When was the last time LizzyM...

[Planes2Doc]

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Said "WOW!" When she read an application...

During my post-bacc, when I was a lurker on SDN, she always provided very helpful advice. Usually it would tell the person whether the direction they were taking was good or bad. But I really wonder, when was the last time that an application really jumped out to LizzyM? What kinds of things do you think actually jump out at ADCOMs? I think the big problem today is that even with SDN members going above and beyond the general population, everyone is still doing the same activities over and over again. Are there any things that are considered outside the box?

I'm hoping to be a student interviewer at some point, and see what happens on the other side of the table. I think that thinking about this can and perhaps providing specific examples can help future applicants. Maybe I will even be able to answer this question for myself if I have the opportunity to be a student interviewer.

 

[487806]

I actually want to see LizzyM's response to this. I'll be surprised to see anyone surprising her in a positive way.

 

[cheechootrain]

Said "WOW!" When she read an application...

During my post-bacc, when I was a lurker on SDN, she always provided very helpful advice. Usually it would tell the person whether the direction they were taking was good or bad. But I really wonder, when was the last time that an application really jumped out to LizzyM? What kinds of things do you think actually jump out at ADCOMs? I think the big problem today is that even with SDN members going above and beyond the general population, everyone is still doing the same activities over and over again. Are there any things that are considered outside the box?

I'm hoping to be a student interviewer at some point, and see what happens on the other side of the table. I think that thinking about this can and perhaps providing specific examples can help future applicants. Maybe I will even be able to answer this question for myself if I have the opportunity to be a student interviewer.

That's a good question. For me, if I see "President of the United States" as an extracurricular, I would say "WOW!"

 

[Geebeejay]

That's a good question. For me, if I see "Former President of the United States," I would say "WOW!"

I dunno man....I'm sure she's seen it all....probably only takes one cycle to see every type of applicant. I think the only time it would be possible to have a "wow" moment like this is during the interview.

 

[Blackhawkdown24]

Uhhh who's cares???

 

[487806]

Uhhh who's cares???

If you don't care, why did you post in this thread?

 

[cheechootrain]

Uhhh who's cares???

If you don't care, why did you post in this thread?

Because he doesn't care if he posts on this thread.

 

[Spinach Dip]

With most med schools fielding thousands of applicants a year, I'd be surprised if there's anything that they find outstanding anymore.

(With the possible exception of 40+ MCAT scores and people with PhDs in cellular biochemistry)

 

[Geebeejay]

With most med schools fielding thousands of applicants a year, I'd be surprised if there's anything that they find outstanding anymore.

(With the possible exception of 40+ MCAT scores and people with PhDs in cellular biochemistry)

since MCAT is scaled, there are many applicants with 40+ (There is probably some with 45), and I bet each school sees at least one per cycle, and probably more.

 

[Blackhawkdown24]

Because he doesn't care if he posts on this thread.

Exactly.

 

[487806]

since MCAT is scaled, there are many applicants with 40+ (There is probably some with 45), and I bet each school sees at least one per cycle, and probably more.

Right... there are a lot of premeds with 40+ on the MCAT. Only on SDN.

Because he doesn't care if he posts on this thread.

😕 I think I got that...

 

[mimelim]

I read an application last year of someone who raised over 2 million dollars for an inner city clinic/health center. They talked a lot about the mixed emotions of trying to get people who didn't want to donate to give vs. helping people who have no where to turn.

Another application was about a student who raised themselves from age 9 onward, not being able to finish HS until 20 because they had zero family/social support. They talked about growing up sleeping on different friend's couches. Then after graduation starting as a bellhop at a hotel and working their way to being an assistant manager within a year and a half. Put themselves through college and applied to medical school.

I tend to be pretty hard to impress, but those two really knocked my socks off. Neither was a genius or exceptionally 'gifted', they were two relatively normal people who had simply done amazing things.

 

[487806]

I read an application last year of someone who raised over 2 million dollars for an inner city clinic/health center. They talked a lot about the mixed emotions of trying to get people who didn't want to donate to give vs. helping people who have no where to turn.

Another application was about a student who raised themselves from age 9 onward, not being able to finish HS until 20 because they had zero family/social support. They talked about growing up sleeping on different friend's couches. Then after graduation starting as a bellhop at a hotel and working their way to being an assistant manager within a year and a half. Put themselves through college and applied to medical school.

