Average experience hours

[CatTech]

I hate to ask this right now because I know many of you are current applicants and some are probably very worried about the exact same issue.... but....



Could you guys tell me what the average number of experience hours are for accepted students? Overall or for specific schools.




I am trying to figure out if I should continue at my current undergrad school for vet school pre-reqs, go back to the school where I did my gen eds (as part of an english ed. program--so the rest of my classes from there don't help toward my major at all....), or go up to Ohio State and do my pre-reqs there.

I'm really thinking Ohio State, because it's my state vet school anyway, and I can get my pre-reqs done and apply to vet school in the fall of 2010 there, whereas if I go to one of the other 2 undergrad schools, it will be at least 2011 before I can apply--possibly longer. (Plus the school I'm currently at, there are only 2 or 3 small clinics in the area, and they never have any positions available. In fact I think one of my vet tech classmates checked into volunteering at one of them last year and they turned her away.---at least if I was at OSU, I might not get to work in a clinic, but I could probably get into some kind of undergrad research position)

But at the same time, I'm kind of behind on my experience hours. Currently:
~160 small animal veterinary experience hours
~80 animal experience hours (from a shelter--again all small animal)
--0!!! large animal hours (unless you count my labs for my vet tech classes--my current major--then by the end of this year it will be ~200)




So my concern is even if I can apply sooner if I go to OSU, will I have enough experience hours for it to even matter?


Although I guess even if I don't have enough experience hours by then, getting my pre-reqs out of the way faster/earlier would help me free up time to take more "booster" classes (like anatomy, parasitology, etc.), and actually work toward a bachelor's.



Basically I'm just looking for advice. And would love to get an idea of how far behind I really am on experience hours...




**Note, I also have practically no upper-division courses currently because of changing majors between two completely different fields. Not sure how much that would affect my chances for acceptance to vet school though if I have my pre-reqs done....

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[pressmom]

I hate to ask this right now because I know many of you are current applicants and some are probably very worried about the exact same issue.... but....



Could you guys tell me what the average number of experience hours are for accepted students? Overall or for specific schools.

I don't know if such a list exists, but you could check the accepted students thread for the last couple of cycles to get a sense of how much experience SDNers had.

I am trying to figure out if I should continue at my current undergrad school for vet school pre-reqs, go back to the school where I did my gen eds (as part of an english ed. program--so the rest of my classes from there don't help toward my major at all....), or go up to Ohio State and do my pre-reqs there.

I'm really thinking Ohio State, because it's my state vet school anyway, and I can get my pre-reqs done and apply to vet school in the fall of 2010 there, whereas if I go to one of the other 2 undergrad schools, it will be at least 2011 before I can apply--possibly longer. (Plus the school I'm currently at, there are only 2 or 3 small clinics in the area, and they never have any positions available. In fact I think one of my vet tech classmates checked into volunteering at one of them last year and they turned her away.---at least if I was at OSU, I might not get to work in a clinic, but I could probably get into some kind of undergrad research position)

Someone here could correct if I'm wrong, but I believe you have to have a tech degree to work as a tech in Ohio, so if you're close to finishing, I would finish up then move back to Ohio. You want to make sure you have residency somewhere for vet school because that will often help you with admissions and the cost of tuition.

But at the same time, I'm kind of behind on my experience hours. Currently:
~160 small animal veterinary experience hours
~80 animal experience hours (from a shelter--again all small animal)
--0!!! large animal hours (unless you count my labs for my vet tech classes--my current major--then by the end of this year it will be ~200)

Sounds like you're off to a good start! I counted my hours with a food animal class I took during my pre-reqs, so I'd say your class hours count as animal experience on VMCAS.

So my concern is even if I can apply sooner if I go to OSU, will I have enough experience hours for it to even matter?


Although I guess even if I don't have enough experience hours by then, getting my pre-reqs out of the way faster/earlier would help me free up time to take more "booster" classes (like anatomy, parasitology, etc.), and actually work toward a bachelor's.

