Clinical Coordinators

[yandorio]

Maybe it is because I went to a Caribbean Medical School but at St George's in California we
were subject to these "clinical coordinators" called Genesis Medicus. These were the most tyrannical goons I
ever had to deal with in my life. They required a ridiculous number of documents for a given rotation, and if you started new rotation you had to start over--they would not accept what you had already sent them for the previous rotation and they gave the okay for. For one rotation they kept pestering a certain student about his behavior, stupid **** like
talking to the Attending Physicians, they said it was his "final warning" even though they couldn't name the Attending Physicians he had allegedly annoyed.The hospital I was at told me this was bizarre and unacceptable (talking to doctors is actually part of the education) but despite promises no one was there to rein them in, like a rogue company with no accountability. In another case they were pestering
my friend about a trivial bureaucratic matter and when he asked for clarification they offered nothing and kicked him off the rotation after he had spend hundreds in hotel bills for the rotation. When I talked to rotating students from American Medical schools and told them what was going on they asked "Who are these goons that keep bothering you? We wouldn't put up with his crap if it happened to us." When pressed the school gave a very patronizing response, basically brushed the issue aside. In the last couple years I heard they
were up to their ears in Sexual Harassment suits against the creepy leader of this organization. When I went off to
the East Coast for rotations I didn't have to deal with Genesis Medicus and it was 100 times more enjoyable and got good reviews from the doctors. When I spoke to SGU students they said they felt the same way about Genesis Medicus but were too scared to complain--so it became a big Stockholm Syndrome vibe.
I wonder if anyone else had to deal with obnoxious "clinical coordinators" (actually annoyers) like SGU students had to deal with.

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[32mads]

I am literally in the same boat as you with this company and I can’t believe I am
Paying them a single fu***** dollar

 

[The kitchen sink]

What facility?

 

[32mads]

What facility?

all genesis locations in Southern California; Hollywood pres, Mission Hospital and LADMC

 

[32mads]

Maybe it is because I went to a Caribbean Medical School but at St George's in California we
were subject to these "clinical coordinators" called Genesis Medicus. These were the most tyrannical goons I
ever had to deal with in my life. They required a ridiculous number of documents for a given rotation, and if you started new rotation you had to start over--they would not accept what you had already sent them for the previous rotation and they gave the okay for. For one rotation they kept pestering a certain student about his behavior, stupid **** like
talking to the Attending Physicians, they said it was his "final warning" even though they couldn't name the Attending Physicians he had allegedly annoyed.The hospital I was at told me this was bizarre and unacceptable (talking to doctors is actually part of the education) but despite promises no one was there to rein them in, like a rogue company with no accountability. In another case they were pestering
my friend about a trivial bureaucratic matter and when he asked for clarification they offered nothing and kicked him off the rotation after he had spend hundreds in hotel bills for the rotation. When I talked to rotating students from American Medical schools and told them what was going on they asked "Who are these goons that keep bothering you? We wouldn't put up with his crap if it happened to us." When pressed the school gave a very patronizing response, basically brushed the issue aside. In the last couple years I heard they
were up to their ears in Sexual Harassment suits against the creepy leader of this organization. When I went off to
the East Coast for rotations I didn't have to deal with Genesis Medicus and it was 100 times more enjoyable and got good reviews from the doctors. When I spoke to SGU students they said they felt the same way about Genesis Medicus but were too scared to complain--so it became a big Stockholm Syndrome vibe.
I wonder if anyone else had to deal with obnoxious "clinical coordinators" (actually annoyers) like SGU students had to deal with.

Who are sexual harassment allegations against? Jack Ayala? The CEO of Genesis?

 

[yandorio]

Who are sexual harassment allegations against? Jack Ayala? The CEO of Genesis?

I believe Senda del Sid and Abdullah Nadeem were the plaintiffs and Jack (Jacinto) Ayala was the defendant.
Abdullah Nadeem et al vs Jacinto Ayala et al is a link.
I have heard that it was worse than this one lawsuit but I don't know details.