I tend to be pretty hard to impress, but those two really knocked my socks off. Neither was a genius or exceptionally 'gifted', they were two relatively normal people who had simply done amazing things.

Really impressive things that are so rare... man, those guys are completely fortunate and talented.

 

[PreMedOrDead]

I believe LizzyM stated a military applicant impressed her a lot once, even came to the interview in his fighting garb.

since MCAT is scaled, there are many applicants with 40+ (There is probably some with 45), and I bet each school sees at least one per cycle, and probably more.

Only 380 people score a 40 or higher on the MCAT each year. So no, they are not flooded with these applicants. There are some, but not many. You also have to consider it'd only take two schools filled to account for every one of these scores (assuming they were all competitive applicants outside of MCAT).

Really impressive things that are so rare... man, those guys are completely fortunate and talented.

I don't know if that's the right word for it....

 

[mimelim]

since MCAT is scaled, there are many applicants with 40+ (There is probably some with 45), and I bet each school sees at least one per cycle, and probably more.

That would be incorrect.

Less than 0.5% of people who take the MCAT get a 40+.

Source: AAMC Data

That is less than 400 students with 40+ MCATs in the entire US per year. Hardly 'many' considering more than 75,800 students take the MCAT per year.

 

[Spinach Dip]

since MCAT is scaled, there are many applicants with 40+ (There is probably some with 45), and I bet each school sees at least one per cycle, and probably more.

As the two above me stated, about 0.3% of MCAT takers get 40+.

Still, even if a school receives a handful of these applicants a year, I am pretty sure they stand out from the other 3,000 applicants in the field.

 

[PreMedOrDead]

As the two above me stated, about 0.3% of MCAT takers get 40+.

Still, even if a school receives a handful of these applicants a year, I am pretty sure they stand out from the other 3,000 applicants in the field.

3,000?

Most schools I've seen get between 5,000 and 10,000 applicants. Of course there are some with much lower (state universities...) and some with much higher (GWU...). This number is expected to be even higher this year, possibly significantly.

There are only about 3,000 applications per year with 36s or higher, and that's not narrowing down for GPA or extracurriculars. Even if all of these people got in, which they don't, that'd only take up about 1/6 of the entire pool of medical school seats.

In the 36-45 range, your numbers still matter, but your GPA and ECs are going to make/break you, just like lower stat applicants.

Of course, the 39-40+ MCATs are going to get a ton of interviews, as they're pretty wow-tastic scores percentile-wise, they aren't going to blow the socks off interviewers like OP is wondering. It takes a pretty holistic application with a hearty story to do that.

Edit: Most recent number for applications is 43,000, which is only about 1,500 above normal full-cycle applications from 2008-2010, but AMCAS did mention that there were about 20% more applicants submitting early this year.

 

[Planes2Doc]

I read an application last year of someone who raised over 2 million dollars for an inner city clinic/health center. They talked a lot about the mixed emotions of trying to get people who didn't want to donate to give vs. helping people who have no where to turn.

Another application was about a student who raised themselves from age 9 onward, not being able to finish HS until 20 because they had zero family/social support. They talked about growing up sleeping on different friend's couches. Then after graduation starting as a bellhop at a hotel and working their way to being an assistant manager within a year and a half. Put themselves through college and applied to medical school.

I tend to be pretty hard to impress, but those two really knocked my socks off. Neither was a genius or exceptionally 'gifted', they were two relatively normal people who had simply done amazing things.

Wow those do sound quite impressive!

The funny thing is that before I was pre-med, I was actually impressed by some of the things that people did. Someone I knew became an EMT after graduating college so he can work on his application. At first I thought it was a very cool thing. But now as an MS-1, so many people worked as EMTs! As for my own story, I always felt very subpar when comparing myself to people on SDN. But when I was doing volunteering during my full-time job, my coworkers were extremely impressed and thought of me as a saint! If I had posted my ECs in the WAMC thread, I'm sure the typical response would have been to spend another year building up my ECs.

Thinking that your application will not impress anyone is not a good feeling. 🙁

 

[Geebeejay]

Only 380 people score a 40 or higher on the MCAT each year. So no, they are not flooded with these applicants. There are some, but not many. You also have to consider it'd only take two schools filled to account for every one of these scores (assuming they were all competitive applicants outside of MCAT).

