Corona

[VictorOfHungerGames]

No - it is not similar to the flu at all. They are entirely different entities! We can surely expect very different outcomes even if the symptoms are the same!

Both viruses (influenza and covid) have a very specific function that takes place in the body (don’t forget that virus are not living, they execute a molecular machine type function and multiply in the process) and they will impact cells/processes in the body differently. Thus - we can expect different outcomes....

Come on - we need to rise above the silliness and act with some sort of authority on the subject.

Be objective! We can not compare covid to ANY other virus, or any other outbreak - simply due to the fact that we don’t have the data to compare!

Leave the influenza comparisons at the door because that’s straight up bush league.

Coronavirus Symptoms (COVID-19) - Worldometer

Possible symptoms, as observed in studies, of infection with the Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV) originating from Wuhan, China

www.worldometers.info

Coronavirus Incubation Period (COVID-19) - Worldometer

Current estimated incubation period (how long it takes for symptoms to appear) for the Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV) from Wuhan, China

www.worldometers.info

Looks almost identical to the flu.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

It is estimated that 50-70% of the population could get infected. At even 1% mortality rate for US that would be
330,000,000 × 0.5 × 0.001 = 165,000. Hopefully I did my math right

Where are you getting 50-70%?

COVID Live Update: 143,722,259 Cases and 3,061,310 Deaths from the Coronavirus - Worldometer

Live statistics and coronavirus news tracking the number of confirmed cases, recovered patients, tests, and death toll due to the COVID-19 coronavirus from Wuhan, China. Coronavirus counter with new cases, deaths, and number of tests per 1 Million population. Historical data and info. Daily...

www.worldometers.info

 

[JustFillIt]

Coronavirus Symptoms (COVID-19) - Worldometer

Possible symptoms, as observed in studies, of infection with the Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV) originating from Wuhan, China

www.worldometers.info

Coronavirus Incubation Period (COVID-19) - Worldometer

Current estimated incubation period (how long it takes for symptoms to appear) for the Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV) from Wuhan, China

www.worldometers.info

Looks almost identical to the flu.

Does not matter what it looks like.. it’s not the same.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Coronavirus Age, Sex, Demographics (COVID-19) - Worldometer

Age, sex, demographic characteristics such as pre-existing conditions, of coronavirus cases of patients infected with COVID-19 and deaths, as observed in studies on the virus outbreak originating from Wuhan, China

www.worldometers.info

Death rate is much higher if you have a co-morbidity and 70 or older.

 

[PharFromNormal]

Is obesity a substantial risk driver? If so how does the prevalence compare between the US & China & Italy.

Do we have any APPE students on here that don’t have rotations anymore that can do homework for us? SDN journal club time

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Does not matter what it looks like.. it’s not the same.

lol you say what?... their s/sx are identical.

 

[M0df]

Coronavirus: Up to 70% of Germany could become infected - Merkel

The chancellor warns that as many as 58 million Germans could become infected by coronavirus.

www.bbc.com

There were other sources, scientific publications that discuss percentage of the population that would be infected if containment and mitigation measures were not taken.

Also, China, South Korea, and now Italy implemented unprecedented measures to keep the spread to what it is.

 

[JustFillIt]

lol you say what?... their s/sx are identical.

I explained how they are different in a previous post. You are not seeing the bigger picture here.

I hold to the concept that comparing them simply based on s/sx is entirely misguided and frankly freshman.

I would also like to reiterate that I am not pushing the concept that covid will be a terrible thing that brings us to our knees, nor am I saying it’s going to be a walk in the park. I’m saying that we do not know how bad this virus will get until it’s ran it’s course in the population - or has fizzled our due to the inability to be transmitted. To make comparisons is hallow and short sighted.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Coronavirus: Up to 70% of Germany could become infected - Merkel

The chancellor warns that as many as 58 million Germans could become infected by coronavirus.

www.bbc.com

There were other sources, scientific publications that discuss percentage of the population that would be infected if containment and mitigation measures were not taken.

Also, China, South Korea, and now Italy implemented unprecedented measures to keep the spread to what it is.

