What types of specialties might be a good fit for MD/MPH candidates to pursue (and why)?

[RikaN]

Hi everyone,

I'm trying to figure out if a 4 year MD/MPH program I was accepted to might be a good fit for me. I am definitely apprehensive about taking the MPH courses at the same time as MD courses, but I also think they would provide a great broader context for the science we learn during the preclinical years. Also I can finish the MPH courses within the first year and therefore wouldn't have to worry about conflicts with studying for boards in the second year.

I'm trying to figure out if it's worth it though. I know I want to work on the level of population health rather than just on the level of treating individual patients, although I do want to be doing clinical work in my future career as well.

What kinds of specialties do MD/MPH candidates end up pursuing? On a related note, what kinds of specialties would be a good fit for someone with an MD and MPH? I'm guessing something like Radiology or Dermatology would seem almost irrelevant, especially if one if planning to focus on global health work in underserved communities abroad, while maybe Emergency Medicine or certain types of Surgery would be a great fit. Perhaps Internal Medicine would be the most applicable though and general enough to be shaped to suit one's overall career goals--like maybe pursuing a subspecialty in Infectious Disease and then working in sub-Saharan Africa on vector-borne disease prevention. Thoughts?

Also what kinds of specific careers might MD/MPH's be aiming for?

Thanks for your help!

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[gyngyn]

Ob-Gyn, IM, Infectious Disease...

 

[darkjedi]

ID, family medicine, internal medicine, pediatrics, emergency medicine

specialties with broad reach and like cardiology and endocrinology too

Basically any specialty where preventative medicine and broad applicability can be suited to an MPH.

 

[familyaerospace]

Aerospace medicine, I believe the mph is required.

 

[TheNeuroman]

It is also very useful for any position of leadership. management, etc. For example, hospital department head, academic work, government doc in health department, etc

This. You can make an MPH valuable in any specialty you enter.

 

[lmn]

It depends on what type of concentration you choose to have in your MPH program, the options are very broad and really open to what you are interested in and what you want to do.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Since you don't even have a specialty or interest in particular in mind, I suggest you forgo the MPH. Why waste your time on it? Doesn't make you more prestigious and there doesn't appear to be any economic benefit.

 

[LizzyM]

Having the skill set to do what you want to do is going to make you happier in the long run and is more valuable than "economic benefit".
There are MDs with MPH degrees in just about every medical specialty including radiology and dermatology and the surgical specialties. Understanding the health care system, access to care, epidemiology , socioeconomic factors that impact patients, knowing how to engage in advocacy and have an effect on public policy are all very valuable skills in every specialty.
Doing the MPH will not narrow your options but may make you more skilled in reading and discussing the literature which can help in your clinical rotations and from there anything is possible.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Having the skill set to do what you want to do is going to make you happier in the long run and is more valuable than "economic benefit".
There are MDs with MPH degrees in just about every medical specialty including radiology and dermatology and the surgical specialties. Understanding the health care system, access to care, epidemiology , socioeconomic factors that impact patients, knowing how to engage in advocacy and have an effect on public policy are all very valuable skills in every specialty.
Doing the MPH will not narrow your options but may make you more skilled in reading and discussing the literature which can help in your clinical rotations and from there anything is possible.

Because doctors can't do work at the population level without an MPH? Oh please. This person doesn't even have a clue of what they really want to do and will have to pay for a degree that may be useless and will have to complete on top of his MD classes. Your very idealistic counter argument forgets to address the rest of the issues at hand.

 

[darkjedi]

Because doctors can't do work at the population level without an MPH? Oh please. This person doesn't even have a clue of what they really want to do and will have to pay for a degree that may be useless and will have to complete on top of his MD classes. Your very idealistic counter argument forgets to address the rest of the issues at hand.

what is your problem, all LizzyM provided is exactly what OP asked for, reasons why an MPH is helpful

 

[LizzyM]

Because doctors can't do work at the population level without an MPH? Oh please. This person doesn't even have a clue of what they really want to do and will have to pay for a degree that may be useless and will have to complete on top of his MD classes. Your very idealistic counter argument forgets to address the rest of the issues at hand.

The MPH covers skills they don't teach in med school. I see where MD/MPH grads match and it is not too shabby. Ditto where they end up working as attendings. If the topic is appealing to the OP, it is worth considering.

