Coronavirus, Students and Liability

[Tangerine123]

I'm just curious how the situation with students is handled in the US currently with corona. The government from my country recently explained how students will proceed. I honestly find this highly unethical and i'm glad that i'm not a student anymore. I really hope that current stundents really think this one through and go for a LoA this year.

In order for students to do their rotations they must sign a document (backed up by the national ministry of health) that goes:

"I declare that I exhume the authorities, teachers of the Faculty of Medical Sciences and the University ..... as well as the authorities of the Ministerial Office, Hospital Directors and doctors of the different centers of the Ministry of Public Health and Social Assistance where it is carried out the practice, from any criminal, civil and administrative liability arising from any action or omission during hospital practices, as well as from any negligent conduct on my part and I assume the expenses that may be incurred"

Note: 3rd world country where we don't even have money for PPE and students are asking friends and family for donations so they can afford their gear.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Lawpy]

In person clinical rotations need to continue. Zoom = bad. The pandemic has been raging for over a year and covid 19 and many small variants of concern are going to be endemic and long lasting. We need to learn to deal with it now.

 

[Tangerine123]

The government basically exploits students. Students work aprox 60-70 hours per week with 36h shifts and bad working conditions. No food, nowhere to sleep (we would use a bench or an old matress on the floor), half of the bathrooms don't work, no showers, no nothing.

They are placed in high risk situations with no support whatsoever: No PPE is given, sometimes students manually ventilate patients for hours.

Tuberculosis is really prevalent here. I remember they used to give us (1) N95 mask that had to last for weeks when we rotated in a TB unit. Sometimes you would just use the regular surgical masks.

The idea that nothing is there to back you up because of sheer negligence is just mind-boggling. I can imagine students being forced by XYZ attendant or resident to evaluate or do a procedure on Covid patients with no protection whatsoever. You either do it or fail the rotation. Got sick? You pay for the tests and all related medical costs. You live? Repeat the rotation because you skipped a certain ammount of days. You die or end up in critical care? Your fault, you signed the paper.

 

[Lawpy]

The government basically exploits students. Students work aprox 60-70 hours per week with 36h shifts and bad working conditions. No food, nowhere to sleep (we would use a bench or an old matress on the floor), half of the bathrooms don't work, no showers, no nothing.

They are placed in high risk situations with no support whatsoever: No PPE is given, sometimes students manually ventilate patients for hours.

Tuberculosis is really prevalent here. I remember they used to give us (1) N95 mask that had to last for weeks when we rotated in a TB unit. Sometimes you would just use the regular surgical masks.

The idea that nothing is there to back you up because of sheer negligence is just mind-boggling. I can imagine students being forced by XYZ attendant or resident to evaluate or do a procedure on Covid patients with no protection whatsoever. You either do it or fail the rotation. Got sick? You pay for the tests and all related medical costs. You live? Repeat the rotation because you skipped a certain ammount of days. You die or end up in critical care? Your fault, you signed the paper.

Are you living in an authoritarian and/or corrupt country?

 

[7331poas]

In person clinical rotations need to continue. Zoom = bad. The pandemic has been raging for over a year and covid 19 and many small variants of concern are going to be endemic and long lasting. We need to learn to deal with it now.

Lets say I agree with you, do you think it is ethical for a school/health system to extort students into waiving liabilities?

 

[Lawpy]

Lets say I agree with you, do you think it is ethical for a school/health system to extort students into waiving liabilities?

No that shouldn't be allowed and i have never seen this happening. OP says they're living in a 3rd world country that may be potentially corrupt

 

[Tangerine123]

Are you living in an authoritarian and/or corrupt country?

Corrupt.

Wasn't sure how to quantify it. But there's a Corruption Perceptions Index that ranks countries "by their perceived levels of public sector corruption, as determined by expert assessments and opinion surveys."

According to it, my country is in the top 15%

 

[Lawpy]

Corrupt.

Wasn't sure how to quantify it. But there's a Corruption Perceptions Index that ranks countries "by their perceived levels of public sector corruption, as determined by expert assessments and opinion surveys."

According to it, my country is in the top 15%

Ah. That's tragic. The liability forms shouldn't be allowed