 

[32mads]

I believe Senda del Sid and Abdullah Nadeem were the plaintiffs and Jack (Jacinto) Ayala was the defendant.
Abdullah Nadeem et al vs Jacinto Ayala et al is a link.
I have heard that it was worse than this one lawsuit but I don't know details.

Thank you! I had to report a doctor through Genesis for sexual assault; genesis never once responded to any of emails and continued to try and place me with that doctor. Since then, Gensis has failed me on every rotation. Doctors have sent over my LOR and genesis says they are "missing".

I dont know what to do moving forward.

 

[Clerkships]

Hi Everyone,

Is SGU using this company for their 3/4th year of clinical clerkships?

NEVER waive your right to a LOR this will allow you to request a copy from the physician during and also post rotation for an updated LOR for your ERAS. Then if you don't match you can also request it to apply for off cycle residency positions.
Does Genesis not keep a database of your documents? I do know sometimes that there need to be updated but each student should have a student file and a representative that maintains your documents.

 

[yandorio]

Hi Everyone,

Is SGU using this company for their 3/4th year of clinical clerkships?

NEVER waive your right to a LOR this will allow you to request a copy from the physician during and also post rotation for an updated LOR for your ERAS. Then if you don't match you can also request it to apply for off cycle residency positions.

@All does Genesis not keep a database of your documents? I do know sometimes that there need to be updated but each student should have a student file and a representative that maintains your documents.

Yes, SGU has relied on this company for 3rd year clerkships. Maybe 4th too, I don't know. Most of the students I talked to strongly resented their humorless bully tactics, stuff like making fun of students just for asking for clarification about documents and dates.
No, I don't think they keep a database of students' documents. I know for a fact I was asked again for their LONG list of documents
the second time I did a clerkship with them, which of course is weird and offensive because I had already sent them that stuff in a prior clerkship and had it approved.

 

[Clerkships]

Yes, SGU has relied on this company for 3rd year clerkships. Maybe 4th too, I don't know. Most of the students I talked to strongly resented their humorless bully tactics, stuff like making fun of students just for asking for clarification about documents and dates.
No, I don't think they keep a database of students' documents. I know for a fact I was asked again for their LONG list of documents
the second time I did a clerkship with them, which of course is weird and offensive because I had already sent them that stuff in a prior clerkship and had it approved.

Wow, that is horrible. I would definitely be concerned on the security/safety aspect of the documents if you are having to resubmit everything. Do they have a portal where you upload it into or are you emailing it to a designated individual?

Does the dean of clinicals tell you to contact this company or how does the school designate you to contact them?

Thanks -
Jacquelyn

 

[yandorio]

Wow, that is horrible. I would definitely be concerned on the security/safety aspect of the documents if you are having to resubmit everything. Do they have a portal where you upload it into or are you emailing it to a designated individual?

Does the dean of clinicals tell you to contact this company or how does the school designate you to contact them?

Thanks -
Jacquelyn

Yes, there is the safety issue and also the patient issue. I was amazed how much of their annoyance, in terms of lost hours, interfered with the patient interaction/preparation so important in these clerkships...
When I did it a couple years ago, you had to email it to GM in a very specific format to a designated individual or they would reject it. And the number of documents was absurd, like 20 in contrast to the more welcoming environment in Florida where maybe 5 or 6 documents were required and they would *work* with you to get stuff done and help clarify things. In one case I remember they were requiring an OSHA face-mask fitting form and could not tell us a single place in Southern California, population 10 million people, where such forms were available and an expert (former EMT) student told me no such "official" form exists. So this is the type of behavior we had to deal with and the SGU deans who are supposed to supervise this type of thing were just like "Move along, nothing to see here." My memory is that we would one day get an email from Genesis Medicus saying "My name is Ne** *** and I will be in charge of coordinating your upcoming clerkship." There was no room for discussion, it was all very regimented and harsh. Here is a copy and paste of an actual message from them:... "extremely strict submission policies. Files will need to be submitted in an organized and timely manner, as they take up to a week for clearance."

 

[gyngyn]

NEVER waive your right to a LOR this will allow you to request a copy from the physician during and also post rotation for an updated LOR for your ERAS.