As the two above me stated, about 0.3% of MCAT takers get 40+.

Still, even if a school receives a handful of these applicants a year, I am pretty sure they stand out from the other 3,000 applicants in the field.

That would be incorrect.

Less than 0.5% of people who take the MCAT get a 40+.

🙁 But I said:

since MCAT is scaled, there are many applicants with 40+ (There is probably some with 45), and I bet each school sees at least one per cycle, and probably more.

Maybe "many" was the wrong word since there are far more than 380 applicants (thanks for the number Mimelim), but if I have 380 of some sort of item, I consider that many items. My main point is if you see a handful (Maybe <5?) of something per year (40+ scores), and I bet most schools do, I don't think your mind gets blown everytime you see it.

 

[Planes2Doc]

My main point is if you see a handful (Maybe <5?) of something per year (40+ scores), I don't think your mind gets blown everytime you see it.

I'm sure almost all of the 40+ MCAT scorers definitely apply to the top schools, so schools like HMS would probably see all of them. I think having a very high score can definitely shoot someone in the foot if they become too cocky, and only apply to a few top-heavy schools. Especially if their ECs don't impress.

 

[occams_razor]

I have a friend who started a non-profit and I am pretty impressed with him, it's a ton of work doing something like that

 

[circulus vitios]

I'm more impressed by the 3.5 GPA, 30 mcat, unremarkable middle-class white male who gets into medical school.

 

[Anathema]

I'm more impressed by the 3.5 GPA, 30 mcat, unremarkable middle-class white male who gets into medical school.

Give it 4 more years until that becomes something remarkable.

 

[RG3forPresident]

3,000?

Most schools I've seen get between 5,000 and 10,000 applicants. Of course there are some with much lower (state universities...) and some with much higher (GWU...). This number is expected to be even higher this year, possibly significantly.

There are only about 3,000 applications per year with 36s or higher, and that's not narrowing down for GPA or extracurriculars. Even if all of these people got in, which they don't, that'd only take up about 1/6 of the entire pool of medical school seats.

In the 36-45 range, your numbers still matter, but your GPA and ECs are going to make/break you, just like lower stat applicants.

Of course, the 39-40+ MCATs are going to get a ton of interviews, as they're pretty wow-tastic scores percentile-wise, they aren't going to blow the socks off interviewers like OP is wondering. It takes a pretty holistic application with a hearty story to do that.

Edit: Most recent number for applications is 43,000, which is only about 1,500 above normal full-cycle applications from 2008-2010, but AMCAS did mention that there were about 20% more applicants submitting early this year.

to expand on this. I did get a 39 on the MCAT. But my 3.56/3.57 c/sGPA definitely does factor into many schools being hesitant to give me interviews. I have 6 interviews at this point, so I'm not complaining or overly worried, but the various rejections I've received have hammered in just how much more it is than a simple number game.

 

[occams_razor]

I'm more impressed by the 3.5 GPA, 30 mcat, unremarkable middle-class white male who gets into medical school.

well the mean matriculant MCAT is 31 (mean applicant is 28) and mean matriculant cum. GPA is 3.67 (BCPM is 3.61) - so it's not really unusual for a 3.5/30 middle class male applicant to get in somewhere
source: https://www.aamc.org/download/161690/data/table17.pdf

 

[PreMedOrDead]

🙁 But I said:



Maybe "many" was the wrong word since there are far more than 380 applicants (thanks for the number Mimelim), but if I have 380 of some sort of item, I consider that many items. My main point is if you see a handful (Maybe <5?) of something per year (40+ scores), and I bet most schools do, I don't think your mind gets blown everytime you see it.

I did notice you said only one, but it was more of the 'many' that bothered me. You're spot on in that regard. However, with regard to items, do you consider 380 atoms a large number of atoms? A reference frame is incredibly important, and in terms of applications, 380 is incredibly small.

Wow those do sound quite impressive!

The funny thing is that before I was pre-med, I was actually impressed by some of the things that people did. Someone I knew became an EMT after graduating college so he can work on his application. At first I thought it was a very cool thing. But now as an MS-1, so many people worked as EMTs! As for my own story, I always felt very subpar when comparing myself to people on SDN. But when I was doing volunteering during my full-time job, my coworkers were extremely impressed and thought of me as a saint! If I had posted my ECs in the WAMC thread, I'm sure the typical response would have been to spend another year building up my ECs.

