* 2008-2009 Secondary Application Thread *

shemarty · Jun 5, 2008

serikk85 · Jun 5, 2008

Yes! Thanks for doing this. Here's my first question. Does anyone know how much secondaries change from year to year? I was thinking about looking at last year's prompts and drafting my essays (I hate waiting and doing nothing) but I don't want to work on them only to find in a few weeks that they don't even ask that question anymore. Anyone?

chad5871 · Jun 5, 2008

serikk85 said:
Yes! Thanks for doing this. Here's my first question. Does anyone know how much secondaries change from year to year? I was thinking about looking at last year's prompts and drafting my essays (I hate waiting and doing nothing) but I don't want to work on them only to find in a few weeks that they don't even ask that question anymore. Anyone?

Most of the schools do not change their secondary essays year-to-year. It's a good idea to draft some essays now. Most of them are pretty short, so even if you don't use a couple, you didn't waste too much time on it.

serikk85 · Jun 5, 2008

chad5871 said:
Most of the schools do not change their secondary essays year-to-year. It's a good idea to draft some essays now. Most of them are pretty short, so even if you don't use a couple, you didn't waste too much time on it.

Sweet. Thanks.

ChubbyChaser · Jun 5, 2008

Probably the ones that appear the most are....Why did you apply to our school?? (you can probably write a pretty generic essay for this and then customize it if necessary)

and then

-What EC made the biggest impression on you.

mdmarty · Jun 5, 2008

Does anyone know were we can get old secondary prompts? Or do we just have to get the prompts from friends who applied last year?

shemarty · Jun 5, 2008

mdmarty said:
Does anyone know were we can get old secondary prompts? Or do we just have to get the prompts from friends who applied last year?

I added a link to my original post at the top of this thread.

silverlining1 · Jun 5, 2008

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=419935&page=9 Post 446 has the complete list of secondary prompts that were compiled in the last cycle. Shemarty, maybe you can edit your original post to include this link?

Many prompts will be similar from last year to this year and also across schools, I believe. Since word counts can differ, I'd advise that you brainstorm bullet points for commonly seen questions, and then it won't be that hard to write the actual essays when you get the prompts and lengths.

EDIT: LoL, Shemarty, you added the link before I posted my reply! Awesome.

SBK · Jun 6, 2008

Holy crap, what a resource. Looks like I have a plan of action as my primaries have already been verified!

shemarty · Jun 6, 2008

SBK said:
Holy crap, what a resource. Looks like I have a plan of action as my primaries have already been verified!

Good luck!

I tried to convince myself that I'd crank out all my secondary essays in May, using the prompts from last year. But, after spending months and months on my PS and finally submitting that yesterday, I've lost some momentum.

I'm going to try writing again after taking a short breather.

hypnix · Jun 6, 2008

Do schools recycle their secondary apps often?

shemarty · Jun 6, 2008

chad5871 said:
Most of the schools do not change their secondary essays year-to-year. It's a good idea to draft some essays now. Most of them are pretty short, so even if you don't use a couple, you didn't waste too much time on it.

Chad5871 answered your question earlier on this thread

hypnix · Jun 6, 2008

shemarty said:
Chad5871 answered your question earlier on this thread

Whoops. I am tired and trying to revise my personal statement. Seems like there is always something to change. I don't even know why I asked cause I still need a few more days to edit the PS

shemarty · Jun 6, 2008

So, for schools like Columbia, Hopkins, Yale, Wash U etc which have an online secondary application...

This is what Columbia's office told me:
"You do not have to wait to be verified to fill out our secondary application. You can begin to fill it out on June 15th."

I assume it works the same way at other schools that have a similar system.

So, I'm going to post links to the secondary websites on post #1 of this thread, in case anybody wants to bookmark them.

ar2388 · Jun 6, 2008

does anyone know whether all secondary applications require an additional fee? or if only some do, does anyone know which ones?

chad5871 · Jun 6, 2008

ar2388 said:
does anyone know whether all secondary applications require an additional fee? or if only some do, does anyone know which ones?

Pretty much all of them do. They range from $50 to $100, with most being around $80.

Also, did anyone try to create a new login for the Columbia secondary? When I did, it took to to a website that said "Johns Hopkins Office of Admissions" or something like that. Looks like someone's gotten their wires crossed.

shemarty · Jun 6, 2008

ar2388 said:
does anyone know whether all secondary applications require an additional fee? or if only some do, does anyone know which ones?