Yeah... South Koreans are known to panic so i really don't care what they do lol but then again, they've been living in fear of unending war for the last 70 years so i guess it's understandable.

Get back to me when 70% are actually infected. I don't believe in fear mongering.

 

[BMBiology]

It is estimated that 50-70% of the population could get infected. At even 1% mortality rate for US that would be
330,000,000 × 0.5 × 0.001 = 165,000. Hopefully I did my math right

More like 1.65M

 

[M0df]

It is not fear mongering. It is called simulations. They don't need to infect 70% of the populations to prove VictorOfHungerGames is wrong. Not a single country is going to let it be and see what happens.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

It is not fear mongering. It is called simulations. They don't need to infect 70% of the populations to prove VictorOfHungerGames is wrong. Not a single country is going to let it be and see what happens.

Wrong? lol is that what you're trying to do? to prove me wrong? well that's a futile effort since I'm not trying to deny that 100% of the population can be infected. I'm just looking at current numbers and stating the simple fact that world wide panic is unnecessary and we don't have to be hoarding water and toilet paper...

I mean if you look at the flu statistically, it has 100% infection rate since in due time EVERYONE will be infected at least once haha

 

[JustFillIt]

Wrong? lol is that what you're trying to do? to prove me wrong? well that's a futile effort since I'm not trying to deny that 100% of the population can be infected. I'm just looking at current numbers and stating the simple fact that world wide panic is unnecessary and we don't have to be hoarding water and toilet paper...

I mean if you look at the flu statistically, it has 100% infection rate since in due time EVERYONE will be infected at least once haha

Ok - if your argument is to not horde toilet paper and water then I would agree with this also.

But I guarantee you something - if we have a 100% infection rate, we will certainly see a very different profile of outcomes associated with covid when compared to influenza with very clear statistically significant differences.

Which is why it’s foolish to compare at this time

 

[MelaNix12]

The fact of the matter is this will most likely infect 40-70% of the population. Everyone do me a favor and go to United States Coronavirus: 1,322 Cases and 38 Deaths - Worldometer and look how the case numbers are growing in the United States per day. You can also go to the CDC's site. The cases are doubling every 3 days on average. Six days ago I saw reports from a lot of ID doctors and staticians saying the amount of people infected was doubling every 3 days. And sure enough three days later...the total case number doubled. Then three more days later...it doubled again. Anyone with a basic understanding of exponential growth can do the math from here. And if you think about it logically, a virus infects exponentially (one person is infected then he/she infects two more, then they each infect two more...). Right now we have over 1,000 cases in the United States. By the end of this month there will be over 100,000 infected in the United States. In two months, over a million. And we are only testing a select few. Now, that's if we do nothing to combat the spread. China was growing exponentially until they got to about 80,000 infected then extreme measures were taken (quarantine!!!). We'll have to do the same. I'm not fear mongering here because, although I'm taking it seriously, I do not think its as big of deal as the news makes it. The death rate will for sure drop as more people are tested. Some experts predict it to be around 0.5%. The warm weather might halt the spread a little bit. I think there was a study that showed the warmer weather decreases the viruse's surface lifespan. The virus is estimated to survive on surfaces up to 9 days currently. But the virus is live and active in places like Iran where it is warm...so who knows for sure. So I think the only comparison you can make with the flu is the number of people infected will be similar...big numbers. I don't think SARS, MERS, or EBOLA had anything close to this amount...I could be wrong. It's going to suck when all the restaurants/bars/entertainment places start to shut down nationwide in the United States. But I guess it's the smart thing to do to combat the spread. I for one will have to keep working my 40 hours a week in the hospital while everyone else in the nation gets to work from home . But I'm still going to take trips/vacations. If you're scared go to church is what I say... Sorry for the rambling.

 

[Sine Cura]

What if Trump has it?

