Will this fulfill my prerequisite?

[Djax99]

I’m an incoming freshman that was just placed in gen chem 3 out of a 3 class chemistry sequence (quarter system). This was due to my AP credit that I had allowing me to skip gen chem 1 and 2.

However, I’m a bit worried as to whether medical schools will accept my AP credit and gen chem 3 as credit for an inorganic chemistry sequence. Does anyone have any experience with this? Should I instead just take gen chem 1 and go through the entire sequence again?

Additionally, i am a bio major so will any classes that I take in the future fulfill this inorganic chem requirement if I decide to take gen chem 3?

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[lodo.owl]

Some medical schools do not accept AP credits to fulfill any pre-reqs, from my understanding. I would go through the entire sequence to get the required 2 years of gen chem needed.


EDIT: Going through the doc below, seems like some medical schools seem to (keep in mind this was released in 2015 and things may have changed for some schools.)

https://www.cc-seas.columbia.edu/sites/dsa/files/handbooks/MEDICAL%20SCHOOL%20ADMISSION%20REQUIREMENTS_June_2015%20V3.pdf

 

[rdyotz]

This is highly dependent on the school. The safe option is to take all of them again. Some schools will allow AP credits, but you need to take upper-level chemistry courses, such as PChem or analytical chem - which are usually much harder. Some schools will just allow AP credits.
Who knows how things will look 3+ years from now when you are applying.

 

[lodo.owl]

The above document is way out of date

Was noted that it was released in 2015 in previous post, provided to show AP acceptance varies by institution.

 

[Djax99]

The above document is way out of date

@gonnif Do you have any insight as to what I should do?

 

[907914]

Take the class instead of placing out else take another different 1/4 to make up for it

This. I would suggest taking the AP credit and then taking upper division chemistry as a substitute (Ie. Take Clinical chemistry and Quantitative Analysis). Source: this is what I did and it has worked well for me.

 

[Djax99]

Take the class instead of placing out else take another different 1/4 to make up for it

Sorry I’m a bit confused. Do you mean to take gen chem 3 and then take another chemistry class later? What does 1/4 mean?

 

[Djax99]

This. I would suggest taking the AP credit and then taking upper division chemistry as a substitute (Ie. Take Clinical chemistry and Quantitative Analysis). Source: this is what I did and it has worked well for me.

I’m a bit worried as I have heard that upper chemistry classes are difficult and it’s been a year+ since I’ve taken chemistry so to be placed in the final class in the sequence might be more rigorous for me.

Would you still recommend using my AP credit?

 

[Djax99]

Medical schools will require that you have a full year of actually chemistry classes above and beyond what AP gives for prereq. So you need 3 quarters. You can either sit and take the actual chem 1 & 2 that you have placed out of or take two quarters of an advanced chem. Personally I would retake the chem 1-2 but your school may not allow it.

Thanks for all the help! I have heard that if you take orgo 1 and 2 (which is one full year) and you use AP credit to get out of gen chem then if you apply to med schools that accept AP credit then this completely fulfills the chemistry requirement (which is usually 2 years of chemistry). Do you know if this is true?

 

[907914]

Thanks for all the help! I have heard that if you take orgo 1 and 2 (which is one full year) and you use AP credit to get out of gen chem then if you apply to med schools that accept AP credit then this completely fulfills the chemistry requirement (which is usually 2 years of chemistry). Do you know if this is true?

Many schools will accept that, many schools will also accept that if you have biochem, but there are also A LOT of schools who explicitly want a year of inorganic chemistry.

 

[Wolvvs]

Thanks for all the help! I have heard that if you take orgo 1 and 2 (which is one full year) and you use AP credit to get out of gen chem then if you apply to med schools that accept AP credit then this completely fulfills the chemistry requirement (which is usually 2 years of chemistry). Do you know if this is true?

Most schools seem to follow this policy. You'll need to check each school's website, here's a summary pulled together by Duke but I'm not sure how complete or up to date it is: https://prehealth.duke.edu/sites/prehealth.duke.edu/files/file-attachments/AP Credit Information, 2017.pdf

EDIT: just realized you said organic I and II but no biochem. If you're going to take this route you should definitely take biochemistry.

 

[Djax99]

@gonnif @MemeLord

So I hate to bother you yet again but what is your own personal recommendation on what I should do?

Should I take gen chem 1 and just go through the sequence normally or should I use my AP credit with gen chem 3 and supplement with higher level chem classes?

 

[rdyotz]

@gonnif @MemeLord

So I hate to bother you yet again but what is your own personal recommendation on what I should do?