 

[Microglia]

Because doctors can't do work at the population level without an MPH? Oh please. This person doesn't even have a clue of what they really want to do and will have to pay for a degree that may be useless and will have to complete on top of his MD classes. Your very idealistic counter argument forgets to address the rest of the issues at hand.

It never hurts to have extra skills. Believe it or not, medical school doesn't make you instantly qualified to do anything. MPH's have a unique way of viewing medicine, and if there's no major opportunity cost and OP thinks they can handle the double duty, I say go for it. There's far fewer opportunities to further expand your skill sets after graduation from medical school, and the opportunity cost is much higher.

Infectious disease is tops for this, but just about any specialty can work. All you have to do is combine your clinical area with epidemiological examinations and it can work for just about anything on the medical side.

 

[LizzyM]

Combining Electronic Medical Records (EMR) and the call for more patient centered outcomes research means that there will be great demand in every specialty for those who can work in this field.

There are also clinical epidemiology questions such as "does it make sense to screen the population for x" where screening for x require a diagnostic imaging technique (radiology's purview) or involve a genetic condition (tons of specialties) and so forth.

 

[ridethecliche]

Yeah seriously. All I do at work is look at PRO's for Orthopedic surgery. It's very useful here and they teach MPH's epi and stats stuff that they don't teach MD's.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

what is your problem, all LizzyM provided is exactly what OP asked for, reasons why an MPH is helpful

How do you figure we have a problem, and how is that any business of yours?

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

It never hurts to have extra skills. Believe it or not, medical school doesn't make you instantly qualified to do anything. MPH's have a unique way of viewing medicine, and if there's no major opportunity cost and OP thinks they can handle the double duty, I say go for it. There's far fewer opportunities to further expand your skill sets after graduation from medical school, and the opportunity cost is much higher.

Infectious disease is tops for this, but just about any specialty can work. All you have to do is combine your clinical area with epidemiological examinations and it can work for just about anything on the medical side.

I've seen a million different MPH integrated to residencies or online. There are also plenty of people doing public health in medicine workout investing in an extra degree and having to complete it on top of an MD.

I'm not saying an MPH won't teach you anything, but unless it is the right investment because you need it for your goals, it is absolutely useless and a waste of time. Everyone thinks that they can handle juggling the world and a few planets, but unless an applicant is absolutely sure they want the program, why advise them to take the risk?

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

I know an ortho surgeon that has a masters in clinical epidemiology. He is actually very proactive in educating communities about prevention methods for certain orthopedic injuries. He also conducts various outcome studies to determine optimal clinical solutions for patients. Having these tools is very advantageous.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

If you discuss something in public on a public forum you open the issue up to all. You invited the reply, you made the poster's business. You're now in medical school so argue your point on its merits, show some leadership to those premeds who want to get to where you are now

Well, he's allowed to interject just like I'm allowed to ask why it is any of his business. Nobody is stopping anyone from their rights. And no, I don't have anything to show pre-meds. I represent myself and myself only.

 

[Boolean]

I've seen a million different MPH integrated to residencies or online. There are also plenty of people doing public health in medicine workout investing in an extra degree and having to complete it on top of an MD.

I'm not saying an MPH won't teach you anything, but unless it is the right investment because you need it for your goals, it is absolutely useless and a waste of time. Everyone thinks that they can handle juggling the world and a few planets, but unless an applicant is absolutely sure they want the program, why advise them to take the risk?

This is an incredibly ignorant statement. Some people learn simply for the sake of learning. If they wish to pursue a degree due to personal interest in the field (such as public health or population health), who are you to judge? From what standpoint are you qualified to simply belittle the entire field of a degree program?

 

[Ismet]

Keep the discussion civil and on topic, please.

 

[ChEMD]

I'm not sure if anyone in this thread can answer this, but how much can you actually learn in an MPH program in which you take all of your classes at the same time as your medical classes? Especially if it's all done in one year! If you truly want to get the most out of a medical and public health education, I really think they should be done separately so you can give 100% effort to each one and learn as much as you can, instead of trying to juggle too many things at once. It's always tempting to do these dual degrees that don't take any extra time, but can you really tell me that the level of education is the same as someone who took an extra year to study their second degree full time?