Thinking that your application will not impress anyone is not a good feeling. 🙁

Look up some people with killer stats that have their applications completely open (ie: Tots, NickNaylor...) and your jaw will drop. After interviewing at a couple top schools, there are definitely many absolutely incredible, larger-than-life applicants out there. While only so many have killer scores, there are many of these types of applicants throughout the spectrum. That's why ECs have become so critical, all the way down to the 'box checking' ways of volunteering, research, shadowing, and clinical work.

I'm sure almost all of the 40+ MCAT scorers definitely apply to the top schools, so schools like HMS would probably see all of them. I think having a very high score can definitely shoot someone in the foot if they become too cocky, and only apply to a few top-heavy schools. Especially if their ECs don't impress.

True. WashU, Harvard, JHU, etc are likely to see nearly all of these applicants that kept up good GPAs and decent ECs. However, even then, each applicant can only take one seat. Additionally, these schools know that holistic physicians are essential, not geniuses. They still have to demonstrate competencies that aren't academic.

I have a friend who started a non-profit and I am pretty impressed with him, it's a ton of work doing something like that

Depends on the non-profit. A friend of mine started a non-profit as a check box. She ended up raising a couple thousand dollars for the organization with minimal effort, and the majority of it donated from her own family. I knew the actual effort so it was depreciated in my mind, but she could sell it well in an application and interview.

I'm more impressed by the 3.5 GPA, 30 mcat, unremarkable middle-class white male who gets into medical school.

They call these the flyover state schools.

to expand on this. I did get a 39 on the MCAT. But my 3.56/3.57 c/sGPA definitely does factor into many schools being hesitant to give me interviews. I have 6 interviews at this point, so I'm not complaining or overly worried, but the various rejections I've received have hammered in just how much more it is than a simple number game.

A 75 LizzyM is pretty remarkable, but your GPA/MCAT are unbalanced. Given that, 6 interviews is excellent. You're on a wonderful path, good luck! 🙂

well the mean matriculant MCAT is 31 (mean applicant is 28) and mean matriculant cum. GPA is 3.67 (BCPM is 3.61) - so it's not really unusual for a 3.5/30 middle class male applicant to get in somewhere
source: https://www.aamc.org/download/161690/data/table17.pdf

I believe what he is saying was either sarcasm, or it is that the odds are basically down to a coin flip in that scenario, whereas other cases mentioned are speaking of applicants with 4.0s and 40+ MCATs, which are shoo-ins.

 

[Goobs]

They call these the flyover state schools.

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1GZzucDMlQ[/YOUTUBE]

nothing wrong with the flyover states!

 

[Planes2Doc]

Depends on the non-profit. A friend of mine started a non-profit as a check box. She ended up raising a couple thousand dollars for the organization with minimal effort, and the majority of it donated from her own family. I knew the actual effort so it was depreciated in my mind, but she could sell it well in an application and interview.

Yeah I've heard of people doing this too as a check-box item. It's probably not all that difficult to "officially" start a non-profit. I wonder if ADCOMs caught onto this or not.

 

[PreMedOrDead]

Yeah I've heard of people doing this too as a check-box item. It's probably not all that difficult to "officially" start a non-profit. I wonder if ADCOMs caught onto this or not.

She got into a top 5 school with that as a 'major talking point' at her interviews. So apparently not, or they didn't care. It definitely made me skeptical of people's applications and intentions, though.

 

[Geebeejay]

I did notice you said only one, but it was more of the 'many' that bothered me. You're spot on in that regard. However, with regard to items, do you consider 380 atoms a large number of atoms? A reference frame is incredibly important, and in terms of applications, 380 is incredibly small.

If we're talking about 380 atoms all scattered all over the floor and I have to pick them up, then yes I consider that unfathomably many 🙂 In the grand scheme of things, you're right, 380 isn't too many.

 

[Planes2Doc]

She got into a top 5 school with that as a 'major talking point' at her interviews. So apparently not, or they didn't care. It definitely made me skeptical of people's applications and intentions, though.

