Community pharmacy residencies: convince me they are not scams

[BenJammin]

I am really really really having a hard time figuring out what there is to gain from a community pharmacy residency. If you can't use them to get an ambulatory care PGY-2 then you either shoot for a faculty position at a COP or you go back into the world of retail. A 50% pay cut to get into an industry that most people get into almost immediately after graduation seems like a scam to me.

But please convince me otherwise. We have an intern here who wants to do one and I'm being Mr. Be Careful. I don't think it's a good idea but then again, I have no residency under my belt and my area is clinical pharmacy. Figured I would ask you guys. Any thoughts?

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[lactonerx]

Seems like it could be useful for building up a good professional network, especially if affiliated with a university. Your network could make you aware of unique job opportunities down the road.

 

[bacillus1]

As you said, it's useful for being faculty at a COP. Actually it's probably the easiest/shortest way of becoming faculty, as it's only 1 year long. If the person doesn't want to be faculty, then yes, there's really no point.

 

[All4MyDaughter]

It really depends on the program. Some of them provide better opportunities for graduates than others. Like all residencies, they are not created equal.

I did a community practice residency.

 

[Kenzi11611]

I applied to one this year. It is at a local teaching hospital though and actually has more of an ambulatory care focus. The majority of rotations are at outpatient clinics (transplant, HIV, psych, community health center) rather than at an actual retail pharmacy. The staffing requirement is at the hospital's discharge pharmacy. So for me I'm hoping to go one of two routes afterwards....PGY-2 in Amb Care or faculty position. But I made sure to ask the RPD what their residents have done post PGY-1, at least one is a SOP faculty member, a couple did PGY-2's in I can't remember what, one is a director of specialty pharmacy at a hospital so there is a variety of things depending on what the Community residency actually entails. I'm not planning to apply to retail jobs next year if I match there.

 

[EBT12]

I typed this in a different thread a few weeks ago:

I think there is a general misperception of what community residents actually do (and in fairness, each program is unique). For example, the residency program I am in partners with a college of pharmacy. Therefore, I am on campus generally two days per week. This time is spent preparing and giving lectures, leading small group discussions, participating in committees, working with student organizations, etc. The other three days a week I am at my practice site. While it is classified as a community pharmacy residency, my time is split between a community pharmacy and a medical practice. I provide clinical services at both locations.

However, the majority of my time is spent developing new clinical services. I have learned a ton of new skills related to developing collaborative relationships with other providers and payors, how to market services to various stakeholders, how to train other pharmacists to provide services, etc. I like being the principle investigator on a community wide study I designed and implemented. It's nice to be offered the opportunity to speak at conferences about new programs that I developed and am being paid for (and yes, it was really me that developed them, not the company or my preceptor). Oh, I forgot to mention - I spend <1 hour/week providing traditional dispensing services (I sometimes cover lunch so the other pharmacists can get a break).

Regarding job prospects, I have obtained a position at an established COP for post-residency. Other residents have gone directly into clinical positions, such as in physician offices. I also know people who went into PGY-2 positions in ambulatory care.

 

[thephoenician88]

I typed this in a different thread a few weeks ago:

I think there is a general misperception of what community residents actually do (and in fairness, each program is unique). For example, the residency program I am in partners with a college of pharmacy. Therefore, I am on campus generally two days per week. This time is spent preparing and giving lectures, leading small group discussions, participating in committees, working with student organizations, etc. The other three days a week I am at my practice site. While it is classified as a community pharmacy residency, my time is split between a community pharmacy and a medical practice. I provide clinical services at both locations.

However, the majority of my time is spent developing new clinical services. I have learned a ton of new skills related to developing collaborative relationships with other providers and payors, how to market services to various stakeholders, how to train other pharmacists to provide services, etc. I like being the principle investigator on a community wide study I designed and implemented. It's nice to be offered the opportunity to speak at conferences about new programs that I developed and am being paid for (and yes, it was really me that developed them, not the company or my preceptor). Oh, I forgot to mention - I spend <1 hour/week providing traditional dispensing services (I sometimes cover lunch so the other pharmacists can get a break).

Regarding job prospects, I have obtained a position at an established COP for post-residency. Other residents have gone directly into clinical positions, such as in physician offices. I also know people who went into PGY-2 positions in ambulatory care.

this is interesting and i'll keep an eye out during scramble. I think it sounds great and it's defn. what you make of it. I honestly don't think it's just free "hey work here and go home." If it turns out to be that way, then why wouldn't pharmacists simply leave and work in a community setting half way through?

But again, it comes down to each residency site being unique and what they have to offer. Interesting though.

 

[sellout59]

I am currently an outpatient resident. Keep in mind as the other poster said that their are different types. I suggest ones that are associated with a health care system rather than a chain pharmacy. The difference in culture from a chain pharmacy run by a corporation and a pharmacy run by a health care system is a breath of fresh air. And... also as the previous poster said, I often spend time at other parts of the hospital. Various outpatient clinics, and doing health screenings.

A few final things to think about (keeping in mind that I have become much more optimistic in regards to the future of outpatient pharmacy as I had been during pharmacy school)

If you think about all the proposed changes in health care, patient centered medical homes, accountable care organizations, the lack of primary care physicians.....

Pharmacy actually might have a chance to fill a role in regards to actually performing MTM, and being responsibile for a larger part of a patients therapy than simply dispensing the correct medication. As much as it pains me to say it, look at what Walgreens is doing, they actually started their own ACOs. I am really starting to think the next big advances in pharmacy are going to come from the outpatient side of things.

 

[BenJammin]

A fraternity brother just got done with a PGY-1 community pharmacy residency and guess what they earned him? A PIC job at Walgreens! This is what new grads have to look forward to. One year at 1/3rd a normal pharmacist salary just so they can be a PIC at a chain. Pharmacy is dead.

 

[PAtoPharm]

A fraternity brother just got done with a PGY-1 community pharmacy residency and guess what they earned him? A PIC job at Walgreens! This is what new grads have to look forward to. One year at 1/3rd a normal pharmacist salary just so they can be a PIC at a chain. Pharmacy is dead.

isn't it normal for the chains to hire new grads to be PICs even without having completed a residency? what's the point?

 

[gwarm01]

A fraternity brother just got done with a PGY-1 community pharmacy residency and guess what they earned him? A PIC job at Walgreens! This is what new grads have to look forward to. One year at 1/3rd a normal pharmacist salary just so they can be a PIC at a chain. Pharmacy is dead.

Damn. That is rough. A community residency only made sense to me if it was in some sort of ambulatory care clinic, but those positions are very few and far between. I think a guy in my class did one and went on to work in a retail corporate office, that at least makes it worthwhile.

isn't it normal for the chains to hire new grads to be PICs even without having completed a residency? what's the point?

Hey, five years ago it was normal for hospitals to hire new graduates too. Saturation just means the job providers will demand more and offer less.