Of course they'd never admit it

 

[ancienbon]

It is estimated that 50-70% of the population could get infected. At even 1% mortality rate for US that would be
330,000,000 × 0.5 × 0.001 = 165,000. Hopefully I did my math right

You re very wrong bro. It is 1650 000 deaths. 1/100 = 0.01

 

[rxkrafted]

Keep in mind that all these cases reported in the U.S. are very underestimated since there aren't enough tests and there are many who are trying to recover with supportive care from home.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Keep in mind that all these cases reported in the U.S. are very underestimated since there aren't enough tests and there are many who are trying to recover with supportive care from home.

Right. This will skew the death rate. Dead people will be reported but those who are sick who may or may not know they have corona may not report themselves to a hospital or a clinic. Heck, if im sick i aint telling anyone. Lol just gonna take a few days off and sip some coroan at home watch the world panic haha.

 

[JustFillIt]

Right. This will skew the death rate. Dead people will be reported but those who are sick who may or may not know they have corona may not report themselves to a hospital or a clinic. Heck, if im sick i aint telling anyone. Lol just gonna take a few days off and sip some coroan at home watch the world panic haha.

Dude - I do appreciate you on this forum, and I don’t want to sound like I’m biting at you.

But - nothing about this situation is funny. This is downright scary and upsetting. If you do not have the balls to admit this, and your coping by making fun of the situation that is fine.

I am going to have respect for the gravity of this situation and do whatever I can to contribute to a positive community outcome. This may mean prepare for the worst amdnhope for the best.

This does not mean - point fingers and laugh at those that may not have the coping skills necessary to understand 100% what it is we are dealing with and/or may just be legitimately scared.

Do you have children that depend on you? Do you have elderly grandparents who may be frail or infirm?

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Dude - I do appreciate you on this forum, and I don’t want to sound like I’m biting at you.

But - nothing about this situation is funny. This is downright scary and upsetting. If you do not have the balls to admit this, and your coping by making fun of the situation that is fine.

I am going to have respect for the gravity of this situation and do whatever I can to contribute to a positive community outcome. This may mean prepare for the worst amdnhope for the best.

Interesting. I find what funny? This is called witch hunt i think. Yes, i find myself being entertained at the fact that people are losing their s#!t over this. Buying every toilet paper on the shelves, fighting over bottled water etc.

As a community pharmacist, i believe it is my utmost priority to protect my community the best i can. I have educated numerous patients who may be at risk on coronavirus. I have been constantly researching and updating myself on current situation so i can inform the patients.

But what do you say to people who are panicking over this chaos mainly caused by the media when theyre ignoring all medical advice from a medical professional and buy all of hand sanitizers and alcohol pads from our shelves? You just laugh... lol

 

[JustFillIt]

Interesting. I find what funny? This is called witch hunt i think. Yes, i find myself being entertained at the fact that people are losing their s#!t over this. Buying every toilet paper on the shelves, fighting over bottled water etc.

As a community pharmacist, i believe it is my utmost priority to protect my community the best i can. I have educated numerous patients who may be at risk on coronavirus. I have been constantly researching and updating myself on current situation so i can inform the patients.

But what do you say to people who are panicking over this chaos mainly caused by the media when theyre ignoring all medical advice from a medical professional and buy all of hand sanitizers and alcohol pads from our shelves? You just laugh... lol

Sure - there are many that are not coping well with the anxiety surrounding this whole thing. I went to the store yesterday and saw about 40 people strip a pallet of toilet paper.

This behavior is the base fruit of herd anxiety. No one knows why they are buying all this toilet paper.. they are doing it for 1 reason.

This reason is simply because, “everyone else is doing it”. It’s the fear of missing out. This stress and anxiety (related to missing out on what everyone else is getting to survive) is something that is very difficult for the human to resist. We are wired in a way that urges us to participate in this behavior as a survival instinct. It is not hard to understand why it is happening, and much less tempting to mock these people if you put yourself in their shoes.

They are simply responding to their survival instinct - nothing more really. Unfortunately, they have not reasoned through the situation to allow themselves the chance to understand that toilet paper will not increase their chance of survival.