You'll find in vet school that people have a variety of experience and courses coming in to vet school. I just had the bare minimum of courses and I'm doing fine. There's really only an advantage first year with taking these courses, so I wouldn't call them necessary. The vet school will teach you what is important to know to be a vet. Try to be as diverse academically and experientially as possible.

Basically I'm just looking for advice. And would love to get an idea of how far behind I really am on experience hours...




**Note, I also have practically no upper-division courses currently because of changing majors between two completely different fields. Not sure how much that would affect my chances for acceptance to vet school though if I have my pre-reqs done....

I had very little upper division science courses coming into vet school. I completed a bachelor's in a completely different field. It won't set you behind at all. Do well in what you take and that's what matters.

 

[LucyLoo]

To get some idea of how much and what type of experience people have you can check out the successful applicants threads. It can give you a feel for how different people have balanced out their grades and experience.

 

[pressmom]

Here are the last couple of successful applicant threads.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=493514

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=359074

 

[CBRGrl]

**Note, I also have practically no upper-division courses currently because of changing majors between two completely different fields. Not sure how much that would affect my chances for acceptance to vet school though if I have my pre-reqs done....

Sorry, this is a little off the main topic, but in response to your question about upper division courses....I applied to vet school last year and wasn't accepted. I have a good GPA and lots of experience working at clinics...etc. When I went in for my file review (another bad decision last year...only applying to one school!) the reviewer looked everything over and the only thing she could come up with was that I had a lack of upper division science courses. I, too, switched to vet later in the game...I have a bachelor's degree in psychology (with lots of upper division psych courses!) but only had my prereqs done when I applied...aka no hard-core, full-time, semesters of upper division sciences (the reviewer's words, not mine!). So to remedy it I enrolled in a master's course and am taking as many 500+ classes as I can. Not sure if this is helpful...but my advice is take as many as you can. It can't hurt but it could sure help!

 

[CatTech]

“Someone here could correct if I'm wrong, but I believe you have to have a tech degree to work as a tech in Ohio, so if you're close to finishing, I would finish up then move back to Ohio. You want to make sure you have residency somewhere for vet school because that will often help you with admissions and the cost of tuition.”

I live in Ohio, just went OOS for tech school. So I already have the residency thing covered. And I plan on finishing up tech school before transferring anyway—the problem is I will be done after this school year (except for a required summer externship), and don’t know where to go for my pre-req classes once next year starts. But figured OSU would be good because then I know my courses will apply for admissions to my state school, and I could * hopefully * do some undergrad research while there to get more varied experience.

But thanks for the heads up!

“I counted my hours with a food animal class I took during my pre-reqs, so I'd say your class hours count as animal experience on VMCAS.”

Yay! I’m hoping it will be okay if I do the same for my classes then… Although I’m hoping to count mine as veterinary experience (instead of general animal experience) because all of my vet tech labs are taught/supervised by DVMs. (well, actually I have to take that back… my Clin. Path lab is taught by a CVT w/ a master’s—though I’m not sure what in… but we don’t actually work with the animals for that lab anyway, just run samples)

Although I still feel behind because I don’t know that I can get in the 1000+ hours many applicants seem to have before my first round of applying….

“Try to be as diverse academically and experientially as possible.”

I definitely need to work on the experience diversity… which is another reason I’m thinking OSU. The school I’m currently at has very few clubs that I’m interested in, and even the most active clubs are… well…. not very active. I figure OSU is a lot bigger than my current school, and probably has a lot more to choose from as far as extracurriculars.



**Also, thanks for the successful applicants thread. I checked it out, and it seems very helpful. Still makes me feel behind…. lol. But helpful none-the-less.

 

[CatTech]

oh, and thanks to lucyloo and CBRgirl for your help also!

 

[pressmom]

You're welcome!

OSU may be a great choice for you since there are definitely clinics where you can work in Columbus, and I'm sure the school has many active pre-vet opportunities. I almost ended up there for vet school and this it's a great area/school.

Best of luck!!