Of all the schools I looked at, their secondary applicaitons do require an additional fee. I believe most if not all schools do require an additional secondary fee. The specific details can be found in the MSAR, on the pages for each school.

Here's an idea of how much they will cost:

Stanford $85, Columbia $75, Duke $80, Harvard $85, Penn $80, Yale $85, Hopkins $75, UCSD $60, Mich $75, Vanderbilt $50, Baylor $70, WashU $50, UCLA $60, UCSF $50

shemarty · Jun 6, 2008

chad5871 said:
Pretty much all of them do. They range from $50 to $100, with most being around $80.

Haha, you said this much more concisely than I did above

chad5871 said:
Also, did anyone try to create a new login for the Columbia secondary? When I did, it took to to a website that said "Johns Hopkins Office of Admissions" or something like that. Looks like someone's gotten their wires crossed.

I tried to do it a couple days ago. It let me create an account, but the actual questions weren't available yet.

serikk85 · Jun 6, 2008

Anybody have any clue when the Hopkins secondary opens up? I can't find a date anywhere....

shemarty · Jun 6, 2008

serikk85 said:
Anybody have any clue when the Hopkins secondary opens up? I can't find a date anywhere....

I just tried calling their office to ask, but their call-in hours are M, T, W 2-4pm.

serikk85 · Jun 6, 2008

So nearly every secondary has the old, "If you have interrupted your college education for a semester or longer, explain what you were doing" essay. I answered this as part of my AMCAS, what should I do? I guess there's more I could talk about since I was out of school for two years, but I think I would mostly just repeat myself. Anyone else in this same position?

serikk85 · Jun 7, 2008

serikk85 said:
So nearly every secondary has the old, "If you have interrupted your college education for a semester or longer, explain what you were doing" essay. I answered this as part of my AMCAS, what should I do? I guess there's more I could talk about since I was out of school for two years, but I think I would mostly just repeat myself. Anyone else in this same position?

Bump.

shemarty · Jun 7, 2008

serikk85 said:
So nearly every secondary has the old, "If you have interrupted your college education for a semester or longer, explain what you were doing" essay. I answered this as part of my AMCAS, what should I do? I guess there's more I could talk about since I was out of school for two years, but I think I would mostly just repeat myself. Anyone else in this same position?

I've been done with classes since after fall quarter of senior year, and I'm also taking next year "off" to apply. In my AMCAS (15 activities section), for each activity that's going to continue into this summer/next year, I have a bullet point that says so.

In the secondaries, when they ask what I've been doing or what I plan to do with my year, I'm just going to have to re-list these things. I think some of the prompts just ask for a chronological list with short descriptions and time commitments, etc. They're not always asking for a developed essay - they just want to know what you did with all the "free time". So, while it is repeating what's on the AMCAS, that's exactly what they're asking for.

Does anybody else have any thoughts about it?

vargant · Jun 7, 2008

shemarty said:
Does anybody else have any thoughts about it?

I would just state again, what you're doing even if it is restating what you said in your work/activities section of your primaries. That way it will show continuity.

Does anyone know how we should do the secondaries? For example, one of the prompts I read stated, "Indicate your significant travel experiences and include the circumstances."

Should I explain what the experience meant to me, or simply state what I did? There isn't a word limit.

serikk85 · Jun 7, 2008

vargant said:
Should I explain what the experience meant to me, or simply state what I did?

That's a good question. I'm wondering the same thing. My prompt says "describe what you did during that time." I was thinking about including more of what it meant since I described what I did in my AMCAS, but the question doesn't ask for that. Would that just annoy adcoms?

shemarty · Jun 7, 2008

vargant said:
I would just state again, what you're doing even if it is restating what you said in your work/activities section of your primaries. That way it will show continuity.

Does anyone know how we should do the secondaries? For example, one of the prompts I read stated, "Indicate your significant travel experiences and include the circumstances."

Should I explain what the experience meant to me, or simply state what I did? There isn't a word limit.

Hmm, "indicate" seems to imply that they just want to state what you did.
For example, if I were asked that question, I might write:

"Studied abroad in Australia from for one quarter (Sept-Dec 2007) with Overseas Studies Program. Traveled, took classes and conducted ecology research with a group of 50 students."

What do other people think?

Orange86 · Jun 7, 2008

vargant said:
I would just state again, what you're doing even if it is restating what you said in your work/activities section of your primaries. That way it will show continuity.