Call me a pessimist, but I've been skeptical of most peoples' intentions for a while. That's incredible (not in the good way) that her "non-profit" took her all the way to a top five school! I'm sure that if more people did this, the ADCOMs would catch on. I think it was only recently that ADCOMs caught onto the whole overseas volunteering trips.

 

[PreMedOrDead]

Call me a pessimist, but I've been skeptical of most peoples' intentions for a while. That's incredible (not in the good way) that her "non-profit" took her all the way to a top five school! I'm sure that if more people did this, the ADCOMs would catch on. I think it was only recently that ADCOMs caught onto the whole overseas volunteering trips.

I think it depends.

For example, those volunteering trips, did it actually seem like their involvement had a lasting, positive, influential impact on their character, their altruism, and their intentions? Or did they go to Mexico, sip margaritas at the beach, and get drunk at discotecas? While you can't always elicit such information in an interview, skilled interviewers can most of the time. It can even often come down to simply listening to their voice and watching their mannerisms, which adds a lot to determining their passion and empathy. This is also easier to express for females, with our wonderful emotions 😉

The person I was talking about was an excellent orator. Really, she was an excellent person, and absolutely deserves to be at a top 5. She had no malicious intent, just wanted to have everything go for her like everyone else on these forums, and as such used the resources available.

The thing is, maybe without that non-profit she wouldn't have been able to do that. I don't hold it against her, the competition just makes these types of things the extra 'umph' that gets people into top programs, and there's really nothing anyone can do about it.

 

[occams_razor]

Yeah I've heard of people doing this too as a check-box item. It's probably not all that difficult to "officially" start a non-profit. I wonder if ADCOMs caught onto this or not.

well i guess it really depends on the person cause my friend who started and runs his own non-profit has put a ton of work into it and does some really awesome stuff. he doesn't come from family money either and raised all the funds himself.
I don't see how someone could register, raise funds, build a website and do legitimate work as a non-profit without putting in effort, but I guess if your family donates all the money that changes things

 

[PreMedOrDead]

well i guess it really depends on the person cause my friend who started and runs his own non-profit has put a ton of work into it and does some really awesome stuff. he doesn't come from family money either and raised all the funds himself.
I don't see how someone could register, raise funds, build a website and do legitimate work as a non-profit without putting in effort, but I guess if your family donates all the money that changes things

It is impressive when people go out and do such things, that's why they're looked upon so favorably. Likewise with things like getting research published, getting amazing stats (GPA/MCAT), and having a diverse immersed background.

However, to add some narcissism, having a programming background I could register a nonprofit, build a website, viralize it using school means and targeted advertising online, and end up raising sufficient funds to classify it as a legitimate organization in a short window and with minimum effort. At the same time, I don't believe it'd be something I find meaningful to me, worthwhile in the short term, nor maintainable and established in the future. I actually did a similar thing to raise money for nonprofits in my community and we received about $10,000. I did not report that on my AMCAS or anything else, because while I enjoyed doing it, I didn't think it was something that represented my persona. The idea and the action was simply a gesture that a group of friends and I wanted to give back with, and we know $10,000 only goes so far. I included other information regarding my charisma and altruism in other ways that I am more excited about.

Of course, this is all personal. If you love it, do it!

Edit: Before asked, I know $10,000 is a lot of money on an individual scale. However, the donation was made toward a medical program for procedures, which are incomprehensibly expensive.

 

[Frazier]

Two words, one name:

William Hwang

http://www.pdsoros.org/current_fellows/index.cfm/yr/2008#hwang

LizzyM's head would spin.

 

[Marika11]

Two words, one name:

William Hwang

http://www.pdsoros.org/current_fellows/index.cfm/yr/2008#hwang

LizzyM's head would spin.

William just became my hero.

 

[ClemsonFirst]

Or Mr. Ding
http://www.pdsoros.org/current_fellows/index.cfm/yr/2008#ding

 

[phikapdoctor]

Two words, one name:

William Hwang

http://www.pdsoros.org/current_fellows/index.cfm/yr/2008#hwang

LizzyM's head would spin.

I just realized how bad of a candidate I am.. Thanks.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN Mobile app please excuse punctuation and spelling

 

[pineapplepancakes]

Two words, one name:

William Hwang

http://www.pdsoros.org/current_fello.../yr/2008#hwang

LizzyM's head would spin.