Should I take gen chem 1 and just go through the sequence normally or should I use my AP credit with gen chem 3 and supplement with higher level chem classes?

Ask your advisor. If you can 'retake' the courses, I would do so, as it will give you a better foundation for taking the MCAT and likely result in a better GPA.

 

[wysdoc]

Ask your advisor. If you can 'retake' the courses, I would do so, as it will give you a better foundation for taking the MCAT and likely result in a better GPA.

When you go see the advisor, say that you have changed your mind about claiming the AP credits for general chem and take the whole year's sequence. Problem solved, you can quit worrying, explain to the advisor why (because med schools often won't take AP credits for pre-requisites.)

 

[Djax99]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord Sorry for bothering you guys yet again but I just spoke to my advisor and essentially what she said is that if I were to use the AP credit then I would have to supplement with upper level classes but these upper level classes include organic chemistry and biochemistry. So essentially if I use AP credit to get out of gen chem 1&2 and then took orgo 1&2 and a quarter of biochemistry, then I would fulfill the chemistry prerequisites. I would not need to take an upper level chemistry class such as physical/clinical chemistry to supplement my AP credit but that instead organic and biochemistry would be enough. Is this the case/is this true?

 

[907914]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord Sorry for bothering you guys yet again but I just spoke to my advisor and essentially what she said is that if I were to use the AP credit then I would have to supplement with upper level classes but these upper level classes include organic chemistry and biochemistry. So essentially if I use AP credit to get out of gen chem 1&2 and then took orgo 1&2 and a quarter of biochemistry, then I would fulfill the chemistry prerequisites. I would not need to take an upper level chemistry class such as physical/clinical chemistry to supplement my AP credit but that instead organic and biochemistry would be enough. Is this the case/is this true?

This is not the case at many schools. Most schools want the full year of Ochem (1, 2, and 3) and a separate year of inorganic chemistry. I know many schools require biochem now, so that should be taken in addition. Many schools WILL allow your AP credit to suffice, but that is a case-by-case at different schools.

 

[rdyotz]

What meme said.

It might work at some schools, but most schools I have seen require 1 year of gen chem and 1 year of o chem (which 1 semester can often be replaced with biochem). This is school-specific, and you don't want to shoot yourself in the foot when you come to apply and then you either have to cram in extra courses or limit where you apply to.

 

[Seihai]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord Sorry for bothering you guys yet again but I just spoke to my advisor and essentially what she said is that if I were to use the AP credit then I would have to supplement with upper level classes but these upper level classes include organic chemistry and biochemistry. So essentially if I use AP credit to get out of gen chem 1&2 and then took orgo 1&2 and a quarter of biochemistry, then I would fulfill the chemistry prerequisites. I would not need to take an upper level chemistry class such as physical/clinical chemistry to supplement my AP credit but that instead organic and biochemistry would be enough. Is this the case/is this true?

Your advisor is wrong. You can look on this forum to see many other distraught premeds that listened to their advisors when they shouldn't have and are worse off for it.

Your advisor is not well-versed in the application cycle and is often as in the dark as you might be. Some advisors are better than others, and you can trust your advisor, but VERIFY the information. We are verifying that the information your advisor gave you is wrong, and providing you evidence that this is the case. Take it as you will. You can take your advisor's advice if you'd like, but I'd hazard a guess that you'd be back here in a few years wondering where it went wrong.

I don't understand why you keep asking what is right and what is wrong. I thought it was made quite clear earlier in this thread that there are no generalizations (like the one your advisor seems to be trying to make) when it comes to med school admissions.

 

[wysdoc]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord Sorry for bothering you guys yet again but I just spoke to my advisor and essentially what she said is that if I were to use the AP credit then I would have to supplement with upper level classes but these upper level classes include organic chemistry and biochemistry. So essentially if I use AP credit to get out of gen chem 1&2 and then took orgo 1&2 and a quarter of biochemistry, then I would fulfill the chemistry prerequisites. I would not need to take an upper level chemistry class such as physical/clinical chemistry to supplement my AP credit but that instead organic and biochemistry would be enough. Is this the case/is this true?

I agree with @gonnif, you can't fill 2 pre-requisites with one course.
@Djax99, you are just an incoming college freshman, it is too soon to already be looking for loopholes and shortcuts if I may be so bold as to say this! (and I am a Texan, so yes I may be so bold!)

If your parents complain that they thought using AP credits could allow you to graduate early, remind them that college + med school is a long haul. If you take Gen Chem in college, I can assure you it will be covered in greater depth than in high school and it will not be a waste of your time.