 

[PharFromNormal]

Right. This will skew the death rate. Dead people will be reported but those who are sick who may or may not know they have corona may not report themselves to a hospital or a clinic. Heck, if im sick i aint telling anyone. Lol just gonna take a few days off and sip some coroan at home watch the world panic haha.

You bring up a good point that I think is frequently overshadowed by “not enough tests.”
I think there is a significant portion of the population that doesn’t want to be labeled as having it. If they don’t get tested then it’s “just a cough, not corona though, no way, I’m ok.”
When someone in the workplace goes out on quarantine, everyone immediately either knows who it is or wants to know who it is. I can easily see many people not wanting to be “that person” or “patient 0” at their workplace that everyone might blame for getting everyone else sick, or worse sick and die. I think because of this some people might also not even want to stay home out of precaution.
I don’t think this a good mentality and that everyone has it, but I’d bet it’s pretty prevalent whether people want to admit to it or not.

 

[El Trombopag]

I work in a hospital near Seattle, and it is a big deal. We’re at the tip of the iceberg, putting plans in place for resources, placement, testing. Every crack in the system is being exposed. My big concern is hospital capacity. We will not have enough ICU beds in the coming months.

A lot of the mindset of this being mostly a concern for older people will not pan out in the US, I’m sure. Age is a risk factor for death, certainly. However we’re starting to take very seriously other comorbidities- particularly obesity and diabetes- that will be enormous influencers of severity in the US.

Just to throw this out, Sanford is making their covid/sars page freely available for the foreseeable future.

Sanford Guide Login

 

[JustFillIt]

I work in a hospital near Seattle, and it is a big deal. We’re at the tip of the iceberg, putting plans in place for resources, placement, testing. Every crack in the system is being exposed. My big concern is hospital capacity. We will not have enough ICU beds in the coming months.

A lot of the mindset of this being mostly a concern for older people will not pan out in the US, I’m sure. Age is a risk factor for death, certainly. However we’re starting to take very seriously other comorbidities- particularly obesity and diabetes- that will be enormous influencers of severity in the US.

Just to throw this out, Sanford is making their covid/sars page freely available for the foreseeable future.

Sanford Guide Login

Do you have any cases in your hospital now?

 

[El Trombopag]

Do you have any cases in your hospital now?

We had one, none currently...though over a dozen tests for ccu patients pending

 

[Thoughtfulsinner]

Terrifying

Life at the epicenter of N.J.’s coronavirus outbreak - ROI-NJ

 

[Dr Wario]

Did anyone see the internal memos that we are supposed to self quarantine for 14 days following exposure to a person who tested positive? Wouldn't this mean that if one employee tested positive, every person who worked with that employee in the last 5 to 10 days would have to be out for 14 days? What the heck will the company do to keep the doors open when they have zero employees for 2 weeks?

Am I missing something?

 

[Sine Cura]

No. These pharmacy chains do not want for geniuses in middle management.

If you literally follow that guidance, pharmacies in cush areas more likely to close first (more likely to have rich whites and Asians stupid enough to have gone on cruises beyond Jan 2020) or those where a good % of your "clientele" spams the emergency dept for primary care, chronic pain management and psych

 

[PharmDBro2017]

Two Emergency Physicians in Critical Condition

www.acep.org

Front line healthcare workers going down. Next few weeks will be chaos... extreme social distancing needs to happen now, do not leave your home unless you must.

 

[JustFillIt]

Terrifying

Life at the epicenter of N.J.’s coronavirus outbreak - ROI-NJ

We hear less and less every day about how this is just the flu.. I love Shawn Hannity, and Rush - but they need to cool it with the downplay.

 

[Momus]

Even monkeys are panicking, don't be like them.

 

[Sine Cura]

Which monkeys?

 

[Traziiramate09]

You're using an acronym. Thank you Xenophylia. I knew it as ppg. Personal protective gear

LOOOL

 

[Xenophylia]

That's just the sort of math that middle management and CEOs don't have to think about often. Leave the logistics at pharmacy level.......