Does anyone know how we should do the secondaries? For example, one of the prompts I read stated, "Indicate your significant travel experiences and include the circumstances."

Should I explain what the experience meant to me, or simply state what I did? There isn't a word limit.

That's a very interesting secondary question. Which school asks that?

serikk85 · Jun 7, 2008

vargant said:
I would just state again, what you're doing even if it is restating what you said in your work/activities section of your primaries. That way it will show continuity.

Does anyone know how we should do the secondaries? For example, one of the prompts I read stated, "Indicate your significant travel experiences and include the circumstances."

Should I explain what the experience meant to me, or simply state what I did? There isn't a word limit.

shemarty said:
Hmm, "indicate" seems to imply that they just want to state what you did.
For example, if I were asked that question, I might write:

"Studied abroad in Australia from for one quarter (Sept-Dec 2007) with Overseas Studies Program. Traveled, took classes and conducted ecology research with a group of 50 students."

What do other people think?

I think that sounds just about right. The prompt doesn't seem to be asking much more than that.

vargant · Jun 8, 2008

Orange86 said:
That's a very interesting secondary question. Which school asks that?

Florida State University

shemarty · Jun 8, 2008

Wow, the secondary's already out? (Or are you using the prompt from last year?)

vargant · Jun 8, 2008

I'm using the prompt from last year. I figured they may use the same prompt, and since I'm not a quick writer, the secondaries I'm doing now may be used with another school or be very similar so that it doesn't take me as long to write.

seven87 · Jun 9, 2008

I've started working on drafts for secondaries, but can't decide how finalized to get them?

Are you all writing rough drafts and then spending a couple days on them when you actually get the secondaries? Or are you planning on doing just about everything now and just proofing them before submission?

ar2388 · Jun 9, 2008

for the schools that say that if we have any additional info we want to tell them, we should do such and such, must be write something? i mean, would it look bad if that part were left blank? what kinds of things are you guys thinking about writing there?

shemarty · Jun 9, 2008

ar2388 said:
for the schools that say that if we have any additional info we want to tell them, we should do such and such, must be write something? i mean, would it look bad if that part were left blank? what kinds of things are you guys thinking about writing there?

I have heard from other people on SDN that if a secondary has an optional essay where you can tell them whatever you want, and you honestly have nothing to tell them, then it's okay to leave this blank. Maybe this is the place for you to talk about any unusual circumstances or to explain what appears to be a flaw in your application. Or maybe you can use this space to tell them what you did during the summer? I'm not sure, but I might leave this essay blank if it says "optional" and I can't think of anything meaningful to say.

serikk85 · Jun 10, 2008

Hey everybody. The Hopkins secondary is up and running!

serikk85 · Jun 10, 2008

serikk85 said:
Hey everybody. The Hopkins secondary is up and running!

What the....ha, just kidding. They just took it offline. I swear it was up though! Had this year's deadlines and everything.

shemarty · Jun 10, 2008

Hmm, it lets me create an account and log in, but I can't click on "Application for Admission ." Is the Hopkins secondary working for anybody else?

shemarty · Jun 10, 2008

serikk85 said:
What the....ha, just kidding. They just took it offline. I swear it was up though! Had this year's deadlines and everything.

Oh, bummer

shemarty · Jun 11, 2008

"List any academic honors or awards you have received since entering college." Does this include research grants for summer research? Does this include graduating with departmental honors?I assume this doesn't include a service award. I'm not in phi beta kappa or anything like that. I don't even think we have a dean's list, or maybe I'm just not on it :laugh:

Also, they ask for start and end dates of employment/volunteering/extracurricular activities. If these are ongoing activities what do I list as the stop date? They don't let you type "present." When they ask me to list Employment, I assume I should list all activities where I got paid? Even if I consider them more extracurricular activities, if I got paid, it's "employment"?

For the LOR section, they ask me to list 2 senior faculty members and "[SIZE=-0]If you have a graduate degree or significant full time work experience of a year or more, it is advisable to send letters from persons who have supervised your work." I haven't been working full time for over a year, so ... does this mean I'm literally only allowed to send two letters from faculty members?

[/SIZE]

shemarty · Jun 12, 2008

Anyone have any thoughts about this?

silverlining1 · Jun 12, 2008

shemarty said:
"List any academic honors or awards you have received since entering college." Does this include research grants for summer research? Does this include graduating with departmental honors?I assume this doesn't include a service award. I'm not in phi beta kappa or anything like that. I don't even think we have a dean's list, or maybe I'm just not on it.