Failure to waive is extremely uncommon and as such, could be a red flag for screeners and PDs.
One can always request that letters be sent, even if the waiver is given.

 

[Clerkships]

Hello,

It is actually very common for IMG's to waive the right to LORs as "placement agencies" are using more and more of the same LOR templates for individuals who rotate. I have personally seen it where the same LOR template was used for 1 male and 1 female that rotated at the same time of the physicians office and the Male who received the LOR stated She and Her along with He in the LOR and the same wording was used. This helps prevent continuity errors when submitting for ERAS.

-Jacquelyn

 

[Clerkships]

Yes, there is the safety issue and also the patient issue. I was amazed how much of their annoyance, in terms of lost hours, interfered with the patient interaction/preparation so important in these clerkships...
When I did it a couple years ago, you had to email it to GM in a very specific format to a designated individual or they would reject it. And the number of documents was absurd, like 20 in contrast to the more welcoming environment in Florida where maybe 5 or 6 documents were required and they would *work* with you to get stuff done and help clarify things. In one case I remember they were requiring an OSHA face-mask fitting form and could not tell us a single place in Southern California, population 10 million people, where such forms were available and an expert (former EMT) student told me no such "official" form exists. So this is the type of behavior we had to deal with and the SGU deans who are supposed to supervise this type of thing were just like "Move along, nothing to see here." My memory is that we would one day get an email from Genesis Medicus saying "My name is Ne** *** and I will be in charge of coordinating your upcoming clerkship." There was no room for discussion, it was all very regimented and harsh. Here is a copy and paste of an actual message from them:... "extremely strict submission policies. Files will need to be submitted in an organized and timely manner, as they take up to a week for clearance."

Thank you so much for the information!

When did you graduate?

 

[yandorio]

Thank you so much for the information!

When did you graduate?

A couple years ago.

 

[Clerkships]

Congratulations.

Have you successfully matched into residency?

 

[yandorio]

Congratulations.

Have you successfully matched into residency?

I'm working on it. I got a 6 figure job right out of school, and am trying to weave myself back into the Clinical scene before my degree gets "stale."

 

[gyngyn]

A couple years ago.

PD's filter for year of graduation (YOG).
Every subsequent year reduces the number and type of residencies that are open to the graduate.

 

[32mads]

From my understanding at SGU, we are required to have our letters sent to the scheduling company (Genesis) and they put them in our "file". They will read our letters to us but we are not allowed to have a physical company. I want to match surgery and had two great letters written by surgeons during my third year. Now, Genesis can't "find" the letters after I reported a doctor.

 

[gyngyn]

From my understanding at SGU, we are required to have our letters sent to the scheduling company (Genesis) and they put them in our "file". They will read our letters to us but we are not allowed to have a physical company. I want to match surgery and had two great letters written by surgeons during my third year. Now, Genesis can't "find" the letters after I reported a doctor.

Did you waive your right to have access to your letters?

 

[32mads]

Did you waive your right to have access to your letters?

I dont even remember that being a choice? Do I have a choice? Is this common? I had the clinical coordinator at Genesis read me the letters and they were wonderful, she then promised me they were uploaded.

 

[gyngyn]

I dont even remember that being a choice? Do I have a choice? Is this common? I had the clinical coordinator at Genesis read me the letters and they were wonderful, she then promised me they were uploaded.

If you did not waive your right, you should have full access to the letters.
If you waived your rights and the company read them to you, they have breached the contract with the letter-writers.
It is uncommon not to waive this right in the application process.

 

[32mads]

If you did not waive your right, you should have full access to the letters.
If you waived your rights and the company read them to you, they have breached the contract with the letter-writers.
It is uncommon not to waive this right in the application process.

What should I do now?

 

[32mads]

What should I do now?

I am about to start fourth year.

 

[gyngyn]

What should I do now?

With regard to...?

 

[32mads]

With regard to...?

All of this about the letters?

 

[gyngyn]

All of this about the letters?

Ask the letter writers to upload them to ERAS in the usual fashion (when it becomes appropriate).
I surmise that you are not applying this cycle.

 

[32mads]

Ask the letter writers to upload them to ERAS in the usual fashion (when it becomes appropriate).
I surmise that you are not applying this cycle.

