Academic/Research Position as a DO

[yumyum72]

Although there is still time in the cycle, I have only been invited to osteopathic med school interviews thus far, so I am contemplating the consequences of being a DO in pursuing a career being part-physician part-researcher. Specifically, I would like to conduct clinical (EDIT: I guess I don't want to rule out basic or translational research, though) global health research.

I know that choosing an osteopathic school will/may limit me in some ways: getting into highly competitive ACGME residencies and practicing at an academic powerhouse. I'm not concerned with the former, as I'm not too interested in Radiology, Dermatology, etc. anyways, and I'm fine with a decent mid-level ACGME residency in my field of interest. However, since research is an interest of mine, I feel like I may be doing myself a disadvantage by handicapping myself from being competitive at large academic institutions. Another concern may be being able to obtain research grants? I read some personal anecdote somewhere on SDN where a grant giving entity ignored an application because it included a DO. Is this prevalent or an isolated case? Lastly, in the realm of global health, is the question of being recognized abroad as a physician as a DO, but from researching on SDN, I don't think that's a huge thing.

However, I have no clue as to whether I'm making this out to be a bigger deal than it is. It's difficult to gauge possible stigma against DOs in the academic environment because of:
1. Self-selection within DOs for primary care and not for research careers.
2. Looking at the low numbers of DOs within large academic institutions is not helpful because of the above caveat and also because of the smaller proportion of DOs to MDs in the physician population in general.
And I have no better sources.

In the end, yes, it's all about what I make of med school and being proactive to seek out those opportunities myself. I could probably carve out a place in the field for myself being a DO, but I want to be informed about possible roadblocks.

Does anybody have better insight into this?

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[AlbinoHawk DO]

Can you get into an MD school? No? Then live with the consequences of being a DO or work toward becoming competitive in the MD world. It's as simple as that. What you need to know is that as a DO you won't be barred from doing research and that there are DOs in places like Harvard. How hard it is to get there depends on many factors. Keep in mind that even an MD from Harvard won't put you easily at an academic powerhouse research job. What it will do is have more opportunities to get there, but getting there is dependent on the individual.

And no, nobody is going to see the initials "DO" and throw away your research proposal. That's not how the real world works. There are thousands of MDs, PhDs, etc. that it will be your research track record that'll be investigated and what decides your fate.

 

[hallowmann]

Can you get into an MD school? No? Then live with the consequences of being a DO or work toward becoming competitive in the MD world. It's as simple as that. What you need to know is that as a DO you won't be barred from doing research and that there are DOs in places like Harvard. How hard it is to get there depends on many factors. Keep in mind that even an MD from Harvard won't put you easily at an academic powerhouse research job. What it will do is have more opportunities to get there, but getting there is dependent on the individual.

And no, nobody is going to see the initials "DO" and throw away your research proposal. That's not how the real world works. There are thousands of MDs, PhDs, etc. that it will be your research track record that'll be investigated and what decides your fate.

This.

As AlbinoHawk said, there certainly are DOs in research and at big academic settings. That said, your options and opportunities are less than of you were to go US MD. If you can't get into a US MD school, and are OK with spending a year or two (depending on your app) getting more competitive for US MD, without a guarantee that you'll get there and might have to go DO anyways, do that. If you don't want to risk it, go DO from now. You may also be able to increase your research chances by going DO/PhD and CV, but that'll also take longer.

 

[costales]

If you want a job at an academic powerhouse, it's always best to get your degree from an academic powerhouse. BTW Many (if not most) people doing "global health research" don't have a medical degree.

 

[yumyum72]

Thank you, responders. You hit the nail on the head.

@costales That is a good point about global health research. It also occurred to me that I could find other fulfilling ways to participate in the field through NGOs. Somehow, I was so focused on research powerhouses as my only option since that’s the environment I’m most familiar with.