 

[CatTech]

yeah... i kind of like the idea of being in an area with a good variety of things to do/participate in too. the 2 schools i've been to (old major, then vet tech) have been such boring places....

i always envied my friends who were going to the University of Cincinnati or OSU and living close to campus---they always had tons of things to do!

i would really like to experience a school like that--active community, active clubs. i'm very much still discovering my interests in life, so i think a place like that would really help with that.

 

[DreamComeTrue09]

Well, I had 750 hours working as a veterinary technician at an emergency animal hospital over the summer and was rejected. I also had about half a year of taking care of a dairy herd of 100+ cows, milking, cleaning, assisting in difficulty calving. As well as horse experience through my school...Still i was rejected.


This application cycle I have 700 hours working as a vet tech at a small animal hospital and I plan on continuing working there. I also have a full year of working with the dairy herd...

Sooo, my point is I think what matters is that you show consistancy. For example, why in the world would one be accepted for working at an animal hospital for the summer? Do you think that person experienced enough in that small time frame to know they want to make a career out of this? Well, I've always known I wanted to be a vet...but saying it is one thing...one must PROVE their commitment to veterinary medicine by showing years of experience within the field, demonstrating dedication.

I wish I had more to put on my application, but rather than try a million different things I stuck to a few that really interest me...so we'll see

 

[cuitlamiztli]

Sooo, my point is I think what matters is that you show consistancy. For example, why in the world would one be accepted for working at an animal hospital for the summer? Do you think that person experienced enough in that small time frame to know they want to make a career out of this? Well, I've always known I wanted to be a vet...but saying it is one thing...one must PROVE their commitment to veterinary medicine by showing years of experience within the field, demonstrating dedication.

I'd like to point out that 'proving your commitment by having years of experience' isn't feasible for everyone, and that people do get in with little clinical experience. They may have only recently decided to pursue veterinary medicine or have had horrible luck trying to find any. Similarly, people with tons of experience get in and find that it isn't the career that they really want... so I guess my point is that the rest of your application matters, too.

To the OP: Wherever you decide to go, I suggest sending all of the clinics in the area a letter explaining that you'd like to get more clinical experience and your resume. Even if there's nothing available at the time, they may remember that you contacted them and consider you when a position does become available. That's what I had to do. For diversity, you could also try zoos or wildlife rehabilitation centers/clinics, if any are close.

Good luck !

 

[CatTech]

cuitlamiztli:

thanks for the advice on sending the resume! i will definately do that. i like the idea of sending it up there a little while before i will actually be going there so that they'll already have it on file if/when something does come up. and i would love to get experience at a zoo or wildlife rehab, but i always thought that those positions would be impossible for me to get... of course, it's always worth the shot! =)


it's also encouraging to hear that it's possible to get in w/ little experience...

and hopefully the fact that i've been formally trained as a vet tech will help too.

 

[cuitlamiztli]

You're welcome!

As far as wildlife rehab/zoos... in my experience, they almost always need some form of help (though not necessarily with the vets). I was curious, so I got onto google and found the Ohio Wildlife Center Hospital and the Columbus Zoo. So, if you end up at Ohio State, you can look at them for some diverse or leadership experience

(Sorry if you're already aware of them... I'm Ohio-opportunity-ignorant )

 

[ylrebmik]

A few people have mentioned that they have been vet techs. or vet assistants in undergrad.. how do you fit that in (the schooling) if you're already in undergrad? (non-trads who arent already techs, anyways)?

 

[lailanni]

I'd like to point out that 'proving your commitment by having years of experience' isn't feasible for everyone, and that people do get in with little clinical experience. They may have only recently decided to pursue veterinary medicine or have had horrible luck trying to find any.

I decided late and only had 2-3 years to get experience. So it's totally possible to be successful without a lifetime of animal experience. I did totally work my arse off for those 2-3 years though and got well over 1500 hours of different kinds of experience.

 

[david594]

A few people have mentioned that they have been vet techs. or vet assistants in undergrad.. how do you fit that in (the schooling) if you're already in undergrad? (non-trads who arent already techs, anyways)?