This and the other posted make me want to give up before I even start my post-bacc. Goodness, are they amazing.

I think SDN's outdone itself for me with this one.

 

[Narmerguy]

Two words, one name:

William Hwang

http://www.pdsoros.org/current_fellows/index.cfm/yr/2008#hwang

LizzyM's head would spin.

Haha Mr. Hwang has been a thread-ender for many years now. There's just no feeling adequate after that.

I imagine it's hard to impress at this point simply by doing stuff that involves being smart (publishing a lot, high MCAT, high GPA, winning some competition, etc) simply because there are tons of brilliant people and though remarkable, there are only so many outlets for that kind of intelligence and you can get used to seeing them. It's much more impressive when someone does some stuff that you wouldn't normally think of, and then does it so incredibly well and effectively that you have to be impressed. Raising yourself from age 9 seems like a good example, or raising tons of money, or being an olympic runner--these aren't things that require you to be super smart. But they require an unusual talent and often require the right person being put up against the right kind of challenge that really brings out the best in them.

That said, I do recall LizzyM commenting that schools often try to use their scholarship money to entice students when they have super high MCAT scores/GPA but I don't know that that means they're impressed by them though.

 

[ModernAlchemist]

This and the other posted make me want to give up before I even start my post-bacc. Goodness, are they amazing.

I think SDN's outdone itself for me with this one.

Read Mountains Beyond Mountains. Paul Farmer is always the ultimate thread ender. That said.... this guy had so much awesomeness I was laughing while reading his bio.

 

[Spinach Dip]

Okay, here's a pseudo-serious one.



I was watching a youtube video a year or so ago where a doctor intubated himself before an auditorium of med students to make a point about awake intubation not being a big deal.

I suppose a skill like this is something that would make med schools say "Oh!" 😱

But... how would you go about informing them of this without sounding like a weirdo? I mean, would you just write in your personal statement, "My extra curriculars include volunteering at the local orphanage, and fluency in three languages. Oh, and I can intubate myself on command."



Weird question. Sorry.

 

[Geebeejay]

😱

Okay, here's a pseudo-serious one.



I was watching a youtube video a year or so ago where a doctor intubated himself before an auditorium of med students to make a point about awake intubation not being a big deal.

I suppose a skill like this is something that would make med schools say "Oh!"
But... how would you go about informing them of this without sounding like a weirdo? I mean, would you just write in your personal statement, "My extra curriculars include volunteering at the local orphanage, and fluency in three languages. Oh, and I can intubate myself on command."



Weird question. Sorry.

Lol, must have a nice gag reflex😱

One of the attendings I work with drilled an I.O. into his sternum to also prove a point. Pretty badass

 

[DoctwoB]

Okay, here's a pseudo-serious one.



I was watching a youtube video a year or so ago where a doctor intubated himself before an auditorium of med students to make a point about awake intubation not being a big deal.

I suppose a skill like this is something that would make med schools say "Oh!" 😱

But... how would you go about informing them of this without sounding like a weirdo? I mean, would you just write in your personal statement, "My extra curriculars include volunteering at the local orphanage, and fluency in three languages. Oh, and I can intubate myself on command."



Weird question. Sorry.

For those of you that read this and immediately went to youtube (like me).

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDRTzmuwMnQ[/YOUTUBE]

That's pretty baller.

 

[pineapplepancakes]

Read Mountains Beyond Mountains. Paul Farmer is always the ultimate thread ender. That said.... this guy had so much awesomeness I was laughing while reading his bio.

I read that, and absolutely enjoyed it. Paul Farmer is awesome, and, I agree, definitely a thread ender.

 

[elevenses]

since MCAT is scaled, there are many applicants with 40+ (There is probably some with 45), and I bet each school sees at least one per cycle, and probably more.

There were ~350 people who earned 40+ MCAT scores in 2011 (86,181 examinees X 0.4% of examinees w/ 40 or greater composite score) https://www.aamc.org/students/download/264234/data/combined11.pdf

Now, 350 is obviously not a lot of people compared with the broader pool of medical school applicants, but many of these individuals likely applied to a lot of top-ranked schools--in fact, I would argue that it is significantly more likely for a student with a 40+ MCAT to apply to top-ranked schools than a student with MCAT scores that dance around 30, which is still five points greater than the mean for all test-takers. Thus, even though there are only a few 40+ applicants, there are, proportionally, a lot of 40+ applications at top-ranked schools. For example, Harvard received 5435 applications in 2011. If only half of the students with 40+ MCAT scores from 2011 applied to Harvard, then approximately one in thirty HMS applicants would have a 40+ MCAT score.