 

[pals2015]

You can also look into DO/PhD programs like VCOM, Michicgian, Rowan, etc I believe there are like 8

 

[group_theory]

It's actually not that hard to become an academic attending at a university medical center ... they are usually hurting for clinical staff because their faculty aren't really working full time clinically, are engaged in research or other academic endeavors, and the pay in academia is significantly lower than private practice/outside academia (so if a harvard MD/PhD stay on to do IM at MGH, then stay on as an academic hospitalist at MGH, his salary is likely lower than a DO who did his AOA IM residency at a community program, and is a hospitalist at that community hospital)

If you are interesting in a career in academic medicine, then work on getting into a decent university program for residency. Take advantage of the human resources available at a university program, get physician mentors/advisors, start a few projects yourself (either from the ground-up, or join an existing project), maybe see what it is like to propose a project, get the necessary regulatory/IRB approval, data collection, etc. Do some QA/QI as well to see what that is like. If it is something you like and wish to pursue, then creating this strong background during residency will help get you into a clinical-research hybrid spot at a university hospital after residency/fellowship - where you will be junior faculty ... where you can start working on grants, ... and publish (to make a name for yourself). Then move up when there is an opening (maybe chief of a subdivision, then division chief, then dept chair, dean, etc)

It's easier to network, and get early exposure if you attend an MD school than a DO school. But afterwards, it's who you know, and what you have done/accomplished (and how much grant money you have been able to obtain) that will set you apart

Dr Ross Zalfonte is a full professor and chair of PM&R at Harvard Medical School and a leading expert on traumatic brain injury. So it's possible to reach the top echelon. Now whether it's a path you want to pursue - well, that's up to you.

http://thedo.osteopathic.org/2013/08/harvard-do-urges-profession-to-question-investigate-publish/

 

[AlteredScale]

It's actually not that hard to become an academic attending at a university medical center ... they are usually hurting for clinical staff because their faculty aren't really working full time clinically, are engaged in research or other academic endeavors, and the pay in academia is significantly lower than private practice/outside academia (so if a harvard MD/PhD stay on to do IM at MGH, then stay on as an academic hospitalist at MGH, his salary is likely lower than a DO who did his AOA IM residency at a community program, and is a hospitalist at that community hospital)

If you are interesting in a career in academic medicine, then work on getting into a decent university program for residency. Take advantage of the human resources available at a university program, get physician mentors/advisors, start a few projects yourself (either from the ground-up, or join an existing project), maybe see what it is like to propose a project, get the necessary regulatory/IRB approval, data collection, etc. Do some QA/QI as well to see what that is like. If it is something you like and wish to pursue, then creating this strong background during residency will help get you into a clinical-research hybrid spot at a university hospital after residency/fellowship - where you will be junior faculty ... where you can start working on grants, ... and publish (to make a name for yourself). Then move up when there is an opening (maybe chief of a subdivision, then division chief, then dept chair, dean, etc)

It's easier to network, and get early exposure if you attend an MD school than a DO school. But afterwards, it's who you know, and what you have done/accomplished (and how much grant money you have been able to obtain) that will set you apart

Dr Ross Zalfonte is a full professor and chair of PM&R at Harvard Medical School and a leading expert on traumatic brain injury. So it's possible to reach the top echelon. Now whether it's a path you want to pursue - well, that's up to you.

http://thedo.osteopathic.org/2013/08/harvard-do-urges-profession-to-question-investigate-publish/

Thank you for the informative response! I was wondering what you mean by the QA/QI part? I've never heard of that.

Do you think partaking in programs like the HHMI research fellowship is a good step towards gaining a career in academic medicine?

Thanks ahead!

 

[yumyum72]

@group_theory Incredibly helpful road map to academic medicine and excellent interview. Thank you!

@AlteredScale I think competitive fellowships always boost your CV in any field. I recently spoke with a DO who did a Fogarty Fellowship, which is more in the domain of public health, but I'd equate it to the HHMI fellowship. They are currently still a resident, but seems to have found success so far in their chosen path.

 

[Doctor Bob]

lots of words

So... yes it's possible.
I've been an academic attending at a civilian ACGME residency program
I've been an academic attending at a military ACGME residency program
I've been the assistant research director for the military's largest EM research program
I was tagged as the departmental director for research and assistant program director for research, then passed on them to go back for fellowship

At no point along the way have I felt that being a DO has held me back. If there was something interesting to me in either the research or academic field I've had no trouble doing it.