It all depends on the state. The ones with less stringent requirements for "vet techs" make it easier to one to get a job doing it.

I can only speak for my state(MA), but here there is no recognition for certified vet techs, so anyone can get a job doing it. All my training was OTJ.

 

[CatTech]

cuitlamiztli:

thanks for the info!

i did know about the columbus zoo being up there--and that Jack Hannah is somehow associated w/ it! (i don't know exactly how though... lol.)

but i didn't know about the other place.

and no need to apologize, even if i had already known about every zoo/wildlife center in a 50 mile radius (i definately do not!!), i really appreciate that you took the time to offer some help!


ylrebmik:

to be quite honest about the schooling to become a certified vet tech, it doesn't really fit anywhere into a bachelor's degree. unless of course your bachelors is in veterinary technology (most people just get an associates to become a tech, but some schools do offer a bachelors)--however, at least at my school, even the classes for a BS in vet tech don't line up with the pre-reqs for vet school.

so your answer would be that it doesn't fit. i basically added 2 years onto my undergrad (could probably have gotten most of my pre-reqs in by now... ). so i will have been an undergrad for at least 6 years when i get my bachelors. but i thought the extra 2 years would be worth it for me so that i could have some formal training in some of the basics of veterinary care (and all accredited tech schools are regulated by the AVMA--meaning that they set the guidelines for what i am learning in tech school--thought that would be more helpful w/ adcoms than being trained on the job, where their are not really specific guidelines on what you have to learn). i also thought it would be a good backup plan in case i decided later on not to go on to vet school--that way i could still work in the veterinary field. not to mention it makes it a little easier getting people to hire me so i can gather experience for vet school!

and now i know what makes it really worth it:
rather than just being a backup plan, it has served to feed the fire that pushes me toward becoming a vet...

 

[CatTech]

**To correct what I stated earlier....

After my labs for vet tech this year, I will only have 100 hrs large animal experience, not 200.

But the good news is that lab is taught by a DVM, so hopefully it should count as veterinary experience instead of general animal experience. (And I know 100 hrs is still a decent amount for someone who was not raised on a farm, nor participated in FFA, 4H, or anything of the sort... Although the # could still stand to be better...)



On a another note...


And I'm thinking about doing my required externship for vet tech this summer at a research lab at a local hospital. My school's pre-vet advisor (also my prof. for my large an. vet tech class) said this would be a great way to get some breadth of experience that would help out my vet school application later on...


I was kind of excited about trying to get into an emergency small animal clinic for the externship, but I already have some small animal vet experience--whereas I have zero research experience.


Oh, and another option I'm considering is seeing if I could do my externship up at Ohio State's vet teaching hospital. That way I could get an idea of what clinicals are like for the 4th years, and get to know some of the people in the CVM... which could prove advantageous in the future??? (On the other hand, if they think I do a crappy job, it could work against me too... )


What do you guys think?

 

[BayleeVet2B]

I'm about to submit, but I have one last question I hope. When entering hours for experience, I thought I read on the board that you can project your hours until 12/31/08 if it's a constant time, ie, I work 20hr/week for the next 12 weeks? Is that right???

 

[david594]

Be sure to list both average weekly hours and total hours for each experience. The total hours should reflect completed hours (total hours to date), and should not include future hours. You are allowed 480 characters in the Description of Duties window. If you need additional space, use the Explanation Sheet.

So no future hours. Sorry.

 

[CurrySpice]

From my admittedly pre-vet perspective, I think that if you have the grades, you can get accepted with mediocre experience and a good explanation, but otherwise it's the easiest part of your application to improve. If I don't get in on my first application cycle, I will definitely take a year and just work at an animal hospital.

We don't have any animals really within a 5 mile radius, and I don't have a car, so.... summer experience it is! I have 1000s of hours of horse experience, 40 hours of equine vet experience, but nothing else yet. I'm hoping to figure out how to hitch a ride into town on a weekend to start volunteering at the animal shelter, but I'm still trying to figure out how to handle schoolwork and friends / simply living on a college campus.