I imagine that the probability of applying increases the higher your MCAT score is, regardless of other factors. If that is the case, high MCAT scores would be overrepresented in the applicant pool. Remember: 40 is in the 99.6th percentile for all test-takers, not for all applicants, and certainly not for all matriculants. So, even though (by definition) a 40+ MCAT score is uncommon relative to lower MCAT scores, they are probably not so uncommon from the perspective of an adcom.

 

[Sophocles]

There were ~350 people who earned 40+ MCAT scores in 2011 (86,181 examinees X 0.4% of examinees w/ 40 or greater composite score) https://www.aamc.org/students/download/264234/data/combined11.pdf

Now, 350 is obviously not a lot of people compared with the broader pool of medical school applicants, but many of these individuals likely applied to a lot of top-ranked schools--in fact, I would argue that it is significantly more likely for a student with a 40+ MCAT to apply to top-ranked schools than a student with MCAT scores that dance around 30, which is still five points greater than the mean for all test-takers. Thus, even though there are only a few 40+ applicants, there are, proportionally, a lot of 40+ applications at top-ranked schools. For example, Harvard received 5435 applications in 2011. If only half of the students with 40+ MCAT scores from 2011 applied to Harvard, then approximately one in thirty HMS applicants would have a 40+ MCAT score.

I imagine that the probability of applying increases the higher your MCAT score is, regardless of other factors. If that is the case, high MCAT scores would be overrepresented in the applicant pool. Remember: 40 is in the 99.6th percentile for all test-takers, not for all applicants, and certainly not for all matriculants. So, even though (by definition) a 40+ MCAT score is uncommon relative to lower MCAT scores, they are probably not so uncommon from the perspective of an adcom.

I'm sorry this doesn't make much sense. To state that 3% of applicants (175 applicants-half of those who scored 40+) or even if they all applied (6%) is a lot or makes it common is not accurate whatsoever. I follow your logic that the higher your score the more inclined you are to apply to schools like Harvard, but to say that such a low percentage makes it common, I think is an exaggeration. I do think that, in general, the applicant pool for Harvard is completely different than that of a "low-tier" state school (whatever that means), but I would say that because Harvard has a pick of students with high stats they can afford to accept applicants with low MCAT scores because they can average it with the higher ones.

 

[Geebeejay]

I'm sorry this doesn't make much sense. To state that 3% of applicants (175 applicants-half of those who scored 40+) or even if they all applied (6%) is a lot or makes it common is not accurate whatsoever. I follow your logic that the higher your score the more inclined you are to apply to schools like Harvard, but to say that such a low percentage makes it common, I think is an exaggeration. I do think that, in general, the applicant pool for Harvard is completely different than that of a "low-tier" state school (whatever that means), but I would say that because Harvard has a pick of students with high stats they can afford to accept applicants with low MCAT scores because they can average it with the higher ones.

it's not common, but it's certainly not unusual. Unusual is an elephant driving a taxi cab.

 

[Graywolf]

it's not common, but it's certainly not unusual. Unusual is an elephant driving a taxi cab.

Haha. Thanks for throwing some personality into this thread. Everyone always is talks about numbers, stats, percentages, percentiles. All I can think of is squares, squares, squares. Forget numbers for once; rather, show adcoms you are proud of what you have and what you've done, and show them how much you want it, and they will begin to forget the numbers as well (this is for all those 'average' numbers out there).

People want circles, not squares.

 

[Sophocles]

Haha. Thanks for throwing some personality into this thread. Everyone always is talks about numbers, stats, percentages, percentiles. All I can think of is squares, squares, squares. Forget numbers for once; rather, show adcoms you are proud of what you have and what you've done, and show them how much you want it, and they will begin to forget the numbers as well (this is for all those 'average' numbers out there).

People want circles, not squares.

So much wisdom in your words... Thanks for this... Circles, not squares-noted