 

[Amygdarya]

MPH can help with clinical research in any medical specialty because clinical research methodology is pretty much all epidemiology and biostatistics, which are normally part of MPH programs.

 

[Lucca]

Academic physicians have always told me to take an epidemiology and statistics course in college as general advice and get the MPH if I feel like doing research in those fields. An academic plastic surgeon at a certain cancer hospital said that he deeply regretted having to send out his results to his mph colleagues because he wasnt sure about his interpretation. Take those words of advice for what you will.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Academic physicians have always told me to take an epidemiology and statistics course in college as general advice and get the MPH if I feel like doing research in those fields. An academic plastic surgeon at a certain cancer hospital said that he deeply regretted having to send out his results to his mph colleagues because he wasnt sure about his interpretation. Take those words of advice for what you will.

Yeah, I'd prefer to be the person that actually interprets and publishes those results. This is why I plan on getting an MPH or MS in epidemiology.

 

[Lucca]

Yeah, I'd prefer to be the person that actually interprets and publishes those results. This is why I plan on getting an MPH or MS in epidemiology.

It's certainly a valuable skillsey and I feel it does make you more knowledgeable about your patient population. Alternatively, private practice physicians I've shadowed always tell me to take business and accounting courses. So it's all about career plans.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

It's certainly a valuable skillsey and I feel it does make you more knowledgeable about your patient population. Alternatively, private practice physicians I've shadowed always tell me to take business and accounting courses. So it's all about career plans.

Yup. An MBA and such courses would help there as well. I have seen doctors in academic settings with MBA's (because of course that's a business too). And I believe some MPH programs make you take courses in financial accounting. The more you know...

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Hi everyone,

I'm trying to figure out if a 4 year MD/MPH program I was accepted to might be a good fit for me. I am definitely apprehensive about taking the MPH courses at the same time as MD courses, but I also think they would provide a great broader context for the science we learn during the preclinical years. Also I can finish the MPH courses within the first year and therefore wouldn't have to worry about conflicts with studying for boards in the second year.

I'm trying to figure out if it's worth it though. I know I want to work on the level of population health rather than just on the level of treating individual patients, although I do want to be doing clinical work in my future career as well.

What kinds of specialties do MD/MPH candidates end up pursuing? On a related note, what kinds of specialties would be a good fit for someone with an MD and MPH? I'm guessing something like Radiology or Dermatology would seem almost irrelevant, especially if one if planning to focus on global health work in underserved communities abroad, while maybe Emergency Medicine or certain types of Surgery would be a great fit. Perhaps Internal Medicine would be the most applicable though and general enough to be shaped to suit one's overall career goals--like maybe pursuing a subspecialty in Infectious Disease and then working in sub-Saharan Africa on vector-borne disease prevention. Thoughts?

Also what kinds of specific careers might MD/MPH's be aiming for?

Thanks for your help!

It looks like UNC puts a strong emphasis on public health.
http://www.med.unc.edu/md/curriculum/curriculum-overview
http://www.med.unc.edu/www/education/combined-programs-md-phd-md-mph/md-mph

 

[LizzyM]

I'm not sure if anyone in this thread can answer this, but how much can you actually learn in an MPH program in which you take all of your classes at the same time as your medical classes? Especially if it's all done in one year! If you truly want to get the most out of a medical and public health education, I really think they should be done separately so you can give 100% effort to each one and learn as much as you can, instead of trying to juggle too many things at once. It's always tempting to do these dual degrees that don't take any extra time, but can you really tell me that the level of education is the same as someone who took an extra year to study their second degree full time?

If the program is accredited by the Council on Education in Public Health (ceph.org) then the curriculum is the same as what one would get in a full-time MPH degree program. Some students find that learning about population health concurrent with the molecular and cellular basis of medicine creates a synergy.