 

[IvyLynx]

From my admittedly pre-vet perspective, I think that if you have the grades, you can get accepted with mediocre experience and a good explanation, but otherwise it's the easiest part of your application to improve. If I don't get in on my first application cycle, I will definitely take a year and just work at an animal hospital.

We don't have any animals really within a 5 mile radius, and I don't have a car, so.... summer experience it is! I have 1000s of hours of horse experience, 40 hours of equine vet experience, but nothing else yet. I'm hoping to figure out how to hitch a ride into town on a weekend to start volunteering at the animal shelter, but I'm still trying to figure out how to handle schoolwork and friends / simply living on a college campus.

wooooooooooooo people without cars (or licenses)! does wonders for your experience hours, lemme tell ya. i think i am going to add a bit about it in my explanation statement.

 

[sumstorm]

As far as counting class experience as animal experience, I would direct that question to VMCAS. I was told not to do so by VMCAS, as it was kind of double dipping. I also was told that I couldn't put some of my major awards (like a year long fellowship with 22k in stipends) in the awards/honors section if I put them under the animal experience section. VMCAS said to put an explanation in the background section.

As for experience, I would contact every DVM practicing and PhD researcher doing animal work, and ask to volunteer as much time as you could there. That is how I obtained my current clinic job; when she needed another person to support a second vet in the practice, it was easier to ask me then to pay for advertising, try to screen applicants, etc. If she hadn't asked me, she would have asked her staff to come up with potential applicants first, before she ever advertised the position OR reviewed the file of applications we keep on hand. I also obtained some amazing animal experience maintaining the research labs at my undergrand (which was NOT class experience, was paid for as a lab tech, and gave me a variety of experience from the natural history collection to the nudibranchs used for neuro research.)

Best of luck.

 

[CatTech]

the thing is, my pre-vet advisor flat out told me that adcoms aren't going to count my vet tech courses for anything (ex: even though i've had anatomy for vet techs, it was a class specific to vet tech students, and therefore won't be counted... boo... lol) so i don't know that counting the experience hours from those classes really would be like "double-dipping"



and...



cuitlamiztli :

i just checked on the Ohio Wildlife place... looks really interesting! I think I may try and volunteer up there when I go to OSU! =) (which i'm pretty sure i will go there next year... at least, i want to, and i think it would be my best option...)

so thanks again for the info!

 

[david594]

the thing is, my pre-vet advisor flat out told me that adcoms aren't going to count my vet tech courses for anything (ex: even though i've had anatomy for vet techs, it was a class specific to vet tech students, and therefore won't be counted... boo... lol) so i don't know that counting the experience hours from those classes really would be like "double-dipping"

The reason your anatomy won't count is because anatomy courses for vet techs are not intended to be upper division courses.

How much experience are you really losing out on though? 3 hours of lab a week times 14 weeks. We're barely talking about 40 hours there.

Once you actually start working in the veterinary field you will find that you can build up hours rather quickly. You will finish up your vet tech certificate in about a year right? Pick up a job then working some of the more undesirable hours(nights, weekends, etc) and you will rack up hours quickly. Working 2 shifts on weekends(16 hours) will net you 800 hours of veterinary experience in a year.

 

[CatTech]

The reason your anatomy won't count is because anatomy courses for vet techs are not intended to be upper division courses.

How much experience are you really losing out on though? 3 hours of lab a week times 14 weeks. We're barely talking about 40 hours there.