P.S. nobody should take PChem (Physical Chemistry) except Chemistry Majors in my, Bio Major, opinion.

 

[907914]

If you take Gen Chem in college, I can assure you it will be covered in greater depth than in high school and it will not be a waste of your time.

Can confirm - my high school chemistry didn't cover any nuclear chemistry, but Gen Chem 3 in college did and I had like 3 C/P questions on it. The college classes are worthwhile if you want to take them as opposed to upper division alternates.

 

[Wolvvs]

Can confirm - my high school chemistry didn't cover any nuclear chemistry, but Gen Chem 3 in college did and I had like 3 C/P questions on it. The college classes are worthwhile if you want to take them as opposed to upper division alternates.

Absolutely agree. And even if you do have a good grasp on the material, getting As in science courses is exactly what you need, an A after an AP class is just as impactful as any other A.

 

[Seihai]

P.S. nobody should take PChem (Physical Chemistry) except Chemistry Majors in my, Bio Major, opinion.

Personally, I disagree. If you're good at math, then PChem might actually be easier than some of the other upper-level Chemistry courses, depending on your school. My PChem course (taken as a decidedly not Chemistry Major) was easier than Orgo, in my opinion.

 

[907914]

Personally, I disagree. If you're good at math, then PChem might actually be easier than some of the other upper-level Chemistry courses, depending on your school. My PChem course (taken as a decidedly not Chemistry Major) was easier than Orgo, in my opinion.

As a student who has not taken any math-related classes in 2 years and loved the conceptualization aspects of Ochem, I will disagree (with the caveat that it is all about personal preference).

 

[Djax99]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord Just wanted to thank you guys for the help. So just as way to clear it all up:

If I use my ap credit and take gen chem 3, supplementing my chem prerequisites with just organic and biochem won’t be enough at a good chunk of schools and that I would instead need to take an upper level chem class or retake gen chem 1&2 later.

If I were to go this route, what upper level chem classes would be possibilities to fulfill my chem prerequisites.

 

[907914]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord Just wanted to thank you guys for the help. So just as way to clear it all up:

If I use my ap credit and take gen chem 3, supplementing my chem prerequisites with just organic and biochem won’t be enough at a good chunk of schools and that I would instead need to take an upper level chem class or retake gen chem 1&2 later.

If I were to go this route, what upper level chem classes would be possibilities to fulfill my chem prerequisites.

That is correct. I would recommend upper division clinical chemistry, PChem (if you want to be physically assaulted daily), and/or taking the full year of biochemistry as opposed to just one quarter.

 

[Seihai]

PChem will academically toughen the OP in the same way that Normandy Beach on D-Day did.

🙁

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord Just wanted to thank you guys for the help. So just as way to clear it all up:

If I use my ap credit and take gen chem 3, supplementing my chem prerequisites with just organic and biochem won’t be enough at a good chunk of schools and that I would instead need to take an upper level chem class or retake gen chem 1&2 later.

If I were to go this route, what upper level chem classes would be possibilities to fulfill my chem prerequisites.

You should ask your advisor and students at your school what chemistry classes you should take. We have no clue what your school offers and what classes might be hard.

For example, my school offers PChem (and it is apparently a living hell for others), but it doesn't offer things like "Clinical Chemistry" or other such courses. It does offer a class that is essentially Advanced General Chemistry, but I believe that out of 200 students who take that class every year, 2 get an A. Probably something to avoid if you can.

 

[wysdoc]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord Just wanted to thank you guys for the help. So just as way to clear it all up:

If I use my ap credit and take gen chem 3, supplementing my chem prerequisites with just organic and biochem won’t be enough at a good chunk of schools and that I would instead need to take an upper level chem class or retake gen chem 1&2 later.

If I were to go this route, what upper level chem classes would be possibilities to fulfill my chem prerequisites.

You keep asking the same question, are you hoping for a different answer this time? Take the full year gen chem🙄

 

[Djax99]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord

Sorry I know I've been pretty annoying, it's just that I've have received a ton of conflicting advice on this topic so I'm not sure what to do.

Additionally, I still don't know if biochemistry counts as an upper level course that can substitute for general chemistry. So far on sdn I have received conflicting advice on if it does or doesn't (mainly that it doesn't) but I have also heard from some of my friends that have gone through the process that have said biochemistry substitutes for the semester of gen chem that they skipped.

I know 2 people that have skipped gen chem 1 through AP credit, then taken gen chem 2, orgo 1&2, and then biochem and they said that was good enough to fulfill their chemistry prerequisites as the biochem supplemented the AP credit. However, on this thread, multiple people have said that this will not actually work so I'm kinda lost hahaha.