 

[supersoaker]

From what the OP said, it seems that they have an interest in working with underserved communities overseas. I was talking to a friend of mine that has worked for the past 25 years overseas in remote and war-torn regions about my plans of becoming a doctor. Since he knew that my interests were in serving such populations abroad, he actually recommended focusing on public health and maybe pursuing a nursing or PA to fulfill my interest in medicine. After spending a few years overseas exposed to such work, I understood where he was coming from with this advice. I'm still determined to pursue an MD/MPH, but I've come to realize that my desire to become a doctor is more of a guilty pleasure. Working as a doctor overseas is the sexy part of the job. You get instant gratification when you can save a persons life or make them healthy again. Everyday you get to feel like you're making a difference. But the truth is, overall, once you leave the community the population is usually in about the same state you as when you arrived. In order to make real and lasting change in a community you need to work at tackling issues such as population-level spread and control of infectious diseases, community/state health policy, preventative medicine, health education, medical training, etc... These are the not-so-sexy tasks that take years or even decades for change to occur, but hopefully results in long lasting improvement to a community. While medical school provides the knowledge to treat and heal the individual, it seems that most medical school curriculum at best only touches on the community level issues and solutions (please correct me if I am wrong). My hope is that an appropriate public health education would fill in those gaps. So I would encourage the OP in pursuing this MD/MPH program if this type of service is where their heart lies. The dual nature of the program might also give context to the bigger picture of how they hope to serve as well as how the medical knowledge they receive may be applied.

As for the OP's original question as to which specialty to choose, as I said, I see patient care as a guilty pleasure and so advise them to choose a field that interests them. There are unfortunately many niches that need to be filled in underserved communities and I'm sure you could find a place with whatever specialty you choose. If you are interested in at least narrowing down a few choices that best serve needs overseas, I would recommend getting out there and seeing what gaps there are abroad. Either volunteer for an overseas program or ask organizations that serve these communities what specialties are most needed. I know some medical schools have summer programs abroad after their first year and hopefully your school has one.

As for AlbinoHawk's comments, I do agree if you have absolutely no direction or interest then an MPH may be a waste of time and effort. If your focus is on patient care or plan to work within an established community, then it is most likely not necessary. But OP has indicated an interest in working in underserved communities so there does seem to be enough direction, in my humble opinion, to warrant this course of action. Plus if they plan on working in such environments, I would hope they aren't quite as concerned about economic benefits (or they may be a bit disappointed).

Regardless, I hope the OP the best of luck!

 

[supersoaker]

I'm not sure if anyone in this thread can answer this, but how much can you actually learn in an MPH program in which you take all of your classes at the same time as your medical classes? Especially if it's all done in one year! If you truly want to get the most out of a medical and public health education, I really think they should be done separately so you can give 100% effort to each one and learn as much as you can, instead of trying to juggle too many things at once. It's always tempting to do these dual degrees that don't take any extra time, but can you really tell me that the level of education is the same as someone who took an extra year to study their second degree full time?

Over the years, I have come to realize that programs such as medical school and MPH are really just the entry level schools to ensure you have a BASIC understanding of the field so that you can REALLY start learning about them afterwards in the real world. Even after four years of medical school you really don't know enough about medicine and need at least a few years of residency to actually become proficient enough to work on your own. And even then you're always learning (that's why they call it 'practicing' medicine). As LizzyM stated, if a program is accredited then it should be teaching you enough of the basics that you need to get started. If a combined program lets you start your actual education in the real world a year earlier, I would say go for it!

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Watch one, Do one, Teach one is old medical adage about mentoring and training those who are coming to learn. My point to you is a successful medical students and eventual resident and attending, it is really all of our responsibility to show something to all and not simply disparage.

Then medicine will be really disappointed. Sometimes I need to compromise, but I remain myself. If I teach techniques, methods and such, I teach them with absolute proficiency, as I currently am teaching a volunteer in my lab. Personality and stuff like that is my own. Learn to be your own person.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

This is an incredibly ignorant statement. Some people learn simply for the sake of learning. If they wish to pursue a degree due to personal interest in the field (such as public health or population health), who are you to judge? From what standpoint are you qualified to simply belittle the entire field of a degree program?

I'm not judging him. I'm not stopping him from anything. He wanted suggestions, and I gave my point of view that it is a waste of time and allocation of resources unless they are sure they need it for the goal they have in mind. The degree is great, but that's not my criticism; so I don't know where you get that I'm belittling an entire field. Maybe for you degrees are free or believe that it is cakewalk to do an MPH on top of an MD (since this is a 4 year program, not 5), but for most people putting that money in and time in can realistically translate into lower basic science knowledge/board scores because of time allocation. OP can decide on his own. My comment was not ignorant. Your comment was simply immature. "Just study what you love for the sake of learning!"