Hello, Thank you. I didn't even know this was option. Is there a maximum amount of LOR that can be uploaded? I haven't done away rotations yet and wasn't sure if I would be getting additional letters (or so I hope

 

[32mads]

Hello, Thank you. I didn't even know this was option. Is there a maximum amount of LOR that can be uploaded? I haven't done away rotations yet and wasn't sure if I would be getting additional letters (or so I hope

Oops, I will be applying next cycle!

 

[yandorio]

"I want to match surgery and had two great letters written by surgeons during my third year. Now, Genesis can't "find" the letters after I reported a doctor."

Sounds like you got a lawsuit if you have some evidence they flubbed things as bad as you described. Don't ever expect to GM to get anything right, or in any way help you. These are world class buffoons.

 

[32mads]

"I want to match surgery and had two great letters written by surgeons during my third year. Now, Genesis can't "find" the letters after I reported a doctor."

Sounds like you got a lawsuit if you have some evidence they flubbed things as bad as you described. Don't ever expect to GM to get anything right, or in any way help you. These are world class buffoons.

that's what I thought..not sure what to do. I'll try anything. thank you for all of your help.

 

[Clerkships]

I'm working on it. I got a 6 figure job right out of school, and am trying to weave myself back into the Clinical scene before my degree gets "stale."

Best way to do both would be to get some flexible telehealth rotations while working so if when you do apply you have more explanation to help support the gap.

 

[Clerkships]

that's what I thought..not sure what to do. I'll try anything. thank you for all of your help.

Have you gone to your med school to get it reported?

 

[Clerkships]

I dont even remember that being a choice? Do I have a choice? Is this common? I had the clinical coordinator at Genesis read me the letters and they were wonderful, she then promised me they were uploaded.

Reach back out to the physicians and request a copy of the LOR and state you are wanting to apply to off cycle positions.

 

[Clerkships]

Hello, Thank you. I didn't even know this was option. Is there a maximum amount of LOR that can be uploaded? I haven't done away rotations yet and wasn't sure if I would be getting additional letters (or so I hope

Yes, there are a maximum amount of LORs you can upload. Ideally post graduation you should attempt to get more experience that mimics the specialties of what your PGY1 would look like so if you are uploading 3 US GS Lors during your interviews you want to show additional experience that mimics what the year will look like. For example - General Surgery Residency Rotation Schedule

 

[Meerkatology]

wow ive heard of caribbean schools being predatory but i didnt know it was this bad. and sgu is one of the good ones too.
sounds like GM is connected with sgu in some under the table financial deals

why would this matter even require a 3rd party agency in the first place anyway

 

[yandorio]

"why would this matter even require a 3rd party agency in the first place anyway"

I admire your intuition regarding the dinero... I talked to an attending in Ob/Gyn about what was going on and he was on my side when I showed him some evidence, eg their emails, then a few days later he sounded irate and said something like "We can't fight, they [GM] control the money." I have no idea what he meant, exactly, with regard to specific details (we all know SGU has a lot of money of their own). In the next life I will be a journalist and chase after such leads....

 

[Clerkships]

wow ive heard of caribbean schools being predatory but i didnt know it was this bad. and sgu is one of the good ones too.
sounds like GM is connected with sgu in some under the table financial deals

why would this matter even require a 3rd party agency in the first place anyway

A lot of Carribean med schools use 3rd party placement agencies in order to help fill the gap of clinicals for their students.

Is this what you mean Meerk?

 

[Meerkatology]

A lot of Carribean med schools use 3rd party placement agencies in order to help fill the gap of clinicals for their students.

Is this what you mean Meerk?

why do they need 3rd party? they are a medical school, can they not directly connect with a mainland hospital to have rotations there?

i mean US med schools dont need 3rd party to do away rotations right? how is this different

 

[yandorio]

why do they need 3rd party? they are a medical school, can they not directly connect with a mainland hospital to have rotations there?

i mean US med schools dont need 3rd party to do away rotations right? how is this different

Good question. I went to SGU (which had its own clinical student coordinators) and put up with all the California Genesis Medicus stuff I described above and then out in Florida these SGU coordinators just arranged stuff through the department, much less heavy-handed and bureaucratic and a better education.