 

[907914]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord

Sorry I know I've been pretty annoying, it's just that I've have received a ton of conflicting advice on this topic so I'm not sure what to do.

Additionally, I still don't know if biochemistry counts as an upper level course that can substitute for general chemistry. So far on sdn I have received conflicting advice on if it does or doesn't (mainly that it doesn't) but I have also heard from some of my friends that have gone through the process that have said biochemistry substitutes for the semester of gen chem that they skipped.

I know 2 people that have skipped gen chem 1 through AP credit, then taken gen chem 2, orgo 1&2, and then biochem and they said that was good enough to fulfill their chemistry prerequisites as the biochem supplemented the AP credit. However, on this thread, multiple people have said that this will not actually work so I'm kinda lost hahaha.

It depends on the schools you are applying to. Get MSAR. Some require an extra biochem class. By the time you apply I’m 3-4 years, it is likely that many more will.

 

[rdyotz]

Medical schools that only require the basics (1 year GCHM, 1 year OCHM, 1 year Physics, 1 year Biology, 1 year English), biochem will (usually) count as an upper-division chem class. However, you are on a quarter system, so you would need 2 biochem courses to fulfill skipping GCHM1/2 (some schools require 2 quarters or 1 semester of biochem).

Some schools allow AP credit, without taking upper levels.

Some schools will require biochem plus 1 year GCHM plus 1 year OCHM, which means you need to take two quarters of upper level chem courses.

Other schools will have different requirements.

Bottom line is that this is school specific. Unless you know which schools you want/can apply to 3 years from now (hint: without a cGPA and MCAT you don't know), you need to leave your options open. That means either ignoring your AP credits and taking GCHM1/2, or taking upper level chem courses that most people think are more difficult. Going the GCHM1/2 route will solidify concepts and likely make those MCAT sections easier for you. Upper-level chem is not on the MCAT, so unless your fallback career is a chemist, they won't help.

 

[Wolvvs]

@gonnif @wysdoc @rdyotz @Wolvvs @lodo.owl @MemeLord

Sorry I know I've been pretty annoying, it's just that I've have received a ton of conflicting advice on this topic so I'm not sure what to do.

Additionally, I still don't know if biochemistry counts as an upper level course that can substitute for general chemistry. So far on sdn I have received conflicting advice on if it does or doesn't (mainly that it doesn't) but I have also heard from some of my friends that have gone through the process that have said biochemistry substitutes for the semester of gen chem that they skipped.

I know 2 people that have skipped gen chem 1 through AP credit, then taken gen chem 2, orgo 1&2, and then biochem and they said that was good enough to fulfill their chemistry prerequisites as the biochem supplemented the AP credit. However, on this thread, multiple people have said that this will not actually work so I'm kinda lost hahaha.

Here's why you're recieving conflicting advice:

Premedical Course Requirements | School of Medicine

medicine.tufts.edu

Academic Requirements for School of Medicine at LSU Health Shreveport

Learn more about the academic requirements needed to apply for admission to the School of Medicine at LSU Health Shreveport on our website.

www.lsuhscshreveport.edu

Tufts will accept your coursework, LSU won't. You need to do the research.

 

[907914]

some schools require 2 quarters or 1 semester of biochem

What schools require 2 quarters of biochem?

 

[Orangekiwi]

OP, I went through this whole process that you're asking about. Got AP credit, placed out of general chemistry, went straight into organic chemistry as a freshman. Not only was it a pain when I was studying for the MCAT because my background in gen chem was trash, but I've had a couple of schools where my credits barely meet their requirements even with biochem, and some schools I didn't apply to because I didn't meet their chemistry requirements. Take Gen chem again. If nothing else, think of it as MCAT prep because even after spending like 50% of my time studying on it C/P was still my lowest subsection.

 

[907914]

OP, I went through this whole process that you're asking about. Got AP credit, placed out of general chemistry, went straight into organic chemistry as a freshman. Not only was it a pain when I was studying for the MCAT because my background in gen chem was trash, but I've had a couple of schools where my credits barely meet their requirements even with biochem, and some schools I didn't apply to because I didn't meet their chemistry requirements. Take Gen chem again. If nothing else, think of it as MCAT prep because even after spending like 50% of my time studying on it C/P was still my lowest subsection.

Can ditto - had to put a lot of extra effort into relearning gen chem as the upper division stuff is not very MCAT applicable.

 

[rdyotz]

What schools require 2 quarters of biochem?

I have only heard of one, I've only used semesters, so I didn't pay too much attention to it, but I think it was Miami, or maybe Penn state?