Once you actually start working in the veterinary field you will find that you can build up hours rather quickly. You will finish up your vet tech certificate in about a year right? Pick up a job then working some of the more undesirable hours(nights, weekends, etc) and you will rack up hours quickly. Working 2 shifts on weekends(16 hours) will net you 800 hours of veterinary experience in a year.

i'm not sure if this was meant harshly, but it kind of comes across that way. i hope it wasn't meant so, but if it was, i really don't appreciate it.


anyway.... i know my anatomy class was not intended to be upper level, and i never expected it to be counted. i was just expressing my lack of excitement over the fact that that means if i want to have an anatomy class that will count towards applications on my transcripts, i will have to take it again... not that i don't love anatomy, because i actually really do. it's just the idea that if i take it twice, it will feel like my time has been somewhat wasted.


and the lab hours i'm referring to are 12hrs a week for this entire school year, not 3 a week for one semester. it may not amount to thousands of hours, but they are hours regardless, and would certainly add up to far more than 40...

also, i spent this past summer working full-time as a tech at a very busy multiple doctor clinic (at least 7 doctors off the top of my head) and was responsible for treatments of all hospitalized patients--ICU and non-critical. and i did a short stint working in a shelter the summer before that. so i actually HAVE started working in the veterinary field.

 

[david594]

Not meant as harsh.

Being a certified tech is a valuable skill and will help you find jobs easy enough. Using it you will be able to accumulate hours very easily so I wouldn't worry about that so much right now. Compared to all of us who had to go asking around for places to observe or volunteer, you will definitely have a leg up.

Working as a tech will also help you a ton with exposure to cases, treatment, etc. Not to mention you will develop many clinical skills. Most of the nurses I work with have done more jug caths than the doctors.

 

[LucyLoo]

i'm not sure if this was meant harshly, but it kind of comes across that way. i hope it wasn't meant so, but if it was, i really don't appreciate it.


anyway.... i know my anatomy class was not intended to be upper level, and i never expected it to be counted. i was just expressing my lack of excitement over the fact that that means if i want to have an anatomy class that will count towards applications on my transcripts, i will have to take it again... not that i don't love anatomy, because i actually really do. it's just the idea that if i take it twice, it will feel like my time has been somewhat wasted.


and the lab hours i'm referring to are 12hrs a week for this entire school year, not 3 a week for one semester. it may not amount to thousands of hours, but they are hours regardless, and would certainly add up to far more than 40...

also, i spent this past summer working full-time as a tech at a very busy multiple doctor clinic (at least 7 doctors off the top of my head) and was responsible for treatments of all hospitalized patients--ICU and non-critical. and i did a short stint working in a shelter the summer before that. so i actually HAVE started working in the veterinary field.

Nah, I don't think david meant it in a harsh way. I'm not sure which vet schools you are considering, but the majority don't require you to take anatomy. I know I was able to use mine maybe as an elective (and it can make your first year a tiny bit easier because you would already have some familiarity with the subject).

 

[CatTech]

ok, sorry i misunderstood then.

and yeah, i'm pretty much loving tech classes. it puts me a little behind timewise, but i get to do lots of things that it would take years for me to ever be allowed to even try once if i just started out sweeping floors/cleaning cages somewhere (not that there is anything wrong with that). like the fact that i've already faced my first rectal palpation of a cow... lol i have a pic of it that i emailed to my family members to gross them out... haha (maybe i should make that my avatar on here...)

thanks for the help/encouragement guys.


and now.... time for some much needed

 

[VAgirl]

the thing is, my pre-vet advisor flat out told me that adcoms aren't going to count my vet tech courses for anything

In my experience, advisors often know squat. And even if they work at a vet school, they don't know the definitive word for how all vet schools will view any one thing. From school to school, things are often looked at/counted differently. So when you apply, it'd be a good idea to call the VMCAS hotline to get the definitive word on how VMCAS thinks you should record things on your application. Even then, though, it often won't match up with how all schools expect to see things recorded. If you're interested in only one school, or primarily interested in one school, it might help to get an idea from them how they count things like hours accumulated in class, etc.

Honestly, the variation between schools was what drove me the most batty while applying.

 

[CatTech]

yeah... the differences between schools seems like it would make things really frustrating... *hopefully* i will keep myself ahead of schedule when i do start applying so its not as stressful. but that's what they all say, right? lol

by the way, congrats to those of you who applied this year on making it through VMCAS!!! and best of luck on making it in!