 

[yandorio]

I went through most of my 3rd year cores and 4th year electives with Genesis Medicus. SGU has a great partnership with this company. I was able to rotate at sites all throughout California which I preferred. I was able to match in California because of them. The owner and his staff have been nothing short of amazing in regards to accommodating our needs. There will always be people that complain and that's expected but I have nothing but great things to say about Genesis Medicus

Wow, most people match due to their grades and USMLE scores and LORs and online interviews. You matched because of Genesis Medicus? That's amaaazing!

 

[thestudentdoctorMD]

Maybe it is because I went to a Caribbean Medical School but at St George's in California we
were subject to these "clinical coordinators" called Genesis Medicus. These were the most tyrannical goons I
ever had to deal with in my life. They required a ridiculous number of documents for a given rotation, and if you started new rotation you had to start over--they would not accept what you had already sent them for the previous rotation and they gave the okay for. For one rotation they kept pestering a certain student about his behavior, stupid **** like
talking to the Attending Physicians, they said it was his "final warning" even though they couldn't name the Attending Physicians he had allegedly annoyed.The hospital I was at told me this was bizarre and unacceptable (talking to doctors is actually part of the education) but despite promises no one was there to rein them in, like a rogue company with no accountability. In another case they were pestering
my friend about a trivial bureaucratic matter and when he asked for clarification they offered nothing and kicked him off the rotation after he had spend hundreds in hotel bills for the rotation. When I talked to rotating students from American Medical schools and told them what was going on they asked "Who are these goons that keep bothering you? We wouldn't put up with his crap if it happened to us." When pressed the school gave a very patronizing response, basically brushed the issue aside. In the last couple years I heard they
were up to their ears in Sexual Harassment suits against the creepy leader of this organization. When I went off to
the East Coast for rotations I didn't have to deal with Genesis Medicus and it was 100 times more enjoyable and got good reviews from the doctors. When I spoke to SGU students they said they felt the same way about Genesis Medicus but were too scared to complain--so it became a big Stockholm Syndrome vibe.
I wonder if anyone else had to deal with obnoxious "clinical coordinators" (actually annoyers) like SGU students had to deal with.

Hey, this message does not really provide the other doctors and student doctors with a clear representation of what's actually happening or the situation at hand. In medical school, we are taught to put ourselves in other people's shoes, so we should make it a point to enlighten others about what exactly is going on. During this cycle's clinical rotations, students who were at a certain timeline or had timeline issues were given a very good opportunity to start rotations without taking their Step 1 in California. This, in turn, caused a large influx of students to a third party called Genesis. Genesis had to not only accommodate hundreds of students but also coordinate with multiple different hospitals and allocate many more physicians to ensure we had a good rotation experience. Unfortunately, we did not experience a seamless transition, but they upheld our grades, provided us with physicians, and also made sure we did not have to cold call dozens of hospitals like students from other schools have had to do. So, after this comment was made, things did become more fluid. We received better doctors, and there was a transition period where everything was moving too quickly, but as a student, I know that not only our school but also Genesis was doing their best to save our futures as physicians. They ensured we still met the criteria to be competitive for a match and eligible for ERAS in the future. This was an old post; Genesis is currently doing a great job with their students.

 

[thestudentdoctorMD]

why do they need 3rd party? they are a medical school, can they not directly connect with a mainland hospital to have rotations there?

i mean US med schools dont need 3rd party to do away rotations right? how is this different

Because US medical schools have contracts and are in one location, international schools with affiliations to the united states have hundreds of hospitals in many states. They give their students options on state preferences for their regards to financial or family obligations. Using a third party is a very beneficial way to organize students to be able to have a choice on which rotation they pick and where and also hold all of their clinical grades, evaluations, and letter of recommendations. American medical schools deal with a couple hundred of students but some international medical schools are dealing with thousands of medical students around the globe. Third parties do a very good job to keep the interest of the students in mind because they are responsive to our requests to who we want to rotate with and what we aspire to be.