It's hard to tell if they mean "academic honors" and "awards" or "academic honors" and "academic awards". If it's the former, which I assume it is, then I'd include your service award.

ButImLETired · Jun 12, 2008

shemarty said:
"List any academic honors or awards you have received since entering college." Does this include research grants for summer research? Does this include graduating with departmental honors?I assume this doesn't include a service award. I'm not in phi beta kappa or anything like that. I don't even think we have a dean's list, or maybe I'm just not on it

Also, they ask for start and end dates of employment/volunteering/extracurricular activities. If these are ongoing activities what do I list as the stop date? They don't let you type "present." When they ask me to list Employment, I assume I should list all activities where I got paid? Even if I consider them more extracurricular activities, if I got paid, it's "employment"?

For the LOR section, they ask me to list 2 senior faculty members and "[SIZE=-0]If you have a graduate degree or significant full time work experience of a year or more, it is advisable to send letters from persons who have supervised your work." I haven't been working full time for over a year, so ... does this mean I'm literally only allowed to send two letters from faculty members?

[/SIZE]

Well, I'm not sure but I can tell you my opinion for whatever it's worth...

1) Honors: I think departmental honors count. I don't think research grants count cause I don't know that I'd consider them "academic honors". Maybe awards? Was it a competitive grant? In that case, you can probably make an argument for that, and just say "so and so grant, awarded competitively yadda yadda yadda"

2) If there's no stop date, don't put one. If it insists that you enter one, I sometimes enter september 09 as the stop date for a lot of those things...after all, you'll hopefully be at their school at the time!

3) I would just send them the professors. If you've been mostly doing undergrad stuff and haven't been working full-time for over a year, it seems like it would end up hurting you to send the letter from a boss you've only had for a short amount of time. If they just meant "a boss who knows you well" they would have said that, so I'd take the time constraints seriously.

Anyways, those are my two cents! Hope it helps....

shemarty · Jun 13, 2008

Does the Hopkins admissions office have an e-mail address? I could only find a phone number.

copingmethods · Jun 13, 2008

shemarty said:
Does the Hopkins admissions office have an e-mail address? I could only find a phone number.

I called today and got a lengthy recording - at the very end of it I think they mentioned an email address, but I didn't write it down.

I have a (very stupid

) question: When secondaries ask for your AMCAS ID, is that the same as your AAMC ID? I just want to make sure I didn't get some other ID # w/o realizing!

chad5871 · Jun 13, 2008

copingmethods said:
I have a (very stupid ) question: When secondaries ask for your AMCAS ID, is that the same as your AAMC ID? I just want to make sure I didn't get some other ID # w/o realizing!

Yes, they are the same.

shemarty · Jun 14, 2008

I added the prompt for Hopkins and Columbia. Feel free to post more prompts and URLs to the online application if you come across any more, and I'll update it on the 1st post.

seven87 · Jun 14, 2008

Thanks shemarty, I have been browsing this thread quite a bit and will post when I get some secondaries.

You haven't received any, right? You just have the prompts from the websites?

shemarty · Jun 15, 2008

Yea, the Columbia and Hopkins ones are online, and they're currently active.
Yale and WashU open this week, so as soon as they do, I'll post those, too.

The other schools that I applied to, I have to wait until they send me an e-mail with a URL. Once I get that, I'll post the link and post the prompt.

I also wanted to try adding some info about which LORs certain schools required, whether they have a minimum and maximum, etc. I've been e-mailing some schools' admissions offices this week because some of these secondaries only give you space to enter 3 LOR writers, and I want to send more than that. I haven't organized the information yet, though.

sss403 · Jun 15, 2008

Hey guys,

I submitted my Columbia secondary a little bit past midnight, but this is the confirmation email I received:

Thank you for choosing to apply to Columbia University College of Physicians & Surgeons. You have successfully submitted your application for the first year medical school class which will enter in August 2008.
Sincerely,
Columbia U College of Physicians & Surgeons Admissions Office

Everything on the application was updated, but I think not this email. Should I worry about this?

Thanks.

shemarty · Jun 15, 2008

You can try e-mailing their office to confirm / bring it to their attention. They've been pretty good about replying to my e-mails

Congrats on submitting your secondary so early!

I feel like we should start a running list of submit date / complete date.

*** 2008-2009 Secondary Application Thread ***

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