Applying for fellowship with a DUI charge (not what you think)

[anervouswreck]

[deleted]

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[premedUVA]

Sorry to hear about your circumstances. Let me preface this by saying I am a medicine subspecialty fellow and there are certainly more knowledgeable folks on here than myself (@aProgDirector, @gutonc).

That having been said, I don't think you have been unethical as your situation currently stands. I assume every program will run background checks on matched applicants, but there would be very few (if any) that would do so for every applicant they are ranking.

Even if programs ran background checks on you (highly doubt anyone is running FBI searches), as you stated, nothing would come up because you haven't been convicted. I would certainly disclose this to whatever program you match to if you have not been exonerated, but hopefully by that time this will all be in your past.

However, you can't escape bringing this up on your licensing applications in the future, but I agree with your PD that this will likely not affect your ability to get a license (assuming your lawyer can get this expunged from your record). Spend whatever money you need to in order to retain a lawyer that knows what they are doing and can get this off your record.

Hope that helps- good luck!

 

[premedUVA]

Thank you very much for your input especially in regards to the ethics of it. I understand the need for transparency and (if not disclosed earlier) plan on letting my future PD know if I match. I think my case is quite unique in many aspects and it is still up in the air. Obviously, if this were a slam dunk DUI with alcohol charge, I would've mentioned that right away even without a conviction. But I have never willfully drank and drove, and this is one of those freak side effects that I have heard about, but only realized how crazy it actually is now that I've experienced it first hand.

I understand what you're saying, but a BAC of 0.01 certainly does not work in your favor. Whether or not you remember drinking is irrelevant. DUI does not mean "driving with BAC above legal limit" and I am not a lawyer, but I imagine the BAC of 0.01 could still be prosecuted as an alcohol-related DUI. They presumably tested your blood many hours after your arrest.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

My advice would have been different, for this exact reason. If you had disclosed in your application, you wouldn't worry about it now. Although I agree that you'll almost certainly get a license with this in your background, you'll still need to report it and it probably will slow down your licensing, hence I would have reported it on your application.

But I agree you didn't "lie" on your application, I just would have disclosed to avoid the problem you're currently in. Sure, some programs might not have interviewed you because of it -- but those are probably the programs that might give you a hard time about it finding out about it after the fact.

What to do now? There's no right answer. I'd probably disclose it now and apologize. Unfortunatley this won't remove your worries, just change them -- you'd now not worry about what will happen when they find out about it (after match), but instead worry that they aren't going to rank you because of it.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

Thank you for your well thought out response. I guess my worries have stemmed from whether or not I'd be see as unethical. I really did not feel unsure of myself when I applied; it is only now that the process has started that I have become anxious over my chances of matching and remembered this detaile.

I do, however, wonder if this would be grounds to rescind a contract if I were to notify them after the match. I'm not too familiar what the NRMP and ERAS state on their terms and licensing, so I hope you can comment on that. I am still very much torn on whether to comment now or later, and as you said, there is no real right answer. You were the first one who I've spoken with that mentioned possibly letting it out in the open now, so I appreciate the other side argument.

Would a program try to waive a match over something like this? Probably not, but it's in the realm of possible. Your choice now is whether you want to worry about this until April/May when your matched program finds out about it, or disclose now and worry that it will affect your interview offers. So, either way, you're going to end up worrying about it -- that's inevitable. You get to pick which worry sounds more manageable for you.

 

[mvenus929]

Would a program try to waive a match over something like this? Probably not, but it's in the realm of possible. Your choice now is whether you want to worry about this until April/May* when your matched program finds out about it, or disclose now and worry that it will affect your interview offers. So, either way, you're going to end up worrying about it -- that's inevitable. You get to pick which worry sounds more manageable for you.

* December. I'm pretty sure IM fellowships match in December.

And if they are on the same timeline as me, invites have already gone out and we are in the midst of attending said,interviews.

 

[Crayola227]

I personally would just ride this out now

 

[shopsteward]

Something I am wondering is whether or not this charge is going to go any further in any case: from what you say it has been several months since you were charged with apparently no further prosecution action being taken against you. What does your lawyer say? Subject to their views, of course, I would be beginning to think that it is becoming less likely that there will be any prosecution: the delay of several months, the difficulties for the prosecution in proving the charge (they can't just present a lab report but have to rely on a police officer's evidence as to intoxication), the lack of third party involvement, the fact that you have self-enrolled in a state monitoring program and the fact that you have effective legal representation all suggest to me that the prosecutorial office will have less of an interest in taking your case forward than they do in many others.

So, before you panic further, ask your lawyers what is happening with your case. If they say that prosecution is now unlikely given the passage of time and other issues, you don't need to do anything. If a prosecution is still on the cards, I would suggest that you not give a blanket notification to programs but wait until you get interview invitations (no need to tell anyone who is not going to interview you anyway). You could then consider replying with something along the following lines -

"Thank you for the invitation which I will be delighted to attend.

Before attending the interview I wish to let you know that I have been charged, but not prosecuted, for a DUI involving ambien, where there was no third party involvement and since which I have been self-enrolled in a state monitoring program. I will of course report the charge on my State licensing application, but I have been advised that as things stand the charge should not be a reason for there to be any limitations on my receiving a medical licence.

I am very much interested in attending your program and hope that this disclosure will not affect your decision to interview me."

 

[premedUVA]

@anervouswreck, how's this all work out?

 

[TennisShoeChic]

I understand what you're saying, but a BAC of 0.01 certainly does not work in your favor. Whether or not you remember drinking is irrelevant. DUI does not mean "driving with BAC above legal limit" and I am not a lawyer, but I imagine the BAC of 0.01 could still be prosecuted as an alcohol-related DUI. They presumably tested your blood many hours after your arrest.

I am puzzled by this attitude- can someone clarify the usefulness of this test? In my experience as a student, it seems that depending of the attending, a BAC if 0.01 or 0.02 may prompt repeated alcohol-abuse conversations with patients, many of whom are there for other instances (like stomach pain with vomiting, where it could be alcohol-related, but it is more likely a infection).

Several times, patients with low BACs (0.01-0.02) have have vehemently sweared they haven’t drank anything recently, and are insulted by these repeated efforts to probe at their alcohol abuse with CAGE questions etc. there was a pregnant patient in particular I remember who was very insulted by this line of questioning.

So is it appropriate to make a big to-do over a BAC of 0.01? Our lab value parameters even say “normal 0.00-0.03”. Is a non 0.0 BAC truly truly a sign of concern for alcohol abuse? Am I getting duped by lying patients? Is it possible that the above poster drank and forgot about it on meds or could it just have been a false positive reading?