 

[radio frequency]

The economic impact due to world wide panic is created by the governments and the media. So obvious and clear. You can't compare the mortality rate until it catches up to the flu numbers. That's like saying John Salley is a better player than Vince Carter just based on number of rings lol

Start reading Science and JAMA and stop reading conspiracy theories...

 

[radio frequency]

We hear less and less every day about how this is just the flu.. I love Shawn Hannity, and Rush - but they need to cool it with the downplay.

Rush should be worried. Lung cancer? He’s not surviving this pandemic.

 

[JustFillIt]

Rush should be worried. Lung cancer? He’s not surviving this pandemic.

I was thinking the same thing the other day... I grew up with Rush, and one of my favorite moments was the state of the union this year and how he was honored. But I do think he has this all messed up.

 

[Hels2007]

I am far more worried about the economic impact of all the measures to contain coronavirus than the infection itself. It can be one of those cases where the cure is worse than the disease. I guess I can just wait and see, there is nothing I can personally do about it.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Start reading Science and JAMA and stop reading conspiracy theories...

More like NEJM. Not a JAMA type. NEJM has higher impact factor. None of them can explain this stupid and amazing phenomenon that is happening in america called toilet paper hoarding.

 

[JustFillIt]

More like NEJM. Not a JAMA type. NEJM has higher impact factor. None of them can explain this stupid and amazing phenomenon that is happening in america called toilet paper hoarding.

I would support to continue the toilet paper hoarding bashing. I’m glad to see you move away from the concept that this is no different than the flu and will affect us the same

 

[radio frequency]

More like NEJM. Not a JAMA type. NEJM has higher impact factor. None of them can explain this stupid and amazing phenomenon that is happening in america called toilet paper hoarding.

I would hope you read both. JAMA has had some really interesting articles on Coronavirus recently though. NEJM as well. I didn’t know you had to be a “type” to read JAMA...

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

I would hope you read both. JAMA has had some really interesting articles on Coronavirus recently though. NEJM as well. I didn’t know you had to be a “type” to read JAMA...

It was a joke. Haven't read either in a long time. Wife is a biochemist. She's basically a walking science journal. Getting daily updates on it.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

I would support to continue the toilet paper hoarding bashing. I’m glad to see you move away from the concept that this is no different than the flu and will affect us the same

Only difference I see is that people are panicking? I still haven't seen solid evidence that this is SOOO deadly that earth has to shut down. Stupid people panicking and hoarding things does not change the nature of this infection.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Serious question. Has anyone actually met or seen someone with this virus? Besides celebrities and athletes, someone who you personally know who has gotten this virus? Genuinely curious.

 

[radio frequency]

I still haven't seen solid evidence that this is SOOO deadly that earth has to shut down.

Ask your wife.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Ask your wife.

For someone who claims to read journals, you seem to have little understanding in words I write... I just said I get daily updates and then proceeded to say I still haven't seen or heard any solid evidence... but then again, I'm sure you don't really care what I say... so... ah well. Why don't you go hoard some more toilet paper.

 

[TonyRx]

This is very interesting, recommend reading the short scenario synopsis, it’s wild and eerily close to reality.

A “war game” like scenario played out on October 2019, based on a hypothetical Coronavirus pandemic resulting in mass infection and global economic fallout.

Funded by Bill/Melinda Gates, John Hopkins and World Economic Forum. Other various resources, videos and pictures on the website from the Live conference held in New York.

Event 201 | Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security

The Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security in partnership with the World Economic Forum and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation hosted Event 201, a high-level pandemic exercise on October 18, 2019, in New York, NY.

www.centerforhealthsecurity.org

12-min Highlight Reel, worth watching

 

[WVUPharm2007]

So I went to BJ's today. They had toilet paper, water, Clorox wipes...didn't buy any because I don't need any. I came for fish oil gummies and those bomb ass chicken sandwiches they got in the freezer. Didn't have a damn one of either. WTF?

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

What am I missing here...?

United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

Preliminary In-Season 2021-2022 Flu Burden Estimates

CDC's weekly cumulative in-season estimates of flu cases, medical visits, hospitalizations and deaths in the United States.

www.cdc.gov

How is one a national emergency and the other not?