i was extremely happy to hear of your acceptance. your story is inspiring to all people who didn't make it first time around.

 

[Doc Ivy]

Ruminant,

Please try not to get defensive, I think what most of us are reacting to is your "all or nothing statement".
Personally, I want to be a doctor so badly, and have such a clear vision of my career in my mind that the thought of applying once and giving up just never entered my mind. Either you get in this year or you give it up forever??? I don't want to judge but it just doesn't seem like your committment is that deep.
I've said this before on another thread, but I'll say it again: it is sooo worth it to take the time to develop your application, your life story into something that conveys a coherent "argument" as to why you should be a doctor. Just because med schools only require you to have a bachelors's degree with some cookie cutter ECs to get in doesn't mean you have to stop there... After all was said and done it took me 4 years to amass a meaningful set of experiences that would leave no doubt in the adcoms mind that women's health is what I was put on this earth to do. I won't go into all the boring details, but it involves taking the time... and as a result I've only had to apply once, no heartaches, no rejections, and interviews at all top 10 and 20 schools, and several acceptances. In the end my personal statement wrote itself, but reflected the years of introspection. I'll be 25 when I start, I'll be "below 30" when I get my MD, and I don't think the extra time earning a graduate degree, publishing research, training as an EMT, working in clinics, going abroad etc. has been a "waste of time doing nonsense"... I've been doing what I love
Don't blow off the importance of being unique, as others have said--we all are, but you still have to weave a unique thread through YOUR life.
Medicine is an honor, a priviledge, and an immense undertaking and for that reason admissions committees have to select the best, brightest, and the most COMMITTED!
Take hard look at not just why you WANT to be a doctor, but what have you done to DESERVE the responsibility. How have you gone above and beyond the call of duty?

Remember, you're young, and life is a marathon, not a sprint

 

[UCLAMAN]

Originally posted by Ruminant
UCLAMAN, it's not your place to say medicine is not for me and I do not want to be a doctor before 30 so I can "brag" about it. Just because you made a medical school does not mean you are the official know how about making a school. Given you do have experience with the process, you're experience is only one out of many. So please, do not make outrageous statements that I should get "my mind" right before applying to med school because I know why I want to go into medicine.

Please enlighten me about your reasons for becoming a physician then. Why do you want to go into medicine?

Its good practice...you will definitely have the question asked of you during interviews. Like I said, I don't know you so I could be totally completely off base. I'm just going off of how you come across in your posts. But, I WANT YOU TO PROVE ME WRONG.

So tell me. Why medicine? Why should a medical school pick you out of the 6000 applications they receive? Why medicine before you are 30?

 

[Ruminant]

Louweezel, all I can say you are beyond superhuman for accomplishing all that before the age of 21. You guys have all convinced me that I have almost no chance of getting into a UC with my stats and ECs. Therefore, I will focus now on getting into an out of state school which I believe would be a bit easier.
As to UCLAMANs questions

Why medicine? Why should a medical school pick you out of the 6000 applications they receive? Why medicine before you are 30?

Because, Why not, because in that order respectively.

 

[Louweezel]

hey rumi

my intent was not to persuade you that you won't get into a UC. only to let you know why all these sdners seem to push the unique thing so much. i would say focus on both instate and out of state. don't write yourself off already for UCs. and finding your "uniqueness" (yes, overused, i know) is a way to help you get into a UC if that's where you want to be.

i'm not superhuman at all, in fact i consider myself an unfortunately rather regular human being, and sadly to the UCs i was sub-par 😛

on another point though, uclaman brings up important questions. maybe you don't want to answer those questions to him, but those are the kind of things that med schools want to know. they will expect those answers in your primary amcas application, in your secondaries and in your interviews. i thought i knew the answers until i had to actually verbalize them, and then i realized it was harder than i had previously thought. whether in state or out of state, you need to know the answers. i was asked those questions at every one of my (non-UC 😡 ) interviews. out of state schools also get 3000-6000 applications *just like yours* (well, kinda). once again the whole uniqueness thing comes in. and how well you can answer questions like uclaman's.

good luck!

 

[Ruminant]

ok superman duly noted.

 

[Louweezel]

that's super-woman to you 😛

 

[Ruminant]

I am a bit confused here. I came on this board to get some advice. Instead I was attacked, and you questioned if I have what it takes to be a doctor and my motivations for medicine. I sense agression from people who are supposed to be the future doctors of our society, the people who are supposed to be there to help others at any cost. I do wonder if medical field fits some of you.

 

[Ruminant]

my bad, louweezel, superwoman and the previous post was not addressed to you.

 

[MDDreamer]

To Ruminant,
When you asked the question what are my chances, I imagine it is hard to hear advice from many sdners to take a year off, but they are hardly attacks meant to hurt you. Sure some comments, meant for thought provoking purposes, may seem on a sensitive side, but they are unbiased and honest answers. Maybe you were hoping for some, "Yes, you are shoo in for UCSF because I am here with the same stats!" But wouldnt those just give you a blind confidence that may or may not help you through out this process? Isnt honesty the best policy?

I think sdners are doing a good job providing advices when they see warning signs, however I think we all forget that we need encouragement too!

So along these lines, though not obligatory, I have to say that by looking at his competitive MCAT score and GPA, Ruminant has the "stats" to get into A medical school. You are 2/3 way there. You just need to convince a med school committee to offer you a seat to their class!

 

[milesinfinitus]

dude, it doesn't seem like you posted here looking for advice at all. It seems that you posted hoping to hear people say "ok honey, you'll be fine. You go on ahead and apply and you'll get in anywhere you want." When people did give good advice, you obviously bristled with contempt at the thought of anyone suggesting that your present accomplishments were not enough to set the world on fire. So don't be surprised if you feel like you're getting attacked. Read your posts. They make you come off as a prick. And don't feed us this "oh doctors are supposed to be perfect benevolent healers with hearts of gold. You people are mean. You shouldn't be doctors" bull$hit. That line is getting old.

 

[ShaylaFinn]

Hi Ruminant -

It's discouraging when you ask for advice and don't like what you hear. But please don't blame the messengers.

No matter how hard you think the admissions process is, it's harder. Ask around on the board and you'll find people with higher MCATs and GPAs, better ECs and LORs who have received NO acceptances.

The folks who have responded thus far are trying to spare you the money, time, and emotional rollercoaster of having to go through the process more than once.

If they didn't want to help, they'd tell you to send in all your stuff "as is"and hope for the best.